Topic: $10k double spend... - page 2. (Read 4350 times)

Son get real..... they're not gonna sue your ass for a shitty Rosewill parts that you bought.

The fact that you compare legitimated chargeback with double spend tell how smart you are.

What risk did Newegg take again?

Some of your points are reasonable. Paypal loses a lot of money to fraud each year for example. But your point about 1 accidental $10,000 double spend is laughably ridiculous. You don't think that would have been a much bigger problem if btc was used widespread and people didn't realize what was going on as quickly? I guarantee there would have been LOTS of money double spent in that situation.

In fact, you could easily implement a fork-detection system: whenever a fork(i.e., two branches with more than one block)  is detected, wait for more confirmations until one branch stops growing, this is not something requires protocol overhauling or even client reprogramming.

LOL @ FUDders who claim this will doom bitcoin b/c merchants.

One double-spend in entire history of BTC vs thousands and thousands of fraudulent doublespends (chargebacks) via MASTERCARD VISA PAYPAL etc etc etc. Not only that, but fraudulent chargebacks are practically encouraged by card companies, are built into the system i.e. you can request one. BTC allows no official channel for chargebacks and the only reason that one ever happened was because of a software fluke, virtually the only significant software fluke so far, which is pretty good for a piece of software that handles millions of dollars.

Do these FUDpeople just not think?

If I were a merchant I'd be glad to use a payment service with such a low risk of double-spends. Give me bitcoin with its 1 accidental $10,000 double-spend any day over Mastercard/Visa/Paypal/Amex/Etc with its cumulative millions of intentional double-spends and double spend feature available on request via official channel.

The only way we could dissuade merchants from adopting bitcoin is by introducing a double-spend feature into the client where you could request that a centralized authority charge back your money from a merchant. Then it'd be just like the credit cards. Oh and jack the fee to like 5%. THAT would be a great way to deter merchants. Not a fluke block-chain fork that is fixed immediately.

You first. Go ahead, create a hard fork, and do the double-spending
Chargebacks might well be easier.

A: I've done a few charge backs over the years, for legitimate reasons, they worked out fine.

B: If newegg accepted bitcoins and got hurt by a double spend, they wouldn't exactly be powerless to do anything about it.  For example they would still have your name, address, probably require a phone number, and you would be facing an immediate lawsuit.  It's not silkroad, they aren't going to just deliver your hardware to an empty ally.

Easy? go ahead and do charge-back. See how well that pans out for you.

The blockchain could find out a double spend, what's wrong is the 6-confirmations recommendation, it should be changed, especially for transactions involving large amount.

Don't you realize that newegg and virtually all online merchants already take this risk?

Credit cards, via charge-back, are one of the easiest ways to double spend.

Yeah, and, chargebacks... Maybe a tiny little fork once in every two years is not that bad...

Still, I wish this had never happened.

If you have several transaction a week..... sure no problem to consider btc.

If you're newegg with thousands of transactions, no way in hell you will take the risk.

Thats all that matters.

maybe they crawl back when credit card fees get risen repeatendly

of course, in short to medium term this will cause people who aren't into bitcoin that much and don't have much knowledge about the system behind bitcoin think twice before getting in.

Yes, really  disaster, our speculation will not work.

No one here debate if btc is still a beta or not.

You cant deny the fact that this will slow down the adoptions by merchant.

The issue is not solved IMO. Simply orphan the fork and keep the default block size limit isnt a fix. We need to come up with a prevention system to put the whole thing in safe mode when this happens again.

Only then, the confidence is restored. Imagine what would happen, if we're all mining ASICs now. It would be a disaster.

Btw, name one incident where the whole banking network has to be stopped as double spending might happen? PPL quickly say "if this happens to bank" has no clue. Sure you bank wiring might be slow and delayed.... that doesnt stop me from buying parts from Newegg does it?

that's just wishful thinking. yes, something went wrong, but look at how fast the issue was solved. if this happened to a bank, until now nobody would know more than that the system doesn't work. instead, bitcoin is back up and running.

keep in mind that it is bitcoin 0.8, it is still beta. but the fact that such a huge issue can be solved that fast is a good sign. of course i like it better if those things don't happen, but that's what beta is for. it is better to find the bugs now than to find them in a few years when bitcoin has spread and increased in value. the way the fork was dealt with makes me more confident about the future.

BTW, some time ago i heard of a professional programmer (can't remember the name) who said he was absolutely amazed that until then not one major bug/malfunction was found in the bitcoin core source code. also, if i understood todays issue correct the problem was the interface between the bitcoin core and the database, which was changed from 0.7 to 0.8. so i guess it won't be too hard to get 0.8.1 up and running.

looks like Nemesis has dumped under $44 :-)

Its best to hold on fiat and buy back in when the price drop.

This recent incident has damaged the confident level of btc. Price drops is inevitable.

Its a wake-up call for all of us. BTC isnt ready for mainstream. Dont expect big online merchants to accept btc anytime soon.

When chain forks there is no reason for a panic sell because you have same amount in both. ... so the worst case scenario is "your amount is doubled." :-)