Aside from that: I'm so done reading articles about Bitcoin that include a picture of a Casascius coin...
Topic: [2013-12-04] -Bloomberg - Greenspan says bitcoin a Bubble (Read 1954 times)
The intrinsic value is a stake in the secure payment network.
Aside from that: I'm so done reading articles about Bitcoin that include a picture of a Casascius coin...
Aside from that: I'm so done reading articles about Bitcoin that include a picture of a Casascius coin...
So if Greenspan is wrong about everything else, that automatically disqualifies him as giving a valid opinion on BitCoin? What if he is right, have you considered that, or does that not fit in with your worldview?
Okay, lets say the father of the largest real-estate bubble in america is somehow *right* about bitcoin. Well, when would you expect this to manifest itself? After the first surge to a dollar? The second to 31? The third to 266? The fourth to 1,000+? Do you see a pattern here at all?
When confidence is lost, the opportunity to recover is also lost. Bitcoin hasn't lost that confidence. For that to happen, we would freefall to near zero, and then stay at some mediocre value - say 1 dollar, and taper off to nothingness as everyone just decided to stop participating.
The problem with his grand and sweeping pronouncement is he bases this on the "intrinsic value" theorem, which for old economic fossils, usually means Gold. You can't directly compare bitcoin and gold, although some try. I suppose there is a rudimentary basis for doing so, where the scarcity of gold ore could be held up to the relative scarcity of finding the correct "hash" for a block. But other than that, they are distant cousins to each other.
In any case, I'd just take his predictions he made during his career and apply that probability ratio to what he's said about Bitcoin. If anything, its a contrary indicator.
AG is almost certainly right about something. Although he made bald unsupported assertions, and all we have to go on for reasoning, is his authority. The authoritative summary being that he hasn't the imagination necessary for Bitcoin. I don't disagree with him on that. Bitcoin is in beta, and so it does require a modicum of imagination, which he hasn't yet found.
Interesting times ahead, is the Fed's taper also a fuse?1
The punch-line to this joke is that with the approval of BASIL III accord, at its implementation there will be a reduction in the "intrinsic value" items held as asset classes in all meaningful central banks on the planet.
Its being traded out for the pseudo-collateralized debt instruments of other central banks.
Add that to the defacto socialization of the debt of the federal reserve, a bank regulatory authority owned by banks (yet again passing the bag of debt rung up by the too-big-to-fail to the taxpayers). http://readersupportednews.org/pm-section/84-84/8076-the-bank-of-american-taxpayers-the-bankers-bank-of-choice
1 "taper-fuse" Definitions from The Century Dictionary and Cyclopedia:
n. A long, flexible fuse, in the form of a ribbon, charged with a rapid-burning composition.
Searching for "Bubbles Greenspan" (one of his nicknames) yields some goodies, e.g.:
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-12-04/greenspan-says-bitcoin-a-bubble-without-intrinsic-currency-value.html
Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said Bitcoin prices are unsustainably high after surging 89-fold in a year and that the virtual money isn’t currency.
“It’s a bubble,” Greenspan, 87, said today in a Bloomberg Television interview from Washington. “It has to have intrinsic value. You have to really stretch your imagination to infer what the intrinsic value of Bitcoin is. I haven’t been able to do it. Maybe somebody else can.”
The man who was the most wrong about everything in economics with the possible exception of every other Fed chief says Bitcoin is a bubble and has no intrinsic value.
We must be on to something here.
Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said Bitcoin prices are unsustainably high after surging 89-fold in a year and that the virtual money isn’t currency.
“It’s a bubble,” Greenspan, 87, said today in a Bloomberg Television interview from Washington. “It has to have intrinsic value. You have to really stretch your imagination to infer what the intrinsic value of Bitcoin is. I haven’t been able to do it. Maybe somebody else can.”
The man who was the most wrong about everything in economics with the possible exception of every other Fed chief says Bitcoin is a bubble and has no intrinsic value.
We must be on to something here.
So if Greenspan is wrong about everything else, that automatically disqualifies him as giving a valid opinion on BitCoin? What if he is right, have you considered that, or does that not fit in with your worldview?
No but the fact that probably he doesn't know what he is even talking about it does.
I bet someone told him that bitcoin is an online currency that no central authority controls or issues and he decided that it's a bubble.
In any case time will tell
So if Greenspan is wrong about everything else, that automatically disqualifies him as giving a valid opinion on BitCoin? What if he is right, have you considered that, or does that not fit in with your worldview?
Okay, lets say the father of the largest real-estate bubble in america is somehow *right* about bitcoin. Well, when would you expect this to manifest itself? After the first surge to a dollar? The second to 31? The third to 266? The fourth to 1,000+? Do you see a pattern here at all?
When confidence is lost, the opportunity to recover is also lost. Bitcoin hasn't lost that confidence. For that to happen, we would freefall to near zero, and then stay at some mediocre value - say 1 dollar, and taper off to nothingness as everyone just decided to stop participating.
The problem with his grand and sweeping pronouncement is he bases this on the "intrinsic value" theorem, which for old economic fossils, usually means Gold. You can't directly compare bitcoin and gold, although some try. I suppose there is a rudimentary basis for doing so, where the scarcity of gold ore could be held up to the relative scarcity of finding the correct "hash" for a block. But other than that, they are distant cousins to each other.
In any case, I'd just take his predictions he made during his career and apply that probability ratio to what he's said about Bitcoin. If anything, its a contrary indicator.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-12-04/greenspan-says-bitcoin-a-bubble-without-intrinsic-currency-value.html
Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said Bitcoin prices are unsustainably high after surging 89-fold in a year and that the virtual money isn’t currency.
“It’s a bubble,” Greenspan, 87, said today in a Bloomberg Television interview from Washington. “It has to have intrinsic value. You have to really stretch your imagination to infer what the intrinsic value of Bitcoin is. I haven’t been able to do it. Maybe somebody else can.”
The man who was the most wrong about everything in economics with the possible exception of every other Fed chief says Bitcoin is a bubble and has no intrinsic value.
We must be on to something here.
Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said Bitcoin prices are unsustainably high after surging 89-fold in a year and that the virtual money isn’t currency.
“It’s a bubble,” Greenspan, 87, said today in a Bloomberg Television interview from Washington. “It has to have intrinsic value. You have to really stretch your imagination to infer what the intrinsic value of Bitcoin is. I haven’t been able to do it. Maybe somebody else can.”
The man who was the most wrong about everything in economics with the possible exception of every other Fed chief says Bitcoin is a bubble and has no intrinsic value.
We must be on to something here.
So if Greenspan is wrong about everything else, that automatically disqualifies him as giving a valid opinion on BitCoin? What if he is right, have you considered that, or does that not fit in with your worldview?
he doesnt seem to be confident in this video about his own opinion.
This is RICH coming from Greenspan, architect of such a financial mess..
Absolutely...you should keep your money in USD. Never mind the fact that they've printed $14000 for every household in America during QE. Move right along please.
So if a national currency is healthy we should not move to bitcoin? I mean stop hating dollars to prove the worth of bitcoin. It's just wrong and pointless.
Bullish. Best contrary indicator ever, on past performance.
Yep, if Greenspan, the doddering old fool who couldn't understand his policies were creating the largest housing bubble of all time, says that Bitcoin is in a bubble - well, buddy - you're not seeing things so well, are you.
He's in the same league as Cramer when he said Bear Stearns was "FINE" one day before they filed for bankruptcy.
They're both bought and paid for by the financial system that they work within.
Absolutely...you should keep your money in USD. Never mind the fact that they've printed $14000 for every household in America during QE. Move right along please.
It feels strange to hear all those "Bitcoin has no intrinsic value", "Bitcoin has no real use" blabbers coming from all these bigwigs while I am enjoying the unprecedented convenience in online business provided by Bitcoin.
I guess the same applies to those who have to suffer geocentrists.
I guess the same applies to those who have to suffer geocentrists.
Then there's the fact you can trade with everybody in the world without being restricted or blockaded by governments, you also can't be taxed and nobody can take any money out of your account unless you type in your password and give it voluntarily. Oh yeah and you can't get spied on easily and people won't be able to data farm your spending habits to send junk to you or find out your home address.
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Interesting that Bloomberg is talking it down.... Maybe they want to buy?
I suspect all these people are scared that their respective selling points ( Dollar/Gold ) are going to drop in value.
Bullish. Best contrary indicator ever, on past performance.
“It’s a bubble,” Greenspan, 87, said today
I smell a troll here
Bloomberg keeps replaying the small part of the Greenspan interview where he says "Is bitcoin in a bubble? Yes!" and not much else of the interview (he talked about a lot of things)
Interesting that Bloomberg is talking it down.... Maybe they want to buy?
Interesting that Bloomberg is talking it down.... Maybe they want to buy?
Its backed by the full faith and credit of mathematics.
As well as everything anyone holds with a bitcoin valuation for which they will happily trade away for bitcoin.
Which is to say that it isn't backed by anything in particular.
However I for one, am backing it with silver and gold from the Bitcoin specie project. Bitcoin Specie:
As to whether bitcoin has any intrinsic value...maybe it does, maybe not. The Dollar certainly doesn't. That is a debt instrument. It is a promissory "note" as in Federal reserve Note. So it has to worry about being repaid, bitcoin doesn't have that worry. We aren't concerned about being repaid, our bitcoins seem perfectly redeemable just as they are. For a Lamborghini just today, yes?
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/2013-12-04-lamborghini-dealership-sells-first-car-for-bitcoin-357820
http://lamborghininewportbeach.blogspot.com/2013/12/we-just-sold-our-very-first-vehicle.html
Although they don't really understand what "Legal Tender" means, if they did, they wouldn't use it in that context. "Legal Tender" means you are forced to accept it, not that you are allowed to accept it. It is not a good thing, and we don't want Bitcoin to be legal tender, free choice is better, and you really only need a legal tender law when your currency sucks.
As well as everything anyone holds with a bitcoin valuation for which they will happily trade away for bitcoin.
Which is to say that it isn't backed by anything in particular.
However I for one, am backing it with silver and gold from the Bitcoin specie project. Bitcoin Specie:
As to whether bitcoin has any intrinsic value...maybe it does, maybe not. The Dollar certainly doesn't. That is a debt instrument. It is a promissory "note" as in Federal reserve Note. So it has to worry about being repaid, bitcoin doesn't have that worry. We aren't concerned about being repaid, our bitcoins seem perfectly redeemable just as they are. For a Lamborghini just today, yes?
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/2013-12-04-lamborghini-dealership-sells-first-car-for-bitcoin-357820
http://lamborghininewportbeach.blogspot.com/2013/12/we-just-sold-our-very-first-vehicle.html
Although they don't really understand what "Legal Tender" means, if they did, they wouldn't use it in that context. "Legal Tender" means you are forced to accept it, not that you are allowed to accept it. It is not a good thing, and we don't want Bitcoin to be legal tender, free choice is better, and you really only need a legal tender law when your currency sucks.
During the last month there was a lot of positive coverage with all those success stories and such. Lately things are turning around with many negative articles being published. I 'm afraid that some people that entered during the latest boom will start having second thoughts.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-12-04/greenspan-says-bitcoin-a-bubble-without-intrinsic-currency-value.html
Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said Bitcoin prices are unsustainably high after surging 89-fold in a year and that the virtual money isn’t currency.
“It’s a bubble,” Greenspan, 87, said today in a Bloomberg Television interview from Washington. “It has to have intrinsic value. You have to really stretch your imagination to infer what the intrinsic value of Bitcoin is. I haven’t been able to do it. Maybe somebody else can.”
The man who was the most wrong about everything in economics with the possible exception of every other Fed chief says Bitcoin is a bubble and has no intrinsic value.
We must be on to something here.
and housing bubble was an impossible event up until 2007 Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said Bitcoin prices are unsustainably high after surging 89-fold in a year and that the virtual money isn’t currency.
“It’s a bubble,” Greenspan, 87, said today in a Bloomberg Television interview from Washington. “It has to have intrinsic value. You have to really stretch your imagination to infer what the intrinsic value of Bitcoin is. I haven’t been able to do it. Maybe somebody else can.”
The man who was the most wrong about everything in economics with the possible exception of every other Fed chief says Bitcoin is a bubble and has no intrinsic value.
We must be on to something here.
Greenspan is said to have commented: "there is no fundamental means of 'repaying' it by any means that is universally accepted."
That's right Alan, it's not a token representing the part of the national debt that's made up of Treasury Bonds, i.e. it's an asset-based currency, not a claim on a gigantic and never-to-be paid debt based currency.
How in hell does this guy actually get away with sitting there on National TV, complaining that he doesn't understand the value of something that's not part of the scammy system he presided over for 20 years? Are people listening to the words coming out of this guys mouth at all? Do they actually understand that he's complaining that it's not bullshit nationalised servitude, and that the Federal Reserve shareholders (e.g. Goldman Sachs, Carnegie Mellon, JP Morgan et al) cannot possibly roll around with their legs in the air while sucking everyone dry?
No wonder the Chinese state have shut the Dollar window. Buy Bitcoin, and stand back to a safe distance. Expect some turbulence.
That's right Alan, it's not a token representing the part of the national debt that's made up of Treasury Bonds, i.e. it's an asset-based currency, not a claim on a gigantic and never-to-be paid debt based currency.
How in hell does this guy actually get away with sitting there on National TV, complaining that he doesn't understand the value of something that's not part of the scammy system he presided over for 20 years? Are people listening to the words coming out of this guys mouth at all? Do they actually understand that he's complaining that it's not bullshit nationalised servitude, and that the Federal Reserve shareholders (e.g. Goldman Sachs, Carnegie Mellon, JP Morgan et al) cannot possibly roll around with their legs in the air while sucking everyone dry?
No wonder the Chinese state have shut the Dollar window. Buy Bitcoin, and stand back to a safe distance. Expect some turbulence.
That's a phenomenal rant right there! It's my birthday today and this was my favourite gift.
I couldn't agree with you more. Jump to: