I really doubt that the supreme court would be able to take a completely unbiased stance at this matter. Or, they may just keep delaying the verdict infinitely, which essentially means that nobody can buy/sell BTC in the meantime.
Of course I'd like to see this ban being uplifted but at the moment, there are two main possibilities. One is that the ban will continue and be justified by the supreme court. The other is that some sort of VAT tax will be instated upon bitcoin transactions.
I honestly don't see any logic behind banning bitcoin, although India seems to push the idea that bitcoin is used for illegal stuff. To me, that's complete BS. Illegal activities are not a result of bitcoin, at all.
Topic: [2018-07-25] India’s Supreme Court Postpones Verdict on Cryptocurrency Ban Again (Read 391 times)
August 02, 2018, 03:46:41 PM
August 02, 2018, 03:56:17 AM
Listen, guys, I have studied the subcontinent closely. The problem subcontinent suffers from is corruption. To hide their corruption Bitcoin and other cryptos are a perfect tool for them, But the main issue here is that these countries are suffering from low tax revenues which is devaluing their currencies. If they approve cryptos/Bitcoin that means the majority of IT sector will start using it for payments which in return will mean even less tax revenue for the governments, which may lead to hyperinflation and collapse of these currencies. Cryptos won't get a green light anytime soon, especially from the subcontinent that's a reality. Pakistan and Bangladesh may follow what India decides.
Do you guys really think that supreme court will approve a piece of tech which is extremely harmful to its currency? Being optimistic is a good thing but let's be real for a moment.
Do you guys really think that supreme court will approve a piece of tech which is extremely harmful to its currency? Being optimistic is a good thing but let's be real for a moment.
You angle of knowledge is really commendable and its something that I have also try to struggle with on what could possibly be the outcome and if I could remember, I came to a conclusion that the odds are against crypto by all means and if there is going to be any win at all, its going to be at the mercy of government regulatory agency while the other party is sure to go with a win no matter the outcome. Lets leave conjectures about maybe the system is corrupt and this might dip into government purse or things like that after all, we have seen judges decide against government that appoint them.
The real question, is who are those that would decide the case? For anyone to be nominated as a Supreme court judge than surely that person does not belong to the generation of computers. Basically, the decision would be based on the arguments of the representatives of both sides that then aligns with what the judges have come to know and have done all their lives. With this, we all know what the likely outcome would be. Its best everyone just go about our normal business whatever happens we take it from there.
August 01, 2018, 05:44:48 AM
Government should accelerate the process else India would become prone to money laundering and stuff.
July 31, 2018, 08:06:41 AM
There are some money laundering schemes that use offshore shell companies, but there are high ranking bank executives that provide money laundering as a service for criminals. Search for HSBC money laundering in Google and look at how corrupted they are.
Also, what the government wants is to control its constituents, not to give them freedom. Bitcoin gives freedom, and the government does not like that.
Also, what the government wants is to control its constituents, not to give them freedom. Bitcoin gives freedom, and the government does not like that.
But remember that both points you make here are related to each other: governments and their politicians are used to the off-shore money system when they want to do some kind of scandalous dealings, but that puts them in the pockets of the bankers who arrange it for them. Bitcoin doesn't have that middleman problem in the same way, once you have some BTC, politicians can use techniques to do their questionable deals in far more privacy than they can with bankers intermediating. And then they owe the bankers nothing.
That's the beauty of peer-to-peer tech, everyone has genuine equal opportunity. Self interest can drive anyone towards cryptocurrency, as everyone has some reason to want it, even if the reasons aren't the same for everyone.
July 30, 2018, 08:31:11 PM
@Thekool1s. Agreed. There are some money laundering schemes that use offshore shell companies, but there are high ranking bank executives that provide money laundering as a service for criminals. Search for HSBC money laundering in Google and look at how corrupted they are.
Also, what the government wants is to control its constituents, not to give them freedom. Bitcoin gives freedom, and the government does not like that.
Also, what the government wants is to control its constituents, not to give them freedom. Bitcoin gives freedom, and the government does not like that.
July 30, 2018, 04:27:53 AM
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It makes them look weak and hypocritical, and that weakens their perceived authority.
I don't think so, as subcontinent is prone to dirty politics these 180 degrees turns hardly make a dent. Also, The majority of These countries have lower Education standard, They see roads and parks as development and the work of their politicians, they hardly care about what government policies are.
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That is where Silicon Valley season 6 will be made? Oh no bollywood invasion hehehe.
Lmao xDD, I don't know how pied piper will adjust to that. Imagine Season 6 being directed by an Indian. I can't even imagine the dramatic effects the season will have... xD
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But also, there are the corrupt bank executives. They do not want competition on their money laundering and tax evasion services that they provide for the politicians, the criminals and the elite. Bitcoin will break that monopoly, I reckon.
I kinda disagree, most of the politicians are businessmen, they can easily get away by setting up Offshore companies. They don't need the banks as much I reckon. But I do agree with the threat bitcoin posses to the banking system.
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There was also someone in the forum who mentioned that the government does not want the average joe to have some money laundering abilities through bitcoin.
Isn't this what every government wants?
July 30, 2018, 04:01:19 AM
Not again. The judiciary in India still intends to shy away from this case. It is quite easy to predict what the outcome might be. The ban most likely will not hold water. The huge population in India will certainly be a great hit for the cryptocurrency market. Cryptocurrency too will be a big plus for the Indian economy, I believe. The Supreme court had better weigh the situation properly and take a proper stand. It is indeed a matter of grave importance.
July 30, 2018, 01:53:31 AM
Listen, guys, I have studied the subcontinent closely. The problem subcontinent suffers from is corruption. To hide their corruption Bitcoin and other cryptos are a perfect tool for them, But the main issue here is that these countries are suffering from low tax revenues which is devaluing their currencies. If they approve cryptos/Bitcoin that means the majority of IT sector will start using it for payments which in return will mean even less tax revenue for the governments, which may lead to hyperinflation and collapse of these currencies. Cryptos won't get a green light anytime soon, especially from the subcontinent that's a reality. Pakistan and Bangladesh may follow what India decides.
Do you guys really think that supreme court will approve a piece of tech which is extremely harmful to its currency? Being optimistic is a good thing but let's be real for a moment.
Do you guys really think that supreme court will approve a piece of tech which is extremely harmful to its currency? Being optimistic is a good thing but let's be real for a moment.
corruption is a problem that every country is suffering from,India is not much different in this regard
but banning bitcoins will simply lose control over ANY possible taxes or revenue from crypto
what I think is happening now is that they are trying to evaluate the cons and pros and I would not be so pessimistic about
cryptos getting a green light in India,CB is an institution pretty independent from the goverment(s) and there will be an interesting
conflict of interests-Central Bank is not interested in legalizing it,while the goverment should be
July 29, 2018, 07:56:56 PM
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The Russian government went through the same nonsense, but they were making different rules for different divisions in their government.
Agreed, But this is a country where the next "silicon valley" is being made. I don't think they are unfamiliar with the tech which they are dealing with. The issue is more than just a piece of tech. If they approve it they are technically allowing the politicians to theft easily which is a huge issue in these developing countries. IMO it's the matter of how deep the money runs. If the Indian judges are bought/sold then we can expect a approval for the cryptos else there is a slim chance of getting the green signal.
That is where Silicon Valley season 6 will be made? Oh no bollywood invasion hehehe.
But also, there are the corrupt bank executives. They do not want competition on their money laundering and tax evasion services that they provide for the politicians, the criminals and the elite. Bitcoin will break that monopoly, I reckon.
There was also someone in the forum who mentioned that the government does not want the average joe to have some money laundering abilities through bitcoin.
July 29, 2018, 06:51:40 PM
They first made an Ass of themselves by prematurely banning all Crypto currencies, then they admit that they did that and they allow it and now they postpone the court ruling on this. This is a sign of a government that has no clue what they are doing. I think people should give them some time to do their research and to finally make up their mind.
The Russian government went through the same nonsense, but they were making different rules for different divisions in their government.
The Russian government went through the same nonsense, but they were making different rules for different divisions in their government.
The problem subcontinent suffers from is corruption. To hide their corruption Bitcoin and other cryptos are a perfect tool for them, But the main issue here is that these countries are suffering from low tax revenues which is devaluing their currencies. If they approve cryptos/Bitcoin that means the majority of IT sector will start using it for payments which in return will mean even less tax revenue for the governments, which may lead to hyperinflation and collapse of these currencies.
These are very important reasons why government announcements about cryptocurrencies are so vague, and why any policy is very weak or non-existent.
Governments can't introduce very harsh measures only to make complete 180 degree turns in the future. It makes them look weak and hypocritical, and that weakens their perceived authority. The cryptocurrency issue makes it very difficult for policymakers, many people have been saying this for a long long time. It's a phenomenon that's impossible to prevent, and it both appeals to the corrupt self-serving nature of politicians and yet simultaneously undermines the entire model of parliamentary democracy. The writing is on the wall.
The members in the RBI bench would be another reason for this ecosystem is yet to get in. The bench is filled with minds of 1980s and the current gen-system is hard for them to understand and cherish the best out of new comes. A comity should be formed with all current techie talents and analyze the each outcomes. Making BTC as a commodity is still fine and yes the legislation can be rewritten. The legislation was written when we were even waiting for a post (physical letter / letter with envelope) to receive.
July 29, 2018, 02:03:54 PM
They first made an Ass of themselves by prematurely banning all Crypto currencies, then they admit that they did that and they allow it and now they postpone the court ruling on this. This is a sign of a government that has no clue what they are doing. I think people should give them some time to do their research and to finally make up their mind.
The Russian government went through the same nonsense, but they were making different rules for different divisions in their government.
The Russian government went through the same nonsense, but they were making different rules for different divisions in their government.
The problem subcontinent suffers from is corruption. To hide their corruption Bitcoin and other cryptos are a perfect tool for them, But the main issue here is that these countries are suffering from low tax revenues which is devaluing their currencies. If they approve cryptos/Bitcoin that means the majority of IT sector will start using it for payments which in return will mean even less tax revenue for the governments, which may lead to hyperinflation and collapse of these currencies.
These are very important reasons why government announcements about cryptocurrencies are so vague, and why any policy is very weak or non-existent.
Governments can't introduce very harsh measures only to make complete 180 degree turns in the future. It makes them look weak and hypocritical, and that weakens their perceived authority. The cryptocurrency issue makes it very difficult for policymakers, many people have been saying this for a long long time. It's a phenomenon that's impossible to prevent, and it both appeals to the corrupt self-serving nature of politicians and yet simultaneously undermines the entire model of parliamentary democracy. The writing is on the wall.
July 29, 2018, 08:10:01 AM
Quote
The Russian government went through the same nonsense, but they were making different rules for different divisions in their government.
Agreed, But this is a country where the next "silicon valley" is being made. I don't think they are unfamiliar with the tech which they are dealing with. The issue is more than just a piece of tech. If they approve it they are technically allowing the politicians to theft easily which is a huge issue in these developing countries. IMO it's the matter of how deep the money runs. If the Indian judges are bought/sold then we can expect a approval for the cryptos else there is a slim chance of getting the green signal.
July 29, 2018, 05:58:44 AM
They first made an Ass of themselves by prematurely banning all Crypto currencies, then they admit that they did that and they allow it and now they postpone the court ruling on this. This is a sign of a government that has no clue what they are doing. I think people should give them some time to do their research and to finally make up their mind.
The Russian government went through the same nonsense, but they were making different rules for different divisions in their government.
The Russian government went through the same nonsense, but they were making different rules for different divisions in their government.
July 29, 2018, 05:24:58 AM
Listen, guys, I have studied the subcontinent closely. The problem subcontinent suffers from is corruption. To hide their corruption Bitcoin and other cryptos are a perfect tool for them, But the main issue here is that these countries are suffering from low tax revenues which is devaluing their currencies. If they approve cryptos/Bitcoin that means the majority of IT sector will start using it for payments which in return will mean even less tax revenue for the governments, which may lead to hyperinflation and collapse of these currencies. Cryptos won't get a green light anytime soon, especially from the subcontinent that's a reality. Pakistan and Bangladesh may follow what India decides.
Do you guys really think that supreme court will approve a piece of tech which is extremely harmful to its currency? Being optimistic is a good thing but let's be real for a moment.
Do you guys really think that supreme court will approve a piece of tech which is extremely harmful to its currency? Being optimistic is a good thing but let's be real for a moment.
July 28, 2018, 09:40:41 PM
India already admitted it created many jobs so its clear to see that they are going to approve crypto. Jobs are going to be replaced by the cryptocurrency industry by majority so I guess that is the reason for the delay. They are arguing about the future that is inevatable but they also don't like.
July 28, 2018, 08:00:40 PM
@Betwrong, @Harlot. Before replying try to understand what I was trying to say. Bitcoin is really not a currency but software for a message passing system. How can you regulate one as a currency and Whatsapp or Discord as another? If India starts regulating bitcoin as a currency, it might set up a precedent that other message passing systems might be currencies too, which would be bad.
I reckon maybe ICOs cannot be regulated as securites also for the same reason.
I reckon maybe ICOs cannot be regulated as securites also for the same reason.
I think when replying to a topic in the Press section we actually have two options: 1. discussing the opinion of the poster; 2. discussing the article itself. No offence, mate, but we just have chosen the latter.
Regarding your view of Bitcoin as a software for a message passing system I can only say that IMO the Supreme Court of India will be reviewing entirely another facet of this complex mechanism called Bitcoin. And since I think that the Supreme Court's decision will be made mostly in favor of BTC and other cryptos, there's no need to worry about them start regulating Whatsapp or Discord. ... Well they can start regulating anything they want, but we are talking about banning here, right? Which in a country like India will never happen neither to Bitcoin nor to Whatsapp or Discord.
I reckon you do not understand. The supreme court of India should be careful what kind of decisions it is making on bitcoin by basing them on a constitution that is not made to regulate something like bitcoin.
It would set a terrible precedent for the other message passing systems that are used in their country because bitcoin itself is but a message passing system of signed messages. I do not know India's constitution, but in America, bitcoin is also free speech that is protected by the 1st amendment.
I understood it the first time and that's why I said that I'm sure that the Supreme Court's decision will be made mostly in favor of BTC, because otherwise it would be anti-constitutional. Nevertheless, I think it can be regulated to some degree in the same way that while free speech is protected by the 1st amendment, terrorist propaganda, for example, is forbidden.
Then we can agree that bitcoin is unregulable and unbannable. I reckon the best India's supreme court could do is to allow bitcoin transactions in their country but minimally regulate only the services that accept and use bitcoin.
July 28, 2018, 11:18:10 AM
I think it's not so hard to predict what final verdict of the Supreme Court will be. I mean, no way they are going to enforce the stupid decision of the Reserve Bank of India. Because? Right, because "cryptocurrency brings a lot of investment and jobs to India" as the article is saying. And exactly that's why the final hearing was postponed, forces opposed to crypto are not feeling comfortable with what is going to happen and they are doing everything they can to incline the Supreme Court to make decision in their favor. But they will fail because they belong to the past, while crypto enthusiasts belong to the future.
The Supreme Court will accept the opinion of the RBI in my opinion. The RBI are, after all, the experts in finance. And they haven't banned Bitcoin, they have just asked banks (whom they regulate) to stay away from Bitcoin exchanges.
The Supreme Court will just consider this a vice and move on.
July 28, 2018, 05:42:16 AM
@Betwrong, @Harlot. Before replying try to understand what I was trying to say. Bitcoin is really not a currency but software for a message passing system. How can you regulate one as a currency and Whatsapp or Discord as another? If India starts regulating bitcoin as a currency, it might set up a precedent that other message passing systems might be currencies too, which would be bad.
I reckon maybe ICOs cannot be regulated as securites also for the same reason.
I reckon maybe ICOs cannot be regulated as securites also for the same reason.
I think when replying to a topic in the Press section we actually have two options: 1. discussing the opinion of the poster; 2. discussing the article itself. No offence, mate, but we just have chosen the latter.
Regarding your view of Bitcoin as a software for a message passing system I can only say that IMO the Supreme Court of India will be reviewing entirely another facet of this complex mechanism called Bitcoin. And since I think that the Supreme Court's decision will be made mostly in favor of BTC and other cryptos, there's no need to worry about them start regulating Whatsapp or Discord. ... Well they can start regulating anything they want, but we are talking about banning here, right? Which in a country like India will never happen neither to Bitcoin nor to Whatsapp or Discord.
I reckon you do not understand. The supreme court of India should be careful what kind of decisions it is making on bitcoin by basing them on a constitution that is not made to regulate something like bitcoin.
It would set a terrible precedent for the other message passing systems that are used in their country because bitcoin itself is but a message passing system of signed messages. I do not know India's constitution, but in America, bitcoin is also free speech that is protected by the 1st amendment.
I understood it the first time and that's why I said that I'm sure that the Supreme Court's decision will be made mostly in favor of BTC, because otherwise it would be anti-constitutional. Nevertheless, I think it can be regulated to some degree in the same way that while free speech is protected by the 1st amendment, terrorist propaganda, for example, is forbidden.
July 27, 2018, 07:00:38 PM
@Theb. Fortuntely, India's supreme court is taking its time before making their decision. I hope their supreme court's research will cause them to know that bitcoin is not regulable as a currency or as a commodity in their present constitution. It will set a bad precedent.
July 26, 2018, 09:23:07 PM
I think it's not so hard to predict what final verdict of the Supreme Court will be. I mean, no way they are going to enforce the stupid decision of the Reserve Bank of India. Because? Right, because "cryptocurrency brings a lot of investment and jobs to India" as the article is saying. And exactly that's why the final hearing was postponed, forces opposed to crypto are not feeling comfortable with what is going to happen and they are doing everything they can to incline the Supreme Court to make decision in their favor. But they will fail because they belong to the past, while crypto enthusiasts belong to the future.
Unfortunately the Supreme Court's way of thinking does not involve or even put into consideration about jobs or the livelihood it will bring in India, they will think about it in a legal point of view. But even in that way, it is always about their own personal interpretation of the law which every judge has his own unique opinion of the law (and maybe that is also why they postponed the verdict). Now if that is the reason for the delay I don't think it is 100% about not having a decision yet they might be having a hard time of agreeing into a verdict in the court, because some of them might possibly be ruling in favor for the exchanges. Jump to: