[2019-02-18] Tim Draper Predicts Crypto Will Rule, Only Criminals Will Use Cash

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Quote from: Lucius on February 26, 2019, 05:35:40 AM

Edward Snowden revealed some very interesting data about how NSA is working on tracking bitcoin transaction and link them with senders / recipients, and this was back in 2013. It's pretty certain that today NSA (or some other agency) have even more efficient tools for the identification and tracking transactions.

Technology advances, so do their tools to track and link blockchain activity, but I'm certain that their best tools aren't even known to the public yet, and probably won't be for many more years to come. I'm grateful that we have mixers to at least obfuscate some of our taint, which currently is the most we can ask for.

People also tend to underestimate how dangerous it is to claim fork coins, especially when it comes to cold wallets people didn't access for years. I can't even begin to imagine how much they already know about us, while we assume that we're fairly anonymous behind our VPN's or TOR. The main reason we're not getting our ass whooped is because we're not a large enough fish.

Lucius

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Quote from: BitHodler on February 26, 2019, 02:11:43 AM

I was aware of that one, but the context of the newer statement is completely different. Saying that people will be laughed at for using fiat sounds like someone who's pretty damn bullish on Bitcoin as payment option.

The statement is now different and differently interpreted, but Draper say that because he think (based on available data) that blockchain transaction are much easier to follow, and therefore is easier to identify criminals who use it, so they will continue to use cash. So he just say cash is much harder to track then bitcoin, but bitcoin or some other cryptocurrency will be used more in future.

Edward Snowden revealed some very interesting data about how NSA is working on tracking bitcoin transaction and link them with senders / recipients, and this was back in 2013. It's pretty certain that today NSA (or some other agency) have even more efficient tools for the identification and tracking transactions.

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Quote from: Lucius on February 25, 2019, 06:48:00 AM

It is not first time that he say something like that, it is just repeated with attachment of word "Criminals". I found an article from November 2017 where Tim Draper say :

Quote

"In five years, if you try to use fiat currency they will laugh at you," Draper told me at WebSummit while wearing a tie with cryptocurrency logos on it. "Bitcoin and other cryptocurriences will be so relevant ... there will be no reason to have the fiat currencies."

I was aware of that one, but the context of the newer statement is completely different. Saying that people will be laughed at for using fiat sounds like someone who's pretty damn bullish on Bitcoin as payment option.

Sure, he's maybe overly optimistic here, but saying that fiat will only be used by criminals has a more serious tint to it, and pretty much makes us all a criminal in his book, because no one here will stop using fiat because it works extremely well.

Overall, people use that what's convenient, and there just isn't a way that his most recent statement holds any value at all, very desperate and an attempt to get himself in the media again.

Lucius

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Quote from: BitHodler on February 24, 2019, 10:51:17 AM

I think this is the first time he made a statement like that, which is likely why people went a bit too hard on him.

It is not first time that he say something like that, it is just repeated with attachment of word "Criminals". I found an article from November 2017 where Tim Draper say :

Quote

"In five years, if you try to use fiat currency they will laugh at you," Draper told me at WebSummit while wearing a tie with cryptocurrency logos on it. "Bitcoin and other cryptocurriences will be so relevant ... there will be no reason to have the fiat currencies."

One more time we see how media manipulate with such news when then need to sell the story, actually they need more clicks on their sites because that's the way they make money.

Tim Draper On Bitcoin: 'In 5 Years If You Use Fiat Currency, They Will Laugh At You'(2017)

BitHodler

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Quote from: bbc.reporter on February 22, 2019, 09:14:04 PM

It appears that Tim Draper has learned some things from bitcoin's forum cave trolls hehehe.

Unfortunately, that's not a good thing. Cheesy

I think this is the first time he made a statement like that, which is likely why people went a bit too hard on him. It shows that even the wealthiest entities in this industry are pretty normal and some times overly anti state.

At least he has been very consistent with his price targets throughout the years, which can't be said about the far majority of the so called experts and multi millionaires constantly adjusting their target based on the flow of the market.

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Quote from: Slow death on February 22, 2019, 11:49:04 AM

Here is one of several informal markets that exist in my country:

I've seen the same markets even in parts of rural Eastern Europe, with the same plastic chairs so the gap in adopting technology is sometimes immense even in the western world.

People that talk about radical things happening in 5 years should really think how some other fantasies ended, cause I still can't buy a flying car or a jetpack, I still can't take a moving walkway to work, still no drones delivering my package (funny how it's five years from the test), still can't send a smell through my telephone or enjoy a show on the smellevision Tongue

.

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Quote from: hatshepsut93 on February 24, 2019, 07:12:47 AM

Why would any crypto enthusiast attack cash? Cash and cryptocurrencies are like brothers, they have more in common than in difference.

I know, right? Does seem slightly perverse. I use cash wherever possible. Credit/Debit Cards just give more power and influence to the banks. Why should a bunch of reckless gambling addicts who destroyed the global economy be trusted to monitor our every move while profiting from our actions? It's bizarre how people are just prepared to accept that as normal, somehow. It's bad enough with the various governments around the world fully engaged in the "war on cash" so the banksters can forever be the middleman for every single financial transaction ever. We don't need to bolster that by contributing to it ourselves. I think people would eventually realise their mistake if we ever found ourselves in a world that no longer had cash in it. But it would be too late, then.

Don't attack physical cash. Anything is better than relying on a bunch of shady banksters.

Quote from: hatshepsut93 on February 24, 2019, 07:12:47 AM

It's especially strange to hear "cash will be used by criminals", because that's the same argument nocoiners say about crypto. So what that cash is physical, it's actually a good think because digital technology will always have limitations.

I don't know why we can't just all settle on the view that "all forms of money/wealth/currency/etc will be used by criminals" and just leave it at that, heh.

hatshepsut93

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Why would any crypto enthusiast attack cash? Cash and cryptocurrencies are like brothers, they have more in common than in difference. It's especially strange to hear "cash will be used by criminals", because that's the same argument nocoiners say about crypto. So what that cash is physical, it's actually a good think because digital technology will always have limitations.

BLAST2MARS

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This statement is true. When the media says that crypto and bitcoin is widely on darkweb and sort of illegal things, they are just trying to cover the big truth which is fiat is the best way for criminals to do it. They are just shifting the blame in crypto when all along, the laundering and terrorism are all triumphant thanks to fiat.

bbc.reporter

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It appears that Tim Draper has learned some things from bitcoin's forum cave trolls hehehe.

Slow death

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Here is one of several informal markets that exist in my country:

I believe that even if it was 6 years from now, still these merchants would not be accepting bitcoin as a means of payments ... Countries like mine that are very poor still need to invest a lot in technology, even if by some miracle in my country someday of these legalized bitcoin, we still need to invest a lot in technology so we can use bitcoin as a means of payment in all markets, stores, schools, pay bills for water, electricity and TV.

btyco

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bitcoin is bitcoin no matter where it came from. Although it's not fungible it's still got the same value. criminals will be using fiat and monero, the rest of us will enjoy bitcoin

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Quote from: gentlemand on February 21, 2019, 06:49:50 AM

Why should anyone care about the availability of cash in Tajikistan unless they're a native? What counts is your own part of the world. Somewhere in Europe will have totally gotten rid of cash within the next few years.

And look at the speed mobile payments took off in Africa. It's possible certain places may end up cashless before more advanced economies.

Just as Lucius said, not sure to who was he referring, the US, the western world, the entire population?

But I find it ridiculous to say that cryptos will annihilate cahs in 5 years while cards and mobile payments haven't managed to do it in half a century.

And, and this was the fact I wanted to point since you mentioned Europe.
Yeah, Sweden might be ahead of all in this quest for cashless society but at the same time, the "engine" of Europe, Germany lags behind a lot, being surpassed by countries much less developed.

And while this wouldn't matter if we talk about a continent, it would be pretty funny in a Union. Having to go to an ATM once you enter Germany reminds me of the pre-euro times when you had to change your money into marks, franks, liras, and pesetas.

But anyhow, 5 years? Not going to happen!

Quote from: Lucius on February 22, 2019, 08:23:02 AM

Maybe you do not care for Tajikistan, but only for your country, which is a common attitude among people today, but for me is also important that the world develop evenly.

This ain't' going to happen either. Continents are not developing evenly, countries are not developing evenly, towns in a country are not developing evenly, even neighborhoods in the same districts are not doing it.

Oh, and pure coincidence, Tajikistan is indeed a major drug hub, so...

Lucius

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Quote from: gentlemand on February 21, 2019, 06:49:50 AM

Why should anyone care about the availability of cash in Tajikistan unless they're a native? What counts is your own part of the world. Somewhere in Europe will have totally gotten rid of cash within the next few years.

And look at the speed mobile payments took off in Africa. It's possible certain places may end up cashless before more advanced economies.

I'm not sure whether Draper thought that crypto will rule only in USA and Europe, but this does not diminish the fact of the current availability of the Internet in the world. Maybe you do not care for Tajikistan, but only for your country, which is a common attitude among people today, but for me is also important that the world develop evenly. The great migration that exists today is precisely the result of uneven development across the world, and Europe is pay price for that.

Data from end 2017 show that only 35% of the total African population is using Internet, but I know you think on services like M-Pesa who use SMS service for payments, so internet is not required.

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Quote from: magneto on February 21, 2019, 02:15:44 PM

However, there is a high possibility that if bitcoin ever does go mainstream that the usage of cash and precious metals will both significantly decrease, primarily due to the fact that there is a lot of overlaps between the functions of BTC and these other assets, except bitcoin offers more benefits.

Precious metals serve no purpose as day to day currency, so there isn't much to lose for them in this specific case.

Fiat has a stable unit value and 99.9% adoption/acceptance, which Bitcoin will need decades for to match, if ever. In the end, people like choice, regardless of how good a certain form of money is, and we have enough historical evidence that there hasn't ever been one single form of fiat, neither one single financial service.

More competition leads to better products and services, that's what we have seen. If it wasn't the financial system messing up, Bitcoin probably wouldn't exist and decentralization wouldn't be a selling feature. Who needs decentralization when no one is censoring your transactions, or freeze your balance? People need to be reminded of why Bitcoin exists, and that continuously.

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Quote from: tyz on February 18, 2019, 02:36:21 PM

Tim Draper Predicts Crypto Will Rule, Only Criminals Will Use Cash in Five Years

Billionaire investor and known Bitcoin (BTC) bull Tim Draper argued that in five years, only criminals will use fiat as crypto becomes universally widespread. Draper made his claims in an interview with American financial news tv channel Fox Business released on Feb. 18.

https://cointelegraph.com/news/tim-draper-predicts-crypto-will-rule-only-criminals-will-use-cash-in-five-years

It is clever. Just turn the tables. Something like that is called framing.

Let's bookmark this and wait for about five years to see what will happen.I'm sure that crypto won't dominate the world after 5 years.It will dominate probably after 20-30 years.The statement "only criminals will use cash" is totally wrong.If only the criminals are using cash,the value of paper money will crash dramatically.

senin

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No matter what anyone says, and the cash of the states will exist, if not always, then for a very long time. Of course, there are states with a high standard of living, where they may be trying to get rid of cash. However, I see no need for this. I think that cash will always have its niche for circulation, along with other types of means of payment.
The statement that in five years, only criminals will use cash, sounds at least silly.

magneto

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Quote from: tyz on February 18, 2019, 02:36:21 PM

Tim Draper Predicts Crypto Will Rule, Only Criminals Will Use Cash in Five Years

Billionaire investor and known Bitcoin (BTC) bull Tim Draper argued that in five years, only criminals will use fiat as crypto becomes universally widespread. Draper made his claims in an interview with American financial news tv channel Fox Business released on Feb. 18.

https://cointelegraph.com/news/tim-draper-predicts-crypto-will-rule-only-criminals-will-use-cash-in-five-years

It is clever. Just turn the tables. Something like that is called framing.

I don't think that you can attribute criminal activity to a form of currency that otherwise serves a completely legitimate purpose. He is doing the exact same thing that mainstream media is trying to characterise bitcoin with.

However, there is a high possibility that if bitcoin ever does go mainstream that the usage of cash and precious metals will both significantly decrease, primarily due to the fact that there is a lot of overlaps between the functions of BTC and these other assets, except bitcoin offers more benefits.

Though I don't necessarily think that bitcoin will "replace" fiat, whether cash, or electronic versions. They will coexist in one way, or another. Central banks and governments simply won't let this happen.

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Quote from: Lucius on February 21, 2019, 06:20:34 AM

There is another good reason why cash will not go so quickly to oblivion, and it is the global availability of the Internet.

Why should anyone care about the availability of cash in Tajikistan unless they're a native? What counts is your own part of the world. Somewhere in Europe will have totally gotten rid of cash within the next few years.

And look at the speed mobile payments took off in Africa. It's possible certain places may end up cashless before more advanced economies.

astrodost

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Any particular Idea on how to encash Crypto. I am loosing lot of money so far in Crypto World.

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