@NeuroticFish. However, we should be careful. Similar to Elon Musk, none of them should be trusted. Those types of people will support bitcoin as long as it is very convenient and beneficial for them. Also, the way they act, they might be thinking the community is full of stupid cryptobros. Have you seen Max Keiser act in conferences? Head shaking and everyone is cheering for him. They might have forgotten that he created a pump and dump called Maxcoin.
This news article should also be cause for skepticsm on Bukele.
Public officials and private individuals close to the president of El Salvador, Nayib Bukele, have been linked to a money-laundering scheme involving Venezuelan state oil company PDVSA, according to a recent report.
According to the report published by Washington DC-based thinktank IBI Consultants, Bukele and his inner circle received up to $2 million in loans, either in a personal capacity or through companies related to Alba Petróleos, a PDVSA subsidiary in El Salvador. Additionally, it states that this money was part of a massive money-laundering scheme carried out in Venezuela, El Salvador, the United States and Panama, among other countries.
Source https://insightcrime.org/news/analysis/el-salvadors-president-bukele-linked-to-venezuelan-money-laundering-scheme-report/
Topic: [2022-08-09] Iran makes first import order using cryptocurrency (Read 524 times)
October 07, 2022, 02:18:19 AM
I am not quite certain why the community likes to defend him.
I don't know where you decided I defend the fact he gambled taxpayers' money. I only stated some facts.
But I'll come to your "dilemma" too: people are defending the fact he adopted Bitcoin; they are proud to see such a bitcoiner (i.e. a president, please don't think too far). I'd guess that having a backup of state-owned bitcoins is part of the process. Keep in mind that while we have focused on the price/speculative component of Bitcoin, Bitcoin is a powerful (crypto)currency and I am sure he (or his advisors) have considered that too in the equation.
So let's not over simplify those actions. They are good and bad too, depending the angle you're looking from.
I feel we are going a bit too far off-topic with this. If you think we will keep going on with this debate, how about making a topic specifically about that?
October 06, 2022, 08:11:34 PM
@NeuroticFish. Is that the excuse for using taxpayer's money to speculate and gamble on bitcoin? He is gambling his future in politics? That is a very head shaking argument because behind every politician's move there is always a hidden agenda. We as natives of the cryptospace and holders of bitcoin should know this by now. I am not quite certain why the community likes to defend him. Is it because he is acting very much similar to those annoying and embarassing bitcoinbros?
October 06, 2022, 04:13:25 AM
Agreed that the bull market will return and anyone who invested in bitcoin will have a return on their investment, however, Bukele a highroller? I would not call him that. He is a government official took the risk by using taxpayer's money to speculate on bitcoin hehe.
OK, maybe my wording is incorrect. Many gamblers try to do it with money that's not theirs. However, Bukele is not gambling only taxpayers' money, but also his future in politics (possibly his freedom too).
Still, as I said, it can be one of the smartest gambling/bet I've seen.
October 05, 2022, 11:06:31 PM
On El Salvador, I have asked this before, however, I have not gotten an answer. Would it not be more advantageous for El Salvador if they used Jack Mallers' original plan for Strike of using Tether USDT as the currency and bitcoin's network as the medium of transport? I reckon Bukele would have the advantages of the dollar without owning a Federal Reserve money printer hehehe.
Time will tell. Using Bitcoin was a great advertising for El Salvador. If Bitcoin price will go again over the roof, El Salvador can even sell and get some of their problems fixed, or at least boast their performance (it would mean a couple of % of their GDP).
It is a gamble and Bukele is a high roller. But the history shows that those who did bet on Bitcoin were winning and there's a very good chance Bukele will win too.
Agreed that the bull market will return and anyone who invested in bitcoin will have a return on their investment, however, Bukele a highroller? I would not call him that. He is a government official who took the risk by using taxpayer's money to speculate on bitcoin hehe.
October 05, 2022, 02:31:43 AM
On El Salvador, I have asked this before, however, I have not gotten an answer. Would it not be more advantageous for El Salvador if they used Jack Mallers' original plan for Strike of using Tether USDT as the currency and bitcoin's network as the medium of transport? I reckon Bukele would have the advantages of the dollar without owning a Federal Reserve money printer hehehe.
Time will tell. Using Bitcoin was a great advertising for El Salvador. If Bitcoin price will go again over the roof, El Salvador can even sell and get some of their problems fixed, or at least boast their performance (it would mean a couple of % of their GDP).
It is a gamble and Bukele is a high roller. But the history shows that those who did bet on Bitcoin were winning and there's a very good chance Bukele will win too.
By the way, if this is true and by the end of September, we begin to see large trades in cryptocurrencies, then I personally see another legal tender coming, this time, not bitcoin alone, but for cryptocurrencies - top ones.
Nope. Ethereum with the move for PoS is downgraded to security, no longer safe. Most of the other coins are either centralized, either too small to matter for now.
Whenever a country moves in the direction of freedom it is a good thing, Bitcoin is financial freedom for everyone.
I can assure you that the government of Iran has no interest in giving its people any kind of freedom.Exactly. These countries are going for Bitcoin because it's unstoppable and it helps them avoid sanctions, not because they are interested in freedom.
Even more, in Iran Bitcoin can be used only to import from abroad, not for the population.
October 04, 2022, 08:26:17 PM
then I personally see another legal tender coming, this time, not bitcoin alone, but for cryptocurrencies - top ones.
Highly unlikely specially about altcoins!There is a key difference between El Salvador and Iran. The former is one of the poorest countries that didn't even have their own legal tender (they use another country's fiat!), Iran on the other hand has its own currency and is among the top 10 biggest economies.
I very much agree.
On El Salvador, I have asked this before, however, I have not gotten an answer. Would it not be more advantageous for El Salvador if they used Jack Mallers' original plan for Strike of using Tether USDT as the currency and bitcoin's network as the medium of transport? I reckon Bukele would have the advantages of the dollar without owning a Federal Reserve money printer hehehe.
October 01, 2022, 03:50:35 PM
Whenever a country moves in the direction of freedom it is a good thing, Bitcoin is financial freedom for everyone.
I can assure you that the government of Iran has no interest in giving its people any kind of freedom. The transaction in question was intended to allow Iran to not have to use US and western financial systems. It was to evade sanctions against Iran imposed by the US. I don't think this is good for bitcoin or for crypto, as this shines a negative light.
October 01, 2022, 06:18:49 AM
https://www.reuters.com/business/finance/iran-makes-first-import-order-using-cryptocurrency-tasnim-2022-08-09/
According to Reuters (who is citing another agency), Iran has made this its first official import order using cryptocurrency. It's an order that worth $10M. It doesn't tell it was Bitcoin or not though, and the following part makes it even more confusing:
I'm not even sure whether I should be happy or unhappy about this news, but certainly it's far from unexpected. It's... part of the adoption...
According to Reuters (who is citing another agency), Iran has made this its first official import order using cryptocurrency. It's an order that worth $10M. It doesn't tell it was Bitcoin or not though, and the following part makes it even more confusing:
"By the end of September, the use of cryptocurrencies and smart contracts will be widely used in foreign trade with target countries," an official from the Ministry of Industry, Mine and Trade said on Twitter.
I'm not even sure whether I should be happy or unhappy about this news, but certainly it's far from unexpected. It's... part of the adoption...
Whenever a country moves in the direction of freedom it is a good thing, Bitcoin is financial freedom for everyone.
September 02, 2022, 01:33:14 AM
then I personally see another legal tender coming, this time, not bitcoin alone, but for cryptocurrencies - top ones.
Highly unlikely specially about altcoins!There is a key difference between El Salvador and Iran. The former is one of the poorest countries that didn't even have their own legal tender (they use another country's fiat!), Iran on the other hand has its own currency and is among the top 10 biggest economies.
August 31, 2022, 10:34:58 PM
@Fivestar4everMVP. We should be very happy. I reckon to witness that bitcoin is being used for the strengths given to it by decentralization is one of the evidences that it works, correct? Why should we criticize how it was used? We do not criticized the companies that create automobiles and cell phones for being used in car bombings.
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August 30, 2022, 09:32:25 AM
"By the end of September, the use of cryptocurrencies and smart contracts will be widely used in foreign trade with target countries," an official from the Ministry of Industry, Mine and Trade said on Twitter.
I'm not even sure whether I should be happy or unhappy about this news, but certainly it's far from unexpected. It's... part of the adoption...
By the way, if this is true and by the end of September, we begin to see large trades in cryptocurrencies, then I personally see another legal tender coming, this time, not bitcoin alone, but for cryptocurrencies - top ones.
August 30, 2022, 09:19:11 AM
I will add these here instead of making new topic, since imho it is part of the same discussion:
Iranian Admin Enforces Regulations on Cryptocurrency Trading
IRAN GREENLIGHTS BITCOIN, CRYPTO PAYMENTS FOR IMPORTS: REPORT
It's the same news, I've added both because the first one has a title that may look negative and it's not.
Iranian Admin Enforces Regulations on Cryptocurrency Trading
IRAN GREENLIGHTS BITCOIN, CRYPTO PAYMENTS FOR IMPORTS: REPORT
It's the same news, I've added both because the first one has a title that may look negative and it's not.
[...] Fatemi Amin said the comprehensive and detailed law ratified by the administration defines regulations on cryptocurrencies, the supply of fuel and electricity for mining, and the authorization to use cryptocurrencies.
August 29, 2022, 04:15:24 AM
More news has come out about this approving my initial statement about replacing SWIFT.
Yesterday at the end of the Automotive Manufacturing Revolution Expo, the minister of Industry, Mine and Trade talked about "crypto-asset" regulations and he mentions that the new infrastructure is going to provide the alternative option to be used to import goods using bitcoin instead of USD and EUR.
Car imports were the focus of the press conference and the details of the mechanisms they have to follow.
Bitcoin will be one of the options not the main replacement.
Yesterday at the end of the Automotive Manufacturing Revolution Expo, the minister of Industry, Mine and Trade talked about "crypto-asset" regulations and he mentions that the new infrastructure is going to provide the alternative option to be used to import goods using bitcoin instead of USD and EUR.
Car imports were the focus of the press conference and the details of the mechanisms they have to follow.
Unless China, Russia and Iran decide to use an alternative to SWIFT, I wouldn't be surprised to see more of them using bitcoin in this fashion.
SWIFT was replaced between Iran and other countries with alternative methods of payment at least 4 years ago. Russia and China are now joining in this year [publicly]. More countries that are members of BRICS or SCO are planning to join in the near future.Bitcoin will be one of the options not the main replacement.
August 29, 2022, 02:01:56 AM
@cr1776. Agreed. Also, if those articles and stories about the government of Iran mining bitcoin through their chosen delegates of miners are real, I reckon yes, it would not be very shocking if they choose to use bitcoin instead of an alternative to SWIFT.
August 25, 2022, 08:29:30 AM
Well, we all know that Iran are still being sanctioned by the US, as we can see from this article a week ago ==> https://www.thenationalnews.com/world/us-news/2022/08/01/us-slaps-fresh-oil-sanctions-on-iran-as-nuclear-talks-stall/ ....
We also know that countries are using Crypto currencies to evade sanctions and also SWIFT transfers that can be monitored and blocked. So this is nothing new.... they just made this public, to make a political statement that these sanctions will not stop them from trading with other countries.
We also know that countries are using Crypto currencies to evade sanctions and also SWIFT transfers that can be monitored and blocked. So this is nothing new.... they just made this public, to make a political statement that these sanctions will not stop them from trading with other countries.
Unless China, Russia and Iran decide to use an alternative to SWIFT, I wouldn't be surprised to see more of them using bitcoin in this fashion.
August 14, 2022, 08:45:33 PM
Well, we all know that Iran are still being sanctioned by the US, as we can see from this article a week ago ==> https://www.thenationalnews.com/world/us-news/2022/08/01/us-slaps-fresh-oil-sanctions-on-iran-as-nuclear-talks-stall/ ....
We also know that countries are using Crypto currencies to evade sanctions and also SWIFT transfers that can be monitored and blocked. So this is nothing new.... they just made this public, to make a political statement that these sanctions will not stop them from trading with other countries.
We also know that countries are using Crypto currencies to evade sanctions and also SWIFT transfers that can be monitored and blocked. So this is nothing new.... they just made this public, to make a political statement that these sanctions will not stop them from trading with other countries.
Also, did Iran not legalize bitcoin mining or their government began mining bitcoin for themselves through taking advantage of partnerships with bitcoin miners because of the cheap electricity offer? I read an article about this but I forgot where it was published. It was an opinion by a contributor where it was speculated that those miners in Iran are really mining for the government. It appears those coins mined were useful for them hehehe.
August 12, 2022, 01:11:49 AM
Bitcoin is a good option for us (regular people), the governments want to have full control but they can't control anything about bitcoin. That includes the price which is volatile and that makes it a less desirable option for big trades.
But a gov-coin or CBDC is basically the same as fiat, they can control everything about it just like the existing banking system.
But a gov-coin or CBDC is basically the same as fiat, they can control everything about it just like the existing banking system.
OK, it makes sense, however, when entity1 and entity2 make trade, my feeling is that if entity1 sells for entity2 IOUs or CBDCs (which value can be manipulated heavily and even turned to 0) is like giving a loan without proper collateral. Of course, a state will probably pay it (with the note that even national currencies' value is manipulated a little), still, using entity3 or, better, an independent "value" instead of entity2's whatever, makes more sense in my head.
The amount I mentioned above was the total in multiple countries not SK alone ($7 billion in SK), and it is not a "story", there has been a long conflict over this money for the past 4 years and they still haven't given it back simply because US doesn't let them!
This is for example part of this long drama last year:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/dominicdudley/2021/02/24/south-korea-agrees-to-unfreeze-1-billion-in-iranian-assets-following-tanker-seizure-by-tehran/
This is for example part of this long drama last year:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/dominicdudley/2021/02/24/south-korea-agrees-to-unfreeze-1-billion-in-iranian-assets-following-tanker-seizure-by-tehran/
Complicated story. I don't know if it's SWIFT or the banks, but I've got the point. However, maybe my words were unfortunately chosen. I didn't say the story is false (I didn't know nor care much), my point was that it's shown to the public in order to not say "we want to avoid the problems Russia has with SWIFT" (which can easily happen due to what happens internationally)
Well, we all know that Iran are still being sanctioned by the US, as we can see from this article a week ago ==> https://www.thenationalnews.com/world/us-news/2022/08/01/us-slaps-fresh-oil-sanctions-on-iran-as-nuclear-talks-stall/ ....
We also know that countries are using Crypto currencies to evade sanctions and also SWIFT transfers that can be monitored and blocked. So this is nothing new.... they just made this public, to make a political statement that these sanctions will not stop them from trading with other countries.
We also know that countries are using Crypto currencies to evade sanctions and also SWIFT transfers that can be monitored and blocked. So this is nothing new.... they just made this public, to make a political statement that these sanctions will not stop them from trading with other countries.
This is something I don't understand. They can very well use any kind of IOUs in the same way, I don't see why CryptoRial is seen as a good choice. I mean, Iran can declare in any second they no longer recognize CryptoRial and other states get scammed. (I know, it's not very likely, but still... Bitcoin is safer option)
Bitcoin is a good option for us (regular people), the governments want to have full control but they can't control anything about bitcoin. That includes the price which is volatile and that makes it a less desirable option for big trades.But a gov-coin or CBDC is basically the same as fiat, they can control everything about it just like the existing banking system.
Quote
of course they are scared they'll face the same. The "stolen" part may be more a story for the public.
The amount I mentioned above was the total in multiple countries not SK alone ($7 billion in SK), and it is not a "story", there has been a long conflict over this money for the past 4 years and they still haven't given it back simply because US doesn't let them!This is for example part of this long drama last year:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/dominicdudley/2021/02/24/south-korea-agrees-to-unfreeze-1-billion-in-iranian-assets-following-tanker-seizure-by-tehran/
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