21 million is it just a pointless number and nothing to do with scarcity? - page 2.

palle11

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Quote from: pealr12 on March 01, 2021, 03:27:44 PM

I think the scarcity part is only related to owing 1BTC and not the sat, btc only have 21 million aside from the little particles that make it whole and not many people have 1 btc, and if btc where to be shared among 21 million people that makes it scarce since only 21 million people out of the world population will have it, in this scenario, sat does not matter.

It is to ask if there will be a time when it will be scarce and that is simply a no. What happens to this question of op is about demand and supply. According to economic terms, a seller will be ready to sell at a particular time and price. The time is operational and capable to further push price up. So you see the worst that can happen is that bitcoin price will keep increase because of the value that will land on it as more demand for it will be made. Bitcoin is broken down into smaller units as satoshi, mbtcs and not just a coin.

odolvlobo

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Quote from: InvoKing on March 01, 2021, 04:59:26 PM

Quote from: aoluain on March 01, 2021, 04:43:08 PM

....But its a limit.

There isn't a limit. 21M is the cap for BTC. In the past people used to buy things like pizza with thousands of BTC but now you can buy the same pizza with 2 mBTC and in the upcoming years we will buy it with 2 Satoshi then 2 mSatoshi and so on.

While the value is limitless, the number is limited. In contrast, the number of dollars is limitless.

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Quote from: aoluain on March 01, 2021, 04:43:08 PM

....But its a limit.

There isn't a limit. 21M is the cap for BTC. In the past people used to buy things like pizza with thousands of BTC but now you can buy the same pizza with 2 mBTC and in the upcoming years we will buy it with 2 Satoshi then 2 mSatoshi and so on.

odolvlobo

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Quote from: cuttingman on March 01, 2021, 02:01:06 PM

I watch videos and read websites about Bitcoin and they mention the 21 million limit to make it sound very scarce. But since there are 100 million Satoshi in a Bitcoin it doesn't seem scarce to me.

"Scarce" doesn't mean "rare". It is a term in economics that means that demand always has the potential to exceed supply.

The supply of air on the earth is finite but it is not scarce because there is always more available than is needed. You need some air? Take a breath. And while fresh water is certainly not rare (it falls out of the sky), it is scarce because the supply is exceeded by the potential demand.

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/scarcity.asp

One characteristic of a scarce resource is that the supply and demand curves are guaranteed to cross. That is not true for resources that are not scarce.

aoluain

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....But its a limit.
Consider that supply is deflationary and demand is rising,
Try buying some in the near future and you will know about scarcity.

What can we compare it to?
FIAT = unlimited
GOLD = unknown

cuttingman

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100 pennies is a dollar, so 100 Satoshis could have been 1 bitcoin. Why did they choose 21 million? To sound scarcer than 21 trillion?

$48,500 for 1 bitcoin or $48,500 for 100 million Satoshis.

suzanne5223

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Quote from: cuttingman on March 01, 2021, 02:01:06 PM

I watch videos and read websites about Bitcoin and they mention the 21 million limit to make it sound very scarce.

They make it sound like it was scarce because it will be during halving season and also when the total 21 million is mine.

Quote from: cuttingman on March 01, 2021, 02:01:06 PM

There are 2,100,000,000,000,000 Satoshi, so if 100 Satoshi (or in tradition money standards 100 pennies), that would mean 21,000,000,000,000.00 Bitcoin. 21 Trillion Bitcoin doesn't sound so scarce now does it...

No, your calculation is wrong cause a single Satoshi is one hundred millionth of a single bitcoin that's (0.00000001 BTC), so it would be 210,000,000,000,000.00 Satoshi not even Bitcoin dollar cause Satoshi is the unit of Bitcoin just like cent is unit of dollar.

Swordsoffreedom

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You are talking about the Future of the Future.
It is estimated that the last block will be mined probably at 2140. so it will take more than 120 years to mine the next 3 million Bitcoin.
within the next 10 years, the price will go skyrocket, so it is too early to attempt to make us scared.

A lot can change in the next 100 years, as example:
A big change can happen within this time, we don't know maybe satoshi programmed it.
or
The alternative to electricity may come, or electricity can be obtained at a so-called price,
As a result, miners would be satisfied only with the mining fee.
or
self mining hardware wallet may come
or
something new things [like Lightning network] may come to handle this.

So, it is too early to be scared, before 2140 we all are going to heaven with our profit.

seoincorporation

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Quote from: cuttingman on March 01, 2021, 02:01:06 PM

I watch videos and read websites about Bitcoin and they mention the 21 million limit to make it sound very scarce. But since there are 100 million Satoshi in a Bitcoin it doesn't seem scarce to me.

I mean if it was 2.1 million Bitcoin and 1000 million Satoshi or 210 million Bitcoin and 10 million Satoshi it changes the scarcity push.

There are 2,100,000,000,000,000 Satoshi, so if 100 Satoshi (or in tradition money standards 100 pennies), that would mean 21,000,000,000,000.00 Bitcoin. 21 Trillion Bitcoin doesn't sound so scarce now does it...

Satoshi decides to give 8 ceros after the point to bitcoin because he has a vision of the future where people can move big amounts of money with satoshis.

But what we have to see now is the fees going down to 100 satoshis. That way bitcoin will go back to normal transactions without having to paying those enormous fees that we have nowadays.

coolcoinz

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I'll cut it short:
You can see that Bitcoin became quite expensive at 60k USD a piece and we haven't even managed to overtaken some of the biggest private companies in the world. At a total of 2.1 million Bitcoins, how would you be able to afford it? How would you be able to transact? I feel like the lucky 21 is just right.

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Quote from: cuttingman on March 01, 2021, 02:01:06 PM

I mean if it was 2.1 million Bitcoin and 1000 million Satoshi or 210 million Bitcoin and 10 million Satoshi it changes the scarcity push.

Satoshi is literally a lower unit of Bitcoin. $1 is equal 100 cents, this does not increase the value of a dollar in any way, it's just a way of representing it in lower units.
If you have a single room to house 10 people, demarcating it into little corners does not solve the the housing problem; little corners does not make a room, 1 Satoshi does not make a Bitcoin.

Quote from: cuttingman on March 01, 2021, 02:01:06 PM

There are 2,100,000,000,000,000 Satoshi, so if 100 Satoshi (or in tradition money standards 100 pennies), that would mean 21,000,000,000,000.00 Bitcoin. 21 Trillion Bitcoin doesn't sound so scarce now does it...

This doesn't make any sense.

This scarcity argument is a tired one and anyone who brings it up doesn't understand how Bitcoin or measurements work.

Lanatsa

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People or majority do think about 1:1 ratio but we do know that 1 bitcoin is equal to million which would really be that enough and scarcity thing is just on the mindset of those

people who do think off that 1 bitcoin should be the standard on getting rich or owning one will be relevant or significant.Its too early to think about scarcity

because we aren't into that level where we should mind off on how bitcoin to be diversified globally.

pealr12

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I think the scarcity part is only related to owing 1BTC and not the sat, btc only have 21 million aside from the little particles that make it whole and not many people have 1 btc, and if btc where to be shared among 21 million people that makes it scarce since only 21 million people out of the world population will have it, in this scenario, sat does not matter.

blockman

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I don't get the comparison of one whole bitcoin to sats or mbtcs. It's like you're getting a hundred dollar and denominates it in centavos, ones, and tens. That seems to be the likely of your explanation or question about its limit.

Quote from: ?? on ??

It was never stated that bitcoin or any other crypto coin have a limited supply and even if their do have limited supply it can never be scarce and what determine it value is the price.

Bitcoin has limited supply and scarce.

xhomerx10

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Quote from: AB de Royse777 on March 01, 2021, 02:57:42 PM

Quote from: cuttingman on March 01, 2021, 02:01:06 PM

I watch videos and read websites about Bitcoin and they mention the 21 million limit to make it sound very scarce. But since there are 100 million Satoshi in a Bitcoin it doesn't seem scarce to me.

I mean if it was 2.1 million Bitcoin and 1000 million Satoshi or 210 million Bitcoin and 10 million Satoshi it changes the scarcity push.

There are 2,100,000,000,000,000 Satoshi, so if 100 Satoshi (or in tradition money standards 100 pennies), that would mean 21,000,000,000,000.00 Bitcoin. 21 Trillion Bitcoin doesn't sound so scarce now does it...

Not sure if you are complaining or compliment. The best feature that bitcoin has is its decentralization and limited supply.

Quote from: xhomerx10 on March 01, 2021, 02:03:36 PM

Not at all and I will sell you as many as I can for a buck a piece. Deal?

But right now 2,100,000,000,000,000 Satosh = $48,000 which means you are asking too much. Maybe after a few decades OP will gladly accept it :-D

I wont complain if he wants to pay me a buck a sat now.

AB de Royse777

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Quote from: cuttingman on March 01, 2021, 02:01:06 PM

I watch videos and read websites about Bitcoin and they mention the 21 million limit to make it sound very scarce. But since there are 100 million Satoshi in a Bitcoin it doesn't seem scarce to me.

I mean if it was 2.1 million Bitcoin and 1000 million Satoshi or 210 million Bitcoin and 10 million Satoshi it changes the scarcity push.

There are 2,100,000,000,000,000 Satoshi, so if 100 Satoshi (or in tradition money standards 100 pennies), that would mean 21,000,000,000,000.00 Bitcoin. 21 Trillion Bitcoin doesn't sound so scarce now does it...

Not sure if you are complaining or compliment. The best feature that bitcoin has is its decentralization and limited supply.

Quote from: xhomerx10 on March 01, 2021, 02:03:36 PM

Not at all and I will sell you as many as I can for a buck a piece. Deal?

But right now 2,100,000,000,000,000 Satosh = $48,000 which means you are asking too much. Maybe after a few decades OP will gladly accept it :-D

xhomerx10

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Quote from: cuttingman on March 01, 2021, 02:01:06 PM

I watch videos and read websites about Bitcoin and they mention the 21 million limit to make it sound very scarce. But since there are 100 million Satoshi in a Bitcoin it doesn't seem scarce to me.

I mean if it was 2.1 million Bitcoin and 1000 million Satoshi or 210 million Bitcoin and 10 million Satoshi it changes the scarcity push.

There are 2,100,000,000,000,000 Satoshi, so if 100 Satoshi (or in tradition money standards 100 pennies), that would mean 21,000,000,000,000.00 Bitcoin. 21 Trillion Bitcoin doesn't sound so scarce now does it...

Not at all and I will sell you as many as I can for a buck a piece. Deal?

cuttingman

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I watch videos and read websites about Bitcoin and they mention the 21 million limit to make it sound very scarce. But since there are 100 million Satoshi in a Bitcoin it doesn't seem scarce to me.

I mean if it was 2.1 million Bitcoin and 1000 million Satoshi or 210 million Bitcoin and 10 million Satoshi it changes the scarcity push.

There are 2,100,000,000,000,000 Satoshi, so if 100 Satoshi (or in tradition money standards 100 pennies), that would mean 21,000,000,000,000.00 Bitcoin. 21 Trillion Bitcoin doesn't sound so scarce now does it...

Topic: 21 million is it just a pointless number and nothing to do with scarcity? - page 2. (Read 402 times)