900,000 illegal bitcoins. | Bitcointalksearch.org

bitcoinst

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Quote from: ChiBitCTy on July 31, 2020, 10:12:42 AM

These are definitely interesting numbers, but it certainly doesn't come as any surprise to me that the numbers are this high. I would love to see the numbers for fiat currency, they would be so far beyond these numbers it's not even funny. I think it's important people keep that in mind.

And for fiat currency, such figures would not be comparable.
In addition, these numbers do not seem to me too high, less than 5% of BTC are conditionally illegal, and the fact that this can be tracked is certainly much greater advantage than the fact that they are "problematic".

0nline

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BTCBTC How about use those bitcoin for good purpose,

goldade

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I do not think we need to be bothered as to where our coins originate from. Just like fiat, which have circulated so much that we do not care about it's origin, whether legal or illegal, we do not have to worry about the origins of the coins.
Trillions of fiat currencies have originated illegally and yet have found it's way into circulation that have gone through even many of us. As long as your coins aren't used for illegal purposes, I believe you're good to go

int03h

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I do not pay much attention to these because they will find a way to dissolve them into the market. Thousands of Bitcoin transactions are made every day. It could be done through exchanges, peer-to-peer, and they would certainly have to go through a mixer to make illegal money legal. Currently there are thousands of bitcoins that cannot be recovered from private wallets. I just look at their chart and believe bitcoin will continue to increase in value.

friends1980

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Not quite sure what these figures are based on. I suppose these criminals didn't PM the writer of the article to let them know how much they have in their bags. The probable conclusion is therefore that these charts are based on stats, which I personally believe is crap.

Another important question, and people stated this before, is how you define "illegal". I think we all know the definition of "crime" but "illegal" as a concept is a lot larger than "crime".

This is however, in spite of the shortcomings of the original article, a very interesting discussion. (which I am not used to in the General Discussion Boards Grin

)

What about coins that were bought with legal money but not declared to the IRS? Are these coins illegal?

What about coins that were bought with money from gambling or prostitution in a country were gambling or prostitution are legal, but by someone who lives in a country were it is illegal? Are these coins illegal?

As you see, this deserves an in-depth discussion, which is way too large to be simply captured within the limitations of a simple chart.

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Quote from: ChiBitCTy on July 31, 2020, 10:12:42 AM

These are definitely interesting numbers, but it certainly doesn't come as any surprise to me that the numbers are this high. I would love to see the numbers for fiat currency, they would be so far beyond these numbers it's not even funny. I think it's important people keep that in mind.

That would be the smartest indicative statistic for Fiat.
Even if this data is correct, it is less than 5% of the total amount of Bitcoins. Even if they hit the market at the same time, they won't change anything. First, their movements will be immediately noticed.
Secondly, if the price drops slightly due to the sale of these BTC, then this will be an excellent chance to increase the volume of BTC in your portfolio.

TimeTeller

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Quote from: AB de Royse777 on July 28, 2020, 11:59:08 AM

Quote from: bitcoinst on July 28, 2020, 11:51:14 AM

One day, all these bitcoins will somehow hit the market. Undecided

It's very possible that our coins are already mixed with illegal coins those were marked on the addresses. You never know.

Does this worry you much?
It doesn't for me.

When we deal with cash, we do not know the source of that cash whether it came from an illegal or legal source one hand before me. I think the Bitcoin hatters are very active to plant the seeds in our head some day we will be in trouble. There will be time when we will not have these centralized exchanges with centralized fiat, there will be a time when we will not have any centralized financial system. Wait for those days.

PS: I am not encouraging those illegal Bitcoin traders by any means. I just think that nothing can stop Bitcoin.

Quote from: Dominic_Crypto on August 10, 2020, 03:32:09 AM

Bitcoin is very actively used in the Dark Net. Therefore, there is no guarantee who had your coins in the past. It's the same as with paper dollars ... yesterday this money could be used to pay for drugs or weapons, and you got change with them in the supermarket. Because of this, you did not become a criminal.

Just like what Royse777 stated above. We have no idea where are our coins originated.
As long as you know you're not doing illegal activity, you are good to go and you don't have to worry.
Same with our fiat money, we don't know how many hands had it passed on.
And with crypto mixers, very likely that at some point we encountered some of those illegal bitcoins.

Dominic_Crypto

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Bitcoin is very actively used in the Dark Net. Therefore, there is no guarantee who had your coins in the past. It's the same as with paper dollars ... yesterday this money could be used to pay for drugs or weapons, and you got change with them in the supermarket. Because of this, you did not become a criminal.

imstillthebest

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Quote from: mariah.sadio on August 10, 2020, 02:40:47 AM

And this numbers is only growing....

they are because illegal activities are always there and they only got stronger when market of cryptos are pumping . the known numbers are roughly close to 900k btc's but the the rest of btc belongs to legit transactions so its fine i guess ? while there are also btc that doesnt belong to someone else because they havent been mined yet but we can still do something like controlling the scams , hacks and other ilegal acts as early as possible before those btc fall to wrong hands

Bitcoin_bullish

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The problem with the Bitcoins held by criminals and scammers is that their activities are rising and becoming more of a problem. There is a growing use of Bitcoin in the darknet markets and increasing concerns. This may be used by governments as an excuse to ban or regulate Bitcoin unfavorably.

The chart below shows the use of Bitcoin by the dark web markets. While this activity is rising Bitcoin will keep being seen as a method to facilitate transactions coming from illicit activities. Russia for example passed a law recently regulating cryptocurrencies but not allowing the Russian population to use them as a currency, which is their actual purpose.

Image link

mariah.sadio

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And this numbers is only growing....

Congyang

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This problem has been around for some time, because there are many who suspect that the value of bitcoins could be greater or smaller in number entering illegal areas. but because there is no security regulatory agency that oversees bitcoin, it will not be on the trending topic of cryptocurrency forums and legal security agencies.

pawanjain

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Nothing lasts forever

And who says that these numbers are correct. It might happen that these numbers are wrong and may be the number is even higher.
We can't even say that the bitcoins we hold in our wallets have come from a good source.
May be somebody would have used it for illegal activities but bud that doesn't make a difference.
Even fiat money would have been used for criminal activities and then used by us but money is money.
So in the same way bitcoins are bitcoins and there's no such thing as illegal bitcoin.

bitcoinst

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Quote from: jerrison on August 08, 2020, 01:18:35 PM

I have seen and heard severally that loads of fraudulent acts are now aided through the use of virtual or digital currency but that is not to say that Bitcoin has bad tenets. People frankly use money for whatever they deem fit as long as it is unde their possession as their property. i personally don't see the need for attaching bitcoin to things as these because the dollar is never metnioned in this context.

What are you speaking about? Repeatedly?
Most of the darknet uses bitcoin. The fact that bitcoin is used by drug dealers is said by all the media whenever possible. Judging by these statistics, "dirty" bitcoins are less than 5%, however, in the minds of ordinary people we can say that all bitcoins are "dirty".

hanisa

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It is true that many currencies are linked to illicit activities, but it is not something that we should worry much about, Bitcoin is like any currency, when we receive a few dollars we do not know the origin much less to what that money is related.

jerrison

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Quote from: bitcoinst on July 28, 2020, 11:51:14 AM

At least 870,000 bitcoins are associated with illegal activities. This is about $ 10 billion.

Darknet marketplaces - 585,000 BTC.
Stolen bitcoins - 204,000 BTC.
Scam project organizers - 98,000 BTC.
Other illegal activities 3,000 BTC.

https://markets.chainalysis.com/#risk-illicit-placement

One day, all these bitcoins will somehow hit the market. Undecided

I have seen and heard severally that loads of fraudulent acts are now aided through the use of virtual or digital currency but that is not to say that Bitcoin has bad tenets. People frankly use money for whatever they deem fit as long as it is unde their possession as their property. i personally don't see the need for attaching bitcoin to things as these because the dollar is never metnioned in this context.

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Quote from: NotFuzzyWarm on July 28, 2020, 12:40:46 PM

Quote from: bitcoinst on July 28, 2020, 11:51:14 AM

At least 870,000 bitcoins are associated with illegal activities. This is about $ 10 billion.
....
One day, all these bitcoins will somehow hit the market. Undecided

So what?
There is no doubt many more 10's of billions of dollars in fiat associated with illegal activities.
Fun Fact: At least in the West, check any large random sample of paper currency and there will be traces of cocaine on much of it. Does anyone worry about that? No.

Well if you put together all the money being generated by illegal drugs, black market, and illegal arms trade then it will surpass the amount of bitcoins that is being discussed here. So I do not really worry that this will affect bitcoin altogether. All of believe that Bitcoin makes us anonymous and most of us believe that we can't remove the fact that there will be organizations and persons that would do illegal things with Bitcoin and crypto currencies.

Yatsan

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Well, it seems like you have exposed the dark side of how Bitcoins are being used by some people working on illegal works to keep on making money. Yes, that was the sad reality that a big bunch of Bitcoins are being used illegally by some people to do their dirty jobs and make transactions by using cryptos but how can we be able to know that such Bitcoin we have received have came out from those illegal transactions if like paper money, Bitcoins are being circulated to provide the users demands and it was freely transferred through transactions. If that's the case, then we cannot tell from which hands does the Bitcoin we have came from.

But we must come to think that this were just a part of the whole Bitcoin circulating in the market and must not embody it as a whole. We cannot control people on how they would use their Bitcoins but this must not lead to misinformation that illegal transactions are being done all due by Bitcoin because a big part of it is still a clean track of transactions that are used for legal activities. All currencies have their flaws which are made up of people using it. The problem is not on Bitcoin but on the people doing illegal transactions using it.

Janation

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At first I was worried about this but then I read someone's post saying without these illegal transactions, Bitcoin might not be the same.

Bitcoin may not be fully anonymous but we can't remove the fact that there will always be those people that would take advantage of these to do illegal transactions. I think that billion might not even be comparable to trillions and trillions of fiats being used to the same kind of acts until now.

bitbunnny

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: ChiBitCTy on July 31, 2020, 10:12:42 AM

These are definitely interesting numbers, but it certainly doesn't come as any surprise to me that the numbers are this high. I would love to see the numbers for fiat currency, they would be so far beyond these numbers it's not even funny. I think it's important people keep that in mind.

And for fiat currency, such figures would not be comparable.
In addition, these numbers do not seem to me too high, less than 5% of BTC are conditionally illegal, and the fact that this can be tracked is certainly much greater advantage than the fact that they are "problematic".

Exactly, these figures doesn't seem so large and dramatic. Maybe the amount that can't be traced is bigger, however compared to amount of illegal fiat money this is nothing to worry about. We all know that Bitcoin is used for illegal activities as well but so it's fiat with the difference that no one is making drama out of that and stigmatite fiat currencies like they are doing with Bitcoin.

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