A dog that vomited and then ate the vomit again - page 2.

gunhell16

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Quote from: Silberman on October 20, 2023, 04:32:57 PM

Quote from: Juse14 on October 18, 2023, 12:57:29 PM

Indeed, when we talk about a man, it is his words that a true man holds and is accountable for. However, there are two people we can't take his word for. apart from charlatans namely critics and politicians. We will never be able to take these two people for granted because they say something like this now, and tomorrow or the day after tomorrow they will say something else as long as it can benefit them.

And I'm not quite surprised by people who behave like that because I personally have been involved in political movements on several occasions and often meet people like that. And people like that can be sycophants when they are on the side that provides benefits and they can also be barking dogs when they don't get any benefits.

We must not forget that Warren Buffett is a businessman, and like any businessman he is not really tied to any ideology or some kind of principle that rules his life, he is after the money, and if something gives him huge profits then that makes it good on his eyes and if it does not then this makes it bad, it is that simple, so Buffett is against investing directly on this market but now we are seeing that he is fine to invest indirectly on it as long as he can get some money out of it.

Warren B. is a businessman, therefore he will undoubtedly allow anything that will help him generate money in as long as he stands to benefit from it. Even if we claim that he has recanted or changed his mind about his unfavorable opinions toward Bitcoin or other cryptocurrencies, his actions will ultimately benefit him, not us.

Is there anything improper with his doing this, if it turns out that he has switched to cryptocurrencies, if it ever is true? Is there really nothing? Instead, we will be glad that another millionaire is working in this sector of the cryptocurrency economy.

Silberman

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Quote from: Juse14 on October 18, 2023, 12:57:29 PM

Indeed, when we talk about a man, it is his words that a true man holds and is accountable for. However, there are two people we can't take his word for. apart from charlatans namely critics and politicians. We will never be able to take these two people for granted because they say something like this now, and tomorrow or the day after tomorrow they will say something else as long as it can benefit them.

And I'm not quite surprised by people who behave like that because I personally have been involved in political movements on several occasions and often meet people like that. And people like that can be sycophants when they are on the side that provides benefits and they can also be barking dogs when they don't get any benefits.

We must not forget that Warren Buffett is a businessman, and like any businessman he is not really tied to any ideology or some kind of principle that rules his life, he is after the money, and if something gives him huge profits then that makes it good on his eyes and if it does not then this makes it bad, it is that simple, so Buffett is against investing directly on this market but now we are seeing that he is fine to invest indirectly on it as long as he can get some money out of it.

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Quote from: Poker Player on October 17, 2023, 09:31:07 PM

Quote from: kingvirtus09 on October 17, 2023, 08:14:52 PM

~snip~

The fact that he has invested in this company that now offers crypto-services is normal to a certain extent, since the cryptocurrency market is getting bigger and bigger and covers many areas of society.

WB is a shrewd businessman. That's the way I like to view him. He makes a decision and sees that decision as what can affect his finances, he quietly retreats without openly recounting. If WB were still holding his anti-Bitcoin view, he would've pulled out of NuBank. I don't begrudge him his decision. It's his money and his choice to make. One thing I've come to hold with close conviction is that no one should blindly follow another when it comes to cryptos. No one knows it all.

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He also spent a long time without changing his cell phone...

That reminds me of a certain serving politician in my country, one of the worst of them all – corrupt to the teeth. The said politician claimed he never changed his phone for years but that doesn't make any difference as he's not in anyway better than those who change theirs on a regular.

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For the little time he has left to live, do not give so much importance to what he says.

That man can outlive Methuselah 🧐

Juse14

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Indeed, when we talk about a man, it is his words that a true man holds and is accountable for. However, there are two people we can't take his word for. apart from charlatans namely critics and politicians. We will never be able to take these two people for granted because they say something like this now, and tomorrow or the day after tomorrow they will say something else as long as it can benefit them.

And I'm not quite surprised by people who behave like that because I personally have been involved in political movements on several occasions and often meet people like that. And people like that can be sycophants when they are on the side that provides benefits and they can also be barking dogs when they don't get any benefits.

Dr.Bitcoin_Strange

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It's nothing new that there can always be some false news like this, but even if it were real, then there's nothing bad about it. Buffett has been preaching about the investment he likes most and how he dislikes the crypto investment, but despite his criticism, it doesn't remove anything from Bitcoin; it's made less of blockchain technology. There's a saying that "change is a constant thing in life." So if he decided to have a rethink overnight that made him invest in cryptocurrency, then it's not my business; it's his business because he definitely would reap the benefits of his investment. The first time I read some of his criticisms of cryptocurrency, what I said to myself that day was, "I will not be surprised if any news comes out in the future that Warren Buffett has been secretly investing in Bitcoin, despite the hate speech he made publicly about cryptocurrency.

Twentyonepaylots

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Quote from: Dave1 on October 17, 2023, 09:45:50 PM

He could have some narrative behind why he continue to attack bitcoin, nevertheless the effect is just temporary though. Maybe he secretly invested on bitcoin, or someone as a hedge fund manager acts for him to be a investor, we will never know.

That's what probably is the cause why he did continue to attack bitcoin, he's just into it and wanted bitcoin to gain popularity. Just some reverse psycho thing, we know he's smart when it comes to investment.

Quote from: Dave1 on October 17, 2023, 09:45:50 PM

Obviously, he has a ton of money already and maybe just playing around and see how it goes for him. For sure though that he knows that NuBank is crypto friendly, but then again, if we talk about profits, it doesn't matter to this billionaire as they will continue to invest which they think will be big someday, including a crypto friendly bank.

If he just wanted to warn the public about bitcoin, he will not go as far as what he did to bitcoin, it was something else on his end to sell mouths against bitcoin. I guess banks won't have to call him telling about their investments, it is him who called NuBank to invest, he's smart enough to play with the businesses especially with the money he has, I bet he has some holdings that he didn't name after him due to his investment confidence rate.

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Warren always be so cold on Bitcoin and crypto, calling it scam here and there, it's normal when you don't understand something to the core you know, how many people are like Warren in the past? For example Micheal Saylor also talk trash Bitcoin years ago too, there are others too that I couldn't remember their names anymore, what happened after? They realize their mistakes and slowly start learning about crypto.

Warren case is different because he is older and his style ways of earning money is from stocks and real estate, this was all he did his whole life, including Gold, but now comes digital gold? It's easier for who he was to call Bitcoin names honestly, anyone can also do the same.

If later Warren decide to embrace Bitcoin I won't be surprised, because he isn't the first and he isn't going to be the last too, so it's not something to hate him for, lack of understanding is always why people condemn Bitcoin.

DrBeer

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Quote from: kingvirtus09 on October 17, 2023, 08:14:52 PM

.....
What do you think?

There is a "beautiful", official version - the gentleman you mentioned invested in the bank "as a bank", and had no idea that the bank is still a supporter of the introduction of cryptocurrency technologies. Whether this is true or not is very difficult to answer. There is neither direct evidence nor direct refutation. Although neither option can be excluded

PS You can watch the reaction - the ideal proof" - withdrawal of investments from the financial institution

Vispilio

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Quote from: kingvirtus09 on October 17, 2023, 08:14:52 PM

This means that W. Buffett has a personal interest in why he is always criticizing Bitcoin, because he probably thinks that when many people panic about what he will say and there is a dump in the market value of Bitcoin, he will take advantage of the opportunity to buy large holdings. It's just that what he wanted to happen didn't happen; this is just my assessment based on the information I found here.

This is like one of the main tenets of "Cigar butt investing", though I don't think that's what's going on here.

More likely some of his advisors suggested that he do a deep dive on crypto, that it's here to stay, and on second consideration they collectively decided that it's ok to have some exposure to such an attractive asset class after all, both directly and indirectly...

jcojci

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Someone like W. Buffett can change his mind as quickly as he wants, especially since he has enormous resources in the form of money. Maybe at that time he wasn't interested in crypto but after he studied crypto (secretly), he was interested and finally, the news came out. We also don't know what really happened to him and there's no need to think too deeply about it.

We just have to see what it will do. Will he support crypto where he previously hated crypto? Or something else will happen. Everyone has their own interests, especially when it comes to bitcoin. So you don't need to be surprised by that.

kingvirtus09

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Quote from: davis196 on October 18, 2023, 05:55:44 AM

1.I think that your forum thread title is very misleading and I smell clickbait. Grin

Do you suggest that Warren Buffet is "the dog that vomited and ate the vomit"? Why would you think of such disgusting thing? Grin

No it is not a clickbait, and you were right on that, His criticisms of Bitcoin are as if he had vomited, and then he also supports cryptocurrency, which is equivalent to eating his vomit again.

And I also see hypocrisy in his personality in the words he utters, even though I know that he was already a very rich person before Bitcoin was actually created, and we know that, of course, it's already given. That's the only thing I attacked that he released, criticizing Bitcoin.

davis196

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1.I think that your forum thread title is very misleading and I smell clickbait. Grin

Do you suggest that Warren Buffet is "the dog that vomited and ate the vomit"? Why would you think of such disgusting thing? Grin

2.Berkshire Hathaway has it's own managers and directors, who are running the business. Just because Berkshire Hathaway had bought some crypto-friendly financial institution in Brazil doesn't mean that Warren Buffet has something to do with this decision. Buffet is just a big shareholder of the company.
3.Many people would think that Buffet is a hypocrite, when he talks about Bitcoin/crypto, but I think that he is sincere in his hatred towards Bitcoin. I can totally understand why he hates Bitcoin/crypto.

Die_empty

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Quote from: Adbitco on October 17, 2023, 10:32:57 PM

He might be among but that doesn't mean he won't speak what is in his mind about crypto sometimes with the sudden growth of bitcoin and the cryptocurrency industry can easily gets him convinced about his view before but, let us also consider this as well. W. Buffetts is a businessman and can do whatever to make money from his investment in other to sustain his wealth, wealth can only be sustain through investment and if he noticed instability in his investment he can pull out his investment back as I believe to know that he is a man that stands on he's words. Well human can change at anytime but let's watch to know he's reactions as they get deeper into their cryptocurrency developments phase.

Businessmen are like politicians who don't have permanent friends or enemies but are driven by personal interests. Warren Buffet is looking for ways to make more money and he is gradually moving away from traditional financial firms to fintech. He has sold off his $1.8bn shares in Visa and $1.3bn stake in Mastercard and channelled the money to invest in this Brazilian fintech bank.

We should also note that Berkshire Hathaway is not the major shareholder of Nu Holdings. His firm just owns 2.98% which is valued at $844,096,030. There are other top investors like Sc Us (ttgp), Ltd, Galileo (ptc) Ltd and Capital Research Global Investors, so Warren might not have much influence. But if he is a man of his word, he wouldn't invested in the bank or would have sold his shares if he discovered that they were investing in an asset he feels is worthless.

hugeblack

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It is not a defense or explanation for Buffett's behavior or opinions, but when you have thousands of investments, some of them may intersect with investments in assets or companies that are not directly related to them or supported by them. Buffett did not buy a bank or company that accepts or is directly related to cryptocurrencies, and therefore we cannot say that His views have changed. All these investments are side investments, not core investments.

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Quote from: kingvirtus09 on October 17, 2023, 08:14:52 PM

What do you think?

If you are angry or believe what W.Buffett said or anyone who criticizes and slanders bitcoin, you have fallen into their trap. They won't care what you think about their statements, they only care about their wealth. I mean they can badmouth bitcoin, criticize bitcoin in front of the media and the goal is to keep people away from bitcoin but they will quietly buy as much as possible. And when the right time comes, they make a good statement about bitcoin and that's when they will sell high priced bitcoin to the public. Don't believe what billionaires and banks say, look at what they are doing.

Jawhead999

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If Warren Buffett bought Bitcoin or Nucoin, then you can criticized him. Buffet is already 93 years old, I don't expect he would change his words because most of old people always stand with his current words.

What about this, you're promoting a mixer, do you support money laundering because every centralized entity always said it's linked to money laundering.

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The answer is simple...... Warren Buffett built his empire on old financial investment tools and he has massive shares in Berkshire Hathaway. They will never promote something that are in competition for investors money that can be invested in their investment firm or the traditional investment options that they offer.

Warren Buffet and his employees come from the old school education system... where they do not teach you about Crypto currencies.. so they will criticize everything that oppose their knowledge framework. Roll Eyes

Majestic-milf

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Another way is that Buffet or his company did not invest in Bitcoin, the investment is in another business that deals with cryptocurrencies.
Let me put it this way, imagine a centralized altcoin exchange that lists a lot of shitcoins, does it matter that they are all garbage if the exchange is making a lot of money by offering a service?
That's how Buffet sees things. In other words even if he didn't like cryptocurrencies he knows there is a lot of money to be made from centralized crypto-related services.

This is true. As a businessman who has been vociferous against Bitcoin, I doubt he'd go back on his words. Not like it hasn't happened in past times of other anti bitcoiners, but him alongside his partner, Charles Munger have made it clear on their stand against it.
I'm not really surprised about this and I will not label it the way the op did because to him it's just business and anywhere there stands to be profit, he'd invest. Infact this is not the first time he's putting his money into the digital sector as in 2019, he also put heavy money into a digital payments company, StoneCo. Still in Brazil.
In another angle, this is good news because it will help push mainstream acceptance and a possible adoption of the Blockchain.

Everyone is entitled to his opinion and so far Warren Buffett has given it and while there's those who have listened to him and entertained FUD, there's still others who have gone ahead and invested. Somehow the more he bad mouths Bitcoin, it continues to boom.

Latviand

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Quote from: Dave1 on October 17, 2023, 09:45:50 PM

He could have some narrative behind why he continue to attack bitcoin, nevertheless the effect is just temporary though. Maybe he secretly invested on bitcoin, or someone as a hedge fund manager acts for him to be a investor, we will never know.

Couldn't have said it any better, if I am in Buffett's shoes I would probably do the same thing, talk shit about bitcoin because I have seen the potential of it to grow and I know that I have a lot of money and if I can lower it ever more using my influence then I can probably squeeze in more profit when I buy bitcoin when it becomes lower. I don't think that he needs to have someone act for him to invest in bitcoin, anyone can freely do it but given that his investments are numerous I would probably believe he does but that person who proxies for him is damn trustworthy.

Quote from: pooya87 on October 18, 2023, 01:24:54 AM

At the end of the day it doesn't matter what these people say or do, people should just stay away from anything centralized and stick to buying as much bitcoin as they can before it is too late Wink

Perfect statement but I have problem with this last part, even if you say that, you'll only probably sway 2 or 3 people, it's inevitable that the public will always do what others are going to say given that people in general aren't taught to think for themselves.

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Quote from: pooya87 on October 18, 2023, 01:24:54 AM

There are a couple of ways we can look at this.

First is the fact that the statements people make publicly does not necessarily reflect the reality or what they truly think. For example I have said many times over the past 9 years that I've known Bitcoin that many of these rich a-holes already own bitcoin and are constantly buying it. There is a high possibility that Buffet is among them.

Another way is that Buffet or his company did not invest in Bitcoin, the investment is in another business that deals with cryptocurrencies.
Let me put it this way, imagine a centralized altcoin exchange that lists a lot of shitcoins, does it matter that they are all garbage if the exchange is making a lot of money by offering a service?
That's how Buffet sees things. In other words even if he didn't like cryptocurrencies he knows there is a lot of money to be made from centralized crypto-related services.

At the end of the day it doesn't matter what these people say or do, people should just stay away from anything centralized and stick to buying as much bitcoin as they can before it is too late Wink

I appreciate what you said; it's quite neutral and clear, and your opinion is, to be honest, good. We don't know what's actually on Buffett's mind, but one thing is clear to me: anything he says is bad for Bitcoin.

The crucial point is that we or we must have accumulated Bitcoin during its halving's next year or during the bull run. If Buffett's remarks irritate you, remember why he said them. Perhaps that isn't so difficult to grasp.

Topic: A dog that vomited and then ate the vomit again - page 2. (Read 419 times)