Due to illness the sample production will start Tuesday.
We are going to prepare mining relevant infos before the launch of the campaign.
Topic: A dream for CPU-Miners - page 2. (Read 876 times)
The problem is that your motherboards will start selling from August September 2023. If there are working samples, then I'm interested in watching a video review with consumption and profit in mining. So far, I don’t understand how to calculate the payback and what coins can be mined.
SBC consists of more elements than required to act as a Server or Miner.
Can you agree on that? This is the reason Compute Modules do exist. They have less parts on it but all features as long the carrier board covers the I/O
So let's say the same computer as SBC costs 120 but as Module only 57. Technically the same just minus all the connectors and less production costs and complexity.
And now you put all of them together on a single carrier (28 in that case).
From our experience larger CPU's scale badly as they consume more power than several small ARM SBC's. And if we take now the overhead of unecessary parts out of the SBC's, than we get a point of Ressource saving / less impact on environment / less costs / less power consumption / flexible availbility on the market / and scaling means also scaling based on users pocket.
Can you agree on that? This is the reason Compute Modules do exist. They have less parts on it but all features as long the carrier board covers the I/O
So let's say the same computer as SBC costs 120 but as Module only 57. Technically the same just minus all the connectors and less production costs and complexity.
And now you put all of them together on a single carrier (28 in that case).
From our experience larger CPU's scale badly as they consume more power than several small ARM SBC's. And if we take now the overhead of unecessary parts out of the SBC's, than we get a point of Ressource saving / less impact on environment / less costs / less power consumption / flexible availbility on the market / and scaling means also scaling based on users pocket.
You are looking from a different point of view it seems. In your eyes you are mining with one CPU only and try to be decentralized.
I think (?).
I think (?).
What part of "scaling" makes you think that?
You're fixated on SBx clusters and trying to sell the concept for mining. Mining doesn't benefit from formal clustering.
IP networks, PCIe, USB all work just as well.
ASIC miners have a small control board and multiple hash boards. GPU mining rigs have multiple GPUs using PCIe.
Why not do something similar? Xeon Phi was an overpriced PCIe compute module that never found a market. It was also lousy
at mining but the concept solves the scaling problem for CPU mining. Common sense would also suggest that fewer, larger CPUs
would scale better than a larger number of SBMs.
You are looking from a different point of view it seems. In your eyes you are mining with one CPU only and try to be decentralized.
I think (?).
So you think its is less expensive to buy one SBC which costs lets say 120$ as like a VIM3 for example.
Ok..
The ordinary miner is checking how much it costs and how rentable it is. So if it makes sense he wants to scale up quickly.
Now my point is what happens if you buy 28 of such SBC's
so 28x 120$ = 3360
Our Board costs currently at a low amount of 100 pieces = 1499€ (at kickstarter)
= 1861€ left for Modules.
For the SBC's you need:
28x Ethernet cables = 28$ depending on lenths
28x Powercables (not all SBC's do PoE) = 28$
And a PSU to power all of them = Don't know 100$
Or 28x 5.90$ if you choose psu per module
Let's say around about 156$ on top, you would save in first round of adding modules. (1x ATX 350W PSU and 1x Ethernet = 26 + 1 =27€ would be needed).
The idea of our board is that you can just replace the Modules with a new generation of Hardware.
So the invest of 1499€ for the board was done only once.
Now you have the benefit that you can use "cost-effective and flexible configurable Compute Modules", instead of just another fully equipped SBC with stuff like Audio, Ethernet, USB, HDMI and whatever connectors you just don't need again.
So the new batch of 28 SBC's would cost much more in the moment of investment, than the "second" batch of Modules for the very same "already" paid ARMedONE.
The third time you add new Hardware saves again money compared to SBC's
and so on.
And thats what i mean also with democratic. It's cost effective(higher accessible) and the longer you stay in mining, the more often you want to upgrade, the better.
As said the price depends as usually on demand. The more people support it, the better and the prices go down and we can create "together" low cost core-modules.
If we reach the second step of creating modules, i can imagine to make the design and layout open source.
I think (?).
So you think its is less expensive to buy one SBC which costs lets say 120$ as like a VIM3 for example.
Ok..
The ordinary miner is checking how much it costs and how rentable it is. So if it makes sense he wants to scale up quickly.
Now my point is what happens if you buy 28 of such SBC's
so 28x 120$ = 3360
Our Board costs currently at a low amount of 100 pieces = 1499€ (at kickstarter)
= 1861€ left for Modules.
For the SBC's you need:
28x Ethernet cables = 28$ depending on lenths
28x Powercables (not all SBC's do PoE) = 28$
And a PSU to power all of them = Don't know 100$
Or 28x 5.90$ if you choose psu per module
Let's say around about 156$ on top, you would save in first round of adding modules. (1x ATX 350W PSU and 1x Ethernet = 26 + 1 =27€ would be needed).
The idea of our board is that you can just replace the Modules with a new generation of Hardware.
So the invest of 1499€ for the board was done only once.
Now you have the benefit that you can use "cost-effective and flexible configurable Compute Modules", instead of just another fully equipped SBC with stuff like Audio, Ethernet, USB, HDMI and whatever connectors you just don't need again.
So the new batch of 28 SBC's would cost much more in the moment of investment, than the "second" batch of Modules for the very same "already" paid ARMedONE.
The third time you add new Hardware saves again money compared to SBC's
and so on.
And thats what i mean also with democratic. It's cost effective(higher accessible) and the longer you stay in mining, the more often you want to upgrade, the better.
As said the price depends as usually on demand. The more people support it, the better and the prices go down and we can create "together" low cost core-modules.
If we reach the second step of creating modules, i can imagine to make the design and layout open source.
Hot swapping isn't needed for mining with CPUs or anything else. I already mentioned the real problem with scaling CPU mining.
An expensive carrier board that adds unnecessary features doesn't do it. Any solution needs to be cheap.
There might be a market for what you're building, but mining isn't it.
An expensive carrier board that adds unnecessary features doesn't do it. Any solution needs to be cheap.
There might be a market for what you're building, but mining isn't it.
Democracy is power to the people. We deliver Power to the people
Hmm interesting that you don't find it democratic : )
Democracy is one person, one vote (CPU).
Hmm interesting that you don't find it democratic : )
I think the opossite:
by offering a platform which is open to all kind of modules we provide a standard. This standard makes it less exensive as soon people start adopting.
The prices we show is based on 100 only. So expect price cuts during the campaign -> we can't change prices but add stretch goals.
So instead of everyone is cooking his own soup, it becomes an adaptable solution and home of new modules based on new tech.
Also to be fair you have to count in the cost reductions for "workhours" and "peripherals" as you need only 1/28th of cables, psu's (even more as you can connect boards to each other), Cables, etc.
Work reduction means:
If you need to update to a new CPU-Core (ARM, x64, Fpga, Risc-V, etc) you can do that during runtime. No need to power off anything. No work to cut off cables, unpluf PSU's, swap psu's, add cables again, mount the board and so on...
It is as easy and quick as adding a RAM module on a mainboard. CLICK
So if you think about Mining Farms and managing them, you will find it very cost effictive to be able to scale and upgrade them to new Technology in 1/28th of the time or even less compared to Servers / Rigs or SBC's. You are faster mining again, you have quicker access to new tech.
Also logistic is much easier as the new "Hardware" is tiny as a SO-DIMM RAM Module. Much better than new Fullsize MAinbaords all the time and new CPU's and new RAM and whatever is required to make it run.. this is like comparing sending a RAM module via Post vs an Elephant by foot. So the shipping costs a Farm saves when upgrading to a new GEN of CPU's should be convincing enough.
Also the last years were showing a tendency to centralization of Blockchains. By having physical 28 servers (more if you use virtualization) inside a box you can help to decentralize multiple chains being them PoW or PoS(Masternode) based. So as enthusiast you can be more democractic at lower cost.
If we reach the Target, we may also reach Stretch-goals and we can create own Core-Modules.
If we make it, you can stay in touch via discord and the community which hopefully is born then, can build own modules. If there is enough demand, we built it on request. I think it's democratic : ) at least a good foundation for a democracy.
There is also Open-Risc and Risc-V whch allows to design own opensource chips.
I think the opossite:
by offering a platform which is open to all kind of modules we provide a standard. This standard makes it less exensive as soon people start adopting.
The prices we show is based on 100 only. So expect price cuts during the campaign -> we can't change prices but add stretch goals.
So instead of everyone is cooking his own soup, it becomes an adaptable solution and home of new modules based on new tech.
Also to be fair you have to count in the cost reductions for "workhours" and "peripherals" as you need only 1/28th of cables, psu's (even more as you can connect boards to each other), Cables, etc.
Work reduction means:
If you need to update to a new CPU-Core (ARM, x64, Fpga, Risc-V, etc) you can do that during runtime. No need to power off anything. No work to cut off cables, unpluf PSU's, swap psu's, add cables again, mount the board and so on...
It is as easy and quick as adding a RAM module on a mainboard. CLICK
So if you think about Mining Farms and managing them, you will find it very cost effictive to be able to scale and upgrade them to new Technology in 1/28th of the time or even less compared to Servers / Rigs or SBC's. You are faster mining again, you have quicker access to new tech.
Also logistic is much easier as the new "Hardware" is tiny as a SO-DIMM RAM Module. Much better than new Fullsize MAinbaords all the time and new CPU's and new RAM and whatever is required to make it run.. this is like comparing sending a RAM module via Post vs an Elephant by foot. So the shipping costs a Farm saves when upgrading to a new GEN of CPU's should be convincing enough.
Also the last years were showing a tendency to centralization of Blockchains. By having physical 28 servers (more if you use virtualization) inside a box you can help to decentralize multiple chains being them PoW or PoS(Masternode) based. So as enthusiast you can be more democractic at lower cost.
If we reach the Target, we may also reach Stretch-goals and we can create own Core-Modules.
If we make it, you can stay in touch via discord and the community which hopefully is born then, can build own modules. If there is enough demand, we built it on request. I think it's democratic : ) at least a good foundation for a democracy.
There is also Open-Risc and Risc-V whch allows to design own opensource chips.
It is clear that you suggest mining on ARM processors due to their low power consumption.
But here the problem of competition with video cards or FPGA arises, because when the price of a coin rises, then its mining becomes profitable on other equipment.
But here the problem of competition with video cards or FPGA arises, because when the price of a coin rises, then its mining becomes profitable on other equipment.
I still question whether or not ARM processing capabilities are viable for mining.
They may have low consumption, but how many ARM processors did it take to have the same performance as a "normal" processor? Would it be profitable?
https://www.fujitsu.com/global/about/innovation/fugaku/
ARM processors are not universal like video cards and may not be popular for home mining due to the difficulty of purchasing these mining solutions.
Farm mining is well established, there's no need for fancy clustering, just a proxy server.
The issue with large scale CPU mining is scaling efficiently and cheaply. Your board is overkill and overpriced.
It's also not very democratic.
The issue with large scale CPU mining is scaling efficiently and cheaply. Your board is overkill and overpriced.
It's also not very democratic.
Those are stackable:
https://www.ebay.de/itm/155266265421?hash=item242697314d:g:qhoAAOSwBiBjeT8w&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAA4Ozn9cBR291d88M6cmiTK7qEX19RskhtqFk7uWdei%2F5GrM%2BRu4pEVomNOhND%2Fhi8sbUpIVRSqxP0%2FAZCyI76ZSveFWb5nTVKCKizhLU4bMcxrlt6XgwOlZtkSf2xBWFbbC5Un3dOUkeAud9ainpwK2WHOV0UrO97eLPeZss3YG2bl%2BNvBHy3g%2Fqy7RJQ9913Lk8NxQqflSdymHakclJtNehGp7%2BGiB27X3V3OHh3d8SY56%2BXT4pcntT3K23CsbdctmxDGdCCjIRBTJMC5RGs9UDiLZcikOFw9C79iSI9c11C%7Ctkp%3ABFBMlp23g55h
And it is what I’ve meant above to fill the waiting time until the board is delivered, those could be send to let people play with the software and help to improve it.
https://www.ebay.de/itm/155266265421?hash=item242697314d:g:qhoAAOSwBiBjeT8w&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAA4Ozn9cBR291d88M6cmiTK7qEX19RskhtqFk7uWdei%2F5GrM%2BRu4pEVomNOhND%2Fhi8sbUpIVRSqxP0%2FAZCyI76ZSveFWb5nTVKCKizhLU4bMcxrlt6XgwOlZtkSf2xBWFbbC5Un3dOUkeAud9ainpwK2WHOV0UrO97eLPeZss3YG2bl%2BNvBHy3g%2Fqy7RJQ9913Lk8NxQqflSdymHakclJtNehGp7%2BGiB27X3V3OHh3d8SY56%2BXT4pcntT3K23CsbdctmxDGdCCjIRBTJMC5RGs9UDiLZcikOFw9C79iSI9c11C%7Ctkp%3ABFBMlp23g55h
And it is what I’ve meant above to fill the waiting time until the board is delivered, those could be send to let people play with the software and help to improve it.
Mining with phones is not suggested as the may blow up.
We have plenty of community images for odroid, Pi and VIM Bords.
We have plenty of community images for odroid, Pi and VIM Bords.
To start with, and without big investments, what equipment would you suggest?
By chance, microcomputers were something I never explored, but it might be interesting to analyze.
Mining with phones is not suggested as the may blow up.
We have plenty of community images for odroid, Pi and VIM Bords.
https://miningpoolstats.stream/bitcoinsubsidium
This pool has images and I believe a calculator. But coin is undervalued as the engines (nft market and para token on top it XBTX ) will lift up soon:
https://xbtx.collective-b.net:8444/
We have plenty of community images for odroid, Pi and VIM Bords.
https://miningpoolstats.stream/bitcoinsubsidium
This pool has images and I believe a calculator. But coin is undervalued as the engines (nft market and para token on top it XBTX ) will lift up soon:
https://xbtx.collective-b.net:8444/
Hi, trust me we just use ARM for CPU mining.
I suggest to keep an eye on BitcoinSubsidium aka XBTX as it Supports NFT‘s and Tokenization.
It is especially efficient to mine with ARM CPU‘s .
I suggest to keep an eye on BitcoinSubsidium aka XBTX as it Supports NFT‘s and Tokenization.
It is especially efficient to mine with ARM CPU‘s .
Do you have any mining profitability emulator?
If I take an old smartphone, can I mine with it?
Hi, trust me we just use ARM for CPU mining.
I suggest to keep an eye on BitcoinSubsidium aka XBTX as it Supports NFT‘s and Tokenization.
It is especially efficient to mine with ARM CPU‘s .
https://discord.gg/f8rQhfk2
Xbtx guys obtained the NFT Marketplace license in Dubai and prepare a launch.
You can spend XBTX also on https://kryptobay.eu and you can check NFT‘s and tokens hosted on chain here:
https://assets.kryptobay.eu
NFT example:
Biggest bonus for XBTX and asic and gpu resistance … source is hosted in my GitHub ; )
I suggest to keep an eye on BitcoinSubsidium aka XBTX as it Supports NFT‘s and Tokenization.
It is especially efficient to mine with ARM CPU‘s .
https://discord.gg/f8rQhfk2
Xbtx guys obtained the NFT Marketplace license in Dubai and prepare a launch.
You can spend XBTX also on https://kryptobay.eu and you can check NFT‘s and tokens hosted on chain here:
https://assets.kryptobay.eu
NFT example:
Biggest bonus for XBTX and asic and gpu resistance … source is hosted in my GitHub ; )
It is clear that you suggest mining on ARM processors due to their low power consumption.
But here the problem of competition with video cards or FPGA arises, because when the price of a coin rises, then its mining becomes profitable on other equipment.
But here the problem of competition with video cards or FPGA arises, because when the price of a coin rises, then its mining becomes profitable on other equipment.
I still question whether or not ARM processing capabilities are viable for mining.
They may have low consumption, but how many ARM processors did it take to have the same performance as a "normal" processor? Would it be profitable?
It is clear that you suggest mining on ARM processors due to their low power consumption.
But here the problem of competition with video cards or FPGA arises, because when the price of a coin rises, then its mining becomes profitable on other equipment.
But here the problem of competition with video cards or FPGA arises, because when the price of a coin rises, then its mining becomes profitable on other equipment.
Ok I can try to tell you how we plan to use it:
We use Custom clusters of Odroid N2+ and VIM‘s for mining but also as root servers for others including accessible remote desktops.
Since the SBC‘s (choosen for efficiency reasons) require a lot wiring we wanted to go a step further and optimize all that by getting a carrier for eternity.
We made it to last generations of modules yet to come.
We put them into Server cases and ordinary racks and can than swap and scale on demand during runtime.
For mining we want to provide own custom modules.
Some algo‘s work better on some ARM systems than anything amd or Intel offers.
Being able to create and use excactly what matches the best (invest and efficiency) is great.
Also it is nice if this thing acts like a server and can be easely controlled without much effort.
Hosters and hashrate providers get a standardized setup (good for employees- and saves time every time you have to scale or to adapt). Maybe you also like to see FPGA or GPU modules.
What we are also going to do is to offer custom cases (again a stretchgoal).
Today after first coffee I had the idea to create a super duper early bird which includes an odroid N2+ based System as waiting time filler (can be send instant )
We believe that cpu Mining is the most Democratic way of mining and would like to mix this with the fact that you get a edge computing cluster acting as your new way a Mac Pro should be like. Modular heterogenous mix of modules . Specific ones for specific tasks.
This way your computer (therefore E-ATX standard) will be your own serverfarm at your fingertips. Choose server style cases, Tower or cubes and or custom cases similar to asics for extreme Temperatur regulations.
Interesting feature is also that you can connect those carriers to each other and build Sandwiches (custom case) whiny requiring wires and psu only once.
We use Custom clusters of Odroid N2+ and VIM‘s for mining but also as root servers for others including accessible remote desktops.
Since the SBC‘s (choosen for efficiency reasons) require a lot wiring we wanted to go a step further and optimize all that by getting a carrier for eternity.
We made it to last generations of modules yet to come.
We put them into Server cases and ordinary racks and can than swap and scale on demand during runtime.
For mining we want to provide own custom modules.
Some algo‘s work better on some ARM systems than anything amd or Intel offers.
Being able to create and use excactly what matches the best (invest and efficiency) is great.
Also it is nice if this thing acts like a server and can be easely controlled without much effort.
Hosters and hashrate providers get a standardized setup (good for employees- and saves time every time you have to scale or to adapt). Maybe you also like to see FPGA or GPU modules.
What we are also going to do is to offer custom cases (again a stretchgoal).
Today after first coffee I had the idea to create a super duper early bird which includes an odroid N2+ based System as waiting time filler (can be send instant )
We believe that cpu Mining is the most Democratic way of mining and would like to mix this with the fact that you get a edge computing cluster acting as your new way a Mac Pro should be like. Modular heterogenous mix of modules . Specific ones for specific tasks.
This way your computer (therefore E-ATX standard) will be your own serverfarm at your fingertips. Choose server style cases, Tower or cubes and or custom cases similar to asics for extreme Temperatur regulations.
Interesting feature is also that you can connect those carriers to each other and build Sandwiches (custom case) whiny requiring wires and psu only once.
Edit:
Excursion: https://quartexpascal.wordpress.com/project/introduction-to-quartex-media-desktop/
If you know NAS desktops interfaces, you get the point about Quartex
From your presentation, I did not understand how this motherboard will be useful for miners. Excursion: https://quartexpascal.wordpress.com/project/introduction-to-quartex-media-desktop/
If you know NAS desktops interfaces, you get the point about Quartex
Jump to: