We can only get some other currencies from government's hand if dollar do not fails.
Don't ever think you can take control over the world with bitcoin..
Topic: Absolutely nothing backs Fiat paper its completely worthless (Read 4429 times)
February 01, 2016, 09:39:04 AM
Dolar is integrated in this system and hardly can be cut from it without harsh response of system.
Dolar will stay as many other currencies of the world at the same time. Bitcoin will take the lead on Internet !
Dolar will stay as many other currencies of the world at the same time. Bitcoin will take the lead on Internet !
Fiat is getting fried
February 01, 2016, 08:15:20 AM
Dolar is integrated in this system and hardly can be cut from it without harsh response of system.
Dolar will stay as many other currencies of the world at the same time. Bitcoin will take the lead on Internet !
Dolar will stay as many other currencies of the world at the same time. Bitcoin will take the lead on Internet !
when Bitcoin takes over anyone left holding fiat will get done like a dogs dinner
Damnit, I must deposit more fiat into banks, because I wait for my -90% bail-in haircut.
I look better with short hair anyway
The difference is that fiat is backed by faith but ultimately exists because of debt. Without debt there would be no need for the amount of currency in existence. When a miner "finds" a block it also creates money out of nowhere, but the fact that there's a limited supply of coins to be mine is in blatant contrast with the never-ending issuing of money Central Banks are tied to.
All money that you can't eat/smoke/fuck/live inside represents debt. Or not.
What, exactly, does BTC represent, other than "I hope (have faith that) someone will give me something of value for this binary string that I got"?
The difference is that fiat is backed by faith but ultimately exists because of debt. Without debt there would be no need for the amount of currency in existence. When a miner "finds" a block it also creates money out of nowhere, but the fact that there's a limited supply of coins to be mine is in blatant contrast with the never-ending issuing of money Central Banks are tied to.
when Bitcoin takes over anyone left holding fiat will get done like a dogs dinner
I don't understand why we always feel it is necessary to contrapose Bitcoin to fiat. Can't they just coexist with each other like they do today? Bitcoin is a good thing but I don't think we should kill all the other things which are not so good just because of that.
We non stop talking about fiat is done, is history and it is evil, but we all still using it and we are going to use it and tomorrow..
We living in this capitalistic monetary system and if we really want to change something we must change that corrupted system!
We living in this capitalistic monetary system and if we really want to change something we must change that corrupted system!
no, the governments back fiat.
In fact, I'm willing to bet you that there are WAAAAAAYYYYY more people who would trust government backed currencies than none-government backed currencies.
In fact, I'm willing to bet you that there are WAAAAAAYYYYY more people who would trust government backed currencies than none-government backed currencies.
only because he have power to do so, and people have not other way around than trusting the government, because going against it would result in being a criminal
essentially this si a dictatorial regime in disguise, in the modern era where we live...
The bolded part is wrong. They trust the government because of all the propaganda they received during their youth. People think communist propaganda brainwashes chinese/previous USSR/north korean etc people, but really, propaganda all over the world brainwashes their people.
Regardless of whether its right or wrong, that's the way the world currently is. You (in general, not you, amph) would be delusional to think otherwise. Hoping people will all magically come to realize the truth and come to bitcoin will only cause bitcoin to die.
the more exact world would be being like a criminal, feeling dirty, but yeah i agree on the brainwashed part, they are like puppets controlled by the government already, not all of them of course
no, the governments back fiat.
In fact, I'm willing to bet you that there are WAAAAAAYYYYY more people who would trust government backed currencies than none-government backed currencies.
In fact, I'm willing to bet you that there are WAAAAAAYYYYY more people who would trust government backed currencies than none-government backed currencies.
only because he have power to do so, and people have not other way around than trusting the government, because going against it would result in being a criminal
essentially this si a dictatorial regime in disguise, in the modern era where we live...
The bolded part is wrong. They trust the government because of all the propaganda they received during their youth. People think communist propaganda brainwashes chinese/previous USSR/north korean etc people, but really, propaganda all over the world brainwashes their people.
Regardless of whether its right or wrong, that's the way the world currently is. You (in general, not you, amph) would be delusional to think otherwise. Hoping people will all magically come to realize the truth and come to bitcoin will only cause bitcoin to die.
no, the governments back fiat.
In fact, I'm willing to bet you that there are WAAAAAAYYYYY more people who would trust government backed currencies than none-government backed currencies.
In fact, I'm willing to bet you that there are WAAAAAAYYYYY more people who would trust government backed currencies than none-government backed currencies.
only because he have power to do so, and people have not other way around than trusting the government, because going against it would result in being a criminal
essentially this si a dictatorial regime in disguise, in the modern era where we live...
...
Also, if miners stop mining btc, then mining btc becomes more profitable, and it atracts other miners... no?
A whole mess of variables.Also, if miners stop mining btc, then mining btc becomes more profitable, and it atracts other miners... no?
-Usually, miners point their rigs at the most profitable coin. So "stopped mining" actually means "pointed their rigs at a more profitable coin (or fork)."
(all the new miners flock to the new coin/fork until its profitability equals Bitcoin)
-Could stop mining due to a bad actor, e.g. Chinese government seizing/buying (to mine their own crypto)/criminalizing the mines.
-The miners are paid in BTC, not fiat. This means that if BTC price falls by 50%, mining becomes more than 50% less profitable until even more miners leave.
-The halvening (block reward cut in half) is coming this summer, etc., etc.
You clearly don't understand what "backed" means, let me educate you:
[Backed currency is a form of money] whose value has a direct correspondence with the value of a commodity (such as gold), whether or not it is redeemable in that commodity on demand.
[Backed currency is a form of money] whose value has a direct correspondence with the value of a commodity (such as gold), whether or not it is redeemable in that commodity on demand.
that was the old definition, you still live under a rock, no money is backed by gold anymore, money can be easily backed by other factor, such as the usage, the more it is used the more value it acquire
everything that make the asset more valuable can be consider a form of backup
That's the current definition of "backed currency". I didn't travel back in time to give you that link.
And if you feel that everything contributes to an asset's backing, how is fiat toilet paper unbacked? It is "backed by the full faith and credit of
Bitcoin? Miners fork off to a better alt, and *POOF!* No moar backing
This process is not that fast, and the community would not jeopardize it's own assets like that. Remember that a hard fork needs to have the majority adoption. Why would the majority want to their assets become dust all of a sudden?
No. A hard fork simply needs *one* miner to start mining it. How long it lives (how many blocks) is another story.
As far as "majority" goes, this "majority" doesn't include people who are hodling (not trading/using) their coin. Only the coins currently in play (on exchanges) & fiat (people willing to buy mined coins) are a part of this "majority."
TL;DR: Miners will mine whatever they can sell, most of their assets are in gear/real estate housing that gear, don't necessarily hold BTC,
Can you see how their interests might not coincide with the hodlers?
Nice point. What could holders do to protect from this risk? There's no precise way to know which new coin will be massively adopted by the miners...
Also, if miners stop mining btc, then mining btc becomes more profitable, and it atracts other miners... no?
You clearly don't understand what "backed" means, let me educate you:
[Backed currency is a form of money] whose value has a direct correspondence with the value of a commodity (such as gold), whether or not it is redeemable in that commodity on demand.
[Backed currency is a form of money] whose value has a direct correspondence with the value of a commodity (such as gold), whether or not it is redeemable in that commodity on demand.
that was the old definition, you still live under a rock, no money is backed by gold anymore, money can be easily backed by other factor, such as the usage, the more it is used the more value it acquire
everything that make the asset more valuable can be consider a form of backup
That's the current definition of "backed currency". I didn't travel back in time to give you that link.
And if you feel that everything contributes to an asset's backing, how is fiat toilet paper unbacked? It is "backed by the full faith and credit of
Bitcoin? Miners fork off to a better alt, and *POOF!* No moar backing
This process is not that fast, and the community would not jeopardize it's own assets like that. Remember that a hard fork needs to have the majority adoption. Why would the majority want to their assets become dust all of a sudden?
No. A hard fork simply needs *one* miner to start mining it. How long it lives (how many blocks) is another story.
As far as "majority" goes, this "majority" doesn't include people who are hodling (not trading/using) their coin. Only the coins currently in play (on exchanges) & fiat (people willing to buy mined coins) are a part of this "majority."
TL;DR: Miners will mine whatever they can sell, most of their assets are in gear/real estate housing that gear, don't necessarily hold BTC,
Can you see how their interests might not coincide with the hodlers?
...
That's the way society works, on trust. Bitcoin being no exception.
You trust that other people will want your bitcoins, and they, in turn, trust that those bitcoins will be worth something to other people. Turtles all the way down.
That's the way society works, on trust. Bitcoin being no exception.
You trust that other people will want your bitcoins, and they, in turn, trust that those bitcoins will be worth something to other people. Turtles all the way down.
If there are any BTC buy offers, thats not the matter of trust at all. When somebody is buyin BTC he/she is taking some risk. The difference is, that governments don't inform about any risks related to their decisions, but want people to believe that their conditions are set in stone.
What do you mean? Did Bitcoin warn you about risks? Is a mechanism for issuing such warnings even a part of the Bitcoin protocol?
I certainly can't speak for every government, but mine (US) hasn't lied to me re. value of the USD.
i guess you are right, but it still has value as governments say that and you can buy stuff with it
You clearly don't understand what "backed" means, let me educate you:
[Backed currency is a form of money] whose value has a direct correspondence with the value of a commodity (such as gold), whether or not it is redeemable in that commodity on demand.
[Backed currency is a form of money] whose value has a direct correspondence with the value of a commodity (such as gold), whether or not it is redeemable in that commodity on demand.
that was the old definition, you still live under a rock, no money is backed by gold anymore, money can be easily backed by other factor, such as the usage, the more it is used the more value it acquire
everything that make the asset more valuable can be consider a form of backup
That's the current definition of "backed currency". I didn't travel back in time to give you that link.
And if you feel that everything contributes to an asset's backing, how is fiat toilet paper unbacked? It is "backed by the full faith and credit of
Bitcoin? Miners fork off to a better alt, and *POOF!* No moar backing
This process is not that fast, and the community would not jeopardize it's own assets like that. Remember that a hard fork needs to have the majority adoption. Why would the majority want to their assets become dust all of a sudden?
Worst case scenario there would be another strong coin on the horizon, and btc would gradually fade as people would migrate their assets to the new strong coin (of even both them would coexist).
no, the governments back fiat.
In fact, I'm willing to bet you that there are WAAAAAAYYYYY more people who would trust government backed currencies than none-government backed currencies.
In fact, I'm willing to bet you that there are WAAAAAAYYYYY more people who would trust government backed currencies than none-government backed currencies.
Surely there are lot of people trusting governments, but it does not proof validity of that view. Gov's are backing money with promises, like the future retirements in some countries.
That's the way society works, on trust. Bitcoin being no exception.
You trust that other people will want your bitcoins, and they, in turn, trust that those bitcoins will be worth something to other people. Turtles all the way down.
If there are any BTC buy offers, thats not the matter of trust at all. When somebody is buyin BTC he/she is taking some risk. The difference is, that governments don't inform about any risks related to their decisions, but want people to believe that their conditions are set in stone.
I am blown away at the ignorant responses here, but that shouldn't surprise me. It's a silly topic to begin with, as bitcoin isn't backed by anything either. "Math and electricity", that's a joke. Money doesn't have to be backed by anything to serve its function, and what we've got--fiat--is hardly worthless. I buy everything with it. Could it become worthless? Certainly. Most things can.
Why then governments hesistate (generally) to print money everytime they need some? Why can't I print some on my own?
Would you like to be "indebted" to yourself???
Then, how do you think governments will be able to take such steps as if it is going to harm the economy so badly???
Printing ain't in the hands of Governments alone, there are Federal Reserves who take care of the same...
I have responded to the claim, that money could be backed by nothing. I didn't say, that governments should print money at will, please read carefully.
no, the governments back fiat.
In fact, I'm willing to bet you that there are WAAAAAAYYYYY more people who would trust government backed currencies than none-government backed currencies.
In fact, I'm willing to bet you that there are WAAAAAAYYYYY more people who would trust government backed currencies than none-government backed currencies.
Surely there are lot of people trusting governments, but it does not proof validity of that view. Gov's are backing money with promises, like the future retirements in some countries.
That's the way society works, on trust. Bitcoin being no exception.
You trust that other people will want your bitcoins, and they, in turn, trust that those bitcoins will be worth something to other people. Turtles all the way down.
Substitute *whatever you want* for Bitcoin. Try Beanie Babies.
I am blown away at the ignorant responses here, but that shouldn't surprise me. It's a silly topic to begin with, as bitcoin isn't backed by anything either. "Math and electricity", that's a joke. Money doesn't have to be backed by anything to serve its function, and what we've got--fiat--is hardly worthless. I buy everything with it. Could it become worthless? Certainly. Most things can.
Why then governments hesistate (generally) to print money everytime they need some? Why can't I print some on my own?
Would you like to be "indebted" to yourself???
Then, how do you think governments will be able to take such steps as if it is going to harm the economy so badly???
Printing ain't in the hands of Governments alone, there are Federal Reserves who take care of the same...
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