Topic: After Chipmixer, Is Sinbad.io Next To Be Shutdown? (Read 1055 times)

You misconstrued my comment. Let me be clear, I did not allude this comment by Royse777 meaning he would keep the funds for himself: The case is serious and I am considering not to touch any funds that is in the escrow address right now unless I speak to a lawyer. This means no one is going to receive anymore payments unless I have a direction from the lawyer. It's for the safety of everyone.

What I mean by this statement is that Hhampuz and icopress (because they are operate as campaign managers in a professional manner) would have made a statement by posting clearly and concisely with their opinions on the isue and also as confirming from their side what they believe actually happened. Apart from that comment above from Royse777, he has kept virtually silent with regards to the Sinbad money laundering operation.

Also, what I mean is that I am sure if campaign participants were going to be out of pocket, Hhampuz and icopress would make efforts to pay from their own pockets. Royse777 would not even entertain the idea.
 
I am completely rational. My personal feelings have played no part in my comments regarding Sinbad and Royse777.



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As per my previous post, the thread is now locked.

So you are suggesting Hhampuz and icopress to move the money and pay the members? Good luck.

I think it's a very good opportunity for Royce to teach you some lessons. He can send some coins to your wallet [if that is an exchange address and KYC verified then you will have more fun]. 😂

Six months ago you were obsessed with whirlewindmoney because luckily you found yourself a spot in a crazy amount of weekly paid signature campaign. You even did not see anything wrong with the 12% APR which was literally looked like a scam to take the investors money, typical scam but with a new form than those 'left and right hand MLM' scams. You never saw anything wrong in it. Ironic.

It seems you are eager to attack the reputation of someone you do not like personally and you don't leave a single chance whenever you find the opportunity but you are always good; even better, you are very protective with your Captain America Shield towards those who give you peanuts. You are as entertaining as the monkeys in the zoo. Joker never did his things for money.

I don't think Symmetrick Ratimov ever gave you a peanut. According to you, he was a member who contributed 1000 times better then me, wasn't he?

Throw enough mud at the wall, some of it will stick.

He will not stop until someone will put all the puzzles together and expose him like Symmetrick Ratimov was exposed.

I was part of the Campaign as Full Member, payments must have been roughly June-August.
And yes, payments were directly transfered to Binance (now i know that it might be a good idea not to chose a CEX adress for campaign payments).
On 29th November i recognised Mail from Binance, which i first thought was spam. On 30th November i logged into Binance to check and realised that sinbad transactions were meant. I guess notifications were on both ways simultaneously.

I'm not sure what you find strange here, but it's a completely understandable reaction to stop the whole thing and think about it with a cool head. How did you understand this as "I will keep all the remaining money from escrow for myself"


Can you give us some additional information about the whole case? Everything is a bit confusing to me, I apologize if you have already written somewhere.
First, when did the disputed transaction take place? Given that you haven't been in the Sinbad campaign for a while, I assume it was even earlier. Is this transaction before or after the sanctioning of Sinbad?
Did you receive the payment from the campaign directly to your Binance account?
As far as I understand, you got this via email, do you have any notifications on the Binance dashboard?

Where do you get that? Nobody (at least not me) has been advertising money laundering. I guess if that would be the accusation, binance would not have let me withdraw my funds so easily. Until now i was a Questionaire with ~10 questions, where i answered 1/2, nothing heard from binance again so far.

But i am curious if it might be a different story for the campaign manager, i guess he will be focussed a little more than the particiants.

I cannot speak for others but what sort of campaign manager does not release a full statement (detailing what their strategy is going forward) when one of clients has been seized for money laundering? Releasing a bit-part statement in the form of a less than two line post is completely unprofessional but what else can be expected from that campaign manager:

The case is serious and I am considering not to touch any funds that is in the escrow address right now unless I speak to a lawyer. This means no one is going to receive anymore payments unless I have a direction from the lawyer. It's for the safety of everyone.

Can you imagine Hhampuz or icopress doing the same thing? No

If the funds were from a money launderer, he will probably be advised to never touch them. At some stage maybe the law enforcement agencies will ask for them to be seized.

Having said that, these are interesting times indeed because the campaign manager was aware he was promoting a mixer that was a re-branding of a known money launderer. I wonder if he will mention that to his lawyer.




=====================

This thread was created six months ago asking if Sinbad was next to be closed down by law enforcement agencies because it was created with $22 million of laundered money by the same person/team behind the Blender money laundering crime.

It took six months but it happened as inevitably it would. I will be locking this thread within a few hours therefore if members would like post something constructive, they can.

Nothing will happen to them.


You don't see how this statement is at odds with the first?

Regardless, I could name some far shadier things that have taken place on this forum.

I think the fact that both you and Vod are constantly shitting on theymos - yet you and Vod hate each other - means that theymos is doing as balanced a job as possible.

Keep us updated.  I'm very curious what will happen to all the folks who have been benefitting from advertising money laundering here, even as it became obvious that the government was arresting those involved in such operations.  When even a forum pretending to be all about free speech has to ban advertisements from an entire industry, you know it's absolutely the shadiest thing you could get involved with.  Good luck to you in getting your funds and again, please share your findings with others as I imagine many are finding themselves in your situation today.

What will happen to those who weared the signature of Sinbad? Is it true that Sinbad was involved in connection with the DPRK?

Sinbad was my first campain ever (i am still kind of newbie) and i used Binance adress for payouts. Therefore my personal account is now directly linked to sinbad escrow adress. I got timeline of 7 days to explain transactions, otherwise account will be limited. At least within this timeline withdrawals work fine.


Thank you for providing the link also leading me to Binance having legal issues in an lot of countries: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.57648203
Even if i originally wanted to keep binance for trading purposes i realizedm that i will not lose anything if that is not possible. It makes decisions much easier.

Don't take this as legal advice, but if someone would address me as "Dear Binancian", I'd probably ignore them. What's the point of all that KYC if they can't address you by your name?
I wouldn't use Binance anyway, they freeze your funds when they make a mistake.

This is the first time I am seen such scenario and I don't think anyone has experienced in this your case before. And all what I will say is that if you want to use the Binance App in the future then you have to tell them that you received the funds from the address based on a service you render and make sure provide the Signature Campaign link for them to make the verification and I know that apart this they will still ask more thing to verify the address.

And if you did not tell them after the 7 days time, they will block your Binance account and blacklist your account to Sinbad. Therefore, explain to them.

Its good to hear that you managed to withdraw your funds as I assumed that they blocked your account while waiting for an explanation. Out of curiosity and to clear that out, did you use Binance address for signature campaign payments, or you sent the sig campaign monmey from your own wallet to Binance?

Regarding what to do, its a touchy matter and I personally don't feel comfortable sharing advice as honestly I am not sure what would I do in your situation, but I do know that Binance can be very persistent if they think you are bullshitting them without providing solid evidence for your story so if you go that route, be careful.

On Wednesday 18.15 UTC i received an email from binance to explain some transactions, which turns out were the payments from Sinbad Campaign / from sindbad escrow adress. Maybe it is interesting to add that i left campaign over 3 months ago.
Estimating that everything is automated i would guess that blacklisting must have been on wednesday.

I already removed all funds from Binance so nothing can be frozen. I also received some PMs on that topic too, but i am unsure how to go on or which advice i should give.
Therefore i want to ask the much more experienced users here for some advice on how to handle that. Maybe there are some "best practices" which i don't know yet.

Any help will be gratefully accepted.

  

Do you know the date these two addresses were added? Because the escrow address received 0.501BTC one day after the report date and the report warn all future transactions associated with that mixer.

In the case of Sinbad, FOID team did not have access to backend wallet data, so they were not able to seize coins, and it appears that this service is managed by a group and not a single individual, as in the case of Chipmixer.

Also, all BTC moved from the chipmixer escrow address about a month ago, are there any restrictions placed on that address?

I'm surprised they've "banned" only 2 Bitcoin addresses: one was used for signature payments on the forum, the other holds just $67 worth of Bitcoin and never sent anything.

What if it's the other way around, and that's the reason the mixer was created in the first place?

Even worse than that: the latter needs the former.

It's the opposite: what I read about Bitcoin in this case is actually quote encouraging:

LOL. Not a single mixer operates with a license... I'm not sure a single one has, ever. Again, operating under the conditions of which the license is provided largely defeats the purpose of a customer using the mixer in the first place. I know you don't understand what I'm talking about. That's OK. I think the best solution is for me to put you on ignore.

There is no financial institution that doesn't abide with set of law guiding the activities of the institution and before tumbler or a mixer will operate in the cryptocurrency ecosystem, it must be issued with a license and the license would be giving to it when they have accepted to obey the rules and meet up the requirements to operate. This is one of the law a mixer must follow Mixing large amounts of money may be illegal, therefore a good mixing company should operate within the financial law of not mixing large amount of funds because criminals will use it to launder money.

Op you forsee this that happened to sinbad.io for over six months and when you created this thread people didn't understand your point and saw it as if you are criticising chipmixer and next will be sinbad.io, but it's clear that what makes all this mixers to be seized by law enforcement agencies is because they do go against the rules and regulations of mixers, if assumed mixers can concentrate on their business and stand to do a legit business with their clients I think that this that happened chipmixer and sinbad wouldn't happen, the accusation a law enforcement agencies used for seizing chipmixer is same thing for this sinbad, I read them and their is no difference between them. All this mixers supposed to have abstain themselves from money laundering business, money laundering is one of the things that is making government to continue to question a mixer and seized them too

Your post doesn't make a lot of sense. What do you mean by "mixing rules"? Are you talking about requirements set by federal governments? If so, which ones? For a mixer to be able to service customers based in the U.S., it requires a money transmitter license, which means the mixer must not only register with the government but KYC for all customers (which defeats the purpose of the mixer). Other countries may have similar laws, some more lax laws, and some may not have any laws addressing the issue at all.

Arguably no mixer operates according to all the laws... it would more or less be impossible for them to do so.


Well that's not exactly true. He said he's "considering not to touch any funds that is in the escrow address" until he receives direction from a lawyer. These are interesting times.

Mixers will basically always fall victim to their own success. As soon as someone pulls off a hack and utilizes the service, it will be seized. This has been shown to be true time and time again now. I think in the future people will look back at the operators of these mixing services and think they were quite brazen to be operating so out in the open and even paying to advertise.  

Looks like their signature campaign manager has locked their thread and is saying they aren’t going to release any funds from escrow… Bold strategy. Let’s see how it pays off for them.

Though the answer remains unknown, I think the founder/creator/owner/operator of both Blender and Sinbad (known as Mehdi) probably became too confident and as a result of that he probably thought he had mixed/jumbled the $22 million he used to create Sinbad to the point it would not be traced back to Blender. He was wrong because a blockchain Elliptic did link them.

I think there is a clear difference when a mixer is being used to mix for the average person conducting non-criminal acts for the sake of increasing privacy and an enterprise that has been created with laundered money to offer a mixing service

I have no doubt they will come down on mixers very hard but cannot speculate as to when the clampdown will start (unless it already has). The accusations against Chipmixer and Sinbad are/were of colossal money laundering therefore they law enforcement agencies closed them down but other mixers did not receive as much attention. That will no doubt change in the future as more money launderers search for alternatives to mix their funds.

Though this is my personal observation, the government is doing all these to destroy Bitcoin since they could not destroy it directly so they have to enter it from the window to destroy everything, Andy they are attacking any company that connected to Bitcoin activities therefore those who are using those services should be careful with the kind activities you share. But question the op asked it looks like futuristic. CM is down z Sinbad is down now which one is the next one to shutdown? It is a very simple question, and it needs a simple answer.

Any mixer that deviate from the mixing rules to do it own things and likeness will be shutdown. Because as a mixer you have to obey the rules set out for you to operate.

Interesting, I hadn't heard anything about that prior to the seizing of their site--and that tells me I ought to bookmark at least one crypto news website. 

Why in the world would any mixer that wants to remain in business for the long term accept funds that are so tainted that, as you said, in doing so they would seal their own fate?  I assume mixers have a choice in the matter, no?

Going forward I'm guessing the US and other governments are going to scrutinize all the mixers harder than they ever have, and I'm wondering if any of those governments are just going to take the quick route and criminalize them.  I always hear that bitcoin can't be stopped by any government, but if you make it illegal to use just watch its adoption drop off a cliff.  Same thing with mixers I'd imagine.

Well, I did create this thread to ask a valid question about whether Sinbad would be next to be shut down by multiple law enforcement agencies because if it could happen to Chipmixer, it could happen to any mixer.

It has taken around six months from when I created this thread to Sinbad being seized but I do not feel vindicated even though I was right. A crystal ball was not required to see this was eventually going to happen because the law enforcement agencies already had their eyes on the Sinbad mixer.

Let us not forget Sinbad was already connected to the Blender mixer money laundering because it received at least $22 million from Blender for the owner/operator Mehdi to launch Sinbad and that why it was always going to fail.

There were also claims made Sinbad was used to launder some of the $35 million stolen from the Atomic Wallet hack. Coindesk have the update on their website.

This Wired.com interview and article regarding Sinbad.io was interesting on several levels including the fact the owner/operator of Sinbad mixer categorically refused to answer the question when asked if Sinbad.io was a relaunch post-branding of the now defunct Blender.io

"Elliptic" is a crypto tracing company that provided evidence to backup a link between Blender and Sinbad and since Blender was already on the radar of the US law officials because they faced allegations of money laundering huge amount, therefore the thread was related to Sinbad. Had allegations in the Wired.com article had been made against Coinomize, Wasabi, YoMix, Whirlwind or others I would have created the same thread but altered the name from Sinbad to the other.

It is as simple as this: Blender was shut down because of money laundering allegations and the owner/operator is wanted by US investigators to face criminal charge. Strong evidence has been put forward by a crypto tracing company that Blender.io was relaunched as Sinbad.io therefore in my opinion the chances are the next mixer to be shutdown will be Sinbad as it is already linked to criminal activity conducted during the previous carnation which was Blender.io

I was hoping for a wider intellectual debate rather than those that have posted with ulterior motives therefore I am locking this thread as some here have missed the point entirely and tried to take the thread deliberately to a different direction when any member including you and I should not be stifled in our comments just because of wearing one particular set of signatures or avatars. If that were the case, all those wearing gambling/gaming or crypto exchange signatures and so on should not be allowed to post comments related to competitors as each and every time a conflict of interest will be falsely cited and that mindset is unacceptable in what should be thriving free speech forum.

This is not a rumor, but a fact confirmed by one of the staff members. We have already discussed this so many times that any further discussion is completely pointless, just as this discussion is pointless considering that logic leads us to a single conclusion, which is that all mixers are targets of those who want to stop them. Which one will be next is just a mere guess and nothing more.

Chipmixer was very lucrative and that was why the campaign thread was flooded with pages upon pages of applicants as soon as there were slots available. As mentioned earlier, I applied (around 3 times) and was overlooked therefore stopped applying.

Can you imagine how difficult carrying out this process manually would be and how simple it would be if it were possible to automate it?

If there was evidence of this happening it would be

There was also the matter of alleged alt-accounts participating in the Chipmixer campaign. I have to agree with you, some members that were both advocates of Chipmixer and also posting regularly to meet the income threshold have gone quiet but if they no longer need to meet those requirements to earn a signature campaign participation income and can earn a weekly amount by posting less then they will as with most members that would probably be the driving factor of their presence here.

There was a link posted some time back where a forum staff member stated words to that effect. I need to try to find it as it confirmed what you cited as a rumour to be true.

I can't really add much to the discussion and my only disclosure is that I once applied but didn't get a look in and so never reapplied for the chipmixer signature campaign (or any other mixers for that matter) after that.

Not long after my application was turned down, the fee being paid to signature participants collapsed but was still very lucrative nevertheless.

I agree with DaveF's sentiment that users seeking mixed coins will probably turn to depositing crypto to exchange A, split the coins into many chunks e.g. three, four or five) or many more) swap them for other crypto and or tokens then send those tokens to other exchanges B, C and D or even uniswap/pancake swap style instant exchanges to either swap back to what ever crypto they were and then sent on to the final destination or yet another exchange, rinse and repeate.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if perhaps a couple of the people taking out short term loans of a thousand dollars at a time on a very regular basis are repaying with laundered money either from Ponzi/hyip style scams, or, money filtered through the above method.

Has anyone else noticed after the initial toxic shock of the chipmixer demise that certain high and not so high profile UID's have started tailing off the amount of their posting...?

Then there is also the rumour that @theymos has sent out an edit that no admin/staff moderators are allowed to join mixing signature campaigns.

It seems like you want to create a war among the Mixer World Campaign participant
Do you know one thing? People are interested more in negative things. If you spread negative things, more and more people will engage with this and will find it interesting to discuss. While I believe JollyGood's title choice is a bit weird. He could have used better wording not to poke Sinbad. But the title makes it more interesting to read.

examplens, did you see the fact LeGaulois posted in another thread? It seems Sinbad and Blender Owner is the same. Since Blender was seized, and now it's exposed that Sinbad is Blender, they should take action and come up with a new brand name.

If there is going to have a thread like that, then we will have episodes of the names of the mixer that will likely next target to be shut down, if we're asking about what happened to Chipmixer and the fate of the other mixers the topic should be generalized for all mixers not just one, as if the authorities have only eyes on Sinbad

And there's openness on Sindad's founder based on the article you provided

https://www.wired.com/story/sinbad-crypto-mixer-north-korean-hackers/

So the founder is willing to address the issue and not ignore it or run away from it.

I feel that this caption is not the best to use in this context. The body of your post showed clearly that you made a post as a user in the forum who is at liberty to express himself whenever and however.
But remembering that the signature and avatar you wear is the one of the major competitor of sinbad.io. You would have been kinda lenient in the choice of your title. Something like this could be more appropriate.

After Chipmixer, which mixer is Next To Be Shutdown?

Then, in the body of your post you would then mention the article sinbad was linked to blender or so.

I have the same sentiments, I think eventually mixing will be portrayed as being synonymous with criminal activity and that false narrative will be pushed out by those that wish to control the agenda. Yes mixers can be used for criminal activity but does not they will. but there might be some sort of radical transformation or implementations which could theoretically keep certain mixers out of trouble but it depends on how law enforcement agencies approach it in conjunction with mixers.



It certainly was a general question and that debate is twisted somewhat by those that see me wearing a signature and overlook the question raised. You are right it is a silly argument against crypto but those that are putting out false information on a regular basis by equating criminal activity to crypto are simply hiding ulterior motives. Like fiat can be used for nefarious purposes crypto can be too but that does not mean it is specifically a tool for criminals.

If those that have become super-rich because of crypto get together to put forward an alternative view that is being projected against crypto then they could help manage the way crypto is talked about in political circles including the all-important financial departments. If lawmakers get a real understanding of what Bitcoin and other crypto are then they will be far more better placed to make the safest and best decisions.

That is true, either they get financial penalties or bad headlines but hardly ever are there criminal cases against banks and when there are there is little to no talk about them being shut down. The problem Sinbad faces is different to competing mixers because none have been accused of being previously associated with Blender and that makes the difference here.

You can as many questions as you like

If Sinbad is operated by the Blender team but Coinomize, YoMix and Whirlwind (and others) are not, then the chances are the others will last longer than Sinbad.

I cannot add more to what you wisely posted other than my opinion that all mixers are most probably being watched by various law enforcement agencies and the moment serious criminal activity is detected they will be shutdown.
 

There were times I thought this, too (especially after BitMixer and Blender were taking down). But I got some hope when I read the proposed regulation for crypto-asset transfers in the EU. They acknowledge clearly that there are legitimate uses of mixers here:

Source: Draft legislation 2021/0241 (COD)

It is implied that this means no general prohibition of mixing, however, that crypto asset service providers, when registering a transaction coming from a mixer and the transaction being suspicious, "should" collect additional data and/or a justification of the mixing "practice".

Of course this is only a draft proposal in one of the major economic regions, but it could indicate a "pragmatic" stance regarding mixers becoming more commonplace. It is also possible that mixing services themselves could be regulated eventually, i.e. for example determining maximum non-KYC amounts and otherwise some form of KYC (which would of course be difficult to be implemented by the current mixers like Sinbad, Whirlwind etc.).

Of course if it is suspected that a mixing operator has cooperated with criminals or acted with a high degree of negligence (i.e. not performing at least basic chain analysis for funds linked to major hacks/thefts/ransomware attacks), then further seizures are to be expected.

---

Edit: Unfortunately, the article I mentioned before was deleted from the final regulation draft. Instead a more ambiguos passage was introduced: that the European Banking Authority (EBA) should clarify the rules crypto-asset providers shall adopt when faced with transactions which went through mixers. So we have to wait what's the final outcome of this.

It seems to me that JollyGood very clearly targeted only one mixer in the subject. He also leaves a reference to this discussion only in the Sinbad ANN thread, I would say try to dramatize everything more. https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.62321741
If you were to observe everything from the point of view of someone who came here to get information about which mixer to use, how do you see this Jolly's performance?

At the same time, he obviously did not research everything enough.

This has already been discussed, and T3PR00T posted the reference from those discussions.

I'm pretty sure that the owner of Whirlwind or Hhampuz as a signature manager doesn't want this kind of campaign.



Why stop there, earlier we saw different paths of the mixer. Can I start a global discussion about mixers with something like Is Whirlwind.money Next To Be an exit scam?
Or if The Sceptical Chymist wants it to be more global we can include Unijoin in this way, it would really encourage discussion. We just need to change the name of the mixer with passive accusations.



Whirlwind has only been operating for a few months. How do you know the same thing won't happen to them? A group of hackers will mix coins through it and it can easily be accused of money laundering. As far as I know, not a single mixer has a solution to protect against "dirty funds".

btw. JollyGood did you read the discussions posted by T3PR00T before starting this topic?

No offence taken  

Unlike the Blender and Chipmixer websites, Whirlwind has not been seized or forced to shutdown. Also, to my knowledge Whirlwind have not been accused of money laundering by any law enforcement agency nor is their owner/operator the subject of an international arrest warrant. Having said that, criminals will use anything that is available for conducting (or trying to conduct) criminal acts.

As an example, just because banks can be used for money laundering does not mean everybody using their services will launder money and as long as the banks have mechanisms in place to either reduce, minimise or eliminate the risk of illegal activity by the owner/operator they will end up escaping serious criminal charges as they do not want to fall in to illegal activity. If a case was made against a bank they could fight a lawsuit against a governmental agency to show they implemented various rules to prevent criminal activity. I think exchanges do the same, they blacklist addresses that have passed on them by law enforcement agencies and are obligated to seize funds to hand over various data to those agencies.

A test case for a mixer in a Court of law will be thoroughly informative. It will become interesting if we ever see a legal defence by the Chipmixer owner/operator or the Blender-Sinbad owner/operator (if either get arrested and presented before a Court).

Yes he seems confident but he refused to answer the question when it was put to him if Blender and Sinbad were related.

The connection was made with a lot of proof, it is much more than a rumour.

The article in Wired was specific to Blender and Sinbad therefore the thread however if I find one where an allegation has been made against another mixer (regardless of their name) I will not hesitate to post about it.

No

I found no article about Whirlwind that alluded to them being a criminal enterprise. As far as I am aware the Whirlwind team have not been accused of money laundering and have not been accused of being being behind Blender.

No

Where is the negative spin? I created a thread to post a link to Wired.com

I have almost zero interest in Chipmixer and anything related to them including who used them and during which time periods. Also, I never used their service. I did apply maybe 3 times to join their signature campaign but was overlooked therefore stopped applying. Only the law enforcement agencies will be able to state their reasons for the investigation in to Chipmixer, I have no idea how long criminals used it for.

The name Mehdi does not sound Russain. It's more like a Pakistani name or middle eastern name.

If you believe so then I highly recommend you to stop promoting a mixer, even leave the bitcoin forum and live a life where you don't need to touch crypto. You are in Bitcoin and to the law enforcement, Bitcoin is somehow illegal or fair to say they are trying everything to label Bitcoin as illegal asset. Why are you risking your life?

This is one of the concerns bitcoiners have had so far - and of course I think it's normal and makes sense.
The government will try to put up more of a fight for any mixer and it's definitely on their watch list. Of course their main reason is to prevent a lot of money laundering cases - but actually they seem to have another mission besides fighting crypto, confiscate bitcoin for example.

The same will probably be attributed to some of the other mixers currently growing and developing, but of course it's a matter of time. Until then, I think the government will shut down any mixer service like they have done other mixers before.

No, it has to be on games and rounds board and need a handsome amount of prize pool from OP's own funding.

There are already two topics about it on service discussion board:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/blenderio-sinbadio-thoughts-5439754
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/wallets-belonging-to-both-blender-and-sinbad-are-identified-in-elliptics-soluti-5446173

Even it was discussed on sinbad.io Ann too: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/sinbadio-mixer-secure-fast-and-easy-to-use-5416985

I trust my reading and I saw another topic about it on another board that makes four places to discuss about it. Having another one about the same topic and in the reputation board is just boring.

I guess Sinbad is paying people secretly to keep them always in the discussions. Whatever they are doing, it seems all are working very well to keep the brand always in everyone's mind.

I think whirlwind still have long road to receive such attention yet. Right now Sinbad seems the most popular mixer around.

Maybe OP should move this topic in gambling board, this question sounds to me like a guessing game or visiting to some gipsy fortune teller and asking her to tell you future from your hand palm.

Can I ask a counter question, Is Whirlwind.money Next To Be Shutdown?  

It is inevitable that most if not all banks have been used by criminals for nefarious activities. How many closures have we had as a result of that? Even when banks engage in scams, they just get a slap on the wrist.

This is a grey area as minimizing or eliminating risk by mixers would mean censoring transactions just as centralized exchanges do and would lead to even more centralization of bitcoin channels.
The government can play Russian Roulette with mixers but the end is definitely not to put a stop to illegal activities.

- Jay -

Eh, JollyGood is just asking a general question that's probably on the minds of quite a few members here, and as far as criminals using any mixer service....that's similar to the argument that bitcoin or [name your cryptocurrency] is/has been used for illicit purposes and therefore is bad.  It's a silly argument against crypto, and if it were valid then fiat should be bad as well as all guns, knives, and anything you can think of that's been the tool of criminals.

Who knows what the government is going to go after and with what amount of resources?  It seems as though all things crypto are under the microscope at the moment but that could change.  I do hope there are some powerful bitcoiners with political influence lobbying for us, because the little guys like myself can't really do much of anything to sway those politicians looking to criminalize mixers and whatever else.

Full disclosure, while posting this I am wearing a sinbad signature.

I think, over time all mixers are going to be shut down by various government entities. Even if they are doing nothing illegitimate, for some reason everybody in law enforcement sees them as illegitimate. I will also say, with more and more exchanges that are not requiring KYC going away I see privacy becoming more and more difficult to obtain.

Continuing with that thought, I have posted many times about various ways to somewhat reliably break proof of ownership of coins. It requires time and effort a decent knowledge of exchanges and (this is important) hunting down exchanges that consider a simple SMS and e-mail address enough KYC for a certain level of withdrawals. Because, if you deposit coins in one exchange using a disposable e-mail and phone number, convert them to another coin, transfer that coin to another exchange that just requires an e-mail address and disposable phone number, and then withdraw from that second exchange after converting to another coin good luck ever being able to prove anything especially if you used XMR or other privacy coins to transfer between exchanges.

Tinfoil hat paranoia, the last mixer that is left standing is run by the NSA....

-Dave

It's a little difficult for me to understand the purpose and goal of this kind of thread, especially in the reputation section. We have to play guessing when a service will be shut down. Maybe pool voting should be started, how long will it last?
Why single out only Sinbad, why not include the other mixers as well? Maybe to run some contest or giveaway.
Is Whirlwind.money excluded from this dilemma even though they are engaged in the same type of business, or just because you didn't find a single article about it? Or because you wear their signature.

Given that you wear the Whirlwind money signature, I assume that you are considered part of their team in some way. Isn't it a little inappropriate to negatively spin competitors without a valid reason?

Do you know how long Chipmixer has been in business, and do you believe that it was only used by criminals in the last few months, so that was the reason for the investigation?

Pointing at Sinbad.io is also referring to other mixer service providers. The prediction that it will be the next to be shut down by law enforcement agencies is mere speculation, who knows another one might be the next because they offer almost the same service. After all, nobody expected the sudden closure of the almighty Chipmixer because no publication predicted it. We can not doubt that these mixer services are needed to promote privacy and limit centralization. But like other genuine services, criminals will always capitalize on this wonderful service to carry out their evil activities. Relating Sinbad with Blender is mere rumors that have not been proven even the website publication used the word "may", which means that they are not sure that Sinbad is an offshoot of Blender.

Mehdi is confident of his fate though and most peobably if he even get caught he will also accept whatever sentence given.

He seem to have roam around bitcointalk since he shared the link https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/2023-list-bitcoin-mixers-bitcoin-tumblers-websites-2827109 emphasizing several anon services were not seized by governments.

If I were NoKor hacker, I would actually be spreading that $1.7B in different anon services. Sinbad only got $10M, thats too small.

Then why did you join the signature campaign of one of the mixers? No offence, I am just asking because I think you shouldn't join advertising what you think are used by criminals.

But that does not mean that good people are not using mixers too. Even before bitcoin, there were online criminals.

It is inevitable that most if not all mixers will be used for (or will be attempted to be used by criminals for) nefarious purposes but when headlines such as "The world’s most prolific crypto thieves have used Sinbad.io to launder tens of millions" are associated with a brand it means their days are numbered.

I found this article in Wired.com interesting on several levels such as the creator of sinbad.io who wants to be known as Mehdi named the mixer Sinbad after the fictional sailor that travelled far by sea. In the interview Mehdi seemed to comment on almost everything that was being discussed but when asked if Sinbad was a new version of the now defunct Bitcoin mixer Blender, he refused to comment.

"Elliptic" is a crypto tracing company and they have suggested there is irrefutable evidence $22 million moved from Blender to Sinbad in the very early days after Sinbad was created therefore that doubles the reasons why it will probably be the next mixer to be shut down sooner rather than later.

Sinbad.io probably does not have too much time before various law enforcement agencies get together to organise the shutdown of their website and try to arrest the owner/operator on money laundering charges. If criminal activity as taken place on an industrial scale and almost zero protocols were put in place to either reduce, minimise or eliminate the risk of illegal activity by the owner/operator they will end up facing serious criminal charges.