Uh huh.
So p2pool is very much like solo mining?
That's .... really not all that appealing for anyone who isn't in the several GH/s league.
Why on earth are you sticking it out with it if you know after a week the returns are virtually non existent?
Hmms. Well thanks for the reply. It didn't actually add much detail that I didn't know, but it did illustrate the "Hey I thought I earned that but it vanished" nature of it, and the "Hey I can mine here for days on end and get zilch" aspects.
I've deliberately not gone for the top mining pools because I understand the need for many mid sized pools rather than one huge dominant pool. There are plenty of good pools outside of the top 5 or 6 big players. Sadly I'm not going to count p2pool as one of them. I've seen people claim they get slightly better than ordinary pool returns out of it, so good luck to those who stick with it, but until a decentralised pool comes out that gives a lot less variance appears ... Nope. I'm not waiting the 6 months required to find out if that's true or not.
Note to p2pool devs : The main forum thread for it on here https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/1500-th-p2pool-decentralized-dos-resistant-hop-proof-pool-18313 really doesn't give anything like enough detail on the variance problems, or the apparently vanishing "earned" BTC side of it. The idea is great. The end product though is a bit opaque.
Seriously guys. Check out the mid sized pools though, the dominance of the main 3 players is getting worrying.
Topic: Ah ha! (p2pool question I can't ask in the place where I want to ask it) - page 2. (Read 1706 times)
April 05, 2013, 04:31:09 PM
April 03, 2013, 05:12:20 PM
Yo noticed that too eh? I've been just mining in P2pool for a few days now(24 hours continuous), in the last few days no one has gotten a single share, the p2pool.info is saying 4 days now without a found block; I think I may have only of gotten some Bitcoins from a few donations since I started 2 weeks ago.
P2pool is working on a very different system then the larger pools, I think Slush's pool gives out a share for every work unit regardless if the pool finds a block or not. In the end on a bad week Slush is taking the brunt of the losses, hence the 2% infrastructure tax to make sure he keeps in business.
P2pool is acting more like one big solo miner, and with an average of only 300gh/s it takes a whole day for the whole system to crack a block. meanwhile slush's pool has 6000gh/s! The averages on wins and losses smooth out a lot better on slush's pool or on the gargantuant BTC pool, that one is huge!
It also doesn't help that the pieces sent to miners is quite large, it takes my rig 760mh/s 1 hour to hash them, it is very distrubing to me when I see the estimate amount at .065 and after a dead or orphaned block It pounds right down to .043, very painful, I haven't gotten a cent in 4 days. but thatws how p2pool works one giant congregation of solo miners, working together but facing the same benefits and challenges of solo mining with the rewards being distributed.
P2pool is working on a very different system then the larger pools, I think Slush's pool gives out a share for every work unit regardless if the pool finds a block or not. In the end on a bad week Slush is taking the brunt of the losses, hence the 2% infrastructure tax to make sure he keeps in business.
P2pool is acting more like one big solo miner, and with an average of only 300gh/s it takes a whole day for the whole system to crack a block. meanwhile slush's pool has 6000gh/s! The averages on wins and losses smooth out a lot better on slush's pool or on the gargantuant BTC pool, that one is huge!
It also doesn't help that the pieces sent to miners is quite large, it takes my rig 760mh/s 1 hour to hash them, it is very distrubing to me when I see the estimate amount at .065 and after a dead or orphaned block It pounds right down to .043, very painful, I haven't gotten a cent in 4 days. but thatws how p2pool works one giant congregation of solo miners, working together but facing the same benefits and challenges of solo mining with the rewards being distributed.
April 03, 2013, 04:20:29 PM
Only took me around 24 hours to figure out I can only post in this section!
(Brains r us).
Anyway! Hi all!
p2pool stuff that I've not managed to find answers for elsewhere:
First off, I've read and basically understand the whole p2pool system. With a couple of huge blank spaces...
When I mine for a standard pool, every share that gets accepted generates some micro BTC quantity. Nice and easy to keep track of, even if the amount varies with block luck. I'm good with all that. But ... in p2pool, it's a little different. I can sit and watch hundreds of accepted shares vanish in to the pool, but not get a single "share" according to p2pool.
I gather that's just how it works, but what I don't get is what on earth is happening to all those accepted non-share returns? Am I being sent deliberate duplicates just to keep my computer busy? .. Frankly I'd rather it didn't do that thanks. Just send me one share every 3 hours if that's the only one I'll get any credit for maybe?
Yes. You're right. I really don't understand that part of p2pool at all, and I've never seen it explained anywhere. I can accept that somehow when I do get lucky and send a good share in, for some reason it seems to get way more credit than it would do on a normal pool, but it makes using p2pool and trying to estimate returns / compare it to any other pool virtually impossible.
The other bit I don't get is ... It seems to be based on a rolling 24hr PPS type system. PPLNS or something? Anyway. That's fine in theory if a pool has enough hash power to turn a block over normally within 24hrs. What seems to happen at the moment though, is if you return a good share and get credit for it at the start of a long block, your credit vanishes before the end of the block gets reached two days later. That doesn't help either when you're trying to pin down how well p2pool works compared to other systems.
Finally! I've seen all the comments saying p2pool isn't suitable for low hash rate miners, but I've never seen anyone dare to state a cut off point for viability. Where do the returns begin to vanish? Is a 750M/hs set up viable? How about 1.2G/hs? What about 500M/hs? The only statement I've seen on low rate miners implied that CPU mining on it was pointless. O.o Rly?! Ya Rly! We knew that already!!!
I'd love to love p2pool, but the opacity for it on those points always makes me feel like leaving it running on p2pool is potentially a huge waste of time. The only conclusion I can draw is .. it's perhaps the ultimate dip in pool. You're barely ever going to get a credit for an accepted share anyway, so may as well just dip in for 15 mins once in a while, return a few on the off chance you get lucky, then dive back out to standard pools.
I wanted to post this to one of the main p2pool threads, in fact it's the only reason I signed up for yet another forum, but here we are!
(Brains r us).
Anyway! Hi all!
p2pool stuff that I've not managed to find answers for elsewhere:
First off, I've read and basically understand the whole p2pool system. With a couple of huge blank spaces...
When I mine for a standard pool, every share that gets accepted generates some micro BTC quantity. Nice and easy to keep track of, even if the amount varies with block luck. I'm good with all that. But ... in p2pool, it's a little different. I can sit and watch hundreds of accepted shares vanish in to the pool, but not get a single "share" according to p2pool.
I gather that's just how it works, but what I don't get is what on earth is happening to all those accepted non-share returns? Am I being sent deliberate duplicates just to keep my computer busy? .. Frankly I'd rather it didn't do that thanks. Just send me one share every 3 hours if that's the only one I'll get any credit for maybe?
Yes. You're right. I really don't understand that part of p2pool at all, and I've never seen it explained anywhere. I can accept that somehow when I do get lucky and send a good share in, for some reason it seems to get way more credit than it would do on a normal pool, but it makes using p2pool and trying to estimate returns / compare it to any other pool virtually impossible.
The other bit I don't get is ... It seems to be based on a rolling 24hr PPS type system. PPLNS or something? Anyway. That's fine in theory if a pool has enough hash power to turn a block over normally within 24hrs. What seems to happen at the moment though, is if you return a good share and get credit for it at the start of a long block, your credit vanishes before the end of the block gets reached two days later. That doesn't help either when you're trying to pin down how well p2pool works compared to other systems.
Finally! I've seen all the comments saying p2pool isn't suitable for low hash rate miners, but I've never seen anyone dare to state a cut off point for viability. Where do the returns begin to vanish? Is a 750M/hs set up viable? How about 1.2G/hs? What about 500M/hs? The only statement I've seen on low rate miners implied that CPU mining on it was pointless. O.o Rly?! Ya Rly! We knew that already!!!
I'd love to love p2pool, but the opacity for it on those points always makes me feel like leaving it running on p2pool is potentially a huge waste of time. The only conclusion I can draw is .. it's perhaps the ultimate dip in pool. You're barely ever going to get a credit for an accepted share anyway, so may as well just dip in for 15 mins once in a while, return a few on the off chance you get lucky, then dive back out to standard pools.
I wanted to post this to one of the main p2pool threads, in fact it's the only reason I signed up for yet another forum, but here we are!
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