AI text prediction in our Smartphone, guesses Bitcoin holders seed phrase.

justdimin

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Quote from: CryptoHeadlineNews on June 17, 2022, 03:43:36 AM

I actually don't believe it's possible to predit a whole 12 seed phrase words. I doubt it. Such A.I tool don't exist.

This is how text prediction A.I smartphone feature works. That feature was meant to help predict frequently used phrase on your mobile phone, and our wallet seed phrase are not phrase we frequently use on our mobile devices, or i will like to ask, how many times do you type in your wallet seed phrase on your phone? Because as for me, the only day i saw my seed phrase was the day i downloaded and registered my wallet and wrote the seed phrase in a safe place.

So i actually doubt if this A.I could guess a whole 12 words correctly.. Or unless you are that careless someone who always type in your seed phrase every morning on your keyboard and has made the A.I remember those set of words to always link together

Maybe not today, but there could be some sort of technology in the future which could make it faster. I mean if you could try much faster, then you could try "all" possible versions of it. The key strokes are there, we know what could be typed in, it's either words or numbers and maybe special cases like %!'^%&T or whatever. In this regard, you give a software the possibility of these three, and ask it to do all combinations to figure it out.

I know for a fact that it won't work that easily right now and would take millions of years to do that, but we are seeing technology rapidly moving higher, the 4 letter passwords are totally gone now. Because, it can be done, in 10-20 years who knows maybe even 12 words would be figured out in a few days or weeks too?

cryptoaddictchie

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Quote from: fiulpro on June 16, 2022, 01:25:46 PM

It's also something that you don't use everyday for me I do not know where did I write my seed phrase but I keep changing, installing uninstalling the wallets therefore it's always a new one there.

Exactly thats why its not gonna be an easy task for the thief. Unless he can accurately guess the arrangement of the seed words which is totally impossible. Even a super computer cant generate a good sequence for that. So I think the idea of stealing using this is quite low though cant really say its not gonna work.

CryptoHeadlineNews

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Quote from: Freeveto on June 16, 2022, 07:56:43 AM

Text prediction in our Smartphones help us predict or guess the next word we're typing......

Therefore this feature can easily guess a crypto holders seed phrase by just typing in one word and the text prediction can

be able to bring out the whole seeds phrase of that wallet.

This is as a result that we have all those data collected, that's the reason it's able to know exactly what you're looking for.

I actually don't believe it's possible to predit a whole 12 seed phrase words. I doubt it. Such A.I tool don't exist.

This is how text prediction A.I smartphone feature works. That feature was meant to help predict frequently used phrase on your mobile phone, and our wallet seed phrase are not phrase we frequently use on our mobile devices, or i will like to ask, how many times do you type in your wallet seed phrase on your phone? Because as for me, the only day i saw my seed phrase was the day i downloaded and registered my wallet and wrote the seed phrase in a safe place.

So i actually doubt if this A.I could guess a whole 12 words correctly.. Or unless you are that careless someone who always type in your seed phrase every morning on your keyboard and has made the A.I remember those set of words to always link together

SFR10

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Quote from: DdmrDdmr on June 16, 2022, 01:31:45 PM

It does make one wonder whether this predictive process is performed locally, or sent to some server under any circumstances...

Despite reading that most of the default ones perform everything locally, I couldn't find a single reliable source that verified those claims or rather statements.

Quote from: bittraffic on June 17, 2022, 01:14:17 AM

What they suggest in the article is, “Do yourself a solid and prevent that from happening by clearing your predictive type cache.”

I think this is how to do it.
https://i.imgur.com/sAn4CtH.jpg

Turning off a feature doesn't clear its cache... Here's a video on "how to do it" for android devices ^{[each brand has slightly different steps]}.

fullhdpixel

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Quote from: Freeveto on June 16, 2022, 07:56:43 AM

RISK FACTOR ASSOCIATED WITH AI TEXT PREDICTION COMES VIA WHEN

.Your phone is stolen by another crypto holder.

.You sell your phone to someone without erasing your data.

.You gifted your phone out to Loved one ,a friend or family member without flashing your entire phone.

Therefore hackers could use this feature to drain a crypto user’s funds by just easily typing in the first word phrase and the text prediction

will complete the wallet's seed phrase.

WHAT TO DO

If your phone is stolen, how can they open it when it's locked? And most phones now are strict and cant be easily re formatted. There's also a wipe data feature that we can use in case you are sure that your phone is stolen intentionally and won't be returned anymore and who sells his phone without erasing all his data?

If we gifted the phone to the people that we know, I don't think they will attempt to stole your cryptos. Hackers will still have a hard time to guess the first word of our seed phrase. Overall in order to be safe from all of these, it is better to not store your seed phrases on your phone but it's already advised before. Seed phrases must be stored only offline and on secured places.

bittraffic

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I noticed this also when I tried to import my wallet to another and when your phone has this autocomplete. It suggests some words. When I type the first letters of the word, it suggests which to complete. Pretty much it already know what I would be typing. These AI is close to hacking me, it just need someone who can use it cleverly and this someone will have my coins.

What they suggest in the article is, “Do yourself a solid and prevent that from happening by clearing your predictive type cache.”

I think this is how to do it.

kaseygriffin

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As far as I understand, the way this modern technology spots seeds is like a game of chance with huge odds. It's like a random person buying a winning lottery ticket, thinking it's going to win, and as it turns out, it's much more difficult than that. So I'm also a bit skeptical about whether we need to worry about these things or not, or whether fear is so overwhelming in our minds that it will come faster than usual.

tjtonmoy

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Quote from: Silberman on June 16, 2022, 06:03:25 PM

Copy and pasting your seed words is even worse than that as this means you have your seed words in a file which is easily available

It's on a usb stick as a text file format and don't worry the usb stick is safe and sound. I do have my backups and they are safe too!

Quote

At most you need to type such information once or twice, and after you do so it is not necessary to type it anymore.

I have the same question! your smartphone AI won't pickup the next word pattern unless you use them frequently! so as long as you don't use them quite often, your AI have no chance of picking it up.

tjtonmoy

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Quote from: Minecache on June 16, 2022, 12:18:17 PM

Paste them? are you saving the seed phrase directly on your phone?. If so, your assets are at risk.

nope, not like that. i use a txt file and save the seed on my usb stick! and the usb is safely kept in my storage! when i need the phrase key i just plug it in and copy the text from txt file

franky1

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if i wrote gui.. text prediction may predict guitar.. (or guilt, guide)
(guitar and guilt are seed words but guides, guidance, guitars, guilty, guild, guile, guiro, guise. and others are not)

so typing in 3 letters gui gives a 33% chance prediction
so typing in 4 letters guit gives a 100% chance prediction for guitar being the word

but it cant predict the next 11 words

to be fair, type in any 4 letter word and manually by hand you can predict the word.. (not all 12 just the particular word).. why you may ask? because thats how the seed word library is set up.. no 2 words seeds have the first 5 letters that are the same.
the library excludes many words that appear too similar.

it cant predict 12 completely random words, that do not make sense to each other (do not form a common sentence)

yes it can predict a single seed word if you have only typed in 3 letters at ~33-50% accuracy. or 100% at 4 letters

AI text prediction is only good at multiple words.. if.. after you have wrote a few words of some popular sentences/quotes it will tell you how the popular saying ends.

but hackers wont use text prediction as a tool for seed sniffing.. they will just use screenshot software to take pictures of your display every X seconds or use key loggers.

Silberman

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Quote from: tjtonmoy on June 16, 2022, 11:57:34 AM

I don't have any issue here, and I don't find this that much risky. I always copy and paste them in my smartphone. It is hard to remember the whole 12/24 word seed phrase late alone type them frequently. As far as I know, the AI won't pick up the next word pattern if you don't use them frequently.
It will always be on risk if you keep your assets in one wallet, if it's not a hardware wallet. Get yourself one of those and be risk free.

Copy and pasting your seed words is even worse than that as this means you have your seed words in a file which is easily available, and you can be sure that if a hacker sees a bunch of random words in a single file they are immediately going to check if this leads to a wallet they can hack, besides why people are typing their seed words so many times they need to have a copy of them available at all times? At most you need to type such information once or twice, and after you do so it is not necessary to type it anymore.

AakZaki

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The AI Text prediction will indeed read every word you want to type, but that doesn't mean it will be able to transcribe and arrange the seed phrases, it's still quite difficult. All keyboards have this feature, you can turn it off easily so no data is read.
If you are worried that the data on your smartphone will be known or hacked by others, pay attention to smartphone security and reset the smartphone if you want to give it to someone else or want to sell it.
Wallets in smartphone apps are all vulnerable to eavesdropping, which is safer to use hardware wallets with double security and hard to hack.

Anonylz

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I think as you continue to type new words with your keyboard those previous words will be pushed back or got mixed up (if not removed after some days) so it will be hard to guess and have the complete phrase imo. It will be equally important to occasionally clear the cache of the keyboard as suggested above, this is easier said than done, I really don't think I have done that before but now it is something I will take note of.

DdmrDdmr

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The news came out around a month and a half ago, which doesn’t make any less necessary to revisit. If one has got time, it’s generally better to go to the horse’s mouth, and read through the reddit post that depicts the case scenarios that were used to reproduce the situation, and points to a couple of links that show how to clear the predictive typing cache.

It does make one wonder whether this predictive process is performed locally, or sent to some server under any circumstances...

fiulpro

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Quote from: cryptoaddictchie on June 16, 2022, 08:51:46 AM

Seed phrase comprises of a lot of words, though AI predictive can catch some words still its hard to get all words, especially those AI predictive program can only rrcognize those words continously being used unless the hacker can see the history of written words in your phone. Probably someone might try it but its not an easy as you think mate.

Fact is they are not only a lot of words, they are also random and unassociated we well for example you take Goat and Triangle 📐 the AI prediction feature lies upon essentially telling them the words that you are using a lot and even if you are selling your phone you are probably going to have a factory reset which means that this would essentially erase everything that there is to predict it. It's also something that you don't use everyday for me I do not know where did I write my seed phrase but I keep changing, installing uninstalling the wallets therefore it's always a new one there.

suzanne5223

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Thanks for the tips.
Every innovative concept always comes with risk but I believe this piece of information is for newbies crypto holders because the mobile wallet is vulnerable right from the beginning and only a newbie will keep big cryptocurrency on a mobile wallet.
In the meantime, it is hard for hackers to guess all seed phrases though if not a lot of crypto wallets would have been hacked and thats if the person doesn't save his/her seeds phrase on the phone.

Minecache

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Quote from: tjtonmoy on June 16, 2022, 11:57:34 AM

I don't have any issue here, and I don't find this that much risky. I always copy and paste them in my smartphone. It is hard to remember the whole 12/24 word seed phrase late alone type them frequently. As far as I know, the AI won't pick up the next word pattern if you don't use them frequently.
It will always be on risk if you keep your assets in one wallet, if it's not a hardware wallet. Get yourself one of those and be risk free.

Paste them? are you saving the seed phrase directly on your phone?. If so, your assets are at risk. Its very difficult to remember all 12/24 words of that seed, so most people save it somewhere offline and only use it when we change phones or use a new wallet. we don't need to do so often, re-enter those phrases every time you open the wallet.

No matter how much or how little our assets, as a crypto investor we should at least have a hardware wallet to ensure the safety of our assets.

tjtonmoy

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I don't have any issue here, and I don't find this that much risky. I always copy and paste them in my smartphone. It is hard to remember the whole 12/24 word seed phrase late alone type them frequently. As far as I know, the AI won't pick up the next word pattern if you don't use them frequently.
It will always be on risk if you keep your assets in one wallet, if it's not a hardware wallet. Get yourself one of those and be risk free.

mk4

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It doesn't necessarily need to be AI, your keyboard app just needs to be decently bad privacy-wise for you to get screwed.

I really don't care though, as I only have like $50 on my hot wallets, then everything else on cold storage. Hardware wallets, people!

vv181

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Quote from: Freeveto on June 16, 2022, 07:56:43 AM

The solution to this is to ensure you clean up your AI predictive type catch so that those data is not stored in there, in case a senario

where your phone got stolen or gets into a wrong hand.

The main culprit is using the default app/configuration of a mobile keyboard:

Quote

Andre’s experiments confirmed that Google’s GBoard was the least vulnerable, as the software did not predict every word in the correct order. However, Microsoft’s Swiftkey keyboard was able to predict the seed phrase right out of the box. The Samsung keyboard, too, can predict the words if “auto-replace” and “suggest text corrections” have been manually turned on.

The article suggests clearing up the keyboard predictive cache, but I'm sure that wouldn't solve the problem either. It's better for people who use mobile wallets should choose an alternative keyboard app that they can fully control: Android Keyboard Alternatives That Respect Your Privacy.

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