Author

Topic: [ANN] Ethereum: Welcome to the Beginning - page 1309. (Read 2006003 times)

legendary
Activity: 1120
Merit: 1000
January 24, 2014, 08:47:48 AM
#53
Quote
Who/what could stop them giving themselves a $20million annual salary for developing?

In theory, nothing. Like anything else in this world, it all comes down to trust. Do you think some of the most well-respected names in crypto are going to steal your money? Then don't invest. You could ask the same question about any real-world corporation...what's to stop them from stealing your investment and bailing? Sure, they might go to jail, but that didn't stop the execs at Enron...or WorldCom...or Tyco...

Quote
Interesting but I'm not comfortable locking down my investment for 1-3 years. The uncertainty about the future of Cryptography currency is too high making long term commitment risky.

According to the IPO information, only the FOUNDERS' investment will be locked down. Investors can sell any time they'd like, once the blockchain actually comes online.
full member
Activity: 210
Merit: 100
January 24, 2014, 08:38:44 AM
#52
They want to change the world as we know it and earn $20,000 million?

First they want to earn $20mio.
Then they try to change the world.
If they fail, they still have $20mio consolation money.
member
Activity: 112
Merit: 10
January 24, 2014, 08:26:54 AM
#51
Some of you have said "but they get the bitcoins, and then they get a share of ether, too!" But you aren't reading their terms carefully enough--those bitcoins go to pay for development. They do not go into the pockets of the founders (other than inasmuch as they are paid salaries, as employees).

Who/what could stop them giving themselves a $20million annual salary for developing?



They want to change the world as we know it and earn $20,000 million?
full member
Activity: 210
Merit: 100
January 24, 2014, 08:11:56 AM
#50
Some of you have said "but they get the bitcoins, and then they get a share of ether, too!" But you aren't reading their terms carefully enough--those bitcoins go to pay for development. They do not go into the pockets of the founders (other than inasmuch as they are paid salaries, as employees).

Who/what could stop them giving themselves a $20million annual salary for developing?

member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
January 24, 2014, 08:10:29 AM
#49
I think there have to be some ground rules. Raising money through the cryptocurrency community really sets a precedent. IANAL, but promising a billion dollar marketcap is dangerous. if you're moving several million dollars around, governments will notice. the idea that you can just put a website with a "prospectus" and have "audits" is... interesting. I would doubt that any Canadian court would consider a case where a cryptocurrency / DAC owner tries to get his rights enforced. so there is no court which would hear such a case, therefore there is no concept of "law" here. any promises should be in the software itself. fundraising clearly does not follow such a protocol. also I would very much doubt that Canadian law allows for private IPOs/crowdfunding, certainly if those funds come from outside the country. for example the US has recently adopted a crowdfunding law, which AngelList uses. but it has many restrictions and applies only for US residents (obviously). the idea that you can just move ahead and ignore all laws is... interesting. I personally doubt its in the interest of the community, but if people would want to invest their money like this, I guess its for the market to decide.
legendary
Activity: 1400
Merit: 1000
January 24, 2014, 08:02:37 AM
#48
Interesting but I'm not comfortable locking down my investment for 1-3 years. The uncertainty about the future of Cryptography currency is too high making long term commitment risky
full member
Activity: 142
Merit: 100
Hive/Ethereum
January 24, 2014, 07:35:03 AM
#47
So there's a lot to read before asking a *completely* educated question about Ethereum, but hopefully I'm not jumping the gun too much...

Because Ethereum has a Turing complete scripting language, you cannot necessarily know how many cycles a script will take to execute, but Ethereum charges a fee based on how many cycles (past 16) that it takes your script to execute, how are you handling that?

If the contract doesn't have enough funds to fully feed it, my understanding is that it will cease execution. After all, if you're a miner, why would you do work for no fee?
legendary
Activity: 1511
Merit: 1072
quack
January 24, 2014, 05:56:44 AM
#46
Congratulations! I've read the white paper (twice) and I am beginning to understand about 25% of it! Whenever I hear about protocols that support building custom currencies, I get all giddy.

The feeling I had when I first learnt about the MasterCoins project, or ColoredCoins or OpenTransactions or NXT has just been magnified even more by seeing what Ethereum is about to bring to the table.

I will be keeping a close on this one.



What happens to these MasterCoins, ColoredCoins, OpenTransactions or NXT projects?

Only time will tell who succeeds in the end, maybe more than one eh? This is the first time since Bitcoin i have seen something really disrupting being introduced to the community. I have confidence Vitalik will see this to completion.

Activity:0,

Well shilled, sir.

Bitcointalk already allows trust ratings selling/buying, account trading etc.. Just make 100 shills and hype&bump the hell up your own threads.

FYI There's nothing but promises- In all the listed alt cryptos too. Basicly what happened is that the author got money and you got nothing.
newbie
Activity: 5
Merit: 0
January 24, 2014, 05:29:33 AM
#45
Congratulations! I've read the white paper (twice) and I am beginning to understand about 25% of it! Whenever I hear about protocols that support building custom currencies, I get all giddy.

The feeling I had when I first learnt about the MasterCoins project, or ColoredCoins or OpenTransactions or NXT has just been magnified even more by seeing what Ethereum is about to bring to the table.

I will be keeping a close on this one.



What happens to these MasterCoins, ColoredCoins, OpenTransactions or NXT projects?

Only time will tell who succeeds in the end, maybe more than one eh? This is the first time since Bitcoin i have seen something really disrupting being introduced to the community. I have confidence Vitalik will see this to completion.
newbie
Activity: 10
Merit: 0
January 24, 2014, 04:45:44 AM
#44
So there's a lot to read before asking a *completely* educated question about Ethereum, but hopefully I'm not jumping the gun too much...

Because Ethereum has a Turing complete scripting language, you cannot necessarily know how many cycles a script will take to execute, but Ethereum charges a fee based on how many cycles (past 16) that it takes your script to execute, how are you handling that?
legendary
Activity: 1511
Merit: 1072
quack
January 24, 2014, 04:24:32 AM
#43
Congratulations! I've read the white paper (twice) and I am beginning to understand about 25% of it! Whenever I hear about protocols that support building custom currencies, I get all giddy.

The feeling I had when I first learnt about the MasterCoins project, or ColoredCoins or OpenTransactions or NXT has just been magnified even more by seeing what Ethereum is about to bring to the table.

I will be keeping a close on this one.



What happens to these MasterCoins, ColoredCoins, OpenTransactions or NXT projects?
member
Activity: 98
Merit: 10
January 24, 2014, 02:45:24 AM
#42
Trying to wait patiently to get my hands on these, can't wait to be able to help a community grow from the beginning.  I just found out about bitcoin when Cody Wilson posted the Dark Wallet on Defense Distributed's Youtube.
sr. member
Activity: 379
Merit: 250
January 24, 2014, 12:31:04 AM
#41
Hey, I don't really understand this, can someone explain it to me? Thanks a lot. It looks cool, but i'm not exactly sure what it is.

Polycentric law.

Welcome to Crypto-Anarchy. Enjoy your stay.
legendary
Activity: 1321
Merit: 1007
January 23, 2014, 11:28:23 PM
#40
This should be posted in Altcoin announcements

Interested though
hero member
Activity: 854
Merit: 658
rgbkey.github.io/pgp.txt
January 23, 2014, 11:22:10 PM
#39
Hey, I don't really understand this, can someone explain it to me? Thanks a lot. It looks cool, but i'm not exactly sure what it is.
hero member
Activity: 640
Merit: 771
BTC⇆⚡⇄BTC
January 23, 2014, 10:48:40 PM
#38
  • The fundraiser will last two months and close at the end of March
  • Early investors for taking a great risk due to the uncertainty of investment will be rewarded by a bonus of 2*initial investment for the first week and then this bonus decays by 2 percent per day for the remainder of the fundraiser until it reaches a floor of the base exchange rate of 0.001 BTC per 1 Ether

Greetings Mr. Buterin,

I hope this project shows us much progress!  Smiley

BTW, Why not getting a wider period of time in order to raise more funds? Wouldn't anything near a 100 days or + be more appropiate?

What about:
Quote
early investors for taking a really HUGE risk due to the uncertainty would be rewarded by a bonus of 10*initial investment for the first week and then this bonus decays by 2 percent per day for the remainder of the fundraiser until it reaches a floor of the base exchange rate of 0.001 BTC per 1 Ether

Summary: More time = Higher fund raising = Higher risk/return ratio

I'm gonna keep a close eye on the development of this.

Keep up the good work!

Cheers!
newbie
Activity: 2
Merit: 0
January 23, 2014, 10:41:06 PM
#37
Hey guys,

So if I can jump in here quickly to clear a question out of the air...

It seems that a main concern to many is that, upon the fundraiser/IPO stage, investors can put forth X amount of BTC for 2000 ether(or less as the days progress)... This simply amounts to investing within a company/idea at the early stages, giving the capital needed to produce a product/good/service.

Once this product is created, the worry seems to be that there will be a 50% devaluation of ether, effectively ruining the "profit" of those who got in early.

However, isn't the point that, if true value is created within that time frame, that the 50% devaluation has no real affect, if say, interest in the new protocol/system, has risen exponentially? As in, an increase of the money supply will not affect prices, per se, if the productivity of the market at that time, outpaces the rate of inflation.

I think the idea of escrow services, contracts, reputation services, etc, is crucial, not only to money itself, but to how the internet and the future will be shaped. If Bitcoin was the "TCP/IP" of the internet, then Ethereum is the "HTML/UI Browser" of the internet, which is massive... however/whatever spawns from this innovation, will be where we are today, meaning those who are in the right place at the right time, will be very well off.

Profit is people. When individuals value a good/product/service/etc, they reward it with profit. The division of labor and all other Econ 101 factors come into play and I for one am a bit confused as to the nervousness of this devaluation and why it is viewed negatively.

Could someone help clear the air? Assuming I invest 5 BTC, therefore receiving 10,000 ether, what is the worst/best case scenario after the release?

Sorry for the tangent!
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 100
We're all good at something, no1's good for nothin
January 23, 2014, 10:29:47 PM
#36
Regardless of which technology stacks survive and/or thrive, I think we can all agree that the financial world is in for some major upheaval!

My thoughts exactly! Good luck guys!
full member
Activity: 142
Merit: 100
Hive/Ethereum
January 23, 2014, 10:17:14 PM
#35
I've read all 28 pages on the other thread, and all the posts on this one so far. I'm surprised at so many people who are opposed to the founders' share. My take on it is this: if you invent potentially world-changing technology, and that technology succeeds, you deserve to be rewarded. I don't see anybody here complaining about how much money Larry Page and Sergey Brin made off Google!

The founders' ether doesn't even begin to vest until one year after launch, and doesn't finish vesting until three years after launch. That means two things: first, there is no "insant profit" for the founders...they only make money if they create long-term value. Secondly, their premine shares are "locked," which means that even though there is an initial 33% premine (0.5X), no portion of that money will show up on exchanges until 1-3 years have passed. For all practical purposes, that ether doesn't even exist until it vests.

Some of you have said "but they get the bitcoins, and then they get a share of ether, too!" But you aren't reading their terms carefully enough--those bitcoins go to pay for development. They do not go into the pockets of the founders (other than inasmuch as they are paid salaries, as employees). If you think they are lying, well that's another thing entirely. Given the caliber of the founders' and their reputation, I think that is seriously unlikely.

Another thing I don't understand is how people understand ratios so poorly. Would you rather 1000 coins at $10 profit each, or 100 coins at $100 profit each? (HINT: It's the same amount either way!).

TL;DR If you think ethereum just faces too many technical and legal hurdles, or that it's just too risky, then don't invest. But if you think this has true potential and you decide not to invest "on principle" because you feel like the founders are making too much money, then you're a damn fool.

Thanks for the coherent thought--it's nice to find between all the troll posts Grin

newbie
Activity: 38
Merit: 0
January 23, 2014, 10:04:00 PM
#34
Congratulations! I've read the white paper (twice) and I am beginning to understand about 25% of it! Whenever I hear about protocols that support building custom currencies, I get all giddy.

The feeling I had when I first learnt about the MasterCoins project, or ColoredCoins or OpenTransactions or NXT has just been magnified even more by seeing what Ethereum is about to bring to the table.

I will be keeping a close on this one.

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