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Topic: [ANN] [PPC] PPCoin Released! - First Long-Term Energy-Efficient Crypto-Currency - page 58. (Read 684839 times)

sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 253
Inflation doesn't influence price much. Most price action is because of confidence in cryptocurrency in general and in speculative trading.
You're right that's a good point; right now cryptocurrencies are growing quite faster than the current x% yearly inflation rate of Peercoin.

POW is used to distribute coins more fairly.  POS is used to secure the network with little energy consumption. Eventually (10 years?) POS will dominate money supply, too.

Will Peercoin's code change then for that to happen? Because as I see it, if it becomes worth a lot, there will still be many, many miners even if the block reward is 10% of what it is now.
hero member
Activity: 516
Merit: 500
CAT.EX Exchange
I have two short questions about Peercoin.

The PoW reward is diminished by half every time there's a 16x increase in the network. So if Peercoin's value was to drop considerably, miners would leave for Bitcoin, so the PoW reward would go back up, thus increasing inflation and contributing to a further price decline. Is that not a problem?
Also, is Peercoin truly more energy-efficient, since the block reward halvings need a considerable 16x increase in the hashrate to happen?

Thanks in advance for your answer.

Inflation doesn't influence price much. Most price action is because of confidence in cryptocurrency in general and in speculative trading.

POW is used to distribute coins more fairly.  POS is used to secure the network with little energy consumption. Eventually (10 years?) POS will dominate money supply, too.
sr. member
Activity: 462
Merit: 253
I have two short questions about Peercoin.

The PoW reward is diminished by half every time there's a 16x increase in the network. So if Peercoin's value was to drop considerably, miners would leave for Bitcoin, so the PoW reward would go back up, thus increasing inflation and contributing to a further price decline. Is that not a problem?
Also, is Peercoin truly more energy-efficient, since the block reward halvings need a considerable 16x increase in the hashrate to happen?

Thanks in advance for your answer.
hero member
Activity: 516
Merit: 500
CAT.EX Exchange
A critical vulnerability in PoS?


Sunny doesn't answer technical questions these days probably because similar questions have been asked/answered before. You are welcom to ask in http://www.peercointalk.org/index.php?board=3.0 where there are several Peershares developers who are very competent in technical issues.
hero member
Activity: 535
Merit: 501
EMC
A critical vulnerability in PoS?

1. Halving POS-transaction

I see, at POS generation, wallet splits transaction by half, if age less
then 90 days.

There is missing detailed explanation, why it doing.
We assume, it made for preserve attack to POS block by carousel with
chain of huge transactions,
when value of some huge transaction grows and grows, and small set of
rich transaction like this
is occupy POS-engine, and disallow to another transactions participate
in POS.

However we see, there is splitting small transaction values, too.
for example, see emercoin block:
http://darkgamex.ch:2752/block/3245626c36497e6d82d68a20c2e00fcd75f938bf780333d3a5038dea71ba4aab
There is divided transaction with small value - 50EMC only.
We thinking, often split like this just unnecessary increases blockchain
size, and produce future transactions with higher size.
So, we decided to setup bottom threshold, and transaction with value
less than that threshold will not be split.

There is our changes:

wallet.cpp:1336
-                if (block.GetBlockTime() + nStakeSplitAge > txNew.nTime)
-                    txNew.vout.push_back(CTxOut(0, scriptPubKeyOut));
//split stake
+                if (block.GetBlockTime() + nStakeSplitAge > txNew.nTime
&& nCredit > nCombineThreshold)
+                    txNew.vout.push_back(CTxOut(0, scriptPubKeyOut));
//split stake if (age < 90 && value > POW/3)

So our question:
Are our changes reasonable? Can it hurt security with some way, which we
not aware?
Can you share your opinion?


2. POS attack - is possible?

Imagine, I do following:

1. Prepare set of 32 "special mature transactions" UTXOs.
Each transaction has relative big value, and matured for long time - for
example, 90 days.

2. Prepare 32 * 32 small "junk transactions" UTXOs.

3. Also, I modify my wallet to generate POS-block with using
IN-transactions, whose I wish.

4. I run quick loop with attempts to generate POS-block (not every
second, but just in the for loop).
    On each loop iteration, I select for my minting transaction inputs
    4.1. - one "special" transaction from [1]
    4.2. - subset of "junk set transaction" [2], selected by bits in the
iteration counter.

5.  As result of [4.1] there will be high probability of pass through
POS-barrier:
 if (CBigNum(hashProofOfStake) > bnCoinDayWeight * bnTargetPerCoinDay)
   As result of  [4.2] there will be different hash values on each
iteration, so
I can generate many attempts to create POS-block with a different hashes.
Therefore tith this way, I have very high probability to generate my own
POS-block.

6. If so, I can create uninterrupted sequence of 32 my own POS-blocks,
and by this way -
rollback some fresh transaction, i.e. produce result like attack 51%.

Question: Is this attack possible? Or, I missing something, and cannot
see whole picture?

I asked Sunny King these questions, but received no reply.
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VOTE FOR PPCOIN
please donate for dev.
BTC: 13MVMftimCmpQEsryo47pTs97ubmwkT31Y
LTC: Lh9ChfS1X3YWXmapr66nQjj3qZmys3qkNw
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Hi PPCoin fans,

We opened some PPCoin Pairs on our website

member
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Yeah, some truth there. I tried once upon a time to get a definite formula to code for a proof of stake and it all vapourised, turned out there was not yet any actual concrete design ready to code.

-MarkM-
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PPC/BTC market is back up after trade engine updates at agx.io!

- The Austin Global Team

Find us at:
agx.io
bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=507474
bitcointalk handles: "agx.io," "AustinGlobal"
twitter.com/AustinGlobalX
austinglobal.tumblr.com
legendary
Activity: 1205
Merit: 1010
Peercoin v0.4.0 is now released. This is a mandatory upgrade release, upgrade deadline is May 4th, 2014. Please visit peercointalk forum for more information and detailed instructions.

http://www.peercointalk.org/index.php?topic=2473.0

Cheers!
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- The Austin Global Team

Find us at:
agx.io
bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=507474
bitcointalk handles: "agx.io," "AustinGlobal"
twitter.com/AustinGlobalX
austinglobal.tumblr.com
sr. member
Activity: 392
Merit: 250
Please if anybody can answer this guys questions, it would be great for ALL PoS coins. Idk why this was only shared with mint forum...

im still on the fence


can someone explain how this stops someone from generating lots of PoS blocks 20 days in the future from a bunch of TX's with small interval, whether through one or multiple wallets

Code:
ss << nStakeModifier;
ss << nTimeBlockFrom << nTxPrevOffset << txPrev.nTime << prevout.n << nTimeTx;
hashProofOfStake = Hash(ss.begin(), ss.end());
if(CBigNum(hashProofOfStake) > bnCoinDayWeight * bnTargetPerCoinDay)
    return false;


im not well enough versed with the code to know what these variable names imply

I am not sure I totally understand the question  but the network will reject blocks with a time stamp more than 2 hours off hence POS blocks generated with future time won't help you now. If you save the found blocks and broadcast the result when time is due, remember that any unspent tx  finds a POS block, this tx will not be allowed to find a POS block in 30 days, and the POS reward will be proportional to the coin age of the tx. That means you can't use this method to get more than your reward than the stake you have. All you get is better compounding of POS reward ("interest of interest").

im talking about TX's generated something like a second apart, a huge consecutive set of TX's
20 days from that point, will i see a huge set of consecutive PoS blocks?
the wallet software may have delays and take many tx inside a time window, but this cannot be relied upon since someone could make a wallet without such limitations
or do the attack with multiple wallets
hero member
Activity: 516
Merit: 500
CAT.EX Exchange
Please if anybody can answer this guys questions, it would be great for ALL PoS coins. Idk why this was only shared with mint forum...

im still on the fence


can someone explain how this stops someone from generating lots of PoS blocks 20 days in the future from a bunch of TX's with small interval, whether through one or multiple wallets

Code:
ss << nStakeModifier;
ss << nTimeBlockFrom << nTxPrevOffset << txPrev.nTime << prevout.n << nTimeTx;
hashProofOfStake = Hash(ss.begin(), ss.end());
if(CBigNum(hashProofOfStake) > bnCoinDayWeight * bnTargetPerCoinDay)
    return false;


im not well enough versed with the code to know what these variable names imply

I am not sure I totally understand the question  but the network will reject blocks with a time stamp more than 2 hours off hence POS blocks generated with future time won't help you now. If you save the found blocks and broadcast the result when time is due, remember that any unspent tx  finds a POS block, this tx will not be allowed to find a POS block in 30 days, and the POS reward will be proportional to the coin age of the tx. That means you can't use this method to get more than your reward than the stake you have. All you get is better compounding of POS reward ("interest of interest").
hero member
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
Please if anybody can answer this guys questions, it would be great for ALL PoS coins. Idk why this was only shared with mint forum...

im still on the fence


can someone explain how this stops someone from generating lots of PoS blocks 20 days in the future from a bunch of TX's with small interval, whether through one or multiple wallets

Code:
ss << nStakeModifier;
ss << nTimeBlockFrom << nTxPrevOffset << txPrev.nTime << prevout.n << nTimeTx;
hashProofOfStake = Hash(ss.begin(), ss.end());
if(CBigNum(hashProofOfStake) > bnCoinDayWeight * bnTargetPerCoinDay)
    return false;


im not well enough versed with the code to know what these variable names imply
full member
Activity: 308
Merit: 100

Hi,

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I have listed your coin already. To provide the full information
for all users you can update the information here:

http://www.crypto-coins-table.com/index.php?var_action=update_coin&coin_id=PPC

regards
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