Topic: [ANN][BSTY2] Community Takeover of GlobalBoost-Y, following 51% attack (Read 4070 times)

Please see the latest post by bstdev.  As always we are open for discussions on changes.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.11075779

Edit: Please feel free to join our IRC https://kiwiirc.com/client/irc.kiwiirc.com/#GlobalBoost

yes because is come a lot of coins but almost of it is passing wave no have stability cause start with a gpu coin and gpu coin is so bad for any coin in begin cause had a lot of farm gpus with hundreds gpus and the others with weak power processor can't do almost nothen of coins.
...and the another factor is the anyone coin had not inovation is just other coin for miners mining and when diff is high they go way because don't have nothen diffrent is just to mine make profit and after coin die with the pass of the time. we can do one coin to make different not just beauty coin with same thing of always,but
one coin with the new ideas the new concept thats what i was want to BSTY make so diffrence and i had a lot of ideas for it.if you want my help and the bsty is just won't help of us we can make this happening.

thanks a lot.

So far only you, me and CPUcoins want to fix BSTY.

Apparently the team has top men working on it :P:P:P, so they wait, and everybody else.
I assume most the coins are held by the BSTY team, that's why nobody else is complaining.
I don't know why they don't want to fix it. Waiting like this and doing nothing will kill it for sure.

About difficulty, this rises when miners join, and decreases when they leave. And miners join and leave mostly because of the block reward. Since the reward dropped 7x but the coin value didn't even increase 2x, everybody left. The solution is simple, increase block reward to attract miners.

Anyhow if BSTY refuses to do it, I will start a new coin, perhaps you can join me there. It will be a CPU coin, so anybody can mine. It's good when you hold a coin, to also mine it, to contribute to it's security. And with a cpu coin anyone can do it.

Regards

i post in the offical thread but no have more discussiion there so i post here too

in the comment than i made before i show to your i agree with bstymaster,he is right, see the cypher as example,they have a lot of miners,whatever how bstymaster explain before what the kill coin but, think a lot about it i see than if BSTY increase the reward to 347 or more maybe 800 or 1024 i don't now we made possible the back of coin to bittrex and get in on cryptsy soon with it purpose. but we do it just to begin and after the "diff" increase automatic and reduces the coin than we can made;just like bitcoin and litecoin use the increase difficult  with  time pass, but made we can innovate in this area to put equilibrium agree with the miners numbers like a how much more miners more diff increase a little,no much to not kill the coin.maybe is the solution.and stay only with CPU until diff is impossible to CPU just like bitcoin and litecoin we go to evolution hardware(GPUs after: asics and others) when diff is become so hard to determinate hardware.

thanks a lot for your attention.

Victor.

here is some news ?

I was see another coins volume miner,trading ,and i research,analyze,studied and think so much about all is happening with BSTY; and after makes this i see than maybe bstymaster is right or not so wrong.

because analysing some coins and model i see than the value of them happen. i see  they have a just only two things: this reward and way to make one Coin become will be bitcoins in comparisson level and In trade.
they have a lot of miners and trade in exchanges maybe the solution is change the reward as bstymaster said and  stay only with CPU mining like all coin can still alive for years without a be one passing wave begun.

PS:how much you increase the reward,more miners come and more trade volume we had and ist will be open the doors to we inovate the crypto-curreny universe with things this don't have.I had ideais for this,but first we need to grown.TO MOON... (It's after studied and analized i can confirm).

Maybe after then the coin have high value and "diff" be so hard we can made in right time GPU mining happening's and after, with the pass of diff and more hard it will be, we can join with asics antminers just like a bitcoin and litecoins just to ensure the permanancy and stability of this coin in the market.

thanks for your attention.

and sorry if is be a stupid thing a purpose to, but i just wanna help and i think than any ideas is maybe  the light of we need.

Victor.

Glad to see some genuine interest in my topic!


The best CPU/GPU hybrid right now would be Monero (XMR) with cryptonight algo, which is a "big" coin. The advantage is 2,3x for the GPU.
There is also scrypt-chacha, than can be adjusted to be CPU/GPU or CPU only (though some specialized hardware could still be created).

I was proposing a cryptonote fork (like xmr), where we would also fix the recent security issues found with xmr, and use scrypt-chacha instead of cryptonight.
And use the inflationary coin distribution I proposed.

In the usual bitcoin model, that all coins now use, the biggest reward goes to the users who mined it FIRST. The advantage of this approach is for advertising. It was good for bitcoin, because there wasn't a cryptocoin community at that time, so this kind of incentive was necessary.  However, we can see it fail for altcoins, one after another, effectively turning all of them into ponzi schemes.
So essentially, an altcoin should reward the hashpower, not being there first. I think it makes a lot more sense, and it actually does encourage the coin to grow to millions of users. This is what we need now!

If I have some supporters, I will write the code.

GlobalBoost not answering questions, rather delete posts.  BSTY is hiding something.  Weak hashes on the networks.

http://s2.postimg.org/ld90y44bt/BSTYDisabled4.png

The higher rewards at the beginning structure is completely 180 to what it should be.  This is what kills coins... Cypher right now...

Rank   Donor   User Name   KH/s    CYPHER/Day   BTC/Day
1              anonymous   9,614,267   154,653.797   6.6501
2             anonymous   775,289   12,471.198   0.5363
3             anonymous   252,787   4,066.303     0.1749
4              Monero30     158,558   2,550.538     0.1097
5              GPdigger      132,088   2,124.745     0.0914

Net hash... 32 Gh/s.   One user.. NINE Gh/s???  A QUARTER of the network?!?

Or START...

Rank   Donor   User Name   KH/s            START/Day
1              overxltc           2,266,663     2,929.652
2              overnoob       2,124,156     2,745.463
3              overx11           934,766           1,208.181
4              neptvey           405,496           524.101
5              anonymous   399,217         515.986

Pool rate of 12 Gh/s, with 8,000+ users.  Sick!  Now combine that MASSIVE level of disparity with that reward structure?  Why the hell would anyone want to mine a coin that's already mostly owned by under ten miners, or possibly only ONE!  I honestly don't even know why anyone participates in a system like this.  This is the last thing you want for network security.  It's called a "distributed" network for a reason.

So are we inventing new currency or just another tool for speculative purposes?  Currency is meant to be used, and carried around in your pocket... like as in your phone.... so, coin... only mined with Android device, the 'wallet' that you carry around.   To prevent virtual node farms, link it to a mobile phone number.  Now nobody has much of an advantage, the network has the distribution it needs, and it's actually useful.

Might want to check out MUE.  Good dev, good philosophy, launched with no hype and with slow steady growth.  Right now the GPU implementation of Quark algo gives GPU's about a 10:1 advantage (on my machine, 7970+R9-290 on an FX-8350).  I think that's about the closest we've got right now to a GPU/CPU hybrid.

Edit:  Holy crap!  Worst case yet!  Vanilla:


Rank   Donor   User Name   KH/s            VNL/Day
1              anonymous   99,931,580   13,910.653
2              kuyiuyzj           63,457,932   8,833.457
3              anonymous   9,162,597           1,275.450
4              vnl1234           8,142,145           1,133.401
5              anonymous   7,884,051           1,097.474
6              anonymous   6,751,714          939.851

Net hash of 300 Gh/s.  Two users have 51%+

7

I see things the other way around. Most people buy computers because they have other needs than mining. Most probably don't even consider mining when they buy it.
However if they later find they can earn a few bucks each month mining, while the computer is idle, why not. It may even turn out that mining will amortize the whole computer cost within a year or two, so this would be really sweet. Lots of people will join in to mine. So the mining reward is very important, if you want to get all these users. And you do want to get all of them, to make a coin secure.
Consider a coin with 100 million home-miners. That's pretty tough even for a government to attack. If not impossible. If the incentive is there, they will come eventually.

If you want fire-and-forget miner, most already are, they set priority to IDLE, or even a better way to do it is to set it to  PROCESS_MODE_BACKGROUND_BEGIN (win32).
And you can tune it a bit, if it still hinders your performance, so you won't feel it at all when running (other than hearing the vents revving).

That in particular won't be too good, but the majority of cpus are decent enough to turn a profit, if the right reward is there. What I'm talking about is bringing mining to the masses.

I'm not criticizing GPUs in general. But the fact is that the wide majority of users don't have a GPU that will turn a profit when mining. Once again, my goal would be getting *most* people into mining.

The advantage over purpose built mining rigs is simply security. You can't compete with the kind of computing power that all the average users combined would bring into cryptos.

GPUs are still ok, many users still have them, and they're readily available at your local computer store.
However GPU algorithms can be implemented into ASICs if the incentive is there, that's why they're evil. So it's easy for a government to attack these kinds of coins.

And the worst case scenario is bitcoin. Governments, have the ability to do a 51% percent attack on bitcoin right now at no cost, if they pass a law to seize all the ASIC farms.
You probably already know, but since it's a public thread, let me make the point that ASIC farms exist because of the economics of manufacturing and purchasing ASICs, you'll get them a lot cheaper if you buy this hardware in mass. You can even develop it, at this level.
And I believe (though I might be incorrect) that cex.io alone has enough hashpower to 51% attack bitcoin right now. If they're legitimate they have no incentive to do it, but still they put all the hardware in one place, ready for the government to seize. Hence, the evilness.

I already mine_{1} occasionally at higher cost than what I get. I would probably need more than a 10x to just break even with operating costs.

You don't need to explain me how using my computer for other needs amortizes cost. The whole point of my miner is that it's fire and forget. I mined while playing Qbeh-1_{2} but for some more AAA action I'm currently mining and playing Borderlands 2_{3}!

My current CPU is an AMD 450 X3. It does not seem to have the power consumption characteristics you mention. Besides, being passively cooled, I cannot run it full load for much time and I don't see any good reason for which anyone should buy more powerful stuff.

GPUs have become proper turing-complete architectures about a decade ago therefore they can run everything a CPU can whatever they're efficient at this is another matter. Yescrypt is not compute-oriented and therefore won't be accelerated by compute-oriented architectures.

{1} Mostly MYR and DBG. Sometimes also Fresh and FTC for testing.
{2} Pretty sure it's some UDK build. Due to some unfortunate design decision, massive overdraw and fillrate. Shading is basically from the 90s so plenty of untapped power. Still a quite simple game. It's not buttersmooth but very playable.
{3} Unreal 3, targeting X360 I have been told. Still quite simple graphically, I am almost at max settings. Again, not buttersmooth but playable.

Thank you for your response! One of the few constructive ones I got so far.

that's exactly the kind of miner a cpu coin needs. just that it needs 100,000's of them.

not sure exactly what you mean by that. you would mine even if your costs are higher than your reward?
with cpu it's good that your only cost is the electric bill, the computer is not a cost, as you already use it for other purposes.

It's not you! I had the same feeling over and over until I came up with a theory.
Some coins get screwed from the start. That's for sure.
But all coins get screwed eventually because of the deflationary model.  Or at least that's my theory.
The faster the deflate, the sooner they'll be doomed. BSTY is a great example of this.
So wait, did I just make a blasphemy here? I think so! It's like the cryptobible says that inflation is the doom of normal money, and their deflationary model is the solution. WRONG!

Let me explain why:
The faster a coin reduces reward, the more obvious the following effect will be.
At start there is the highest block reward, and the lowest hashpower.
So the early miners will get tons of coins, at a very very low cost. So there it is: inflation right from the start. The bitcoin model fails to reduce inflation, it simply puts inflation right there from the beginning.
The only way not to fail now is that these early miners will pretend they never mined the coin at all, and never sell it. This is absurd and insane. Ultimately people need money and will sell some of it.

So my workaround to this problem is to have the block reward proportional to the difficulty. This creates inflation still, however it changes the holders of these inflated coin. You will get inflated coins, but for higher hashpower, so there is a minimum amount you'd be willing to sell for. You need to compensate for electric costs, so this will help. I'm not sure if it eventually works out, but at least it's a workaround for the initial inflation issue. I'd say it's better to give many coins to people who invested lots of electricity than to the first people. There is no good reason why the early miners should have it all, not at all. This is simply PONZI and that's why all of them fail.

Real money works with inflation too, their inflation mechanism may be different than what I'm proposing but they do work better than cryptocoins.

My inflation mechanism is similar to farming. If more people start farming wheat, more flour will be produced. That's what happens in real world. So either the flour price drops, or the demand increases and then is successful.


They haven't got the unfair profit, because I stopped them when they were just about to get it. That's why they're mad at me.
But I haven't created the problem, I just exposed it. Having low hashpower is the problem, and is the result of their reward structure.
Their profit relied on nobody exposing it, and I'm sure they didn't even realize they had the problem in the first place. You did, but I'm pretty sure they didn't.

If a GPU miner can be made for this coin, then it's a good thing to make it, it simply exposes that this is not a cpu coin. Or if the performance advantage is not so big, then it will be a CPU/GPU coin.

GPU coins are ultimately evil because it moves mining from the average user to the professional miners, therefore creating centralization, and making it possible for a single entity to have over 51%.
With CPU mining a professional miner cannot compete with the casual user, who has the hardware for free, he only pays the electric bill for mining. But for the casual user to get  in and make a difference, a lot of them have to join in. So there must be a reward higher than the electricity cost. This is hardly the case with BSTY and not really the case with any other coins either.
If there would always be some profit for the casual user, then millions will eventually join in, making it the most secure coin ever created.

So yeah, lets increase the reward, that's the only solution, GPU or not. Also minimum reward that makes sense is 347, but I advocate to experiment with higher reward, let's see what happens.
It must attract many miners, therefore it will have a strong hashpower. Miners ultimately give value to the coin, so we may actually see a coin value increase.
Other thing that can give value to a coin would be anonymity, I also proposed it and am willing to code it.

Since I have been asked[1] to write about my position regarding BSTY and I found those legit questions I have decided to cross-post this in both the official and the "takeover" thread.

My interest in this coin stems from the unique algo. Due to life issues, I have been away from programming a couple of years and I really needed to update my skills to modern GPU methodologies. In theory I should be doing something more useful but since mining is a relatively compact problem it's a decent problem for starters.
I have kept an eye on it also because I like the idea of an existing company using an extra tool to grow. If they want to use the coin for profit and it turns out to be a good coin anyway, then we have common interest.

I am an occasional miner. Just to give you an idea, I have mined ~10k MYR in about a year. I don't think I hold any BSTY.
I might or might not mine it in the future, I got no plan. Sure no mining as you guys talk about it: I sell my extra electricity at an higher cost than you would consider "too high to mine".

It seems I have a feat for picking up coins which get screwed.

I had some feelings the hashrate was going low; I was honestly happy that was not my problem. I have difficulty understanding how changing the reward would change anything at this point. The value was nonsensically low last month anyway. I did read somewhere about the reward change; I don't consider it clearly broken even though I don't see much good reasons to do that. I am not against turning profit either so if this change rewarded early adopters more than it rewards current adopters... I cannot even tell if this is good or bad.
Has the BSTY team got "unfair profit" from this? I don't think so. I would have to look at the blockchain. In theory, I am not against that. It doesn't feel like DRK or BCN anyway.


[1] Probably due to being mentioned in this message. Let me be clear, I am mildly amused GPUs are called to the rescue. Everyone who thinks GPUs are "evil" of "nothing new" must have been living under a rock for the last 20 years (ignorant) or on Intel payroll (paid to talk shit).
That said, my miner has stronger priorities right now and I cannot estimate any timeframe for any eventual release including yescrypt even though I have some parts ready. Besides, having a 7750 I cannot offer any support to other models. Sure thing is the last pwxform isn't going to be fast it needs some bigger picture thinking.

OMG this Bruce Porter Jr. never sleeps. Maybe he's a bot. Maybe he's even a bot-net! Who knows?!! He deleted this one in less than 10 seconds. Whooppeee!
Have no fear though! no deletions going on in my thread.



Yes, it's hard to recruit cpu miners, when you don't pay. Same goes for gpu miners, or even asic.
I can help you with cpu mining, if you PAY ME! Oh no, don't get started now, that is if you increase the block reward, so I can get paid for mining, me and every other miner.

Anyhow, I started this takeover thread. Once y'all are done taking orders from the porter family, join me. I don't give orders, I give solutions.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1016617.0;all