Topic: [ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency - page 175. (Read 9723733 times)

Another Successful Dash Budget Cycle passed, 5024.98 Dash will be paid out across all voted in DAO projects in the next 24h
 (see u next month)
https://www.dashcentral.org/budget
https://app.dashnexus.org/proposals/active

...And where Monero stands? Marketcap side it fares much better than Dash.

Thank you for the detailed reply.

Going by what you said it is clear mining rewards will not be increasing any time in the near future (and probably will never) the rationale for that is clear now. Regarding the buzz around masternodes, any discussion to ascertain consensus in a potential change in the budget system should probably be discussed over a long period of time just to ensure they get it right.

With so much activity around various DASH community groups and their active Core Group hopefully things will go from strength to strength.

Mining rewards will not increase, they never have. Mining rewards were originally scheduled to be reduced to 40% in a time period of 2 years (2014-2016).
Just like the masternode rewards were originally scheduled to be increased to 60% in that same time period.
That scheduled mining reward reduction stopped at 45% with the introduction of our decentralized budget in 2015.

The reason masternodes are being discussed so much lately is the Dash Economics discussions which will lead to Dash Core Group introducing several network polling proposals,
to see if there is concensus among masternode owners to change our current blockreward allocation from 45% (miners) / 45% (masternodes) / 10% (budget)
to 38% (miners) / 54% (masternodes) / 10% (budget) over a time period of 5 years & to see if there is concensus among masternode owners to introduce a more flexible budget system
(one that is not limited to 10%).

There are several reasons behind these proposed changes, which will be described in detail in those upcoming network poll proposals and can also be found here :

Dash Core Group Presentation on Dash Economics
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUf76R2V3pY

At this point it is a bit unrealistic to exspect an increase in mining rewards, it is not what this cryptocurrency drives (it never has). But discussing it on the other hand is fine with me.
We can exspect a lot more heated discussions about mining and masternodes rewards the coming weeks, as we are getting closer to those network polls.
We are witnessing Dash governance in action : Discussions --> Polling Proposals --> More Discussions --> MN voting --> Clearity --> Network as a whole moves on.

Do you think mining rewards will increase? And why are masternodes being mentioned all over the place in recent weeks so much so than ever before?

On today's episode Amanda speaks with Veronica Andrino, Dash Philippines Head Ambassador. The Philippines shows great potential for Dash, especially in terms of remittances and business.

https://youtu.be/JCexpiFFpdM

For now i consider this just a signal that new long term investors got interested in Dash. It could have to do with investors that watched the DashPay demo and observed all the progress on Dash Platform
and wanting to have a position for themselves in Dash, before Dash Platform and the DashPay Dapp gets released to Dash mainnet.

It could also have to do with investors anticipation on the Dash Economics discussion outcome and how that could strengthen their Dash Masternodes ROI in the next 5 years. It could even be dormant
long term Dash investors that did not setup masternodes before, that are setting up  masternodes now in order to use the voting power of those masternodes in the upcoming Dash Economics network polls.
Or it could simply be large whales diversifying into Altcoins (which in Dash case means having their long term investment collect some interest, by setting up masternodes).

I am not convinced right now that this large increase in active masternodes is related to the Dash staking option on Binance, that got announced recently.

upload of more than 150 master nodes in hours.



Have those nodes been accumulated by the same group of people?

Any ideas on this huge increase?

could be by it?

https://www.binance.com/en/support/articles/af64a497b040498f85c573baf4f24fcb

a greeting

I would go a step further, things are not good because of the coronavirus pandemic and there is no clarity about what the next 6-9 months might bring.

It is too difficult to ascertain exactly what constitutes an upward or downward trend because of the complications that have arisen affecting the whole social economical climate on a global stage. If we can get some sort of normality back (as was with pre-coronavirus times) then we might see things becoming clearer.

Difficult to gather from statistics. All i can tell is that Dash has more spending then generating. Looking at the MRI (Miners Rolling Inventory) percentage for some specific PoW cryptocurrencies over a time period of 5 weeks and taking into account that MRI above 100% means more sold and MRI below 100% means more hoarded and also taking into account that (unlike other cryptocurrencies) Dash has newly generated supply split between miners and masternodes :

Bitcoin : 99,35% (slightly more newly generated supply hoarded then sold)
Bitcoin Cash : 82,91% (more newly generated supply hoarded then sold)
Bitcoin SV : 512,63% (far more newly generated supply sold then hoarded)
Dash : 112,10% (more newly generated supply sold then hoarded)
Litecoin : 96,93% (slightly more newly generated supply hoarded then sold)

Source : https://terminal.bytetree.com/ (see on-chain --> supply with each cryptocurrency)

Goal should be to bring Dash MRI down to below 100%

Next 6 to 9 months will be a very interesting period for altcoins. Altcoin season is here and it has still been expanded for longer months. Some people fear that the market gives altcoins very good rises recent months and when price drops back, they fear of another long down trend. They fear too much about it.

The downtrend is over and now we have been in an uptrend. During uptrend, price will be dumped back a little bit but such dump is for correction. After correction, price will rise again and hits higher peaks.

Well...I think it's time for Tok to fork DASH and make his own vision come true.   I and many others do not agree with ur assessment and I'm very certain will vote for the changes advocated for by dcg.  Good luck with your new project....I will be firmly voting for RTs proposal.  Cheers.

Those are all valid points quizzie. Also, XKCD has made valid points in his comments. But they're insufficient to address the issues at hand which are chronic and fundamental in terms of loss of market share. Doing "more of the same" isn't going to fix it IMO. Compared to bitcoin or litecoin we've already got massive reward ratios for nodes which are ridiculous compared to the cost of running them. We've also got far more versatility in the chain functionality, yet w've sunk out of trace on rankings and they are buoyant, including the forks. This isn't a problem of "too much mining reward". All the top coins have nearly twice that of Dash.

It's helpful to see the "economics" of the coin in at least 2 layers of context. At the protocol level there only a few variables which makes it much easier to analyse than the morass of nebulous complexity of the broader market and holder demographics.

We need to "engineer" that inner protocol model so that all the variables are perfectly tuned with each other, work in harmony and it's bullet proof. I've already demonstrated how easy it is in the last 2 posts - it's almost back of the envelope stuff and is only basic due diligence apart from anything else.



IMO, the reason I've been at cross purposes with others in these discussions is because I'm addressing flaws in the core protocol economics and they're countering with anecdotal solutions from the broader market context. Ok - some of those may be valid, but it's again like leaving the brakes on and just fitting a bigger engine instead.

If something is flawed or unstable in that inner protocol economics model then it's going to be felt all the way to the outer layers but it'll be impossible to detect where the problem originates cos it'll be buried in clouds of opinionated ambiguity that's unresolvable.

So returning to your question: , the answer is that the above analysis of core protocol model (whether we take my "500 Dash supply" market perspective or your "1000 Dash supply") requires Dash to lose market share or miners to mine at a 50% loss either of which destabilises the core protocol model.

The only way that model comes back into stability IMO is:

1. ramp the mining reward back up significantly. This would restore the lost competitively described in Example 1 previously. It will also solve the conflict of priorities between that and mining viability described in Example 2

2. continue to evolve the service provision layer to "mop up" the asymmetric margin over cost in the part of the primary supply that's "gifted" to masternodes. (Because if we don't, the market will do it for us by devaluing the coin further)

3. between 1 and 2 we will then have a more "measurable" value added provision by masternodes and this will feed positively back to both the supply deficit challenge (Example 1) and the mining sustainability challenge (Example 2) to mitigate them

We will then have a sustainable, competitive protocol economics model that isn't in conflict with itself, can market the primary supply competitively and sustains mining. With all that in place the price can rise and masternodes will start to benefit as well with dollar-valued rewards that are more in line with original expectations.

Well I'd like to know who is selling more Dash, miners or MN owners ( or teams that get 10%, they cash it, no? ) .  Who care less and who is to blame the most for DASH marketcap position...

Why uncompetitive and unstable ? Miners may got a lower revenue since 2015 (depending if they were in a position to upgrade their mining equipment or not and depending on their electricity costs),
but they did get a higher market position / price / better reviews with Dash due to all the technological advancements (PrivateSend, InstantSend, ChainLocks, Dash Platform)
which could not be done without incentivized masternodes. These technological advancements are most likely already priced in by the market (Dash Platform the obvious exception).
And the miners survived and even thrived in the period 2015-2020, looking at the explosive growth of the Dash hashrate over the years.

Link : https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/dash-hashrate.html

How high would we rank in a market without having any technological advancements and being basically a clone from Litecoin while having full mining revenue ?
Would people still mine it after 6 years ? Or would they have switched to another PoW network that offered better revenue or better name recognition ?

OK, lets look at it your way then. (Example 2).

We'll do the exercise again with different priorities. We'll make the supply to market a constant and allow the mining revenue to vary instead (which was constant and competitive in the last example). This time all 1000 Dash are delivered to the market as you say, from primary holders(Miners and Masternodes).

So now, for its $3000 investment, the market gets:

1. all 1000 new Bitcoins (=50% of the closing supply)
2. all 1000 new Litecoin (=50% of the closing supply)
3. all 1000 new Dash (=50% of the closing supply)

But lets look at the mining revenue:

1. the 1000 new Bitcoins cost $1000 to mine and revenue was $1000
2. the 1000 new Litecoins cost $1000 to mine and revenue was $1000
3. the 1000 new Dash cost $1000 to mine but revenue was only $500

So we now have uncompetitive mining rewards and the model's unstable. Something else would have to give to restore equilibrium.

The "uncompetitive overhead" is still there - it just pops out in a different place.

The Dash blockchain does not make a distinction between mining rewards and masternode rewards, they are both treated as newly generated supply and added to the circulating supply.
Which means that the market in your example gets a newly generated supply of 1000 Dash, because masternode payments are considered mined supply to the blockchain
(which is why masternode rewards, just like mining rewards need 101 confirmations before they get spendable).

Both masternode rewards and mining rewards are collected through so called 'Coinbase transactions', which have both a generation and a fees part. I am not even sure with the current blockreward allocation
if masternode rewards received on an exchange address can be differentiated by that exchange (through tracing) from mining rewards. They would be pretty much identical, specially now masternode payments
can be generated in a different payout address (thereby cutting the link between the masternode collateral and the masternode reward).
  
Of course not all mined supply goes to the market. Some miners hoard the received mining reward on their own address and some masternode owners do the same for their masternode reward.

Interesting graphics.

I consider that everything in this world is based on cycles ... life, seasons, markets ...

After the latest Theter (USDT) increases in the market, it is not difficult to guess that something fat is being hatched.

What could it be?

I think there will be a big hit on the table, and your USDT will be earmarked to dominate certain crypto currencies by very strong hands, and it will be the last big jump to a new price level.

Which currencies will benefit?

Well, those that have a clear use, or give their holders something that benefits them.

ETH, I think it could benefit, also currencies like Tezos, ATOM, or Dash for its passive returns, but especially Dash for its new model of wealth creation through the Dash Investment Foundation.

Let's think for a moment that Fundación Dash Investment little by little, value backed by Gold ... and it doesn't stop doing it for years.

What could be the fundamental value of Dash in 10 years?

This is practically not offered by anyone in this market.

A decentralized fund, backed in gold, with instant payments, optionally private, with chainlock.

One would have to be an idiot having millions in USDT not to take a large part invested here ... and own a master node or part of it, with returns of more than 6% per year.

I still have it very clear, but of course, I am nobody.

Going back to the question, yes, I think there will be a huge increase in some specific altcoins, but not all, and I dare say that BTC will lose the top spot in dominance in the next two to three years.

Today again new hashrate ATH 6,9 P.hash

A greeting.