Topic: [ANN][LSK] Lisk | Blockchain Application Platform for JavaScript Developers - page 648. (Read 3074310 times)
October 19, 2016, 08:32:38 AM
lisk ded?
October 19, 2016, 05:48:55 AM
@bigKush
1. How can the ability to transfer money qualify or not qualify, if it has to be taxed or not? If it would be so easy, I would just settle up a company in Dubai, Delaware or so, pay someone a salary there and ask all my clients to pay me offshore.
You are normally taxed, where you are working or where your income appeared and not, where you transfer the money later.
2. It is mandatory, that the business decisions are made in Dubai etc. How it makes ("nominee director" or current CEO) doesn't matter. But some straw man director doesn't work and the shareholders are also not allowed to be representative, because otherwise you would have a operational site in Germany again.
3. If - as you tell - you settle in Dubai and you are doing business outside of Dubai, how you can proof, that it is not in Germany. Which you need to proof in this case and which make everything much more worse.
3. For further discussion please check § 50d EStG, AStG and the DBAs between Germany and V.A.E. before.
1. How can the ability to transfer money qualify or not qualify, if it has to be taxed or not? If it would be so easy, I would just settle up a company in Dubai, Delaware or so, pay someone a salary there and ask all my clients to pay me offshore.
You are normally taxed, where you are working or where your income appeared and not, where you transfer the money later.
2. It is mandatory, that the business decisions are made in Dubai etc. How it makes ("nominee director" or current CEO) doesn't matter. But some straw man director doesn't work and the shareholders are also not allowed to be representative, because otherwise you would have a operational site in Germany again.
3. If - as you tell - you settle in Dubai and you are doing business outside of Dubai, how you can proof, that it is not in Germany. Which you need to proof in this case and which make everything much more worse.
3. For further discussion please check § 50d EStG, AStG and the DBAs between Germany and V.A.E. before.
October 19, 2016, 05:46:21 AM
OP buying new accounts , and even changed his Profile picture , is LISK over?
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16612565
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16612565
Haha, that actually made me laugh out loud. I'm sure a few people got worried by LiskQH though...
October 19, 2016, 04:47:46 AM
In case that Lisk will have to pay the tax for all ICO donations:
- Would it be 19%?
- 19% of all donations converted into EURO with the value it had on the last ICO day? Or how would this be calculated?
- Would it be 19%?
- 19% of all donations converted into EURO with the value it had on the last ICO day? Or how would this be calculated?
Approx. 35-64% (Income/Corporation Tax, trade tax, maybe VAT)
-snip-
Holy cow. A good argument to do everything to get the gGmbH approved. Even if it takes some more time. Maybe you should contact Uli Hoeneß to get some tips and learn from his mistakes.
October 19, 2016, 04:01:29 AM
In case that Lisk will have to pay the tax for all ICO donations:
- Would it be 19%?
- 19% of all donations converted into EURO with the value it had on the last ICO day? Or how would this be calculated?
- Would it be 19%?
- 19% of all donations converted into EURO with the value it had on the last ICO day? Or how would this be calculated?
Approx. 35-64% (Income/Corporation Tax, trade tax, maybe VAT)
Quote
If the point is to save on taxes, why the hell did your lawyer recommend you to open up a gGmbh in Germany? There are so many difficulties. Just open a company in Dubai in Free zone, you'll get 0% tax on capital gain, thin capitalization, no VAT,no stamp duty , simple pay 2000 AED per year and that's it! And you can do it within 2 weeks, including time to residence visa approval for the manager.
Because such wannabe offshore is not working. You must move at least the business to Dubai. Means, that the (main) staff need to be there too. If the staff stays in Germany, if the CEO works/operates from Germany, it will harm the tax-extemptness of your construct. It can be, that the tax office qualifiy the Dubai company as a "Zwischengesellschaft" and they will be compledly taxed or that the part of work, which is done in Germany, qualify to a "operational site" in Germany and "just" this part will be taxed.
Because of this, I recommend in such cases this gGmbh, even if it took some month longer than expected and there are some risks left, like all the time, if you do something new.
Btw. as the ICO started in Germany, it is not so easy to take the money and go somewhere.
Lol, not quite agree with your statement.
1)
"Btw. as the ICO started in Germany, it is not so easy to take the money and go somewhere." - It's crypto. you can transfer it whenever you want. andy offshore, and they will never ask any question if you fill KYC profile.
2) It's not mandatory for Max to sit in Dubai office. You can appoint nominee director which will rule the company with strict limit from it's shareholder (Max & Co). Who the hell will qualify it's office as Zwischengesellschaft", if the company will be settled in the Free economy zone, will do it's business outside of Dubai, and International law will apply, in particully, competition law and law of incorporation.
October 19, 2016, 03:55:25 AM
In case that Lisk will have to pay the tax for all ICO donations:
- Would it be 19%?
- 19% of all donations converted into EURO with the value it had on the last ICO day? Or how would this be calculated?
- Would it be 19%?
- 19% of all donations converted into EURO with the value it had on the last ICO day? Or how would this be calculated?
Approx. 35-64% (Income/Corporation Tax, trade tax, maybe VAT)
Quote
If the point is to save on taxes, why the hell did your lawyer recommend you to open up a gGmbh in Germany? There are so many difficulties. Just open a company in Dubai in Free zone, you'll get 0% tax on capital gain, thin capitalization, no VAT,no stamp duty , simple pay 2000 AED per year and that's it! And you can do it within 2 weeks, including time to residence visa approval for the manager.
Because such wannabe offshore is not working. You must move at least the business to Dubai. Means, that the (main) staff need to be there too. If the staff stays in Germany, if the CEO works/operates from Germany, it will harm the tax-extemptness of your construct. It can be, that the tax office qualifiy the Dubai company as a "Zwischengesellschaft" and they will be compledly taxed or that the part of work, which is done in Germany, qualify to a "operational site" in Germany and "just" this part will be taxed.
Because of this, I recommend in such cases this gGmbh, even if it took some month longer than expected and there are some risks left, like all the time, if you do something new.
Btw. as the ICO started in Germany, it is not so easy to take the money and go somewhere.
October 19, 2016, 03:53:32 AM
OP buying new accounts , and even changed his Profile picture , is LISK over?
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16612565
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16612565
A stupid attempt...
The original account is LiskHQ, not LiskQH.
Looks like the same as on Twitter with Max Kodrek instead of Max Kordek.
But the good thing is, the official Twitter account of Lisk is now verified by Twitter.
https://twitter.com/LiskHQ
October 19, 2016, 03:16:19 AM
OP buying new accounts , and even changed his Profile picture , is LISK over?
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16612565
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.16612565
October 19, 2016, 01:44:59 AM
That would be interesting to know but you can be assured: wherever there are large sums laying around, the german government will take its share. With a gGmbH comes a massive tax reduction, that's why it's so complicated. Hope LSK will find another way to form their company.
As a gGmbH you won't have to pay corporate nor commercial tax if Google Translate is correct.
October 19, 2016, 01:28:29 AM
@BigKush: The point isn't establishing a company. But to proof to the German tax office, that the maintainment of a cryptocurrency is non-profit and because of this, it should tax-extempt, is a bit more difficult.
It is nothing "out-of-the-box". The Argumentation took some time.
It is nothing "out-of-the-box". The Argumentation took some time.
In case that Lisk will have to pay the tax for all ICO donations:
- Would it be 19%?
- 19% of all donations converted into EURO with the value it had on the last ICO day? Or how would this be calculated?
That would be interesting to know but you can be assured: wherever there are large sums laying around, the german government will take its share. With a gGmbH comes a massive tax reduction, that's why it's so complicated. Hope LSK will find another way to form their company.
If it's so complicated, then why the hell Lisk goes that way?
Just forget Germany and find easier solution, in other tax residence.
October 19, 2016, 01:10:47 AM
If the point is to save on taxes, why the hell did your lawyer recommend you to open up a gGmbh in Germany? There are so many difficulties. Just open a company in Dubai in Free zone, you'll get 0% tax on capital gain, thin capitalization, no VAT,no stamp duty , simple pay 2000 AED per year and that's it! And you can do it within 2 weeks, including time to residence visa approval for the manager.
October 18, 2016, 01:03:58 PM
How is Waves doing it for example? Or ETH? They managed to keep the full amount?
Great point!
Honestly is paying 19% in taxes really that bad? I have owned a business for 4 years now. Just pay the taxes and move forward! If you really believe in LISK then you will make the money back and much more in profit in the long term. This coming November will be 6 months since LISK was launched. Not paying taxes only to save development funds while everyone waits doesn't seem like it's working for the value of LSK. Just pay the taxes to the German government and provide a decent salary to the future employees so you don't continue to lose them to other job offers.
October 18, 2016, 12:33:05 PM
How is Waves doing it for example? Or ETH? They managed to keep the full amount?
October 18, 2016, 12:05:26 PM
@BigKush: The point isn't establishing a company. But to proof to the German tax office, that the maintainment of a cryptocurrency is non-profit and because of this, it should tax-extempt, is a bit more difficult.
It is nothing "out-of-the-box". The Argumentation took some time.
It is nothing "out-of-the-box". The Argumentation took some time.
In case that Lisk will have to pay the tax for all ICO donations:
- Would it be 19%?
- 19% of all donations converted into EURO with the value it had on the last ICO day? Or how would this be calculated?
That would be interesting to know but you can be assured: wherever there are large sums laying around, the german government will take its share. With a gGmbH comes a massive tax reduction, that's why it's so complicated. Hope LSK will find another way to form their company.
October 18, 2016, 11:14:30 AM
@BigKush: The point isn't establishing a company. But to proof to the German tax office, that the maintainment of a cryptocurrency is non-profit and because of this, it should tax-extempt, is a bit more difficult.
It is nothing "out-of-the-box". The Argumentation took some time.
It is nothing "out-of-the-box". The Argumentation took some time.
In case that Lisk will have to pay the tax for all ICO donations:
- Would it be 19%?
- 19% of all donations converted into EURO with the value it had on the last ICO day? Or how would this be calculated?
October 18, 2016, 09:57:11 AM
@BigKush: The point isn't establishing a company. But to proof to the German tax office, that the maintainment of a cryptocurrency is non-profit and because of this, it should tax-extempt, is a bit more difficult.
It is nothing "out-of-the-box". The Argumentation took some time.
It is nothing "out-of-the-box". The Argumentation took some time.
October 18, 2016, 09:50:33 AM
well...that's quite a sad portion of information for us. Cause being a lawyer myself, i've already established one company at Switzerland,Zug, one at UAE, and one at Iraqi Kurdistan during the period (that took not more than 2 months - including full legalization of documents for beneficiary owners and making an articles/charter from the scratch) when Max' lawyer is not able to establish a single one within couple of months...even with such high budget =(
There must be tons of red tape to get around - I've heard setting up a company in Germany can be a tricky job if there are certain rules involved. Crypto + non-profit sounds like it could be a nightmare. Hopefully they will get around it. Must make it difficult to employ developers if there is no GmbH in place.
October 18, 2016, 08:46:57 AM
well...that's quite a sad portion of information for us. Cause being a lawyer myself, i've already established one company at Switzerland,Zug, one at UAE, and one at Iraqi Kurdistan during the period (that took not more than 2 months - including full legalization of documents for beneficiary owners and making an articles/charter from the scratch) when Max' lawyer is not able to establish a single one within couple of months...even with such high budget =(
October 18, 2016, 07:56:11 AM
just look from now for their future, how the popularity Lisk survive 
October 18, 2016, 07:53:01 AM
Too late already deleted it lol.
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