Topic: [ANN][MOTO] Motocoin - page 49. (Read 178256 times)

DELETE THIS FUCKING SCAM COINADER.

They stole my ~2k MOTO and disappeared.

the coin game are so funny,lol

This thread has been quiet for quite some time.
So, how is development going? Have you worked anything out with the dev?
Can you give us an eta for the bigger map to stop bots. It would be good if instead of the timer changing, the map size also changes with the time making fall-through maps harder to find (stopping some bots and giving humans a chance).

funny. It is easier for him to sell via the marker)).

This could mean two things, "when will the cap be introduced?" or "when would the subsidy stop?" and I'm not sure which you intend to ask.

Introduced - Like any other change, this can only come down to "whenever the network agrees to do so."
Stopped - I don't image that we would change the subsidy curve itself, only change to let it fall to zero when it normally would if the specialized conditional to keep it from doing so had never been introduced.


There is no server side.


We really will not.  While it seems likely that we may introduce an option for different variants on the original MOTO challenge (maybe a race or an obstacle course) I don't think it is anyone's intent to try to use any different games.  Doing so would likely very much complicate the mining process, in the best case.

Other games with other "engines" behind them will be other coins.  


Everyone everywhere loves games, but I'm not sure what that has to do with anything.


You have to replace "it" with "they/them" in this statement.  One offering alone could never accomplish that.


It isn't just a matter of "adds complexity" it is a matter of "might (even accidentally) entirely invalidate the legitimacy of the mining process."  This would be a devastating outcome, and there seems to me to be no good reason to even risk it when a new game can be much more readily made as a new network instead.


These aspects can be approached without needing multiple games added to the same chain.


Promotion/Marketing will resume in due time.  Right now there is no sense in wasting time/energy (or any other resource) on marketing when we have much more pressing matters to attend to.


We have several people in the community who are all very interested in seeing this experiment through to the end, whatever end that may be.  It will not be "forsaken" unless the chain halts, and even then I'm sure everything possible would be attempted to keep the chain hashing.  If the network were going to "just give up" it probably would've happened by now.  Instead we see the opposite, the committed participants are just making more and more commitment every day.  (Hash rate appears to be way up this week, with some new participants in mining!)


Why?  What improvements do you think would make it a more appealing competition?


Personally, I think that given the option between games that cost money, games that are free with advertisements, or games that pay you anything at all to play (even just "a coupla cents") the decision will not be a hard one for most.

(Assuming all three options are perceived as "fun" anyway.)


Again, what would make it more fun?  Don't answer "add more/different game types" because this isn't something that makes the game more fun, it is something that makes other games.  What specific changes to the current MOTO challenge would make it more enjoyable?


Honesty is awesome, but we need actionable detail to be able to do much about anything!  You can't just say "it isn't fun, fix it" because we really do not know what "fun" means to you, so we can't know what to fix.  Fun is highly subjective.

In any case, we really can not afford to approach any sort of change until after the infrastructural issues are all addressed.

The more I am looking at and thinking about the "cumulative work warp" attack that you've brought up the more I am realizing that this will likely be a necessary step in any resolution for it.

I'll be working on establishing an approximation.

At least the premine appears to have gotten quickly redistributed.

As for the cap, we've already covered that earlier in the thread.  As things stand now, production will continue indefinitely (so that there is always some incentive to mine a new block, instead of everyone waiting around for tx fees to come in) but that doesn't necessarily mean that the coin will not maintain sufficient scarcity.  The production curve does drop off quite a bit and the long tail produces relatively little on anything but absurdly long time-frames.  I don't see it as a major problem (compared to some other infinite-issuance coins, particularly) but I understand the concerns.

In any case, you do certainly seem to be in agreement with most on the matter.

I think eventually one of two things will happen.  Either some "sink" offering a reason to destroy MOTO will be introduced, or a cap will be added but in such a way that there always remain some incentive to mine.  Personally I'd prefer to see the latter, and I have a few ideas on how this could be done.


I think in some ways MOTO represents even more of an innovation than HUC.  It is really a shame that it has been surrounded by so much concern, conflict, disagreement, and drama so far.


Some of us are very dedicated, and in for the long haul.


At the moment this is somewhat undeniable.  It is really not just the best option, but the only option.  I don't expect that situation to persist for long, though. 

This right here was enough to steer me clear of this project.

Cap-less coins are pointless IMO & premined is... eh you know.

I've watched this one since the start because I actively invest in Huntercoin and I kinda figured this is how this project would turn out.

Best of luck though anyone who is continuing on this project.


I think if you are looking to game and earn coins HUC is probably still the best option that I know of.

Motocoin game it's impossible 
Have you minted any block? xD

This has me interested...

I'll bid 0.0000005 per.  You're only about one order of magnitude above market, so I'll only bid one order below.

Seriously, this sort of post should be in the marketplace section, anyway, shouldn't it?  Maybe you'll have better luck there, but I doubt it.

Selling 17k MOTO for 1 BTC or nearest offer. PM me if interested

motocoin game is a game changer.

I just mean that MOTO is the "proof of concept" for a human mined, proof-of-play secured coin.  It is the first such coin, so it serves as an existence proof that the concept can be implemented.


They still could, but they are likely to be variants on the original challenge and using the same physics/rules in the engine.

Using multiple different games with entirely different rule sets and engines on the same chain, in a proof-of-play mechanism, would be fraught with complications.


Sure, I'm sure that over time the game genres and their rule sets applied for both human-mining and proof-of-play systems will grow increasingly varied and complex.  Things like HUC and MOTO are just the first movers in this space, they are assuredly not the last word.

I'm sketching out an idea for a fork of MOTO with an entirely different game (though still "noisy map plus physics" based, to retain comparable security in the proof function) using a challenge that scales on a point accumulation requirement instead of a time requirement.  Such a setup does not seem to be subject to the same warp issues that arise from the existence of the "three clocks" that MOTO has.

the motocoin game looks like interesting very much~

proof of concept form? What is this, never heard of it, lol... a pity different gaming modes couldn't have been created for this coin, I'm sure others will do it with other criteria, though

I wouldn't say that.  The security of the network has to, of course, come before the human-mine-ability.  Once the security issues are resolved I'm sure some way to balance human mining will be found, whether that means N-heads approach or something else entirely.


Most bot mined coins are not dumped.  The most productive (generally) bot miner does seem to dump a large portion of his earnings intermittently, but also appears to be holding some back.  I'm holding every coin I mine, personally, as I think the price is very discounted due to all of the drama in recent weeks.  Feel free to dump and discount that price even further, I'm sure there will be plenty of buyers to be found.  (Has anyone else noticed that MOTO is one of the few alts with a persistent "institutional block" on the books?  Smart money is smart.)

The coin would've only been re-branded had Will disappeared on us without leaving any access to the repository and site.  Since this is now no longer a risk (or at least is mitigated by the requirement that both Will and myself would have to up and vanish to lose these resources) there should be no need for any further discussion of re-branding at this time.


It is very likely that some additional proof-of-play coins will appear with different games.  I don't think MOTO has any plans of doing different games, however.  We may explore some different game "modes" in the future, but the proof challenge itself will probably always remain a "trials style bmx" challenge.


Yes, this. Online "sport" gaming has just changed forever.  Tournaments can now be automated, can now not have to rely on any central tournament coordinator, and can not be cheated in any reasonable way.  This is huge.


It is likely that this idea, even in the proof-of-concept form of MOTO, is too big for even just Will and I to handle alone.

I would like to see nothing more than for some more interested devs to start getting involved!


We have a couple of different "PR resources" on standby, but until the network security problems are addressed they will remain in standby mode.

There is no sense in burning resources on promoting the coin before the coin is secure and stable.  Such promotion would likely attract more potential attackers.  Such promotion would likely not attract more usage, as users would be hesitant to rely on a coin with multiple known security and stability issues.  (Do you want *your* money tied up in a blockchain that might halt or, worse, suddenly be rewound to genesis?)

Thanks for the extended explanation, appreciate it.
That being said I guess there is little hope for this coin for others to mine, only a few people mining it and dumping is unacceptable so I'm selling my stack.
Goodluck with it. 

It does work fine, it just needs some slight modification to work reasonably, and some "tuning" to work efficiently against the current network parameters.  You can likely see how to do both the modification and a part of the tuning by comparing the code minim1ner released with the map filter code in my patches to the reference client.


At this point a "really crappy bot" (like Flipper heh) would probably be a huge disappointment to you.  You would almost certainly be mining at a net loss on energy cost.  (The flipper variant that I ran the longest would now generate only a couple of blocks a day.)  Even minim1ner's bot, tuned optimally, will probably soon be no longer competitive.

I'd just wait for some mining pools.