Topic: Announcing ProzCoin : Proof of Action (PoA) - page 19. (Read 78486 times)

Ok boys and girls lets explore using proz coin for purchasing services as larry states
first off as you may of noticed with many major companys accepting bitcoin like tiger direct and dell computer and so on ,you know real companys with thousands of employees not some guy with a website selling gorilla tape ,but  when you deal with real companys they accept the bitcoin and then cash out ,they dont bag hold the coin its to new ,so they dump it and it has driven the price of bitcoin down ,which ofcourse was not expected and ofcourse its the wild west out there nobodydoes that mentality has a price to pay

now boys and girls listen vert attentativelynow
if i were ti try to spend your coin shopping somewhere as you say out of the first and only premined block of your coin it would of cost me 300 satoshi yeah
now if you look at the current exchange rate its a miracle to get 100 satoshi and that is very limited cause of nuthing availiable from current development stalled state
so boys and girls to use your coin to buy whatever would be as you have stated a stupid deal
why pay 300sat and get 100sat  nobody in business will hold this thing ,anybodyin business holding this wont be in business

so to sum this up its a pipe dream anybody will be buying crap with this coin anywhere

furthermore its an insult to the investers this coin is so sad a shape so fast

hopefully said investers will learn  that the ico ipo iwhatever is just a way to remove them from their money and as we have seen here once again its not even worth what you payed for it

in this scenario larry is the winner over the invester as his desire stated thru his actions ,Action including grandstanding how many btc he has sold multple times
no documentation for legal presale money transferer status ,(which he conviently ignores and claimes nobody does ,maybe nobody in his circle of characters but in the court of law he will loose  its illegal

and ofcourse his proof of action for us to believe we can use this coin to buy shyt

we feel like kids hear bullshyt told to us that disrespects our integrity

no body will use this wallet less coin to buy anything manual or whatever

boys and girls this is a sad day in crypto world

bump? I think this coin is about to go under 

We’re proud to accept all major (and some minor) forms of Crypto-currency.

If you have a marketing project, whether it be a social media campaign, graphics design challenge, website design or something else– we’d be glad to work for Bitcoin, Litecoin, Dogecoin, Namecoin, Peercoin, Blackcoin, Darkcoin and many more. If you happen to be a bag-holder of a particular coin, shoot us a message on the “Contact” page and detail which coin you’d like to pay in and we can quote you in the coin of your choice for the work needed!

We’re strong believers in crypto being the future of money and we can’t wait to exclusively accept cryptocurrency for payment from our Clients!

they cant be very afiliated they dont even mention it on their website

im not the detective guy either
watch my video its cool nuthin else going on here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27E4Qfj7iEY

im not the detective guy

im not makin money on this
cause i point out the truth of it all is a good thing
nuthin else is happening here
coin price is pathetic
they got their money why would they care
when is this great website opening so they can go there i wont ever go there
whats larry gonna do to stop the jumpers at cex
they are jumping cause the stuff he does and genie boy  its not a staff and what is erco doing all i see is 2 people that will run the new empire in crypto

It's glaringly obvious that GreatOrchid, CryptoAvenger and this "detective" guy are one and the same.
Thanks for keeping the thread bumped and providing some comic relief.
How's that post count coming along ? Soon you'll be getting a nice Dice signature that'll make you money huh ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJ88-sYmu4o
why cant you comment on this why do you copy their name
aparently thats why you have your conzpro oy company  cause it was taken in usa by these people

HMC's post was way over my head but he certainly seems to know what he is talking about. A critical poster such as him is a great asset imo.

Yes, and I am not even ignoring the very valid points by HMC, but allude to Shannon's updates within the same comment.  I think a point by point reply will be redundant by the time Shannon gets done.


Chris

Glad to hear. If you ignore a few select people the thread is easy to read.

It is interesting to see all the time invested in FUD.  Wonder what would happen if those people used their energy for positive actions.


Shannon will have some nice updates here soon.


Chris

watch this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27E4Qfj7iEY

hey larry who are these people with your name you never said anything about them
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Published on Jun 11, 2014

If actions are not ordinal they can not be consistently hashed into an authenticated structure.  Well ordering is critical not only block to block, but over the whole structure.  (Bitcoin orders transactions within a block for a reason.)


These are all fine technology stack pieces (I am particularly a fan of both Nodejs and peer.js) but it isn't clear how they will fit together to form a node.  Can you elaborate this some?


My only suggestion here would be to not reinvent the wheel.  Gitian or similar makes light work of this concern.


Already we hit our first major question!  How will the authenticity of these tokens be traced in verification?  It seems like this step should be the first place where there is some mention of some crypto primitives.  Maybe Rabin's OT distributes some partial Shamir share, which can only later be reassembled after independent validation over action?  I'm not sure of the details you intend, but somehow this initial handshake needs to be both authenticated and preserved in order to be able to root the rest of the proof structure, no?


Why?  If the client is injecting the initial handshake token (which is presumably unique) why does the client need to introduce a secondary identifier here?


What exactly is the "deposit" in this step, how is it "created" and by whom?  Your use of "the server" is ambiguous throught this explanation, can you restate this with more clear terms?.


So now we have a tuple of that is somehow encoded as a "deposit"? Is ServerNonce the same thing as the handshake token from step 1?  If not, what happened to that?

Quote

• In order to mine a deposit you will need to perform the action, performing the action usually involves submission of a form. The form will contain a piece of the solution to the crypto puzzle, this will be stored in the chain.
   

Huh?  What, specifically, is the crypto puzzle, and what is this "piece" of it that the form contains, and how does that relate to the deposit?  Who submits this "piece" to the network and how is authenticated into the chain?  (Who is producing the blocks, and how?  How do they confirm this "piece" as a legitimate partial token?  How is this confirmation later retraced in verify steps?)

Quote

• Upon submission the client will receive the last piece of the crypto puzzle, allowing a user's client to build the pieces into a transaction and sign it with the client's current pubkey.
   

Now we have a full ("completed?") puzzle, that is signed and submitted.  Why is this done separately from the last step?

Quote

• The server can determine from the resulting transaction that the owner of the pubkey is the signer of the transaction, that the server verified that the action was completed, and that the rest of the deposit was actually placed there by the network.
   

Sure.  I agree that the server the form was submitted to can verify that the action was completed, and that the "deposit dance" was done.  However it is not immediately clear how anyone *else* can now trace this claim.  A verify agent (third party peer on the network) can see the pubkey of the proving (person doing the action) agent, the encoded "deposit" tuple marking nonces from the proving agent and challenging (the server hosting the action) agent and session token, and the completed and signed "puzzle" result.  How do they reassemble these into a proof trace that asserts the constraint that the action was actually performed?

What is the criteria by which a transaction is valid?  What is the criteria by which a block is valid?  These are the critical questions, and appear to be unanswered in your explanation.

Quote

This is a very high level view of the puzzle/proof process, a more detailed description will live on our github page.

It is so very high level that it can basically be restated as:

1. Prover requests a token from challenger
2. Challenger requests a token from Prover and from the network and generates a deposit
3. ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
4. PROFIT!

Sorry for the lame joke.

Seriously though, your outline does not actually explain anything about how workflow can work.  It says there will be some tokens and some form of crypto puzzle, and then everyone will be happy and everything will work out.  It seems like there's an excluded "and then some magic happens" step where those tokens and that puzzle somehow make everyone happy and make everything work out!

Probably the most missing part of the missing parts is the "fourth agent."  You've mentioned the proving agent, the challenging agent, and (briefly) the verification agents.  Under traditional certification network models, this would probably be enough roles.  For a differently structured coin (one without fully-mined-at-genesis assets) these roles could be all that is necessary.  However, for Proz PoA you will, of course, need a fourth role which we can call the "bursar" role.  The bursar is the entity which is currently holding the actual key to the coin to be distributed.  Somehow we need to go from a challenger issuing a challenge for a proving agent, to the proving agent issuing a solution and consequent claim to a bursar agent, to the bursar agent transferring claim of the coin (or key) to the proving agent, to the whole flow being independently retraced as valid and authenticated by the verifying agents.

So far, I don't see how any of that can be done with just what you have described.

Quote

Thoughts? Improvements, Glaring holes?

I think this is a seemingly very weak effort on something that should have been solved long before this project was even mentioned in public as a "PoA coin."

I can't really comment on potential improvements until there is a more complete explanation to improve upon.  Right now my most pertinent suggestion for improvement would be "explain *all* the steps fully."

The glaring holes that will need to be filled in are many and large, perhaps starting with an exposition of what actual cryptography primitives will be employed, how, when, and by which agent.  This would go a long way toward making your explanation of the contribution start to fit the claim of the contribution.  We don't need complete implementation details, just a workable theory.

The theory that you've presented here is just, for lack of a better word, humorous.

Please let these guys work on what is important. <-------Larry can skype you so you can save airfare to orlando to get a high pressure sales call right in your computer ,this is what they are working on ,getting the money ,they dont care about wallet they alredy gave up that omni thing  ,nuthing else is reality other than larrys same old storys
dont forget the genie guy thats mr mastercoin why is he here trying to do simple addition and not even able to do ,Instead of making the wallet that every coin does first , he is here talking crap
tell them what to do is what im doing but they dont listen to the comunity ,they listen to money and they take it thats job 1


Genecyber - Are we on track for the release teased over the weekend? I think a social media push would help with awareness. It would be good to get everyone ready to do so.


[/quote]

if you dont think this is important then you  have a big problem
this is how they do business the first thing was illegal duh thats not my problem and it shall be known to all

if these guys are the new crypto world
why dont they live in their great website
they got the money already let them move on
 

Please let these guys work on what is important.

I am heavily invested in Proz. Time may prove me wrong but  I see a lot of promise with this project. To others who FUD this thread, if they were planning to run off with the ICO don't you think they would have done that already? What can they gain by posting in this thread?

Genecyber - Are we on track for the release teased over the weekend? I think a social media push would help with awareness. It would be good to get everyone ready to do so.

i dont fud its truth
i dont go away
i have all the time in the world for deceit
let them go away to their website if it ever works
im big and i dont need my hand held or told what to do ,as long as they are lieing and deceiving it shall be shown
im the community and i will always be heard