I think the problem of anonymizing forum interaction will only fuel hate, lack of education, offense and things like that.
They can say that the real user is registered in the forum's database, and he can be penalized for that. Yes, that's true. But in the end what was the advantage of anonymity?
That's why I say, for those who would really use this type of tool, they will be the first ones who won't use it.
Topic: Anonymize Usernames for Unbiased Discussions on Bitcointalk! - An Idea (Read 535 times)
November 28, 2024, 06:56:54 PM
November 28, 2024, 12:55:42 PM
one way to find out...
You mean to try to anonymize those boards?
November 28, 2024, 12:49:57 PM
How about a board where no usernames are shown at all? To prevent spam, let's add some Rank restrictions, and only allow completely anonymous posts there. You'll need to have a hidden post history for this. But as much as this be a really cool feature, it's probably easier to just create an alt account if you want to post anonymously.
That is a good idea, maybe we can name this board Bitcoin4chanTalk 
I would like to hear what theymos and other OG members has to say about this, but I am interested to try this.
might be cool. but special boards with restrictions like ivory tower and serious discussion kinda have fizzed out even though they are solid boards.
one way to find out...
November 28, 2024, 12:46:08 PM
Although I find this initiative interesting, and I think the community does too, judging by the responses it has had, I think it goes against the way the forum works today.
Anonymizing, apart from the technical difficulties and possible abuses, I think it goes against the spirit of a forum where progress is based on merit, and that the nickname we are here is defined by our identity on the forum, which is built from the merit received, seniority, total number of posts, feedback, DT status and I don't know if I'm leaving anything out.
Anonymizing that I don't think would be very unbiased, as I've had discussions in politics where the opposing side (and me too) are biased, and I don't think that being two anonymous people instead of me and (for example) suchmoon would make us less biased. Apart from the fact that even if everything, merits, nicknames, trust, etc. were deleted, I think that in some cases we would end up recognising each other.
I foresee the same success as the “serious” discussion boards.
Anonymizing, apart from the technical difficulties and possible abuses, I think it goes against the spirit of a forum where progress is based on merit, and that the nickname we are here is defined by our identity on the forum, which is built from the merit received, seniority, total number of posts, feedback, DT status and I don't know if I'm leaving anything out.
Anonymizing that I don't think would be very unbiased, as I've had discussions in politics where the opposing side (and me too) are biased, and I don't think that being two anonymous people instead of me and (for example) suchmoon would make us less biased. Apart from the fact that even if everything, merits, nicknames, trust, etc. were deleted, I think that in some cases we would end up recognising each other.
How about a board where no usernames are shown at all? To prevent spam, let's add some Rank restrictions, and only allow completely anonymous posts there.
I foresee the same success as the “serious” discussion boards.
November 28, 2024, 12:41:31 PM
Based on your screenshots, changing the name isn't enough. You should also remove the Rank, coins, Activity, Merit, Avatar, personal text and Trust score.
Even than you would be able to identify many members based on their post history or member ID number, if that is also not changed.How about a board where no usernames are shown at all? To prevent spam, let's add some Rank restrictions, and only allow completely anonymous posts there. You'll need to have a hidden post history for this. But as much as this be a really cool feature, it's probably easier to just create an alt account if you want to post anonymously.
That is a good idea, maybe we can name this board Bitcoin4chanTalk I would like to hear what theymos and other OG members has to say about this, but I am interested to try this.
November 28, 2024, 11:15:47 AM
Based on your screenshots, changing the name isn't enough. You should also remove the Rank, coins, Activity, Merit, Avatar, personal text and Trust score. And the usernames shouldn't be shown in quotes. But if someone quotes a user, the forum database should still store the correct quote for others to avoid turning it into plagiarism.
this opens the possibility of editing a quote with no backref to the original.
easy to abuse.
IMO if there’s an anonymous post then all comment/post below it should be anonymous so maybe having a board that does that aka “Anonymous board” could solve that but if possible having all post within the thread to be anonymous (everything should be freely expressed .easy to abuse.
However there’s still an issue, the user is logged in to make the anonymous post which means the mods can still get the particular user if the UID is linked to the anonymous post, so on a second thought posting through an Alt is still the most suitable option to posting anonymously..
November 28, 2024, 10:38:43 AM
Isn't it possible to hide user information on threads if they willingly want to make a post anonymously?
We should have a checkbox on the post-writing screen, somewhere around the "Post" and "Preview" buttons, maybe above them and below the textbox where we write our posts. The checkbox should look like this: Post anonymously: [checkbox]
Those who mark the checkbox and then press "Post", their post should get posted, but all their information should be hidden. The space where user information is shown should only say "Anonymous Poster" with no href, which means the username shouldn't be clickable. There should be no profile or anything behind it.
We should have a checkbox on the post-writing screen, somewhere around the "Post" and "Preview" buttons, maybe above them and below the textbox where we write our posts. The checkbox should look like this: Post anonymously: [checkbox]
Those who mark the checkbox and then press "Post", their post should get posted, but all their information should be hidden. The space where user information is shown should only say "Anonymous Poster" with no href, which means the username shouldn't be clickable. There should be no profile or anything behind it.
this opens the possibility of editing a quote with no backref to the original.
easy to abuse.
November 28, 2024, 10:34:49 AM
People will be able to discern who is who based on avatars, merit count, merit history, signature, rank, and probably other things. The point is a random username won't do much if people can still find out who is who IMO. You would need to randomize everything.
Other things include the style of writing posts, as well as the style of text design in posts and the total number of posts. That is, this annomization will be pseudo-anonymous, which will be ideal for a forum dedicated to bitcoin. 
But with the randomization of everything on the forum, it will turn into a jumble of posts and "noise of voices", like in a crowded public place, where you "can't hear a pleasant melody". For me, the personalization of posts (certain nicknames, and therefore the users behind them) is a kind of quality mark, the posts of which contain interesting thoughts, ideas or technical information. I'm not just quoting under this.
And a bunch of merits spurred me on not being lazy to read this post. November 28, 2024, 09:19:53 AM
Quote
it can post whatever is sent to it under the bot's name
No, it should be processed manually by the message recipient, and re-written using the publisher's dictionary, and then posted in a slightly changed form (to preserve the content, but to change the wording).Quote
when the bot gets abused for linking to malware, the bot will get banned
That's why each message is handled manually, just like in mailing lists. If such account is banned, then N users are banned at the same time, so it is important to pick a good message broadcaster, who will moderate the content appropriately.By the way: if someone thinks, that such group wouldn't last long, then why so many people think, that Satoshi was more than one person?
November 28, 2024, 08:43:39 AM
The simplest solution is to join any group of anonymous users, who will process your content, and post it on forum
This would be an interesting concept for a bot: it can post whatever is sent to it under the bot's name. But I don't expect that to last long: when the bot gets abused for linking to malware, the bot will get banned.I don't know why some users have a problem when people create alt accounts just to say something they don't want associated with their "real" usernames, i think that is the best approach for "unbiased discussion".
That's the beauty of the freedoms Bitcointalk gives you: you can create as many accounts as you want, and someone else can complain about that if they want 
November 28, 2024, 08:06:21 AM
True but to move towards a more decentralized approach we definitely need a layer to protect our identities so the commenter's opinions are not influenced by the person behind the account but by content posted by the account. Ad Hominem attack for instance: It's problematic because it avoids engaging with the actual argument and diverts the discussion to irrelevant personal attributes.
The forum is not decentralized and there is no way we can move towards that in this very forum. If what you proposed is possible without all of the drawbacks, then it would be very interesting, but the drawbacks are inevitable IMO. I don't know why some users have a problem when people create alt accounts just to say something they don't want associated with their "real" usernames, i think that is the best approach for "unbiased discussion". November 28, 2024, 06:10:28 AM
Quote
You would need to randomize everything.
Exactly. The simplest solution is to join any group of anonymous users, who will process your content, and post it on forum, at a random time in the future.Quote
it has to be a feature in the forum and it has to be Theymos himself who would add it
Not necessarily. The system, where you would have N users, behind a single account, will still be compatible with the existing forum. Then, it would be the opposite case of using alt-accounts: instead of having N accounts per single user, you will have just N users per single account. 
November 28, 2024, 04:28:05 AM
That sounds very, very hard to implement on an aging SMF codebase that can barely crank in patches without introducing other weird bugs.
Isn't it possible to hide user information on threads if they willingly want to make a post anonymously?
We should have a checkbox on the post-writing screen, somewhere around the "Post" and "Preview" buttons, maybe above them and below the textbox where we write our posts. The checkbox should look like this: Post anonymously: [checkbox]
Those who mark the checkbox and then press "Post", their post should get posted, but all their information should be hidden. The space where user information is shown should only say "Anonymous Poster" with no href, which means the username shouldn't be clickable. There should be no profile or anything behind it.
This will allow anyone willing to make posts anonymously so they are not judged or attacked personally. No posts, merits, trust, avatar, or signature will be shown, which could make someone understand who the poster is or their rank in the forum.
November 28, 2024, 04:13:15 AM
if somebody wanted to post anonymously, wouldn't they just use a forum like 4chan, where everybody is already anonymous?
I assumed we were talking about posting something for Bitcointalk users. To state the obvious: if it's posted somewhere else, it's not relevant here. 
November 28, 2024, 04:05:24 AM
How about a board where no usernames are shown at all? To prevent spam, let's add some Rank restrictions, and only allow completely anonymous posts there. You'll need to have a hidden post history for this. But as much as this be a really cool feature, it's probably easier to just create an alt account if you want to post anonymously.
That sounds very, very hard to implement on an aging SMF codebase that can barely crank in patches without introducing other weird bugs.
However, if somebody wanted to post anonymously, wouldn't they just use a forum like 4chan, where everybody is already anonymous? Or a Bitcoin-specific forum modeled off of it. That would be much easier than hacking a forum's source code to introduce anon accounts.
November 28, 2024, 03:48:32 AM
In Bitcointalk, discussions can sometimes be influenced by biases—whether it’s familiarity with a username, reputation, or preconceived notions about a member.
I like the idea, and I've thought about how an anonymous discussion would be before, but: what you call "biases", I call pattern recognition. If a known troll posts something, I know it's not worth the time to read it.Based on your screenshots, changing the name isn't enough. You should also remove the Rank, coins, Activity, Merit, Avatar, personal text and Trust score. And the usernames shouldn't be shown in quotes. But if someone quotes a user, the forum database should still store the correct quote for others to avoid turning it into plagiarism.
Ah, icopress....the days of being able to post as an anonymous guest are long gone. Not sure when Theymos did away with that
It must have been because of spam. You can't ban anonymous guests any other way.i didnt think you ever could post as a guest or anonymous account, i thought those accounts here were regular accounts and manually changed by theymos for whatever reason at some point. not sure though.
As far as I know, anonymous posts were really possible in the early days of the forum.How about a board where no usernames are shown at all? To prevent spam, let's add some Rank restrictions, and only allow completely anonymous posts there. You'll need to have a hidden post history for this. But as much as this be a really cool feature, it's probably easier to just create an alt account if you want to post anonymously.
November 28, 2024, 02:21:12 AM
People will be able to discern who is who based on avatars, merit count, merit history, signature, rank, and probably other things. The point is a random username won't do much if people can still find out who is who IMO. You would need to randomize everything.
Including previous posts 😂. I don't think there are any other way but to create an alternative account. Quote
discussions can sometimes be influenced by biases
Consider it from a social community perspective. You go to community clubs, be with your friends or people you like everyday. You can not be friends to everyone in your city or country. This will exists. November 27, 2024, 06:59:43 PM
This isn't a feature request to the forum but something users would willingly do on their client side! That is, with a mentality that "I don't want to be biased with my opinions despite the account being a newbie, a trusted member, or my friend" so let me just freely express what I think and the principles I stand for without any history of the accounts influencing my opinions.
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The username is our forum identity. This is a global community, hiding your identity is not a very positive thing in general.
True but to move towards a more decentralized approach we definitely need a layer to protect our identities so the commenter's opinions are not influenced by the person behind the account but by content posted by the account. Ad Hominem attack for instance: It's problematic because it avoids engaging with the actual argument and diverts the discussion to irrelevant personal attributes.Just the opinion that people have to know how to separate things naturally. Now, if someone can't do this alone and needs a tool to help them, it's okay to use this script.
But, I honestly think that those who naturally cannot make this separation of judgment will not use the script - at least for a long time. I say this because your inability to respond appropriately to each subject, regardless of who made the post, will unconsciously force the person to know who made the post, because only then will they be able to give a response.
Note that I think the idea is interesting and that it could be useful for some users. I just think that those who really should use the script won't.
November 27, 2024, 05:19:05 PM
True but to move towards a more decentralized approach we definitely need a layer to protect our identities so the commenter's opinions are not influenced by the person behind the account but by content posted by the account.
Well, for the fact that we've got some scripts that supports this already (which, I didn't even know about until at the time of reading this thread) don't you think it'll sound a bit off to have two functions on patch? Considering the fact that the only difference between yours and the main script is the change in control...Sounds more like having an anonymously built profile o'er an anonymous profile... ain't nobody knows who TF you are in person already... Okay, I get it. Personally, the first thing that'd come to my mind (if I ever wanted to hide my identity) would be creating an alt. I appreciate your idea and I totally understand from your perspective.
November 27, 2024, 04:44:40 PM
People will be able to discern who is who based on avatars, merit count, merit history, signature, rank, and probably other things. The point is a random username won't do much if people can still find out who is who IMO. You would need to randomize everything.
Randomizing everything will be difficult to the scripter and also the forum users. It is impossible to anonymize a username such that no one will track the identity behind it.The best to do is to create an alt for the purpose of discussing topics you don't want to be linked to your profile.
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