Are there any "communist" pools? | Bitcointalksearch.org

JA37

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Quote from: MacFall on May 12, 2011, 01:28:10 PM

But who's to say what one's ability is? Why not devote ALL your processing power to mining? Why not spend ALL of your money (except for what you require for the barest of necessities) to build more mining rigs? In other words, contribution never comes by one's "ability". People contribute what they are willing to contribute, every time. Not just in mining pools, but in all things.

It makes more sense, then, that the rules be "contribute what you are willing to contribute, and be compensated according to what others are willing to pay". Which is market exchange.

I was just commenting on the "it's not really exploitation". It probably is if you don't contribute what you can. I don't adress any of the other issues with this sort of pool.
But if you have 3 GPU and 1 P3 (all idle), and you contribute the P3, you're not contributing what you can. If the GPUs are used for folding@home, then you only have the P3 to contribute, and hence not exploiting.
IMHO.

I'm a market liberal kind of guy myself, so I don't think this kind of pool would work either unless it's a very tight group doing it. Like a family or similar.

BioMike

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Seeing the amount of cycles spend on distributed computing (foldingathome and alike) I think people would mine without payout if the bitcoins were used in a trusted way that would strengthen the community.

Lets say that the bitcoins were kept in one spot and the contributors of the pool were allowed to submit ideas and vote for the ideas.
Ideas would of course be how the bitcoins would be spend (with some minor restrictions). >50% (or even >66%) of the votes would execute the idea. Less would invalidate the idea.

If you would accept only one idea per contributor per year, they most likely won't send a bogus idea, but only something that has been well thought of.

I would join such pool.

MacFall

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Agorist

Quote from: JA37 on May 12, 2011, 01:18:18 PM

Quote from: MacFall on May 12, 2011, 12:40:33 PM

It's not properly exploitation if the rules say you can take without contributing.

But generally the rules also say that you must contribute your best effort. If you only put a P3 into the pool and keep all your GPUs for other pools, then you aren't contributing what you can, and hence exploitiong the system.

But who's to say what one's ability is? Why not devote ALL your processing power to mining? Why not spend ALL of your money (except for what you require for the barest of necessities) to build more mining rigs? In other words, contribution never comes by one's "ability". People contribute what they are willing to contribute, every time. Not just in mining pools, but in all things.

It makes more sense, then, that the rules be "contribute what you are willing to contribute, and be compensated according to what others are willing to pay". Which is market exchange.

SgtSpike

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Activity: 1400

Merit: 1005

Quote from: JA37 on May 12, 2011, 01:18:18 PM

Quote from: MacFall on May 12, 2011, 12:40:33 PM

It's not properly exploitation if the rules say you can take without contributing.

But generally the rules also say that you must contribute your best effort. If you only put a P3 into the pool and keep all your GPUs for other pools, then you aren't contributing what you can, and hence exploitiong the system.

Then you run in to another problem...

If I was to contribute everything I had, then what incentive would I have to make myself more capable of contributing? In other words, why would I buy a bunch of GPU's to mine with if it wouldn't make any difference in the end result?

The whole pool would suffer from this sort of thinking, as no one would want to bother to buy new cards to contribute more to the pool. It would effectively stagnate the whole thing to P3 levels.

JA37

sr. member

Activity: 378

Merit: 250

Quote from: MacFall on May 12, 2011, 12:40:33 PM

It's not properly exploitation if the rules say you can take without contributing.

But generally the rules also say that you must contribute your best effort. If you only put a P3 into the pool and keep all your GPUs for other pools, then you aren't contributing what you can, and hence exploitiong the system.

MacFall

member

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Merit: 10

Agorist

It's not properly exploitation if the rules say you can take without contributing.

lutherblissett

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no . . because capitalists will exploit it always and forever.

AntiVigilante

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Quote from: os008 on May 11, 2011, 06:30:40 PM

Quote from: mjsbuddha on May 11, 2011, 11:19:15 AM

Saying communism would work if people weren't so greedy is like saying painting everything the color of baby shit would work if everyone were blind or that a boat with a hole in it would work if water was thicker. Develop a system that compliments human nature or you didn't really develop a system.

Actually, there're enough decent people in the world to make communism work, but shame they're not hypocritical enough to make it to a political seat.

The only political system that works is the one that exists as a conference and all power vanishes after the conference is over. Limit 30 days a year. The power goes back to the people to exercise the laws and means themselves.

os008

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Quote from: mjsbuddha on May 11, 2011, 11:19:15 AM

Saying communism would work if people weren't so greedy is like saying painting everything the color of baby shit would work if everyone were blind or that a boat with a hole in it would work if water was thicker. Develop a system that compliments human nature or you didn't really develop a system.

Actually, there're enough decent people in the world to make communism work, but shame they're not hypocritical enough to make it to a political seat.

AntiVigilante

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Quote from: MacFall on May 10, 2011, 11:57:23 PM

Just out of curiosity, is there anyone here who would actually donate mining power to a collectivized pool just for the sake of being generous?

The problem is, even if there are enough people willing to act so altruistically, there are also plenty of people who aren't. So a mining "commune" would need some way to exclude people who don't contribute. Which will inevitably end up looking like "to each according to his contribution, from each according to his willingness to compensate".

First, yes I would. Mass donation system coming.

Second, deadline. Return unused coin in percentage donated * who came up with the best ideas.

The problem with communism is that the hegelian mindfuck they pull comes before usage. I say we put it in the refund portion see how they like.

BioMike

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Quote from: AntiVigilante on May 11, 2011, 08:07:49 AM

LOL. Half seriously though, without the hypocritical Harrison Bergeron fantasies commies and fascists have, I'd be interested in a mass donations system.

Use the Eligius pool with all the same address for who/what you want to donate to.

mjsbuddha

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yung lean

Saying communism would work if people weren't so greedy is like saying painting everything the color of baby shit would work if everyone were blind or that a boat with a hole in it would work if water was thicker. Develop a system that compliments human nature or you didn't really develop a system.

njloof

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Quote from: deadlizard on May 11, 2011, 01:59:15 AM

Quote from: njloof on May 10, 2011, 06:24:28 PM

Heck, I'd pay a few bitcoins for well-designed Soviet-style posters with these slogans on them

Awesome! Print that at 11x17 and you got yourself a deal

AntiVigilante

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Quote from: SgtSpike on May 10, 2011, 05:29:18 PM

Quote from: AntiVigilante on May 10, 2011, 05:21:55 PM

Quote from: SgtSpike on May 10, 2011, 04:21:41 PM

Quote from: AntiVigilante on May 10, 2011, 04:03:51 PM

Quote from: mjsbuddha on May 08, 2011, 12:06:42 AM

The problem with communism is there's no incentive to work.
Communism gives communism a bad name.

The problem with posting philosophy on the Internet is that...

I DON'T NEED AN INCENTIVE TO WORK.

I have plenty of things I'll pay to be allowed to do.

Ok then, it's settled.

I'll start a communistic pool with a pentium 3.
You join with all your video cards.

We split 50/50.

Sound good? Cheesy

Make it dynamic. You handle leaflets, I'll create the software. Only all I got is a shitty laptop. But cool for starters.

Lol, let's do it.

I'll make it as happy-sounding as possible.

"Join the communist bitpool TODAY!"
"Get YOUR FAIR SHARE of everything that is mined!"
"Help your neighbor when he's down, and he'll help you when you're down!"
"Donate a gigahash or three, and help people who don't have access to the kind of hardware you do!"

Etc, etc. Tongue

LOL. Half seriously though, without the hypocritical Harrison Bergeron fantasies commies and fascists have, I'd be interested in a mass donations system.

deadlizard

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Quote from: njloof on May 10, 2011, 06:24:28 PM

Heck, I'd pay a few bitcoins for well-designed Soviet-style posters with these slogans on them

SgtSpike

legendary

Activity: 1400

Merit: 1005

Quote from: MacFall on May 10, 2011, 11:57:23 PM

Just out of curiosity, is there anyone here who would actually donate mining power to a collectivized pool just for the sake of being generous?

The problem is, even if there are enough people willing to act so altruistically, there are also plenty of people who aren't. So a mining "commune" would need some way to exclude people who don't contribute. Which will inevitably end up looking like "to each according to his contribution, from each according to his willingness to compensate". In other words, a meritocratic market arrangement. And that's what happens to successful* communes, just about every time. They adopt market exchange, and then are no longer communes.

*This is not counting the examples of short-lived successful communes, which burned like bonfires for a while, and then disappeared - such as the early Christians, the German Anabaptists, and a few other religious communities that existed in Colonial America.

If you're going to create a commune, then you HAVE to allow the freeloaders. There's no other way to work it.

MacFall

member

Activity: 84

Merit: 10

Agorist

Just out of curiosity, is there anyone here who would actually donate mining power to a collectivized pool just for the sake of being generous?

The problem is, even if there are enough people willing to act so altruistically, there are also plenty of people who aren't. So a mining "commune" would need some way to exclude people who don't contribute. Which will inevitably end up looking like "to each according to his contribution, from each according to his willingness to compensate". In other words, a meritocratic market arrangement. And that's what happens to successful* communes, just about every time. They adopt market exchange, and then are no longer communes.

*This is not counting the examples of short-lived successful communes, which burned like bonfires for a while, and then disappeared - such as the early Christians, the German Anabaptists, and a few other religious communities that existed in Colonial America.

SgtSpike

legendary

Activity: 1400

Merit: 1005

Quote from: njloof on May 10, 2011, 06:24:28 PM

Quote from: SgtSpike on May 10, 2011, 05:29:18 PM

Quote from: AntiVigilante on May 10, 2011, 05:21:55 PM

Make it dynamic. You handle leaflets, I'll create the software. Only all I got is a shitty laptop. But cool for starters.

Lol, let's do it.

I'll make it as happy-sounding as possible.

"Join the communist bitpool TODAY!"
"Get YOUR FAIR SHARE of everything that is mined!"
"Help your neighbor when he's down, and he'll help you when you're down!"
"Donate a gigahash or three, and help people who don't have access to the kind of hardware you do!"

Etc, etc. Tongue

Heck, I'd pay a few bitcoins for well-designed Soviet-style posters with these slogans on them

I'll see what I can do.

EDIT: Will this do? Tongue

(NOTE: I didn't create it, don't pay me bitcoins)

njloof

member

Activity: 73

Merit: 10

Quote from: SgtSpike on May 10, 2011, 05:29:18 PM

Quote from: AntiVigilante on May 10, 2011, 05:21:55 PM

Make it dynamic. You handle leaflets, I'll create the software. Only all I got is a shitty laptop. But cool for starters.

Lol, let's do it.

I'll make it as happy-sounding as possible.

"Join the communist bitpool TODAY!"
"Get YOUR FAIR SHARE of everything that is mined!"
"Help your neighbor when he's down, and he'll help you when you're down!"
"Donate a gigahash or three, and help people who don't have access to the kind of hardware you do!"

Etc, etc. Tongue

Heck, I'd pay a few bitcoins for well-designed Soviet-style posters with these slogans on them

SgtSpike

legendary

Activity: 1400

Merit: 1005

Quote from: AntiVigilante on May 10, 2011, 05:21:55 PM

Quote from: SgtSpike on May 10, 2011, 04:21:41 PM

Quote from: AntiVigilante on May 10, 2011, 04:03:51 PM

Quote from: mjsbuddha on May 08, 2011, 12:06:42 AM

The problem with communism is there's no incentive to work.
Communism gives communism a bad name.

The problem with posting philosophy on the Internet is that...

I DON'T NEED AN INCENTIVE TO WORK.

I have plenty of things I'll pay to be allowed to do.

Ok then, it's settled.

I'll start a communistic pool with a pentium 3.
You join with all your video cards.

We split 50/50.

Sound good? Cheesy

Make it dynamic. You handle leaflets, I'll create the software. Only all I got is a shitty laptop. But cool for starters.

Lol, let's do it.

I'll make it as happy-sounding as possible.

"Join the communist bitpool TODAY!"
"Get YOUR FAIR SHARE of everything that is mined!"
"Help your neighbor when he's down, and he'll help you when you're down!"
"Donate a gigahash or three, and help people who don't have access to the kind of hardware you do!"

Etc, etc. Tongue

Topic: Are there any "communist" pools? (Read 8178 times)