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Topic: ASIC Testing on Scrypt? - page 5. (Read 17434 times)

legendary
Activity: 2674
Merit: 2965
Terminated.
September 03, 2013, 12:08:49 PM
There are professional ASIC fab companies known to be exploring Litecoin ASICS. No reason why they couldn't have built one by now and are keeping quiet.

its a fact that its been done - people are stupid , we have learned this by observing how docile people are .

most of the population are damaged goods, unfortunately. 
Well yes. I keep noticing this.
If I had sucessfully created an ASIC for Scrypt I wouldn't share it either, so..  Tongue
member
Activity: 81
Merit: 1002
It was only the wind.
September 03, 2013, 12:08:38 AM
I just looked up the pricing on EK waterblocks, as I don't do water cooling and I hear they're good. Looks like I was wrong, they retail for about a third of the price of a 7950, therefore ordering them in massive quantities would get a significantly better price. You're still probably looking at increasing your price per GPU by 10%-15%, though, which is why I would probably go with air cooling anyway.

Also, WindMaster, that is pretty fucking awesome. I'll soon be running 5 GPUs out of my bedroom, lol. You're WAY outta my league.
legendary
Activity: 1400
Merit: 1000
I owe my soul to the Bitcoin code...
September 03, 2013, 10:58:48 AM
It would have been cooler if it was.  Tongue


ArtForz is contained.

He's locked in a box in my basement till spits out an LTC ASIC miner that works on solar powered Chrome Books!



~BCX~


Lol,  make sure to charge top dollar for it. LTC mining could be bigger than BTC!
newbie
Activity: 20
Merit: 0
September 03, 2013, 07:48:57 AM
really interesting ..
member
Activity: 81
Merit: 1002
It was only the wind.
September 02, 2013, 11:59:06 PM
#99
Yeah but watercooling is more effective which should increase the lifespan of the GPUs.

It also takes care of the problem of having such a high heat load in such a small, densely packed area, which seems to be what people above were saying made it unlikely a GPU farm of this size can be built.  And Wolf0's estimate of 30% is real high.  Large GPU farms don't go and pay retail single unit pricing from gaming water block manufacturers.  We're talking about thousands of units here at wholesale pricing with the GPU manufacturer omitting the fan and heatsink to drop costs.

Well, had I thought they would pay retail price, I would have said 50%. I just guessed they'd get a pretty hefty discount for ordering in bulk.
legendary
Activity: 1400
Merit: 1000
I owe my soul to the Bitcoin code...
September 03, 2013, 07:40:05 AM
#99
Yep there he is again.

So what you guys are hinting is it may be Artforz?


It's not ArtForz LOL


~BCX~

It would have been cooler if it was.  Tongue
hero member
Activity: 798
Merit: 1000
‘Try to be nice’
September 03, 2013, 02:56:25 AM
#98
There are professional ASIC fab companies known to be exploring Litecoin ASICS. No reason why they couldn't have built one by now and are keeping quiet.

its a fact that its been done - people are stupid , we have learned this by observing how docile people are .

most of the population are damaged goods, unfortunately. 
legendary
Activity: 1204
Merit: 1001
RUM AND CARROTS: A PIRATE LIFE FOR ME
September 03, 2013, 02:14:01 AM
#97
There are professional ASIC fab companies known to be exploring Litecoin ASICS. No reason why they couldn't have built one by now and are keeping quiet.
member
Activity: 81
Merit: 1002
It was only the wind.
September 02, 2013, 11:23:25 PM
#96
Thanks for pointing that out. This seem like an expensive solution.

If you can spend $750,000 on GPU's then you probably could spend another $50,000+ on cooling  Smiley

30% of $750,000 is $225,000. Even if you have that kind of cash to drop on cooling, it's stupid to do because it's a fuck of a lot cheaper to get good AC.
full member
Activity: 178
Merit: 100
September 03, 2013, 02:06:54 AM
#96
full member
Activity: 178
Merit: 100
September 03, 2013, 01:53:51 AM
#95
I just caught this on wemineltc.com.  Nearly 2 million KH/s from a single user.  I think it's fair to say that's even a bit excessive for a typical botnet.  Or is it not.


Maybe someone out there testing the waters on their programming skills?
..
...
....
......


It is the two generation of a Chinese rich, investment 7500000 yuan Nong, ASIC currently do not come out.

 Shocked Shocked
hero member
Activity: 630
Merit: 500
September 03, 2013, 01:38:32 AM
#94
I saw that farm and I love seeing all those rigs- but still, that's 250Mh/s or so of Scrypt.

Wind - One more note, I read through your history as you piqued my interest, and I think I better understand as to what you are doing by putting the pieces together. You've got a perfect mix of skills to set everything up along with the fact that the infrastructure is really there, at least in part back in May, to support the 3D Film rendering server leasing that you did. I am imagining that you run a lot more GPUs per motherboard than I was thinking, and this is an edge. Not sure how all the infrastructure costs you have wouldn't kill your ROI, but I'm going to assume with the multiple uses of the infrastructure, and tax breaks, this is factored in.

Certainly, a limited number of people have the skills, capital and cheap power, but I do understand your point that certainly the infrastructure exists and while out of the range of a "normal" or even an "advanced" mining operation, there are professional setups that can easily achieve this goal.

It's obvious you have the capability to have one of the larger Scrypt mining operations out there, however, I don't believe you're the 2 Gh/s mystery, although a quite respectable operation.

When this all is over, I'd love to hear more about your setup. We have some time left to mine though, so maybe next year.

member
Activity: 81
Merit: 1002
It was only the wind.
September 02, 2013, 11:12:47 PM
#93

The easiest way to cool it is to run a chilled water glycol loop to a small chiller plant and outside cooling tower, then either liquid-cool the GPU's (my preference) or air-cool the GPU's with water-cooled air handlers in the space.


Quote
Water blocks for each GPU would easily raise the cost per GPU by 25%-30%. Sure, if you have unlimited funds, you can do it, but other than that, it's just stupid.
He's not talking about using water blocks for each GPU but water cooled air handlers like these:


Pay attention to the part in bold.
full member
Activity: 168
Merit: 100
September 03, 2013, 12:56:52 AM
#93
Just saying...







Those look like various IBM redundant PSU. At least 1460 watts, I'd say. FYI you can get 2000 watt bladecenter PSU on ebay pretty cheap! ($60 or less).
you are right,it is DELL ,very cheap,  600 * MSI 7850  1G , About 240Mhs and 250LTC/day

Let's say you spent the low-end of $200 for your 7850 cards.  Those *alone* would cost you $120,000.00.  Never mind the motherboards, CPU, RAM, ELECTRICITY, etc.  You may mine upwards of $580.00 daily ... but that's still a pretty long payoff.

What I want to know is, where did you get the startup capital to do this?  Where do you buy 600 MSI cards?  I am assuming that took you a while.  I would think that even high volume retailers don't keep that quantity of a particular card on-hand.  And as others are wanting to know - what does your electric bill look like?  I hear stories of "free electricity", but trust me that doesn't last.  Even if your rental contract doesn't have an abuse clause, any judge in his right mind would sign the eviction order to throw you out.  And if you live in the States, you can expect a visit from the DEA.  :-)


hey hey,It is in china,Electricity is cheap,and you can find a place do it easy ,example Small Hydropower or small factory.This began in 2012 with some people, the cost has been recovered in April 2013 , and buy 600 cards is very easy here(because so many cards are made in china...).

Electricity is $ 0.07 / KWh, 6 * 7850 probably consumes at 900W, so one day the electricity is 2160KWh * $ 0.07 = 151.2 USD per day, Electricity is about one-third of income.
hero member
Activity: 630
Merit: 500
September 03, 2013, 12:44:45 AM
#92

That's certainly not in "unlimited budget" territory.  I trust that the above photos look significantly different than what everyone else was envisioning when talking about a service entrance in this size range?  Were you guys envisioning a substation and switchyard or something?


Cool, thanks for posting. You must have ramped up a bit since you were at 18,000 kh/s in May. I do wonder why you're thinking you have some sort of trade secret though, except the fact that you're running more GPUs per rig with custom engineering and using custom frames with forced cooling.

The cooling is probably a very "cool" design, but the number of GPU's per rig honestly isn't worth the cost delta to me. Those are the cheap parts of my rigs - Memory, MB and boot drives cost me $140 per rig or less, so stuffing double the cards in the rig saves $140, minus whatever the parts you're using to rig it, which I assume would be minor in cost. You may save minor power, but you pay .065, and I pay .048, which doesn't really impact too much.

I think we got off topic though, your setup is not running anywhere near the 2 g/hs we're discussing, and while your initial message that stated it would be simple to create, just because we all know in theory and can multiply our own setups out, this is still a very odd thing to pop up as it did. Regardless, I'm sure we'll see this a lot more in the near future. I admire your eluded to setup, and you were correct, I wasn't clear on what 1 MW would look like going in. It's okay to admit that anything over 100,000 kh/s using GPUs does take a lot of unique problem solving to implement successfully in order to fit in leased spaces that are readily available with cheap power and is not common. Which brings us back once again to the original point.





member
Activity: 81
Merit: 1002
It was only the wind.
September 02, 2013, 10:38:39 PM
#91
That's about 560,000 watts or 0.56MW.

Since 1w = 1 joule/sec, it should be enough to heat 1 gallon of water from 20c to boiling (100c) in roughly 2 seconds.

I know there are other factors, like the amount of open space, etc., but that should give you an idea of how much energy is consumed by that farm.

You'll need to spend some serious dough on cooling if you want to run a farm like that in one location.

The easiest way to cool it is to run a chilled water glycol loop to a small chiller plant and outside cooling tower, then either liquid-cool the GPU's (my preference) or air-cool the GPU's with water-cooled air handlers in the space.

Water blocks for each GPU would easily raise the cost per GPU by 25%-30%. Sure, if you have unlimited funds, you can do it, but other than that, it's just stupid.

Look forward to chatting, love to hear from others on how they implemented, even after the fact. My expansion will never grow above 200,000 kh/s for GPUs.

I believe the power consumption would more likely be 1MW by extrapolation from my farm. And by "below Radar", I think it was meant that it was likely to be heard of by someone in the community.

In terms of switching over though, going from Bitcoin to Litecoin takes a bit of tweaking, but certainly could be pulled off. I'd question why they just switched though, as it would have been wiser to switch months ago.


That's the thing. If this was a large entity you would think that there would be people employed to manage this kind of setup or even the couple investors would operate it. Even if they switched a few machines a day over it would pay for labor and we would see a linear increase in difficulty. This thing popped out of nowhere, ran for a couple days, and is now gone. There was another user up around 1 million KH/s, but they've been bouncing around all over the place, slowly falling, and are around 600,000 KH/s now. Hopefully, whatever this thing is it just dies off and goes away.


Hashrate that bounces all over the place is a pretty good indicator of a botnet. You can't go by the number of connections, obviously, but one thing they can't really hide well is bots coming online and going offline.
sr. member
Activity: 476
Merit: 250
September 03, 2013, 12:42:09 AM
#91
Windmaster,you made my day ..f*cking awesome
hero member
Activity: 574
Merit: 500
September 03, 2013, 12:40:31 AM
#90
So long story short ..Windmaster YOU are the mystery 2600 gig hash ??


Also what are your GPS co'ords and what are your views on Al-Cadia Huh
hero member
Activity: 868
Merit: 500
CryptoTalk.Org - Get Paid for every Post!
September 03, 2013, 12:20:57 AM
#89

That's certainly not in "unlimited budget" territory.  I trust that the above photos look significantly different than what everyone else was envisioning when talking about a service entrance in this size range?  Were you guys envisioning a substation and switchyard or something?


I envisioned a huge warehouse piled high with stacks of mobo's and GPU's with arcs of electricity flying around.  Roll Eyes

jk but your setup looks pretty sweet.
sr. member
Activity: 347
Merit: 250
September 03, 2013, 12:01:32 AM
#88
Look forward to chatting, love to hear from others on how they implemented, even after the fact. My expansion will never grow above 200,000 kh/s for GPUs.

I agree that it'll be a fun time once GPU mining becomes uneconomic, and everyone starts posting photos.  For that matter, it would be interesting to get together a group of large mining farm builders over a beer to "shoot the shit" after this is all over.  There's a lot of interesting engineering and tricks of the trade that people have developed for large mining farms.


You've never run a farm judging by your comments. Let me give you a clue why it's unique for a single location: Heat & Power.

As best I can tell, most of the people here have just never seen what a ~1MW service entrance looks like, or are imagining something massive and expensive.  So here, I ran outside with my camera just before dark in an attempt to educate people on what a service entrance of this size actually looks like.  I'm not going to post any mining rig photos for the reasons I noted a few posts back.  However, I'll post service entrance photos since there isn't exactly anything in these photos that will help anyone else build a GPU farm.  Our service entrance in the below photos has a maximum capacity of 900kW (2500A x 208VAC x 1.73):

The transformers out on the pole.  I bet no one would take a second look or think anything was at all unusual if they saw this next to any warehouse or office building:







Electrical distribution room:



The 4th panelboard contains 3 2500A fuses and the disconnect.  I can't take a photo of the disconnect and fuses, as this panelboard is sealed by the power company:



The other 3 panelboards contain an assortment of 100A, 200A, 400A, 600A and 1000A breakers that feed the other subpanels throughout the building:







Here's a 400A disconnect ahead of one of the subpanels that fanout power to each row of racks:



Note: I Photoshopped all of these (well, GIMP'd them).  I resized them down to a reasonable size, cropped them to the area of interest, and in the case of the power pole photo, removed the PUC tag # for the pole and the serial # on the transformer (I value my privacy, and any lineman in half of the western US could look up the exact location of that power pole otherwise).


And no, I will not post rig photos until after GPU mining of all cryptos becomes uneconomic and the contents of the photos will not aid anyone else in building their GPU farm.  However, it's not going to take long for someone to calculate an upper bound of how high our hash rate could be for the amount of power we have available.  It's between 0kH/sec and that upper bound, that's all you'll get for now.  Smiley

That's certainly not in "unlimited budget" territory.  I trust that the above photos look significantly different than what everyone else was envisioning when talking about a service entrance in this size range?  Were you guys envisioning a substation and switchyard or something?
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