Topic: ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It - page 223. (Read 3917468 times)

I didn't quite say it was Havelock's fault--just that it's stupid to try making money there.
There's no evidence of such a thing ever having been done, making the possibility of it *ever* happening speculative at best.*

But now that you bring the responsibility thing up, I'll say it:  Yes, it is partially Havelock's fault.

Havelock's fault for pretending to screen their offerings.
Havelock's fault for making assurances like "we hold all the money in escrow until it's needs by the issuer" (presumably doling it out like a parent does his child's allowance), and then failing to act on their promise (see Mintspare thread).
Havelock's fault for their own grossly overvalued IPO [HIF], which flopped just like all the rest of the crap listed there.

There's plenty more, but TL;DR:  I didn't claim it's Havelock's fault, but, now that you mention it, it kinda is.

---

*I'm talking about investing as opposed to trading.  It's possible to make money trading, and the fact that the charts have some upswings interrupting their negative slope is proof enough that some people, at some point, have bought lower than they sold (profited).

 You shouldn't have said that.  It shows a lack of reading comprehension skills.
Not one person in this thread has blamed Havelock. 

Well, I gotta say: Is it really Havelock's fault that "none of the stocks trade above IPO price"? It's the stocks that fail, not Havelock per se. I assume it's more of a general problem of the Bitcoin securities/stock market and people coming up with IPOs that don't have a sound business model business model

another advice: don't spit upwards, it'll fall on your face

4realz?  Gotta be a few professionals here who are intentionally losing massive amounts of money.  Like U, 4 instance.


Never take advice from Anons.  Trading is not a cooperative sport.  For every good trade, there must be a matching *bad* trade.


"Dumb money" is what *ALL* AM shareholders are.  At least all who bought shares on Havelock.  Because:

There may be a few smart traders, but no smart investors.


...and FFS, never invest on an exchange where not a single offering is trading above its initial listing price.  That sort of thing doesn't just make you "dumb money," it makes you certifiably insane.


See (1).


wut
Someone offered you commissions?  But you can't type up a grammatically correct post.  You have no understanding of the very rudiments of business, like "contracts are there to be followed, not broken," "if you're a multimillion getting funding on some interwebs forum, spend five minutes a day posting to keep the marks calm," and "once the shares are sold, the issuer doesn't lose a penny if the shareholders dump their shares for nothing.  Conversely, the issuer doesn't profit if the share price skyrockets.  Not unless the issuer plans to sell more shares."

Stop typing nonsense, inept pimping is the worst kind of FUD.  It's frickin' embarrassing to read through, too.

Precisely, very good catch! : )

Except the "doesn't care": I care enough to come here and discuss, and I hate to see people lose money, so I give warnings here and there.

Denying the AM is high-risk due to its Bitcoin+unregulated+China nature is bad.
Accepting that and investing anyway is good as long as you understand what you are doing and which are the risks.

Hey some people do. I was merely wondering if anyone did. How about you stop punishing people for being victims of your own preconceived notions?


Ah I believe you must be looking for the accredited investor lounge. Sorry this is a public forum.


Don't bother.


Amen brother. I've already purchased advertisement space for AM. You wanna help rally people to create a pool to get more? I really don't have the money to keep doing that.

Well said! 

Based on your theory and your frequency of talking, I think you need to replace your donation link with AM's AD in your signature, at least.

There is a rumor that divs would come soon enough in september.. ^^

Saying to make "investments" based on rumors, is like trying to make a living buying lottery tickets and call it doing "business".
I can see that most people who are "investors" here are extremely amateurish.
So let me give some words of advice:

1) Never speculate, don't buy anything by hearing shit from third parties. Gather data yourself.
2) Don't be "Dumb Money": in the business and investment world they classify investors as "smart money" and "dumb money". "Smart money" are investors who are also experts in the field you are entrepreneuring, so the main capital is not the money they are bringing to the table but their expertise and connections that would eventually be a great help for the growth of the company. "Dumb Money" is what most AM shareholders are: bunch of clueless chickens who are just sitting on their chairs asking to the entrepreneur when they will see their money back. Not only they are not providing any help, but they are also an annoyance.
For future entrepreneurs out there: never take "dumb money".
For future investors: never invest in something you don't understand or can't help it to grow.
3) Never invest if you can't afford to lose.
4) Don't try to get quick profits by instilling FUD. That is extremely shortsighted and moronic, especially destructive for startups.

I declined to take commissions when I was bringing business to my investments, refusing finders fee and sales commissions because my main goal is to provide value to my investments. The end game is not some money now, but astronomical price when the companies exits (when they sell the company).

If you are a true investor in AM the best you can do is to think how you can assist to your company to be leading in the market. Can you connect them with potential buyers? Do you know a place with cheap electricity? Do you have connections with financiers? Or at least, can you refrain from talking shit about the company you invested? It is fucking moronic and self-defeating to become an annoyance and expecting them to outperform when you are staining their image.
Be fucking smart.

Yeah, I guess people may be doing that. At least it's better than losing money. But you have to be careful not to miss the real train, when it really comes. That's the gamble here.

That's not what I meant at all. Just wondering if anyone is buying on missed dates and selling on rumors. Normally the saying is buy on rumors and sell on news.

Sure, it's basically just a bet that there is no massive movement up or down, it's just waiting and playing the people. But to believe that this is done by FC or someone from AM is ludicrous, since the volume and the swings on Havelock are much to shallow to really profit...

The order book over the last few months has been like watching the tides roll in and out. Somebody has to be making money off this.

My first 8 shares of AM had a bitcoin cost average of 2.5BTC. (Burnside's BTCTC.CO)
Granted, BTC was around $60/each, but it's a bit painful to look at the top of the spreadsheet and see some of the wicked prices AM fetched.

I bring this up because it feels a lot like March/April of 2013. 
I think, for the most part, Gen2 chips created a gaping hole of almost a year in the momentum of this company.

I'm still buying into a company that can bring more chips to market than any other company.
Even if Gen3 was a bit of a stinker (power-wise) they still have the reach to make more and better chips in the future.
Their name still demands cooperation from other manufactures.
I think they got a little caught off guard that 200's didn't sell off the shelves like they did back in '13.
If they phase right into Gen4 chips, after Gen3 has done all it can do, I think marketing (and PR) will be less of an issue.

Just a few random 7am thoughts...

Does he really have any shares (still) The way he talks makes me think he already got out of the game or, at best, still owns a couple of very old shares "just to be safe" and really doesn't care anymore 

So, the anticipated pullback is here. The situation is in some sense quite interesting and can be used as example to show that there is no the only one right approach.

Case 1.
Someone bought into AM around 0.15 as a speculation on approaching dividends. FC made the salon and announced 'hopefully August'. Then buying ensued and share price roughly doubled. Up to now no dividends, so natural reaction of such person is to sell at any profit he is able to squeeze out. Remember, the first reason for his speculation was approaching dividends. At this point his investment is a success and he simply moves on.

Case 2.
Someone bought into AM as a speculation on real turnaround. In such case his time frame is about 6 months  (starting from June/July) and current situation should be seen by him as an opportunity to increase his stake.

Case 3.
Someone bought into AM either during IPO or later for the purpose of long term mining or chip, miners production. There is absolutely no reason to do anything.

What's really interesting is the fact that all three individuals could still be successful! The question is: will they stick to their strategy or not? But have no doubts, just sticking to your strategy does not guarantee that you will win. That's why wise money management, patience and cold blood are all so important.
Also, difficult part of the puzzle is to distance oneself from the green-eyed monster - someone's luck or success should never influence you or feed your greed.
 
Overall, investing (or money management if you prefer) is not, for large majority of people, a suitable way of making one's living.

Lohoris, what game are you playing for god's sake.
If you don't trust them, sell your shares and forget about it.

Only if you can trust them.
Here we are talking about a bitcoin company operating in China in a very secretive manner.
What's your recourse should they just grab the money and cancel the shares? Zero.
So you obviously want dividends, otherwise you've got nothing.