At what point did you realise that Bitcoin was a failed project?

NeuroticFish

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Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

so its no longer too slow and expensive to use.

This is BCashers narrative. The blockchain tech, if it's properly decentralized, is getting expensive if it's being used heavily. PoW is expensive too. And if you want it fixed, it's extremely easy: go for any worthless altcoin, those will be cheap to use; and especially if you go for one that's also centralized, you'll get fast confirmations too.

Now, at least the cost part, that's not much of a flaw, it's a feature. Bitcoin success relies on greed. This makes so many miners mine it and make the blockchain more secure than any other coin's, this also makes people hurry and pay huge fees for the transactions in order to not miss whatever market movement. You seem to have forgotten that 1-3 sat/vByte was just fine before this new bull run/FOMO bubble has started.

Also you seem to forget that in many cases there are options to avoid on-chain transactions, which is the usual advice in this kind of situations. This means altcoins or LN. This approach fixes the speed and fees for many (especially the withdrawal fees from exchanges, which are in most cases bigger than tx fees). And before somebody jumps and tells "then why don't use altcoin only?", remember that without Bitcoin success, most/all altcoins would not exist, remember that your altcoin is most probably not accepted in the shop you want to use it, remember that your alcoin's price cannot compare with Bitcoins (and that's why you are actually using Bitcoin, no matter what you are saying). And remember that you are free to use what coin you want.

And if you still don't get it, then you don't want to understand and I wasted my time explaining it for you.

avikz

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Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

Do you remember exactly when you realised Bitcoin had failed as a cryptocurrency. What was your thoughts around that epiphany.

What in your mind would it take to fix bitcoin, so its no longer too slow and expensive to use.

Is there any hope for Bitcoin, or have you given up on it?

Show me a single object/innovation/matter/technology that doesn't have flaws! I will then take your argument for further discussion! There is definitely rooms for improvement but that doesn't mean it has failed as a cryptocurrency!

Bitcoin is the first ever cryptocurrency created on the face of earth so it's a crime to think that bitcoin wouldn't have any flaws! If you think it is slow and expensive, please adopt Lightening Network and these issues will be solved for you!

EdgeoftheContinent

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Quote from: A62662 on January 24, 2021, 04:02:09 AM

Ok, i see, so for 99% of the users of bitcointalk, the only thing that matters is if the price of BTC is going up or not. That alone is proof bitcoin is a failed project, almost nobody is using it for what it originally was intended for. What more proof do you need, its right there in front of you Cheesy

Bitcoin has proven to the whole world that it has failed and failed hard, now the only thing its good for is as a ponzi scheme, and once the ponzi pops, then what, what are we left with after the bubble ends, a corpse of a crypto.

Being the first crypto is not necessarily a good thing 12 years later, now its just an old useless dinosaur. Dont waste your time and effort with this old crap, there are much better cryptos than BTC.

Bitcoin is now just as useless as the 12+ year old computers it was first mined on. Try using a 12+ year old pc today, its useless, just as useless as BTC is for paying in a normal everyday shop.

Not really sure how bitcoin is a ponzi considering a ponzi would not allow a open ledger. And in a ponzi astronomical returns are guaranteed where as in bitcoin most people will tell you that it is a volatile asset that has the potential to lose your entire investment. So while you might not think bitcoin is a good cryptocurrency saying it is a ponzi scheme is ignorant. I buy plenty of things with lightning network so while you may be unaware of tools that allow you to use bitcoin everyday doesn't mean everyone else is the same.

A62662

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Ok, i see, so for 99% of the users of bitcointalk, the only thing that matters is if the price of BTC is going up or not. That alone is proof bitcoin is a failed project, almost nobody is using it for what it originally was intended for. What more proof do you need, its right there in front of you Cheesy

Bitcoin has proven to the whole world that it has failed and failed hard, now the only thing its good for is as a ponzi scheme, and once the ponzi pops, then what, what are we left with after the bubble ends, a corpse of a crypto.

Being the first crypto is not necessarily a good thing 12 years later, now its just an old useless dinosaur. Dont waste your time and effort with this old crap, there are much better cryptos than BTC.

Bitcoin is now just as useless as the 12+ year old computers it was first mined on. Try using a 12+ year old pc today, its useless, just as useless as BTC is for paying in a normal everyday shop.

ultrloa

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Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

Do you remember exactly when you realised Bitcoin had failed as a cryptocurrency. What was your thoughts around that epiphany.

What in your mind would it take to fix bitcoin, so its no longer too slow and expensive to use.

Is there any hope for Bitcoin, or have you given up on it?

I don't actually realize that bitcoin is failed project since so far this coin is doing a great run for over the years although their are instance that I lose some money on my trades due to unfortunate event of bearish market condition but I don't really blame it to the bitcoin since I always think about its my mistake for being greedy to earn and look for another pump. That's why by now I'm trying to learn more even a single little movement so that I cannot miss anything and to possibly earn always on my trades.

A62662

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Quote from: PhoenixZephyrus on January 24, 2021, 02:50:31 AM

Quote from: LogitechMouse on January 24, 2021, 01:35:23 AM

2 words. Lightning Network.

I know that the problem/s that we are seeing towards Bitcoin is its high transaction fees and slow transaction speed. Lightning Network answers it all and it is on its testing phase already. If this will be implemented in almost all of the sites then we will see Bitcoin's tx fees significantly lower and faster tx speed.

TBH, I didn't see Bitcoin as a failed project although its main purpose isn't being used that much (to be a currency). Yes we might see Bitcoin being used to pay things and that is the main purpose of it but some just see it as an investment more than a currency but it isn't enough to say that it is a failed project.

Lightning Network, although looking like a good solution, has its own set of problems, mainly regarding the over-dependence of the network on fund-concentrated nodes, and chances of fraud as the transactions do not need to be confirmed by the whole network, just by the parties participating. At its current stage, without a remedy to these kind of vulnerabilities, I don't really think that it can be feasibly applied to everything right now, like the people are implying.

It, like a lot of things, has its own vulnerabilities and those need to be remedied or atleast a better version needs to be developed before just stating that it's the end-all be-all solution.

I dont think those who mention that bother about that at all. All they want is for BTC to keep going up, they dont care about bitcoin, they only care about the price of bitcoin. Thats why they never tell the whole picture.

Ironically what they are really after is fiat, thats how they can actually buy the stuff they want and need in the real world, unlike BTC that you can hardly use at all.

PhoenixZephyrus

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Quote from: LogitechMouse on January 24, 2021, 01:35:23 AM

2 words. Lightning Network.

I know that the problem/s that we are seeing towards Bitcoin is its high transaction fees and slow transaction speed. Lightning Network answers it all and it is on its testing phase already. If this will be implemented in almost all of the sites then we will see Bitcoin's tx fees significantly lower and faster tx speed.

TBH, I didn't see Bitcoin as a failed project although its main purpose isn't being used that much (to be a currency). Yes we might see Bitcoin being used to pay things and that is the main purpose of it but some just see it as an investment more than a currency but it isn't enough to say that it is a failed project.

Lightning Network, although looking like a good solution, has its own set of problems, mainly regarding the over-dependence of the network on fund-concentrated nodes, and chances of fraud as the transactions do not need to be confirmed by the whole network, just by the parties participating. At its current stage, without a remedy to these kind of vulnerabilities, I don't really think that it can be feasibly applied to everything right now, like the people are implying.

It, like a lot of things, has its own vulnerabilities and those need to be remedied or atleast a better version needs to be developed before just stating that it's the end-all be-all solution.

btc_angela

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Quote from: charlesmichel1 on January 24, 2021, 02:02:21 AM

The question should sound like "when did you stop idealizing Bitcoin?". I can't agree that Bitcoin failed as the crypto, but I understand it will never become the world currency.

Bitcoin has not intention to become a world currency to be fair, it's that there are people who are pushing for this narrative. Maybe what the OP is trying to say is that since it was design to be a micro-payment scheme by Satoshi, with the exorbitant fees that we are seeing it could be somewhat a failed project because it didn't work as design.

However, just like any other technology, specially Internet, it has grown so big that it also evolved into an asset/store of value/hedge by big companies against QE. As for the rising fees, everyone is talking about the buzz word - "Lightning Network".

charlesmichel1

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The question should sound like "when did you stop idealizing Bitcoin?". I can't agree that Bitcoin failed as the crypto, but I understand it will never become the world currency.

LogitechMouse

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2 words. Lightning Network.

I know that the problem/s that we are seeing towards Bitcoin is its high transaction fees and slow transaction speed. Lightning Network answers it all and it is on its testing phase already. If this will be implemented in almost all of the sites then we will see Bitcoin's tx fees significantly lower and faster tx speed.

TBH, I didn't see Bitcoin as a failed project although its main purpose isn't being used that much (to be a currency). Yes we might see Bitcoin being used to pay things and that is the main purpose of it but some just see it as an investment more than a currency but it isn't enough to say that it is a failed project.

rokon1234

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I never had such an idea because I always think the future of Bitcoin is much better.The price of bitcoin is now huge.It is foolish to think that bitcoin is a failed project.Now bitcoin is gaining huge amount of capital by trading.So, I think bitcoin has never been a failed project and it's to be hoped that this will not happen in the future.

EdgeoftheContinent

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I don't think bitcoin has failed. I have bought things with bitcoin, so therefore it is a success. I understand there may be limitations at this point but there were limitations when the first airplane was built. People kept building and making things better, in my opinion bitcoin has a long way to go before it reaches the final product.

ImHash

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I knew from the start that Bitcoin is not enough for everybody's daily use, it has high fees, slow network in terms of confirming transactions and has small block size, Bitcoin could be used for big players, it's not really enough for mass adoption. there could be things done to fix it, such as increasing the block size and using the lightning network, but I doubt that all the people adopt that idea.
Though Bitcoin is not a failed project at all.

Youghoor

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Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

Do you remember exactly when you realised Bitcoin had failed as a cryptocurrency. What was your thoughts around that epiphany.

What in your mind would it take to fix bitcoin, so its no longer too slow and expensive to use.

Is there any hope for Bitcoin, or have you given up on it?

Why is Bitcoin a failed project ? Bitcoin has been in the financial ecosystem for about 11 years now and you are calling bitcoin as a failed project. What do you understand when something is described as a failed project? To my understanding, a failed crypto project is usually that project with no significant importance in the crypto ecosystem. Bitcoin is basically the bench mark for every crypto project. You shouldn't use the slow transaction speed of Bitcoin to describe it as a failed project.

arcmetal

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Do you remember exactly when you realized that this comment thread had failed as a topic. What was your thoughts around the epiphany that this is just f.u.d. .

What in your mind would it take to fix the mind of this poster, so that its brain is no longer too slow and expensive to use.

Is there any hope for no-coiners, or have you given up on trying to explain it to them?

Kemarit

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Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

Do you remember exactly when you realised Bitcoin had failed as a cryptocurrency. What was your thoughts around that epiphany.

I never thought of that, Bitcoin has become a asset that everyone wanted to get their hands on, so why it is a failed as a cryptocurrency. You can still send money cross-border and that is "good enough" for majority of bitcoin enthusiast.

Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

What in your mind would it take to fix bitcoin, so its no longer too slow and expensive to use.

There are fork coins of Bitcoin and supposedly fix. this issue, however, still they are mining empty blocks, meaning people are still using Bitcoin regardless of the fees.

Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

Is there any hope for Bitcoin, or have you given up on it?

Bitcoin has been functioning as design, maybe it just change its narrative. And no I'm not given up.

maculeth

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As a digital currency, I think there is no hope, but the good thing is that bitcoin can be a profitable investment asset. It is impossible if the current $ 30k- $ 40k bitcoins are used as a means of payment. but at such a high price, bitcoin can be very profitable as an investment asset.

TravelMug

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Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

Do you remember exactly when you realised Bitcoin had failed as a cryptocurrency. What was your thoughts around that epiphany.

What in your mind would it take to fix bitcoin, so its no longer too slow and expensive to use.

Is there any hope for Bitcoin, or have you given up on it?

Good question, but to be honest, it didn't crossed my mind that bitcoin is a failed project. If it is then we should reach our 10 year, it should have died in the first couple of year. But for those who see that it is a failed project, it's either they are just a true hater of this technology, or they are totally ignorant of what bitcoin is, simply as that.

As for the fees, LN (Lightning Network) is one solution, even Electrum now supports it. But it is still on the testing phase. Maybe this topic can help you out:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/a-beginners-guideline-to-bitcoin-lightning-network-5202798
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/the-lightning-network-faq-5158920

gurunanakji777

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I never thought Bitcoin is a failed project but we can say the transaction fees of bitcoin is quite high and that is the only concern I noticed in bitcoin. Yes, it's expensive to buy 1 Bitcoin by a small investor/trader He/she can not even think to buy 1 bitcoin now it is out of reach for them but buying some satoshi is not an issue.

A62662

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Quote from: eaLiTy on January 23, 2021, 07:58:20 AM

Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

Do you remember exactly when you realised Bitcoin had failed as a cryptocurrency. What was your thoughts around that epiphany.

What in your mind would it take to fix bitcoin, so its no longer too slow and expensive to use.

If BTCitcoin was a failed project i will not spend too much time in the market, so what makes you think that it is a failed project when you can send the coins with a fees of 51 sat/B and you will get it confirmed within half an hour. If you are looking for instant confirmations you need to look elsewhere but i am happy with the fees right now.

Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

Is there any hope for Bitcoin, or have you given up on it?

Giving up on what aspect. If the price is beyond your imagination and you are not seeing that as a good entry point then you can give up the dream of making a fortune, the aspect you are telling i already explained Tongue

.

Right there, we have crucial problems. Half an hour confirmation time. That is way too long. Ethereum is what Bitcoin should have been from the start. Then again Ethereum has its own problems, like high fees, just like bitcoin has.

lepbagong

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Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

Do you remember exactly when you realised Bitcoin had failed as a cryptocurrency. What was your thoughts around that epiphany.

I don't see it as what you say and bitcoin is still one of the mainstays of cryptocurrency.
so for me I don't need to discuss it because I didn't experience it. still believe that bitcoin is still the mainstay of crypto.

Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

What in your mind would it take to fix bitcoin, so its no longer too slow and expensive to use.

there is no way I can fix bitcoin because bitcoin works alone with a built-in system, how can that affect that. so far it is still normal and no one is worried about the state of bitcoin. if it slows down or not if the price is expensive, of course something that bitcoin deserves.

Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

Is there any hope for Bitcoin, or have you given up on it?

bitcoin will run well and there are many hopes that we want to get from the existence of bitcoin, and there are no words of giving up for those who are still loyal in crypto. because it is the goal and perhaps the life we seek.

eaLiTy

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Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

Do you remember exactly when you realised Bitcoin had failed as a cryptocurrency. What was your thoughts around that epiphany.

What in your mind would it take to fix bitcoin, so its no longer too slow and expensive to use.

If BTCitcoin was a failed project i will not spend too much time in the market, so what makes you think that it is a failed project when you can send the coins with a fees of 51 sat/B and you will get it confirmed within half an hour. If you are looking for instant confirmations you need to look elsewhere but i am happy with the fees right now.

Quote from: Samthehero on January 23, 2021, 07:15:56 AM

Is there any hope for Bitcoin, or have you given up on it?

Giving up on what aspect. If the price is beyond your imagination and you are not seeing that as a good entry point then you can give up the dream of making a fortune, the aspect you are telling i already explained Tongue

.

Jawhead999

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Do you mean about the transaction fees? Yes, this is a challenge for us right now especially when mining Bitcoin is become harder and not profitable, so the supply are close to maximum (21 Million) and those miners only get profit by fees.

I know how high the fees if you send a small amount money (also I don't see any reason why they do that if they don't have much money) but this can be reducted by segwit address, batch, and lightning network (still fairly new and developed).

If lightning network already success (means safe to use, no bug, can be trusted) then, the fees will be dropped significantly.

Samthehero

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There is a topic discussing what is wrong with Bitcoin here;
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/what-do-you-think-is-the-biggest-disadvantage-of-bitcoin-5286664

Nobody says when they found out about these flaws, would be interesting to know when they realised this, was it just recently or was it a long time ago.

Also has it changed their views on the future of the project from what they thought in the beginning?

Samthehero

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Do you remember exactly when you realised Bitcoin had failed as a cryptocurrency. What was your thoughts around that epiphany.

What in your mind would it take to fix bitcoin, so its no longer too slow and expensive to use.

Is there any hope for Bitcoin, or have you given up on it?

Topic: At what point did you realise that Bitcoin was a failed project? (Read 239 times)