Topic: At what point do we stop kidding ourselves? Bye Bye mining farms. - page 3. (Read 4499 times)

You are correct.  However, there is still a psychological bias toward buying into a currency that had real work done to create vs a premine.

First, if I gave 144 people 25 bitcoins each, and they sold them, what would happen to the price of a bitcoin? According to you, the market would collapse because it cost them nothing to gain those bitcoins. Obviously, it wouldn't because there are enough free bitcoins to affect the market. You can't generate an unlimited number of bitcoins, so you can't drag the value down to the marginal cost.

Second, suppose Bitcoin was premined and 1 bitcoin was given to each of 21,000,000 people. Would the value of the bitcoins forever be 0? What if other people wanted some? What if people wanted two or more? What if one person managed to collect 10,000 and got someone to trade two pizzas for them? Would the value still forever be stuck at 0? No.

Don't you see? The value of a bitcoin has nothing to do with the cost of creating it. The supply of bitcoins does not depend on their value and bitcoins are not consumed. The economics of gold, oil, and other commodities do not apply to bitcoin.

how?  it's already risen to the 400,000,000 level three months ago and hasn't moved beyond it.  as you said, it's 'almost unprofitable' (or else it would be rising further).  it may do so later , for example of the btc price rises, but for now, it ain't.

The mining farms are going to exist as long as they are breaking even and the mining continues to be profitable. The price of bitcoin would have to drop very low (<$100) before they go away.

How? I suppose its a matter of interpretation. It's still quite profitable in my area as well as many areas. Undervolted I would be over 50% profitable.

already happened.


https://blockchain.info/charts/hash-rate

I do expect btc to rise as well. Not exclusively though. Hashrate will rise to an almost unprofitable state, and hopefully the btc value follows suit. I can say this is the first quarter in the history of bitcoin that we've actually seen decreases in difficulty which is promising. That's for a different discussion though. I cover quite a bit of that here --->   https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.11695012

Take part or don't. Thank you for contributing yet another off topic reply though!


Plenty of people contributed to this discussion in a helpful way. Only one person said some stupid ass shit that had nothing to do with the discussion and he was called on it. Action. Reaction.

no one can touch bitcoin, enough said!!!

I'm expecting the price of BTC to rise as a result ..

How can you expect to have a quality conersation when you immediately come off defensive and with a nasty attitude? Calling people fools and idiots because they don't agree with you is a great way to keep people away.

True but you are missing my point. They (the government) are getting paid for it. Twice. Taxes in america dude.

Whereas they are not with bitcoin. Unless people are claiming mining on their tax returns now? 

This is exactly my point. Governments do not care about who is responsible for using more electricity and "pollution on a massive scale".

Haha well you are missing a huge part of what gaming is and who that market belongs to

Three biggest names in gaming?

1)Steam

2)Microsoft

3)SOA


All three operate and pay taxes in america.




I mean I agree. And believing in free market I cant even disagree with what they are doing. I just see it as harmful in the long run. But perhaps i'm just too paranoid.

How about you actually read the thread before posting?

Well this is something that one should get used to. Humans are flawed. They are greedy and are going to abuse just about anything that they can.
It's unfortunate to see this happen but not much can be done to prevent an ASIC company to mine with new hardware before releasing it, right?

And what are your proposals to have a secure blockchain and network?

No, it is not responsible as human beings to waste electricity. Bitcoin is an experiment to revolutionise the global monetary system. It has the potential to save millions of people's life-savings, help overseas workers save fee remitting money home. Innovations do not come without costs. The electricity used are costs of technological advancement.

I would be safe to say that the global gaming industry (PC/console/mobile) uses more energy than Bitcoin does. Are they also irresponsible playing too much games and using more electricity than needed? Will governments come together and put an end to this?  

A cryptocurrency that cost nothing to make will eventually worth nothing, because it is voluntarily participated. Why should I pay 200 dollar for something that cost nothing to make??? Suppose that you can generate 1 bitcoin today with a cost of 1 dollar, then everyone will immediately go to generate coin and sell it on market for $199 of profit right away, that will drag the price down to 1 dollar

This is the big difference between bitcoin and fiat money, which can hold its value without any cost, because average people are not allowed to produce fiat money but forced to use it

And you need huge amount of resource to ensure the security of the network, that is the mining cost. Anyone can make a fake bitcoin with just coding, but they can not fake hash power, so the hash power will prevent anyone from attacking the system and modify the transaction. In fact the huge energy cost is just a byproduct of the large hash power, it has to be there to ensure the security of the network when millions of funds are transferred in the network

In fact, the huge cost in electricity is not a must, suppose that someone invented a quantum miner, with only 100w of power it can solve a block average 120 minutes, then the network will be very green with 12 such miner. However, he might need to spend billions of dollars to produce such a miner, and the wealth invested might be much higher than electricity cost of ASIC miners, so the cost still stays high

I agree with you that more hash-rate would increase security in a decentralized aspect. Although this is not the behavior we are seeing. We are seeing asic companies actively centralizing the network by creating farms and mining on their own hardware. Counteracting the very purpose of bitcoin (decentralized network).

Lol I think we see that.

Hashing power will continue to rise over the years, as more people buy the junk from the industrial companies, and the industrial companies continue to break through with tech.