Avoiding board limitations by temporarily moving threads to another board

BTCforJoe

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Quote from: MiLkz on March 27, 2018, 08:28:08 PM

Quote from: theymos on March 27, 2018, 04:17:03 PM

The selfMod bit will now be permanently cleared when a non-mod moves a topic into a section which doesn't allow selfMod.

Awesome!, Glad to see it taken care of so fast

Please take a look at this thread concerning a major problem with self-moderation: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/scam-preventionremove-self-moderation-for-topics-within-the-marketplace-2929216

I second this. These forums are a great marketplace that displays premium placement in organic search results. I am coming across more and more newbies who have registered accounts here solely to post that they have been scammed by the types of users who lock their self-moderated threads. When asked why they didn't create an account before dealing with a seller here, they've simply answered that they found the post from a Google search and didn't feel the necessity to create an account.

My recommendations on this would be to either disallow the feature of self-moderating threads in the Marketplace section, or to display Default Trust for all users, including those that are not logged in.

Edit: example - https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.33231264

MiLkz

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Quote from: theymos on March 27, 2018, 04:17:03 PM

The selfMod bit will now be permanently cleared when a non-mod moves a topic into a section which doesn't allow selfMod.

Awesome!, Glad to see it taken care of so fast

Please take a look at this thread concerning a major problem with self-moderation: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/scam-preventionremove-self-moderation-for-topics-within-the-marketplace-2929216

theymos

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The selfMod bit will now be permanently cleared when a non-mod moves a topic into a section which doesn't allow selfMod.

EcuaMobi

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Quote from: SFR10 on March 27, 2018, 06:31:20 AM

Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 24, 2018, 02:25:13 PM

The option to move the thread to another board should be disabled on Boards with this kind of specific limitations,

Normally, that would result in restricting the following things that you mentioned here:

Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 26, 2018, 10:38:12 PM

I would think the purpose is to allow users to move them to the right board after posting on the wrong one and being told so by others. It can also be used to move closed topics to Archival for example.

So instead of that (different types of threads, in general), I think self moderated threads (as a whole) shouldn't have the ability of being transferred to another board.

Reason behind my suggestion:
- I highly doubt a casual user, knows how to create a self moderated topic (most will just click the "new topic" > disregard the "Additional Options..." > type and click post). So if someone creates such topics, they won't be publishing those in a wrong board.

Yes, that's a drawback. Moderators would probably need to be more active on those boards.
Your suggestion makes a lot of sense regarding the Spam accusations board. However on Auctions the issue is no self moderation but the OP editing or deleting his own posts.

The advantage of this option I suggest though is that it's very easy to implement. Just adding a condition in a couple of places would be necessary. It could be considered as a temporary fix.

Quote from: SFR10 on March 27, 2018, 06:31:20 AM

Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 24, 2018, 02:25:13 PM

The thread should be marked somehow so that those limitations are kept even after moving them to another board, or
Threads moved from a Board with limitations should not be allowed back if the corresponding limitation was broken (if a post was moderated or edited for example)

I support these two.

I like these 2 options more too. However they do require more development.

SFR10

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Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 24, 2018, 02:25:13 PM

The option to move the thread to another board should be disabled on Boards with this kind of specific limitations,

Normally, that would result in restricting the following things that you mentioned here:

Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 26, 2018, 10:38:12 PM

I would think the purpose is to allow users to move them to the right board after posting on the wrong one and being told so by others. It can also be used to move closed topics to Archival for example.

So instead of that (different types of threads, in general), I think self moderated threads (as a whole) shouldn't have the ability of being transferred to another board.

Reason behind my suggestion:
- I highly doubt a casual user, knows how to create a self moderated topic (most will just click the "new topic" > disregard the "Additional Options..." > type and click post). So if someone creates such topics, they won't be publishing those in a wrong board.

Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 24, 2018, 02:25:13 PM

The thread should be marked somehow so that those limitations are kept even after moving them to another board, or
Threads moved from a Board with limitations should not be allowed back if the corresponding limitation was broken (if a post was moderated or edited for example)

I support these two.

nc50lc

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Quote from: MiLkz on March 26, 2018, 11:09:02 PM

How do you move a thread?, I cannot find the move topic area Huh

If you are the topic starter:
-Open the thread you want to move.
-Scroll-down to the bottom of the page.
-Look for the "move topic" button: (Take Note: I've used this image in another thread that's why the "lock topic" was encircled)

Quickseller

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This has been a known issue for several years now, although this seems to be getting abused more frequently as of recent.

I believe TheButterZone used to edit his auction threads fairly frequently, however for some reason this seems to have stopped.

MiLkz

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Quote from: EcuaMobi on March 26, 2018, 10:38:12 PM

Threads can be moved to and from most (all?) boards, not just Auctions. I would think the purpose is to allow users to move them to the right board after posting on the wrong one and being told so by others. It can also be used to move closed topics to Archival for example.

How do you move a thread?, I cannot find the move topic area Huh

EcuaMobi

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Quote from: MiLkz on March 26, 2018, 09:30:06 PM

Is this ability limited to the Auctions section? ..and what exactly is the purpose of non-mods moving threads?, mods seem to be ontop of that from what I see

Threads can be moved to and from most (all?) boards, not just Auctions. I would think the purpose is to allow users to move them to the right board after posting on the wrong one and being told so by others. It can also be used to move closed topics to Archival for example.

MiLkz

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When we spoke about having our posts deleted in that thread, I had no idea a user could move a thread. I see you figured it out though Grin

Is this ability limited to the Auctions section? ..and what exactly is the purpose of non-mods moving threads?, mods seem to be ontop of that from what I see

EcuaMobi

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Quote from: digaran on March 26, 2018, 06:32:37 PM

Before posting on any thread in scam accusation, auctions, make sure that you have checked OP's posted topics, there is always a post containing the link to the new place of the topic

That's not always true. The thread announcing the topic was moved is published only if the OP (or the moderator) chooses to do that. It's optional:

Besides, moving the thread is not a prerequisite for Auctions.

Quote from: digaran on March 26, 2018, 06:32:37 PM

maybe we could have the OP removed as the author of such threads, making a guest account as the author when you move a self moderated thread to those boards

I don't like that idea very much. Then we wouldn't know who created the thread and the OP wouldn't have any control of it at all, he wouldn't just lose the disallowed functionality as he should. I think there are much better ways to prevent this issue

Quote from: digaran on March 26, 2018, 06:32:37 PM

why did you post this publicly?

This (bug?) doesn't allow users to hack others' accounts, reading PMs, injecting code into the DB or other security vulnerabilities so I don't think there's a security risk here.

It seems several users are already abusing this so I think it's better to make it public so that users know their posts could be moderated even in Scam accusations and OP's posts could be edited or deleted even on Auctions until this is fixed. This can reduce the effect of the exploit. Besides making this public can add some pressure so it's solved faster.

If an Admin disagrees and thinks there's an issue in making this public then he can trash this thread. I guess some Admin would've already done that in that case.

digaran

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Before posting on any thread in scam accusation, auctions, make sure that you have checked OP's posted topics, there is always a post containing the link to the new place of the topic. maybe we could have the OP removed as the author of such threads, making a guest account as the author when you move a self moderated thread to those boards. why did you post this publicly?

EcuaMobi

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Quote from: jackg on March 25, 2018, 10:44:05 AM

Quote from: Cobalt9317 on March 24, 2018, 06:58:30 PM

This is what you called SMF 1.1.19 Glitch/Bug xD well honestly I don't have that enough knowledge about SMF but the way you deduce it, it was pretty simple explanation so for an instance if this thread is in scam accusation you can move it and delete my post with a little knowledge of exploiting the said bug. Lips sealed

P.S. I'm having a coffee break here why don't you join me while the water is still hot in the thermos

Does the bug mean you can make a topic self moderated in a board that doesn't normally allow it or that you can make a thread regress back to being self moderated if moved to a board that supports it, from a board that doesn't, and originally in a board that does? Or has the bug not exactly been isolated?

The bug has been isolated. It does allow to self moderate threads on the scam accusation board (which normally doesn't allow self moderation) or to edit or delete own posts on auctions (which normally doesn't allow that).

Quote from: jackg on March 25, 2018, 10:44:05 AM

This is quite a serious bug, I'd consider negging the OP of that thread EcuaMobi for doing something like that if you haven't already done so.

~~I don't think negative is deserved. I'm adding neutral to him~~. I've replaced it with a negative after considering more factors.

jackg

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Quote from: Cobalt9317 on March 24, 2018, 06:58:30 PM

This is what you called SMF 1.1.19 Glitch/Bug xD well honestly I don't have that enough knowledge about SMF but the way you deduce it, it was pretty simple explanation so for an instance if this thread is in scam accusation you can move it and delete my post with a little knowledge of exploiting the said bug. Lips sealed

P.S. I'm having a coffee break here why don't you join me while the water is still hot in the thermos

Does the bug mean you can make a topic self moderated in a board that doesn't normally allow it or that you can make a thread regress back to being self moderated if moved to a board that supports it, from a board that doesn't, and originally in a board that does? Or has the bug not exactly been isolated?

This is quite a serious bug, I'd consider negging the OP of that thread EcuaMobi for doing something like that if you haven't already done so.

Cobalt9317

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This is what you called SMF 1.1.19 Glitch/Bug xD well honestly I don't have that enough knowledge about SMF but the way you deduce it, it was pretty simple explanation so for an instance if this thread is in scam accusation you can move it and delete my post with a little knowledge of exploiting the said bug. Lips sealed

P.S. I'm having a coffee break here why don't you join me while the water is still hot in the thermos

EcuaMobi

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One of my posts on this thread in Scam accusations got deleted by the starter of the thread.

However the thread is not marked as self moderated and it's actually not allowed to create self moderated threads on that Board as shown in this capture.

It seems the started of that thread made it self moderated on another board, then it was moved to Scam accusations (either by him or a moderator). That made the thread to sop being self moderated and the warning to be removed. Since OP didn't like what I posted on his thread it seems he moved the thread to any other board, deleted my post and moved it back to Scam accusations. That's the only explications I could find. Let me know if you can explain it otherwise.

Other Boards have their own limitations, like not editing posts on Auctions. So I've tried this on one of my posts. I moved one to Digital Goods and, as expected, I was allowed to edit or deleted my posts. Then I was able to move it back to Auctions and the limitations were back in place.

This represents an issue because:

Any user can be censured by the started of a topic without being aware that's a possibility, like it happened to me
Users not aware of this issue can be mislead into thinking no post could have been moderated by the started of a topic on Scam accusations; or no post could have been edited or deleted if the thread is on Auctions. This can be easily exploited by the started of those threads

I see 3 options to solve this problem:

The option to move the thread to another board should be disabled on Boards with this kind of specific limitations,
The thread should be marked somehow so that those limitations are kept even after moving them to another board, or
Threads moved from a Board with limitations should not be allowed back if the corresponding limitation was broken (if a post was moderated or edited for example)

Topic: Avoiding board limitations by temporarily moving threads to another board (Read 350 times)