Bank Of America Patent | Bitcointalksearch.org

BillyBobZorton

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Quote from: MF Doom on September 22, 2015, 06:14:39 AM

so this is why the "big money" never came into btc. As soon as btc was big enough to spark interest, they caught wind of these banks going forward with tech that can and probably will destroy btc, so they are keeping their money in institutional investments, like B of A

I think Big Money hasn't come yet simply because the big money holders are simply old people that have no idea what Bitcoin is and probably their assistants are also old and or ignorant about Bitcoin and will stick to "old school" corporations and equities. We'll need a generation shift so wait for at least 10 years to see real change. And when I say 10 it could be 20 or it could be 2.

RawDog

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Quote from: Kprawn on September 23, 2015, 09:41:48 AM

Quote from: edric on September 23, 2015, 06:00:18 AM

Quote from: mikewirth on September 21, 2015, 01:31:56 PM

Well, I guess we no longer need to speculate whether or not Bank of America takes crypto seriously!!! This just in: MAJOR patent: http://www.pat2pdf.org/patents/pat20150262173.pdf

Basically, Bank Of America wants to own all wire transfers done on blockchain rails. Wow!

Bank of America is clearly: in it to win it!! I would not have guessed this.

This is not some obscure patent which barely references Bitcoin like the JP Morgan bullshit - this is a very broad patent squarely directed to a primary function of the Bitcoin system.

It's very interesting. They basically are saying they invented the idea of using cryptocurrency for international wire transfers. It just sounds like further cornering of the money transmitting/remittance business by big banking power brokers that control the regulators.

How can they claim that? A fast search :

http://www.google.com/patents/US6554184

This is a very funny patentUS6554184 - it claim everything. I wonder if they ever tried to enforce it?

Kprawn

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Quote from: edric on September 23, 2015, 06:00:18 AM

Quote from: mikewirth on September 21, 2015, 01:31:56 PM

Well, I guess we no longer need to speculate whether or not Bank of America takes crypto seriously!!! This just in: MAJOR patent: http://www.pat2pdf.org/patents/pat20150262173.pdf

Basically, Bank Of America wants to own all wire transfers done on blockchain rails. Wow!

Bank of America is clearly: in it to win it!! I would not have guessed this.

This is not some obscure patent which barely references Bitcoin like the JP Morgan bullshit - this is a very broad patent squarely directed to a primary function of the Bitcoin system.

It's very interesting. They basically are saying they invented the idea of using cryptocurrency for international wire transfers. It just sounds like further cornering of the money transmitting/remittance business by big banking power brokers that control the regulators.

How can they claim that? A fast search :

http://www.google.com/patents/US6554184 and http://www.google.com/patents/US20020077971 and http://www.google.com/patents/US20150112856

There are several patents for international money transfers and I guess they will get a lot of opposition from Swift / MoneyGram / Western Union.

Western Union Company (“Western Union”) owns four patents (“money transfer patents”) directed to systems for performing formless money transfers using an electronic

transaction fulfillment device (“ETFD”).

They will be in courts for years to come over this subject :

http://www.law360.com/articles/213859/fed-circ-reverses-western-union-s-16m-patent-win

neoneros

sr. member

Activity: 462

Merit: 250

I can draw your avatar!

I think this is where development of the banks personal and closed blockchain technology comes in handy, a swift way to make wiretransfers more reliable and faster. They can patent whatever they want and extort eachother over what is and isn't within the boundaries of those patents. It will never stand in the way of the demise of their species ignited by Satoshi. The need of banks and the dependance for them to wire value across the globe is done for by the rise of the cryptocurrencies.

rgm108

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Activity: 274

Merit: 250

It's already been done.
https://switchless.com/ Has a solution called Falcon. Just happened to see a demo a while back.
Where BoA might have an edge is where they are using multiple Crypto's. My understanding is that Falcon only uses Bitcoin but I could be wrong.

edric

hero member

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Quote from: mikewirth on September 21, 2015, 01:31:56 PM

Well, I guess we no longer need to speculate whether or not Bank of America takes crypto seriously!!! This just in: MAJOR patent: http://www.pat2pdf.org/patents/pat20150262173.pdf

Basically, Bank Of America wants to own all wire transfers done on blockchain rails. Wow!

Bank of America is clearly: in it to win it!! I would not have guessed this.

This is not some obscure patent which barely references Bitcoin like the JP Morgan bullshit - this is a very broad patent squarely directed to a primary function of the Bitcoin system.

It's very interesting. They basically are saying they invented the idea of using cryptocurrency for international wire transfers. It just sounds like further cornering of the money transmitting/remittance business by big banking power brokers that control the regulators.

elvizzzzzzz

full member

Activity: 135

Merit: 100

"What is the new invention created, from separate common parts?
A financial transfer system that uses blockchain rails, instead of the current world clearinghouse? Sounds like bitcoin to me."

Exactly so. First banks prevent their customers from using their accounts to trade bitcoin,
then they patent the process to profit from it. The supposed feature of the patent is
that transferring the money in three hops, one of which is a cryptocurrency, is faster,
in some unknown circumstances, than a single wire transfer.

I'd suppose that would be true if there were a delay somehow built into the SWIFT system, or
if it were necessary to use both the SWIFT system and another wire transfer system,
but I do not see how that would work.

The mystery of this patent is whether it does what it says, except it doesn't actually
specify how the advantage is calculated, ie, how it works.

I'd throw it out.

AgentofCoin

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Merit: 1001

Quote from: mikewirth on September 22, 2015, 02:54:54 AM

Quote from: Mickeyb on September 21, 2015, 03:46:26 PM

So what is so extraordinary to patent here, I don't get it?

To get a patent, it doesn't have to be so extraordinary. just new and not obvious. So extraordinary is for a Nobel prize.

Quote from: Mickeyb on September 21, 2015, 03:46:26 PM

Here is an example of the exchange:

(1) USD Bank Account transfer to Coinbase exchange.
(2) USD Coinbase convert to bitcoin Coinbase.
(3) bitcoin Coinbase transfer to bitcoin BTC-E exchange.
(4) bitcoin BTC-E convert to EUR currency.
(5) EUR BTC-E currency exchange withdrawal to EUR Bank Account.

I have just done what BoA proposes without using their "patentable" service.

The Supreme court said: "all inventions are made up of wheels, gears, cogs - all of which are very well known and ordinary. It is when you put them together in a certain combination that they yield a special output or result, that makes them together a new invention."

You have done this combination today. But did you put all these elements together prior to the BofA filing?

What is the new invention created, from separate common parts?
A financial transfer system that uses blockchain rails, instead of the current world clearinghouse? Sounds like bitcoin to me.

Quote from: mikewirth on September 22, 2015, 02:54:54 AM

I think they will be awarded the patent for wire transfers done on cryptocurrency rails.

Maybe so, maybe not. Do me a favor and contact me either way when there is a final determination.

Blawpaw

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This means Bitcoin is finally picking up!
I wonder what will be the outcome from all of this big moves in a year or two Wink

GriffinHeart

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Hello there!

Quote from: RawDog on September 22, 2015, 05:58:48 AM

Quote from: Kprawn on September 22, 2015, 05:03:32 AM

Satoshi allowed this too happen, when he abandoned his experiment.

Yes. This is all true. Bank of America pretty much owns Bitcoin now that Satoshi left it for the sharks.

Fuck Satoshi. That lazy fucking guy.

We don't KNOW Satoshi, if he exists behind that anagram, or his motives.
This could be his experiment, leaving money to the sharks of human conciousness and marking the outcome of it.
You have no idea what his motives were, facts are the person/people behind the "Satoshi Nakamoto" alias created a currency worth, at it's peak, $1000. That is admirable.

elvizzzzzzz

full member

Activity: 135

Merit: 100

I would see the novel features as :

a) Offering the "system" as a service

b) the inclusion of a second exchange in the process. This seems odd.
Surely the process could be completed without going through a second exchange?

I'd see it as routine to wire funds from one bank to an exchange, convert to BTC,
convert to a different currency, and wire funds to another bank in a different country.
That would be done as a discrete process, and I never got around to writing an
application to automate it.

JPage

full member

Activity: 399

Merit: 105

Quote from: GermanGiant on September 22, 2015, 06:05:42 AM

Quote from: RawDog on September 22, 2015, 05:58:48 AM

Quote from: Kprawn on September 22, 2015, 05:03:32 AM

Satoshi allowed this too happen, when he abandoned his experiment.

Yes. This is all true. Bank of America pretty much owns Bitcoin now that Satoshi left it for the sharks.

Fuck Satoshi. That lazy fucking guy.

Patent application and owning a patent are not the same thing.

Well, they own the patent application, and as soon as the examiner is done, the patent application becomes the patent. So it is pretty darn close to being the same.

JPage

full member

Activity: 399

Merit: 105

Quote from: MF Doom on September 22, 2015, 06:14:39 AM

so this is why the "big money" never came into btc. As soon as btc was big enough to spark interest, they caught wind of these banks going forward with tech that can and probably will destroy btc, so they are keeping their money in institutional investments, like B of A

The interesting part is that Band of America was VERY committed and involved in early 2014. What else have they filed in the last 18 months?

MF Doom

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so this is why the "big money" never came into btc. As soon as btc was big enough to spark interest, they caught wind of these banks going forward with tech that can and probably will destroy btc, so they are keeping their money in institutional investments, like B of A

GermanGiant

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Quote from: RawDog on September 22, 2015, 05:58:48 AM

Quote from: Kprawn on September 22, 2015, 05:03:32 AM

Satoshi allowed this too happen, when he abandoned his experiment.

Yes. This is all true. Bank of America pretty much owns Bitcoin now that Satoshi left it for the sharks.

Fuck Satoshi. That lazy fucking guy.

Patent application and owning a patent are not the same thing.

RawDog

legendary

Activity: 1596

Merit: 1026

Quote from: Kprawn on September 22, 2015, 05:03:32 AM

Satoshi allowed this too happen, when he abandoned his experiment.

Yes. This is all true. Bank of America pretty much owns Bitcoin now that Satoshi left it for the sharks.

Fuck Satoshi. That lazy fucking guy.

Kprawn

legendary

Activity: 1904

Merit: 1074

Well, Satoshi is not here to stop them and he or she or they did not patent it, so it's clear what they are trying to do. Stealing ideas and concepts in the corporate world is nothing new. These assholes have money to burn on

Patent Lawyers and if this gives them a competitive edge on other companies, then they will do it. In the big ocean, the sharks eat the smaller fish. Satoshi allowed this too happen, when he abandoned his experiment.

There might be grounds to appeal this, but the Sharks rule the ocean.... just bend over and take it from behind. Roll Eyes

... Even if Satoshi comes forward now, it would be too late to stop this from happening... the sharks already

tasted the blood in the water. Cry

boopy265420

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Quote from: NorrisK on September 21, 2015, 03:07:45 PM

When checking this patent it seems to me like they are patenting a specific use scenario for the use of any cryptocurrency. If you check the flowchart it also seems that they are patenting some kind of use case where crypto is only used if it is more optimal then conventional methods.

What is my understanding from this application they are trying to patent some services for their customers as they will be first to offer and want to keep it just for their customers.Blockchain as whole is open and can not be patenting by any company.Their will be seen many blockchain based services and products in future by different banks and institutions.

mikewirth

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Merit: 250

Quote from: Mickeyb on September 21, 2015, 03:46:26 PM

So what is so extraordinary to patent here, I don't get it?

To get a patent, it doesn't have to be so extraordinary. just new and not obvious. So extraordinary is for a Nobel prize.

Quote from: Mickeyb on September 21, 2015, 03:46:26 PM

Here is an example of the exchange:

(1) USD Bank Account transfer to Coinbase exchange.
(2) USD Coinbase convert to bitcoin Coinbase.
(3) bitcoin Coinbase transfer to bitcoin BTC-E exchange.
(4) bitcoin BTC-E convert to EUR currency.
(5) EUR BTC-E currency exchange withdrawal to EUR Bank Account.

I have just done what BoA proposes without using their "patentable" service.

The Supreme court said: "all inventions are made up of wheels, gears, cogs - all of which are very well known and ordinary. It is when you put them together in a certain combination that they yield a special output or result, that makes them together a new invention."

You have done this combination today. But did you put all these elements together prior to the BofA filing? Even if someone performed a transfer as described before that date, it wasn't all put together as a unitary system - until BofA described it in their patent. I think they will be awarded the patent for wire transfers done on cryptocurrency rails.

Mickeyb

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Move On !!!!!!

Quote from: AgentofCoin on September 21, 2015, 02:26:17 PM

Quote from: mikewirth on September 21, 2015, 02:15:07 PM

Quote from: AgentofCoin on September 21, 2015, 02:10:53 PM

Quote from: mikewirth on September 21, 2015, 01:59:12 PM

Quote from: AgentofCoin on September 21, 2015, 01:53:39 PM

3) The process described on page 3 is not novel, they are buying coins on behalf of the BoA client, that is all. They are middle men.

How did you make a determination that this is not novel? Your matrix for determining novelty seems to be quite a bit different than the one used by the patent office.

In a novelty determination, you must cite: a SINGLE reference, which predates the filing date, which does EXACTLY the same thing. If there are ANY differences - you must do an obviousness test - not novelty. So- please provide a reference where this is done - EXACTLY as BofA describes.

When I state it is not novel, I guess you are correct, I should have said it is not "non-obvious".
There will be no "novel" references that predate, because the issue is not whether someone beat them to the punch, but whether it is actually "ownable".
The process that is described is not special and if granted,
would potentially prevent all other banks from using a basic system of clearance for future crypto wire transfers.
It is a basic closed system that is described, it is what I do everyday. All that they do is automate it within a closed BoA Server.

Because I can automate squeezing lemons, doesn't mean I can patent the process of squeezing.
Unless, of course, there is a "new" component. Sometime that hasn't been invented yet.

Funny enough, there are more than 100 patents on the process of squeezing lemons. So, you clearly have little or no understanding of the patent system. "it is what I do everyday". Where you doing what BofA described everyday on Mar 17, 2014? Because you'd have to prove that as of the filing date. I highly doubt you were making wire transfers from one currency, through an exchange, via bitcoin, through a second exchange and into a second fiat - everyday more than 18 months ago. But if you can prove you were, you can blow up their patent!!!

I highly doubt there are lemon squeezing patents on the process of squeezing,
unless there is a novel component, otherwise they wouldn't be granted,
and there would be only one of those patents.

Here is an example of the exchange:

(1) USD Bank Account transfer to Coinbase exchange.
(2) USD Coinbase convert to bitcoin Coinbase.
(3) bitcoin Coinbase transfer to bitcoin BTC-E exchange.
(4) bitcoin BTC-E convert to EUR currency.
(5) EUR BTC-E currency exchange withdrawal to EUR Bank Account.

I have just done what BoA proposes without using their "patentable" service.

I am very sure there are users here who have done this, including hackers from eastern europe.

EDIT:
Here is a link from this forum dated April 01, 2012, 12:05:57 PM, where the process is described,
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.830254,
and people in that thread claimed to have done it themselves.

So what a hell are they trying to patent here? I have never done a transfer like described above but I would be able to do so, since I have both US Bank account and EU country bank account. I would just change btc-e with Kraken and do as described above.

So what is so extraordinary to patent here, I don't get it?

Topic: Bank Of America Patent (Read 2217 times)