Topic: BCU or Bitcoin Unlimited for sale at Bitfinex (Read 2615 times)

only way there would be a 2 bitcoin is if blockstream pull the bilateral split pin of their MASF UASF bip9 grenades.
gmaxwell has already tried to get anything not blockstream endorsed to split..

even you have wanted other non-blockstream endorsed implementations to split.. yet all the brands over the last few years have wanted to remain as a decentralised peer network. how many times have you used the phrase "BUcoin" because you believe anything not blockstream endorsed isnt bitcoin


dont cry the fake tears of "2 coins are bad" while also advocating to cause a split
we both know you want to centralise bitcoin to just one team which gmax as the CTO

hypocrit

This is business as usual. Exchanges don't give a fuck about anything that isn't making money with traffic (fees). They saw the hype of bitcoin unlimited vs bitcoin core, decide to chime in with fancy looking futures with those tokens. Well, at least it was clear to take an obvious conclusion: bitcoin unlimited will get instadumped in exchange of bitcoin core if the split ever happens.

There may be a short pump and dump ETC style but that's about it. In any case... im hoping we don't need to reach that point, having 2 bitcoins... a total disaster.

You are mixing apples and oranges. Those BCC/BCU tokens have nothing to do with any "funding" of their site or anything else. You give Bitfinex your BTC and they give you the same amount of BCC and BCU and on December 31 they will exchange your BCC back for BTC 1:1 and if there is a new currency (BTU) then they will also exchange your BCU for BTU 1:1, so there is no profit for them in all this. The fact that you can trade those BCC and BCU tokens again has nothing to do with Bitfinex because you don't trade with Bitfinex, you trade with other traders.

People here are questioning the point in trading BTU tokens because they think the fork will not happen but the BTU usability/profitability has nothing to do with fork happening or not happening, that's what I was trying to explain in my previous post. Maybe a simple example will help you understand. You give Bitfinex 10 BTC and they give you 10 BCC and 10 BCU. Right now the BCC value is around 82% of BTC, the BCU value is around 18% of BTC. So if you immediately sell those 10 BCU for BTC you will get 1.8 BTC and you can immediately withdraw it. Then on December 31 Bitfinex will give you 10 BTC back for your 10 BCC. You had 10 BTC in the beginning, you ended up with 11.8 BTC in the end, regardless of any fork, your profit is 18%, i.e. what you got for selling your BCU tokens. Or, you can take even shorter path: you have 10 BTC, you keep 1.8 BTC and with the remaining 8.2 BTC you will buy 10 BCC and again wait till the end of the year when Bitfinex gives you 10 BTC for them. How is it possible that somebody can't understand a first grade elementary school math is really beyond me.

Except the usual trading fees Bitfinex is not gaining nor losing anything by listing BCC/BCU tokens and allowing traders to trade them. If the fork happens then all pre-fork bitcoins will exist in both blockchains so for each BTC that Bitfinex held before the fork there will be 1 BTC and 1 BTU in their wallets. That's why they will be able to give you not only BTC back for your BCC but also BTU (currency) for your BCU (tokens). The only profit that you will get, i.e. 1.8 BTC in the above example, you will get from other traders who will buy your BCU or sell you their BCC, not from Bitfinex. Why would anybody give you 1.8 BTC for your 10 BCU? Because they think the fork will happen. If there is no fork then they were wrong and all their BCU will become void by December 31 and thus they lose their invested BTC, i.e. you are +1.8 BTC and they are -1.8 BTC. But if the fork does happen then on December 31 they will get the new BTU currency for their BCU tokens, which they bought for only 18%, so they will hold more than 5 times more BCU than how much they originally paid (you) in BTC, so to them this may seem like a really good risk/reward ratio deal actually. In this case your loss is the fact that you will only get 10 BTC back from Bitfinex for your original 10 BTC but you will get no BTU. If you didn't do this whole BCC/BCU deal then you would be holding 10 BTC and 10 BTU now, so those 10 missing BTU will be your loss, i.e. you are +1.8 BTC and -10 BTU and they are -1.8 BTC and +10 BTU. It's always a zero-sum game. Hope it makes finally sense.

I am not saying this is a good deal or a bad deal, that you should or shouldn't go for it, I am merely explaining what so many people here apparently didn't understand. To me 18% BTC profit in 8 months (plus possibly a 5 times bigger BTU loss) is maybe an ok deal (if I think the fork will not happen), or a very bad deal (if I think the fork will happen), but either way it's not a great deal because it's only 2.25% a month and I can definitely get more than that by lending. But if you are not lending and don't think the fork will happen and of course don't expect Bitfinex to turn into Gox v2.0 this year then this might be worth considering.

Having gone through the Mt. Gox and the Bitfinex issues I can tell you from experience that the Bitfinex way is much better.

Mt. Gox:  Bankrupt, loose all your money and never get it back.  If there is any value there it will be eaten up by the sharks/lawyers.

Bitfinex:  Get tokens to represent the value of your prorated share of what was taken, eventually get the value of all your BTC at the time of the hack.

Sure, I lost the appreciation on my BTC from the time of the hack until I got my money back.  Am I happy about it?  No.  Am I pissed they were hacked?  Yes.  However I am much happier with how they handled it than what happened in the Mt. Gox case.  I would much rather have something rather than nothing.

If you would rather the company file for bankruptcy and you lose everything after a hack then use another exchange with that policy. 

If bitcoin is the only source of income, it means that the exchange for today is the only way out. And this is because life requires real money.

So are you telling that they are using to fund their site in the event of the hack by providing another token,it is not a fair process and is there anything in the terms of service that says that if and when the exchange looses money they will compensate by providing an alternative,what ever it is i am not a fan of the exchange.

I see that a lot of Bitcoin users work with the Bitfinex exchange, and do not worry about their finances at all, despite last year's hacking incident. As for me, I decided to bypass them.

Seems many people here didn't really understand what the Bitfinex BCC/BCU game is about. If you put your bitcoins there you will get the same amount of BCC plus the same amount of BCU. You can then immediately sell all those BCU for BTC, right now the price is 18%, and withdraw them. You will have to keep all your BCC there and on December 31 you will get your bitcoins back for them, 1:1. So you get all your bitcoins back plus an extra 18%. And this is regardless whether the fork will or will not happen.

I still wonder why People opt to buy BCU coins while knowing fully well that a Bitcoin hard fork is under probability and may not happen. Seems like a top gamble. My thoughts are that, BCU coins aren't worth those predefined values by Bitfinex

It looks like it is not a possibility to see a BCU as yet again they failed big time when they suffered the biggest crash till date and people wont believe their stuff anymore as time and again they are proving that they are not capable to take the bitcoin to the next level.

This is not FUD. These tokens were being traded on Bitfinex. Seems like they're still being traded and will be until December 31st.


I wonder why... Maybe that's exactly why these tokens exist.


They don't become anything and they're nothing to begin with.

Been a while since I've seen an option contract on any asset this is back to the days of BTCT.co when we still had options.
Even then the options were better defined than this ^^.
But it seems they are betting on their reserve until the end of the year and letting people bet on their rights to some forked coins and creating a fractional reserve of shadow tokens.

Summary:
You may exchange bitcoins for BCCs and BCUs using the Site’s token manager platform until immediately before Contract Settlement.

Deposit 1 BTC get 1 BCC and 1 BCU then trade them example you can buy BCU for 33 cents if it forks by the end of the year and assuming its valued at more than 33 cents a coin at fork your super rich otherwise by December 31st they will be worthless.

It's free money for them and fun for speculators but I would say its more of a speculation toy the option will likely go to 0 and time value is only 7 months.

If you get 1 BCC and 1 BCU you can also turn them back into a Bitcoin so arbitrage is a play just like a good old havelock investment on Bitcoin Mining Difficulty ^^.

Ok, got it, thanks

If the fork does not happen the price of BCU will go to zero.  Buying BCU is a way for you to bet the fork WILL happen.  If you bet on a horse to win and the horse does not win then you lose your bet.

Same thing here. 

Only buy BCU if you think the fork will happen (or you think you can dump them for a profit on some other sucker that thinks the fork will happen).

If the fork does not happend, those who have BCU, these BCU could not become BTC?

Supose you buy 10 BCU, after december 31st, if the fork doesn't happend, these 10 BCU may become 10 BTC?


Certainly do? Maybe? Certainly don't?

Yes, Bitfinex has started trading these tokens but right now you cannot deposit or withdraw BCC nor BTU tokens which makes them quite sketchy…. There is nothing to back them except for Bitfinex which is probably running on fractional reserve to be honest(most exchanges are).

So BCC + BTU should be around the value of 1 BTC at current prices.

It is a great tool for speculators and traders, especially if they are experienced. However if you are just an average bit coiner then you shouldn’t really use it.

Yeah, but BCU is currently worth significantly less than BCC

Think of them as futures…

You are essentially buying a share of BitFinex’s total bitcoin reserve, and speculating on the bitcoin core: bitcoin unlimited price ratio. Traders love to trade this sort of futures and derivatives these days, personally i don’t trust them.

The price is currently in favor of bitcoin classic which isn’t surprising at all, as bitcoin core still has a lot more nodes right now than bitcoin unlimited.

Boy this is gunna be interesting.

Hard fork has not happened, please  don’t spread any FUD…
It is basically a token just like its own scam token BFX to compensate the losses from the 2016 hack. It does not represent the actual BTU coin or the Bitcoin Core coin.
So right now obviously you cannot withdraw any of these tokens into an actual wallet, because the hard fork has not happened yet.
But you can trade them on their website.

Calm down and relax as this is just a FUD news .For that to happen there must be a hard fork and that never happened and it will not happen just like that,it is just an assumption that the price would be so and so and bitfinex cannot sell something that is not in existence .