Topic: Best country on earth for altcoin mining - share suggestions - page 2. (Read 3157 times)
I've always wanted to visit Argentina. Cold weather (at least in the South or closer to the Andes), cheap electric, lots of beef grown there, and a language that's much easier to learn then most (in my opinion).
I live in Argentina and its really cheap mining here talking in large scales.
we are at the end of the America, we have around the same prices than in USA for the hardware. its free of taxes at import, with just a bit higher VAT, 10.5% for hardware here.
very cold weather in the south, you can choose a nice location like Bariloche, or if you like even more cold in the end of the World Ushuaia, you will find very cheap salaries and rentals for your operations because the inflation.
and talking to electricity that i think its the most important part.
if your consumption its more than 30 MW, around 40 rigs, you can purchase electricity directly to generators.
We have an entity who regulates the national price of the MWh, CAMMESA. http://portalweb.cammesa.com/default.aspx
currently the price its 240 ARS per MWh, thats 0.24 Argentine pesos per KWh, and 17.8 ARS its equivalent to 1 usd, so its 0.0134 per KWh, after that you have to pay carriage from the generator to your local distributor, thats another 0.01 usd per kwh i think, and some lot of taxes, that turn it from 0.03 to 0.04 usd per KWh,
same as china or even cheaper, in fact that's why genesis mining were operating here for some time.
I am building as many rigs i can trying to reach that minimum consumption for purchase in bulk, i have 20 so far..
we are at the end of the America, we have around the same prices than in USA for the hardware. its free of taxes at import, with just a bit higher VAT, 10.5% for hardware here.
very cold weather in the south, you can choose a nice location like Bariloche, or if you like even more cold in the end of the World Ushuaia, you will find very cheap salaries and rentals for your operations because the inflation.
and talking to electricity that i think its the most important part.
if your consumption its more than 30 MW, around 40 rigs, you can purchase electricity directly to generators.
We have an entity who regulates the national price of the MWh, CAMMESA. http://portalweb.cammesa.com/default.aspx
currently the price its 240 ARS per MWh, thats 0.24 Argentine pesos per KWh, and 17.8 ARS its equivalent to 1 usd, so its 0.0134 per KWh, after that you have to pay carriage from the generator to your local distributor, thats another 0.01 usd per kwh i think, and some lot of taxes, that turn it from 0.03 to 0.04 usd per KWh,
same as china or even cheaper, in fact that's why genesis mining were operating here for some time.
I am building as many rigs i can trying to reach that minimum consumption for purchase in bulk, i have 20 so far..
I didn't know Washington State didn't have State Income Tax. Now I want to move. lol Cheap electric, no state tax, cool climate, presumably sparsely populated (if not on the coast at least)? New York city is an albatross around the neck of my home state and it's just dragging all of Upstate NY down into the sewer with it more each year. :/
Yes, it is extremly hard (and expensive) to arrange cooling system in place where even water is an issue. If you compare it to Georgia with this regard, Georgia is definite winner.
However, Washington is something to explore further. What about taxes? Is not it making the project expensive?
Thanks a lot for sharing so many details for all of us.
I presume you mean Kuwait is extremely HOT. It's also dry though so evap cooling would work well - if water is available enough.
There are 3 County PUD in Washington State that offer less than 3c / KWH all costs included rates - Chelan and Douglas counties are close to that on RESIDENTIAL and SMALL business rates, their mid-size and large business rates are less.
Grant county is close to 4.5 for residential/small business, but once you get above 200KW into the large business rate they are in the 3 or under range as well.
These 3 counties offer the lowest rates in the country by quite a bit - the next lowest areas in the US I'm aware of barely dip under 5 cents/KWH for INDUSTRIAL level rates.
All 3 have local power rates subsidised quite a bit, as they all have considerable hydropower via large Columbia River dams and sell off the excess power to outside areas - mostly the Seattle/Tacoma area but at least some as far away as California and they make enough over production costs on those long-term contracts to be able to sell to locals for less than cost of production.
For reference, the Grand Coulee dam is located partly in Grant County, partly in Okanogon County (it dams the Columbia River, which forms the boundary for the 2 counties in that area), but is owned by the Federal Bonneville Power Administration - and provides ZERO power to Grant County as far as I know (it's power output tends to get shipped a lot farther away).
There are quite a few areas that have 1 GB service, or fiber backbones with even higher data rates available throughout the world, it's getting fairly common any more for mid-to-high pop density areas.
All 3 of the Central Washington PUDs mentioned above have a "fiber backbone" that runs alongside their power transmission network with a primary usage intend of remote meter reading.
Access to it is provided to customers via local ISPs and "terminator boxes" that offer 100 Mb Ethernet by default but do have "higher speed" fiber ports available as an option, as well as linking into the power meter(s) for the location the box is at.
However, Washington is something to explore further. What about taxes? Is not it making the project expensive?
Thanks a lot for sharing so many details for all of us.
Really? Washington State can offer under 3 cents/kwh? 
Kuwait is extremely hard.
Kuwait is extremely hard.
I presume you mean Kuwait is extremely HOT. It's also dry though so evap cooling would work well - if water is available enough.
There are 3 County PUD in Washington State that offer less than 3c / KWH all costs included rates - Chelan and Douglas counties are close to that on RESIDENTIAL and SMALL business rates, their mid-size and large business rates are less.
Grant county is close to 4.5 for residential/small business, but once you get above 200KW into the large business rate they are in the 3 or under range as well.
These 3 counties offer the lowest rates in the country by quite a bit - the next lowest areas in the US I'm aware of barely dip under 5 cents/KWH for INDUSTRIAL level rates.
All 3 have local power rates subsidised quite a bit, as they all have considerable hydropower via large Columbia River dams and sell off the excess power to outside areas - mostly the Seattle/Tacoma area but at least some as far away as California and they make enough over production costs on those long-term contracts to be able to sell to locals for less than cost of production.
For reference, the Grand Coulee dam is located partly in Grant County, partly in Okanogon County (it dams the Columbia River, which forms the boundary for the 2 counties in that area), but is owned by the Federal Bonneville Power Administration - and provides ZERO power to Grant County as far as I know (it's power output tends to get shipped a lot farther away).
There are quite a few areas that have 1 GB service, or fiber backbones with even higher data rates available throughout the world, it's getting fairly common any more for mid-to-high pop density areas.
All 3 of the Central Washington PUDs mentioned above have a "fiber backbone" that runs alongside their power transmission network with a primary usage intend of remote meter reading.
Access to it is provided to customers via local ISPs and "terminator boxes" that offer 100 Mb Ethernet by default but do have "higher speed" fiber ports available as an option, as well as linking into the power meter(s) for the location the box is at.
Washington has no income tax (possible exception for Seattle, but that recent city ordinance is being legally challenged on the basis that it violates STATE law and does not apply to the 3 counties in question anyway).
You still have to pay Federal taxes, but you're going to run into that anywhere in the US.
Sales tax is kinda high, but no worse than many other states - I was paying the same sales tax rate when I was in Iowa due to a "local city sales tax" where I was living.
Otherwise, no clue what you might be referring to on the "What about taxes?" question.
Going by "country wide rates" doesn't WORK, too many large and even some mid-size and small countries have VARIABLE rates depending on where you are IN the country.
The USA for example has rates that vary from a hair under 3 cents/kwh to over 30 (THIRTY) cents/kwh (I think Hawaii might be higher than that, but California gets to around 30 in at least some areas).
Heck, the US has fairly wide variations within a STATE in most cases.
Didn't KNC base their mining operations in Sweden or Norway somewhere, due to low hydropower cost + cool climate?
No, never heard.
How hear could be used for e.g. laundry?
We are speaking for mega mining datacenters which as you can imaigen is located in big seperate building specially built for servers and necessary equipment.
No, do you? Not much from what ive heard. The heat could used for home heating and laundry too.
How hear could be used for e.g. laundry?
We are speaking for mega mining datacenters which as you can imaigen is located in big seperate building specially built for servers and necessary equipment.
Do you know what is electricity price there?
Iceland - cheap or free geothermal power generation and cold climate for free cooling
No, do you? Not much from what ive heard. The heat could used for home heating and laundry too.
For drying clothes , sorry I thought this was a home setup
You might find this link for electricity and natural gas prices interesting. http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/Energy_price_statistics
Bulgaria does look like a winner for electric costs based on what I just read there. I was curious about the costs in Romania, since I lived there for a few years (although not recently). About a decade ago Romania was ranked as the #3 country in the world for Hackers, right after the USA and China. Considering that it's a country with a mere ~21 million population I think that's pretty good evidence of the high technical savvy of the younger generations there. I know that crypto is quite popular there and you would easily find lots of people with some experience in it. The downside is that the country is extremely corrupt and the government is inept as well as being as crooked as a dog's hind leg. Electricity is quite cheap (industrial rates in particular), goods are accessible if you have the money to buy them, internet is fast, cheap and stable, and if you were in a city with a higher elevation (Brasov or Cluj-Napoca come to mind) the summer temperatures aren't that bad.
Bulgaria does look like a winner for electric costs based on what I just read there. I was curious about the costs in Romania, since I lived there for a few years (although not recently). About a decade ago Romania was ranked as the #3 country in the world for Hackers, right after the USA and China. Considering that it's a country with a mere ~21 million population I think that's pretty good evidence of the high technical savvy of the younger generations there. I know that crypto is quite popular there and you would easily find lots of people with some experience in it. The downside is that the country is extremely corrupt and the government is inept as well as being as crooked as a dog's hind leg. Electricity is quite cheap (industrial rates in particular), goods are accessible if you have the money to buy them, internet is fast, cheap and stable, and if you were in a city with a higher elevation (Brasov or Cluj-Napoca come to mind) the summer temperatures aren't that bad.
Do you know what is electricity price there?
Iceland - cheap or free geothermal power generation and cold climate for free cooling
$0.055
True. That's why we are doing it in Georgia first; and meanwhile we have to decide either re-invest in Georgia or invest in other country.
Post soviet countries are mostly best for mining. Even in some of those countries governments provide free electricity for the citizens. And if you have opportunity to bring hardwares from dubai. Everything may be very cheap and nice.
I dont know about georgia so much but i lived in several post soviet countries and they mostly do not receive any bill at all. Even in one of them government gives free gasoline to the citizen that have car every 3 months.
Very true.
Bulgaria yes is an interesting option.
Thanks for compliments to my country. According to Geo-Greak myth: Jason and Argonauts adored Georgia and they did steal Golden Fleece from Colchis with which local people were collecting gold in rivers 
We love Greek people and cannot flight to return Golden Fleece black; that's why in 2017 we created GFL (Golden Fleece) token to mine the altcoin (which nowadays is similar to collecting gold in rivers centuries ago)
Bulgaria yes is an interesting option.
Thanks for compliments to my country. According to Geo-Greak myth: Jason and Argonauts adored Georgia and they did steal Golden Fleece from Colchis with which local people were collecting gold in rivers
We love Greek people and cannot flight to return Golden Fleece black; that's why in 2017 we created GFL (Golden Fleece) token to mine the altcoin (which nowadays is similar to collecting gold in rivers centuries ago) China, former Soviet Union, former Warsaw pact countries.
mining in EU is tough - electricity prices are high, taxes are high cost of living is high...
Baltic countries could be interesting, probably Estonia, having mostly friendly approach to crypto and since they have plenty of power from their dirty oil shale.
Lithuania is not a good option since the closure of their nuclear power station they depend on imports, maybe Latvia - dunno for sure.
I thought Bulgaria is good and people here confirm.
Georgia is awesome though, I agree on that.
mining in EU is tough - electricity prices are high, taxes are high cost of living is high...
Baltic countries could be interesting, probably Estonia, having mostly friendly approach to crypto and since they have plenty of power from their dirty oil shale.
Lithuania is not a good option since the closure of their nuclear power station they depend on imports, maybe Latvia - dunno for sure.
I thought Bulgaria is good and people here confirm.
Georgia is awesome though, I agree on that.
China, former Soviet Union, former Warsaw pact countries.
mining in EU is tough - electricity prices are high, taxes are high cost of living is high...
Baltic countries could be interesting, probably Estonia, having mostly friendly approach to crypto and since they have plenty of power from their dirty oil shale.
Lithuania is not a good option since the closure of their nuclear power station they depend on imports, maybe Latvia - dunno for sure.
I thought Bulgaria is good and people here confirm.
Georgia is awesome though, I agree on that.
mining in EU is tough - electricity prices are high, taxes are high cost of living is high...
Baltic countries could be interesting, probably Estonia, having mostly friendly approach to crypto and since they have plenty of power from their dirty oil shale.
Lithuania is not a good option since the closure of their nuclear power station they depend on imports, maybe Latvia - dunno for sure.
I thought Bulgaria is good and people here confirm.
Georgia is awesome though, I agree on that.
We are not looking for investment partners so far in other countries but we rather need to explore market/s and study different options. Our intention is to be major investor using funds generated from Golden Fleece project.
That said, if we identify credible partner who will join our ICO for Golden Fleece (GFL) and we jointly work to raise funds, then we can develop mining facility in both countries simultaneously; e.g. we issued non-minable 100ml GFL coins and we may agree with partner to allocate 5 to 10 ml GFL for investment in mining facility of partner's country. Our ICO and price estimates could be found here http://goldenfleece.co/index.php/ico-details/
Yes, I live in the country, I mine on a very small scale, and I have a nice and completely unrelated business of my own. I've shared the details, because the country is often overlooked in favor of bigger economies in the region, which is strange, considering it's one of the top countries in the world for starting and running a business. It is not, however, among the top countries for doing business because of the state of the local economy, but you couldn't care less about that, as you are not going to sell anything here. IMO large scale investments need stable environment, and a country which is part both of EU and NATO, with fixed currency (and is expected to adopt the Euro in few years) that has among the best IT infrastructures in the world, simple tax policy, very low taxes and employee expenses, is as good as it gets.
That said, if we identify credible partner who will join our ICO for Golden Fleece (GFL) and we jointly work to raise funds, then we can develop mining facility in both countries simultaneously; e.g. we issued non-minable 100ml GFL coins and we may agree with partner to allocate 5 to 10 ml GFL for investment in mining facility of partner's country. Our ICO and price estimates could be found here http://goldenfleece.co/index.php/ico-details/
Any suggestion for possible partners in Bulgaria to go through financial figures and partnership? Send us private message.
I'm not into that, so can't help you with investment partner (not to mention anyone I could think of would have been approached already, I guess). If you are just looking for easier way in, the procedure for incorporation here is simple and doesn't even take a day, so I'd avoid having any Bulgarian partners if they are not in with half of the money. Or you can try asking the company I mentioned, since they would probably know whomever is interested in larger scale mining.Yes, I live in the country, I mine on a very small scale, and I have a nice and completely unrelated business of my own. I've shared the details, because the country is often overlooked in favor of bigger economies in the region, which is strange, considering it's one of the top countries in the world for starting and running a business. It is not, however, among the top countries for doing business because of the state of the local economy, but you couldn't care less about that, as you are not going to sell anything here. IMO large scale investments need stable environment, and a country which is part both of EU and NATO, with fixed currency (and is expected to adopt the Euro in few years) that has among the best IT infrastructures in the world, simple tax policy, very low taxes and employee expenses, is as good as it gets.
Any suggestion for possible partners in Bulgaria to go through financial figures and partnership? Send us private message.
I'm not into that, so can't help you with investment partner (not to mention anyone I could think of would have been approached already, I guess). If you are just looking for easier way in, the procedure for incorporation here is simple and doesn't even take a day, so I'd avoid having any Bulgarian partners if they are not in with half of the money. Or you can try asking the company I mentioned, since they would probably know whomever is interested in larger scale mining.Yes, I live in the country, I mine on a very small scale, and I have a nice and completely unrelated business of my own. I've shared the details, because the country is often overlooked in favor of bigger economies in the region, which is strange, considering it's one of the top countries in the world for starting and running a business. It is not, however, among the top countries for doing business because of the state of the local economy, but you couldn't care less about that, as you are not going to sell anything here. IMO large scale investments need stable environment, and a country which is part both of EU and NATO, with fixed currency (and is expected to adopt the Euro in few years) that has among the best IT infrastructures in the world, simple tax policy, very low taxes and employee expenses, is as good as it gets.
Of course, there are many things which matter, but electricity is big element 
That's why we chose Georgia for our first mega project (absolutely attractive for altcoing mining), not only because this the land of Colchis and is our motherland
There are three big blockchain servers located in Georgia, run by Bitfury; even the State Registry of property/business is using their blockchain. Well, anyway, blockchain is different story then mining but linked
Electricity price is one parameter, but then there's taxes (not all countries treat revenues from cryptos the same way), internet connection stability, electric grid stability, summer temperature, hardware price (VAT etc.)...all kinds of things.
In other words, if you pay 1ct/kW but all the rest is shit, it's not worth it
That's why we chose Georgia for our first mega project (absolutely attractive for altcoing mining), not only because this the land of Colchis and is our motherland
There are three big blockchain servers located in Georgia, run by Bitfury; even the State Registry of property/business is using their blockchain. Well, anyway, blockchain is different story then mining but linked
china electricity prices are very low and maybe New zealand.
European zone is very expensive. Dont run miner if u are living in there.
European zone is very expensive. Dont run miner if u are living in there.
Electricity price is one parameter, but then there's taxes (not all countries treat revenues from cryptos the same way), internet connection stability, electric grid stability, summer temperature, hardware price (VAT etc.)...all kinds of things.
In other words, if you pay 1ct/kW but all the rest is shit, it's not worth it
Yes, good option. Especially considering that "main" internet cable to Georgia across the Black Sea from Europe comes exactly from Bulgaria.
Any suggestion for possible partners in Bulgaria to go through financial figures and partnership? Send us private message.
Serbia, Bulgaria and Moldova looks interesting for Golden Fleece considering the geographical location; but as we all know in this era of technology (still we are in e-stone age) distance does not matter.
We are discussing joint project with Singapore based partner as well; but again that said top top top priority is to make successful our ICO that starts on 15 August!
Any suggestion for possible partners in Bulgaria to go through financial figures and partnership? Send us private message.
Serbia, Bulgaria and Moldova looks interesting for Golden Fleece considering the geographical location; but as we all know in this era of technology (still we are in e-stone age) distance does not matter.
We are discussing joint project with Singapore based partner as well; but again that said top top top priority is to make successful our ICO that starts on 15 August!
Georgia is close to Bulgaria
So if possible op should look for a backup site there.
So if possible op should look for a backup site there.
Georgia is close to Bulgaria
So if possible op should look for a backup site there.
So if possible op should look for a backup site there.
china electricity prices are very low and maybe New zealand.
European zone is very expensive. Dont run miner if u are living in there.
European zone is very expensive. Dont run miner if u are living in there.
Electricity price is one parameter, but then there's taxes (not all countries treat revenues from cryptos the same way), internet connection stability, electric grid stability, summer temperature, hardware price (VAT etc.)...all kinds of things.
In other words, if you pay 1ct/kW but all the rest is shit, it's not worth it
Bulgaria:
- it's in EU, so transfers FROM SEPA-enabled exchanges are cheap (depends on the bank you use, outgoing are not that cheap, but there are banks using SEPA, like UniCredit, and most others also allow SEPA if you go in their office; or you can use TransferWise for moving money)
- EU VAT deductable, so you can pay it here whenever something goes out of your inventory
- income and corporate tax is flat 10% if your money come here. If not - you don't care.
- no requirement to have anyone working in the company as you can work in it as a manager on a contract
- electricity base cost is about than 0.09 EUR, with company contract you can get much lower and deduct VAT
- cheap property to rent or buy
- cheap labor if you want people working on it
- some PC hardware stores already specialized in building mining rigs (hardwareBG.com) almost en masse, already built few larger projects
- cheap security - you can get it covered for literally few eur per month, depending on the scale, or you can just get few ex-cops for like 250 EUR a month
- cheap and very reliable internet connections, you can get optic and a mobile cell backup for few euros a month
- cheap accounting, a contract is 75 eur a month and they would do everything for you - you just have to send them any invoices, etc.
- very, very, very low chance on govt bullies, as they don't get anything high-tech at all. Which is why the IT is the only branch in the country that develops so well
- the country is stable, despite changing governments (well, last times it was just the same party coming back, as much as we hate it)
- higher temperatures only mid-summer, but on a large scale you'd use combined cooling solutions anyway
.
Not sure if you want to reside here, but if this is the case - it's among the cheapest countries in Europe. Low crime rate too.
Not really much going on government level in regards of cryptocurrency, old school, so they don't get it. If anything they would impose same tax, but it's really hard to ever force you to declare unless you fill a bank account with transfers from exchanges...
- it's in EU, so transfers FROM SEPA-enabled exchanges are cheap (depends on the bank you use, outgoing are not that cheap, but there are banks using SEPA, like UniCredit, and most others also allow SEPA if you go in their office; or you can use TransferWise for moving money)
- EU VAT deductable, so you can pay it here whenever something goes out of your inventory
- income and corporate tax is flat 10% if your money come here. If not - you don't care.
- no requirement to have anyone working in the company as you can work in it as a manager on a contract
- electricity base cost is about than 0.09 EUR, with company contract you can get much lower and deduct VAT
- cheap property to rent or buy
- cheap labor if you want people working on it
- some PC hardware stores already specialized in building mining rigs (hardwareBG.com) almost en masse, already built few larger projects
- cheap security - you can get it covered for literally few eur per month, depending on the scale, or you can just get few ex-cops for like 250 EUR a month
- cheap and very reliable internet connections, you can get optic and a mobile cell backup for few euros a month
- cheap accounting, a contract is 75 eur a month and they would do everything for you - you just have to send them any invoices, etc.
- very, very, very low chance on govt bullies, as they don't get anything high-tech at all. Which is why the IT is the only branch in the country that develops so well
- the country is stable, despite changing governments (well, last times it was just the same party coming back, as much as we hate it)
- higher temperatures only mid-summer, but on a large scale you'd use combined cooling solutions anyway
.
Not sure if you want to reside here, but if this is the case - it's among the cheapest countries in Europe. Low crime rate too.
Not really much going on government level in regards of cryptocurrency, old school, so they don't get it. If anything they would impose same tax, but it's really hard to ever force you to declare unless you fill a bank account with transfers from exchanges...
Absolutley agree. But we focus now on our ICO and let's see how it goes http://goldenfleece.co/index.php/ico-details/
We have our ICO dedicated topic seperatly and will be greatful if you visit and share your thought there on our project. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2040790.new#new
I do not want to bother people too much speaking on our project in this window.
It makes sense to be multinational . Simple reason is a country may destabilize and having a second country gives you backup.
Obviously this is more true for a larger company. You mention you may have as much as 50 million to invest So I would say that is big enough to consider 2 locations each one in a different country.
A second comment on being diverse would be to say have some BTC mining gear. Avalon 741's are reliable and with dirt cheap power 5 cents or less having 5 or 10 % of your gear with them gives you a backup if alt coins have a massive crash.
If alt coins were to crash BTC could explode in value so 40 million in alt coin gear and 10 million in btc gear may be a good mix for you.
We have our ICO dedicated topic seperatly and will be greatful if you visit and share your thought there on our project. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2040790.new#new
I do not want to bother people too much speaking on our project in this window.
True. That's why we are doing it in Georgia first; and meanwhile we have to decide either re-invest in Georgia or invest in other country.
Post soviet countries are mostly best for mining. Even in some of those countries governments provide free electricity for the citizens. And if you have opportunity to bring hardwares from dubai. Everything may be very cheap and nice.
It makes sense to be multinational . Simple reason is a country may destabilize and having a second country gives you backup.
Obviously this is more true for a larger company. You mention you may have as much as 50 million to invest So I would say that is big enough to consider 2 locations each one in a different country.
A second comment on being diverse would be to say have some BTC mining gear. Avalon 741's are reliable and with dirt cheap power 5 cents or less having 5 or 10 % of your gear with them gives you a backup if alt coins have a massive crash.
If alt coins were to crash BTC could explode in value so 40 million in alt coin gear and 10 million in btc gear may be a good mix for you.
No, never heard.
How hear could be used for e.g. laundry?
We are speaking for mega mining datacenters which as you can imaigen is located in big seperate building specially built for servers and necessary equipment.
No, do you? Not much from what ive heard. The heat could used for home heating and laundry too.
How hear could be used for e.g. laundry?
We are speaking for mega mining datacenters which as you can imaigen is located in big seperate building specially built for servers and necessary equipment.
Do you know what is electricity price there?
Iceland - cheap or free geothermal power generation and cold climate for free cooling
No, do you? Not much from what ive heard. The heat could used for home heating and laundry too.
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