Isn't it a bit unfair that VIR is only moving very slowly (average of the last 30(?) days) while traders can act much faster?
While Bitcoin did rise from 50 to 60 USD I earned ~2% on my USD deposit in interest. If I don't (auto)lend out for VIR, I have a hard time to keep up with demand, since traders borrow, wait for a 5% rise (in these crazy times that seems to be quite easy) and then exit the position again. If I make sure money is put up as fast as possible for VIR, I am lending out for nearly the cheapest rates possible atm., if I set a percentage I would have to adapt it to the market from time to time to stay attractive...
The current rush will drive up VIR, yes, but if there's a crash afterwards a high VIR doesn't help me at all because my offers then just won't be taken (like in the BTC lending market atm. - "Short your coins, weekend is coming" by the way!) and the high VIR will actually do more harm than good.
I understand I complain on a high level (at least no matter in which way the rate moves, I'm kinda guaranteed to get a share of the profit, as I hold USD and BTC) but slowly adapting VIR rates are not very nice to lenders in a high demand scenario and even worse in low demand. Maybe there can be a measurement of volatility that factors in to how many days are considered for the VIR? If volatility is high, I'd expect the VIR to go up much higher than it currently is.
Real world number time:
APRs for the last 5 days as lender in the USD market (you can check yourself on bitcoincharts how much traders made on that money...), yesterday on top, then day before yesterday etc.:
177,2044
130,2016
125,0596
127,7510
141,9950
Looks impressive, right? Well, all in all it's a ~2% increase so far which is nice, but there was much higher demand for sometimes much higher rates (today I rarely saw demand to borrow for less than 150%). If I took one of these 150% offers though, I risk: Pulling down VIR even more, under-/overselling the market after the loan ends (which is NOT predictable at all since traders get bust or exit their position to take their profit/loss randomly) or (if I want to look how offers look after I get the money back, to maybe grab a better rate) to have stale money lying around.
Maybe my thoughts on the topic are all wrong though and there are convincing reasons (other than to protect traders from sudden VIR spikes) to keep VIR rather smooth?
Topic: [BETA]Bitfinex.com first Bitcoin P2P lending platform for leverage trading - page 46. (Read 137528 times)
March 20, 2013, 06:05:03 PM
March 20, 2013, 04:34:51 PM
BTW i set this chat now http://us10.chatzy.com/21801378841161 i will be there for some more hours if anyone wants to chat
I like how quickly you answer questions. Why is this ridiculous loan offer at the top?
troll loan and also a quick way to see how much USD is on the side line 
March 20, 2013, 04:04:13 PM
I like how quickly you answer questions. Why is this ridiculous loan offer at the top?
USD Loan demand
Minimum lending time (days) Rate (% per 365 days) * Amount Demand count
333 333333.0% 10000.0 1
365 152.0% 6000.0 10
30 150.0% 9900.0 1
90 122.0% 5330.36 6
USD Loan demand
Minimum lending time (days) Rate (% per 365 days) * Amount Demand count
333 333333.0% 10000.0 1
365 152.0% 6000.0 10
30 150.0% 9900.0 1
90 122.0% 5330.36 6
March 20, 2013, 03:45:42 PM
Why did all but 1 of the loan offers suddenly disappear?
someone took them (happen allot during price spikes) or got cancelled (not likely) March 20, 2013, 03:43:28 PM
Why did all but 1 of the loan offers suddenly disappear?
March 20, 2013, 03:18:56 PM
If I have a loan offer out, and then it gets partially filled am I earning interest that day on the part partially filled?
yesIf I then cancel the loan does the part that is partially borrowed stay lent out?
yes March 20, 2013, 03:15:16 PM
If I have a loan offer out, and then it gets partially filled am I earning interest that day on the part partially filled?
If I then cancel the loan does the part that is partially borrowed stay lent out? I might want to adjust the rate on the rest of it based on market conditions without canceling the portion lent out.
If I then cancel the loan does the part that is partially borrowed stay lent out? I might want to adjust the rate on the rest of it based on market conditions without canceling the portion lent out.
March 19, 2013, 09:08:35 PM
Ah, I see, thank you.
March 19, 2013, 09:02:16 PM
I want to know what triggers margin calls under gox lag condition
nothing, margin calls /FE wait for mtgox But, I got a margin call the other day and gox price didn't spike enough to trigger it. Is this the recent change that Raphael mentioned?
March 19, 2013, 08:47:05 PM
I want to know what triggers margin calls under gox lag condition
nothing, margin calls /FE wait for mtgox But, I got a margin call the other day and gox price didn't spike enough to trigger it. Is this the recent change that Raphael mentioned?
March 19, 2013, 08:39:43 PM
I want to know what triggers margin calls under gox lag condition
nothing, margin calls /FE wait for mtgox March 19, 2013, 08:37:42 PM
Is there anyway to see the historical buy/sell prices for the Bitfinex level 1 orderbook? It would be nice to be able to see what the price is spiking too once MtGox is lagged out.
https://bitfinex.com/pages/public_log
ppl so far did not go bannanas and buy/sell when mtgox is lagging seams most ppl follow the mtgox lagging price
This only shows me what price the orders were executed at. It's my understanding that positions are forced closed by the current buy/sell price. So someone removing their ask could cause a margin call, am I correct? I want to be able to determine the probability of a margin call in the gox lag condition.
I don't want to know where they goto. I want to know what triggers margin calls under gox lag condition, is it the current buy/sell price on bfx level 1 orderbook. And, if so, where can I see historical data for highest bid and lowest ask price in order to see the volatility and estimate the risk.
March 19, 2013, 07:43:48 PM
Is there anyway to see the historical buy/sell prices for the Bitfinex level 1 orderbook? It would be nice to be able to see what the price is spiking too once MtGox is lagged out.
https://bitfinex.com/pages/public_log
ppl so far did not go bannanas and buy/sell when mtgox is lagging seams most ppl follow the mtgox lagging price
This only shows me what price the orders were executed at. It's my understanding that positions are forced closed by the current buy/sell price. So someone removing their ask could cause a margin call, am I correct? I want to be able to determine the probability of a margin call in the gox lag condition.
March 19, 2013, 07:19:55 PM
Is there anyway to see the historical buy/sell prices for the Bitfinex level 1 orderbook? It would be nice to be able to see what the price is spiking too once MtGox is lagged out.
https://bitfinex.com/pages/public_log
ppl so far did not go bannanas and buy/sell when mtgox is lagging seams most ppl follow the mtgox lagging price
This only shows me what price the orders were executed at. It's my understanding that positions are forced closed by the current buy/sell price. So someone removing their ask could cause a margin call, am I correct? I want to be able to determine the probability of a margin call in the gox lag condition.
March 19, 2013, 06:09:50 PM
Is there anyway to see the historical buy/sell prices for the Bitfinex level 1 orderbook? It would be nice to be able to see what the price is spiking too once MtGox is lagged out.
https://bitfinex.com/pages/public_log
ppl so far did not go bannanas and buy/sell when mtgox is lagging seams most ppl follow the mtgox lagging price
March 19, 2013, 06:02:35 PM
Is there anyway to see the historical buy/sell prices for the Bitfinex level 1 orderbook? It would be nice to be able to see what the price is spiking too once MtGox is lagged out.
March 19, 2013, 12:02:53 PM
Huge jumps as far as i see it - and it only needs to jump shortly in the wrong direction to kill your position, if you're too greedy and keep too little balance as a cushion...
Seems like either a big trader or a lot of smaller ones got a bloody nose. On the other hand a ~800k USD buy at MtGox AFTER the rally of the last few days was not something too predictable. Maybe they'll learn now and be a bit more careful?
Seems like either a big trader or a lot of smaller ones got a bloody nose. On the other hand a ~800k USD buy at MtGox AFTER the rally of the last few days was not something too predictable. Maybe they'll learn now and be a bit more careful?
March 19, 2013, 11:31:27 AM
To everyone,
I'd like to point out that while the price is increasing, the depth is very thin. So don't hesitate to take profit
Raphael
Nobody went broke taking profits! I'd like to point out that while the price is increasing, the depth is very thin. So don't hesitate to take profit
Raphael
allot of forced executed https://bitfinex.com/pages/public_log
Code:
FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.434(-10.68) -10.68 2 minutes ago
29349 FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.434(-100.0) -100.0 2 minutes ago
29348 FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.434(-100.0) -100.0 2 minutes ago
29347 FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.434(-100.0) -100.0 2 minutes ago
29345 FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.4337(-40.17) -40.17 2 minutes ago
29352 EXECUTED @ 56.8873(0.1) 0.1 2 minutes ago
29344 FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.4427(-100.0) -100.0 3 minutes ago
29342 FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.4309(-100.0) -100.0 3 minutes ago
29340 FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.4309(-27.63) -27.63 3 minutes ago
29339 FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.4309(-100.0) -100.0 3 minutes ago
29338 FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.4309(-100.0) -100.0 3 minutes ago
29337 FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.4309(-100.0) -100.0 3 minutes ago
29346 EXECUTED @ 56.8991(1.0) 1.0 3 minutes ago
29335 FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.4309(-100.0) -100.0 3 minutes ago
29230 EXECUTED @ 55.5501(2.0) 2.0 3 minutes ago
29334 FORCED EXECUTED @ 55.4283(-98.0): was FORCED PARTIALLY FILLED @ 55.5501(-2.0) -100.0 3 minutes ago
29333 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.59(-100.0) -100.0 3 minutes ago
29343 EXECUTED @ 56.59(100.0) 100.0 3 minutes ago
29341 EXECUTED @ 56.241(-1.33): was PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.581(-12.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4911(-9.65),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.491(-5.31),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.491(-18.26),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4115(-1.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.3959(-0.08),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.31 -50.0 3 minutes ago
29331 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.142(-13.8): was FORCED PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.581(-12.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4911(-9.65),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.491(-5.31),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.491(-18.26),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4115(-1.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.3959(-0.08),PARTIALLY -100.0 3 minutes ago
29330 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.4906(-15.04): was FORCED PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.5806(-12.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4906(-9.65),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4906(-5.31) -42.0 4 minutes ago
29329 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.1416(-13.8): was FORCED PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.5806(-12.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4906(-9.65),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4906(-5.31),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4906(-18.26),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4111(-1.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.3955(-0.08),PARTIA -100.0 4 minutes ago
29328 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.142(-13.8): was FORCED PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.581(-12.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4911(-9.65),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4911(-5.31),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.491(-18.26),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4115(-1.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.3959(-0.08),PARTIALLY -100.0 4 minutes ago
29327 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.491(-13.04): was FORCED PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.581(-12.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4911(-9.65),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4911(-5.31) -40.0 4 minutes ago
29326 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.581(-2.0) -2.0 4 minutes ago
29325 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.1409(-13.8): was FORCED PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.5799(-12.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4899(-9.65),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4899(-5.31),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4899(-18.26),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4104(-1.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.3948(-0.08),PARTIA -100.0 4 minutes ago
29336 EXECUTED @ 56.5824(-1.0) -1.0 4 minutes ago
29324 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.1434(-13.8): was FORCED PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.5824(-12.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4925(-9.65),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4925(-5.31),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4924(-18.26),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4129(-1.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.3973(-0.08),PARTIA -100.0 4 minutes ago
29323 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.1402(-13.8): was FORCED PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.5792(-12.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4893(-9.65),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4892(-5.31),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4892(-18.26),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4097(-1.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.3941(-0.08),PARTIA -100.0 4 minutes ago
29322 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.1402(-13.8): was FORCED PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.5792(-12.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4893(-9.65),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4892(-5.31),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4892(-18.26),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4097(-1.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.3941(-0.08),PARTIA -100.0 4 minutes ago
29321 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.1447(-13.8): was FORCED PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.5837(-12.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4938(-9.65),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4937(-5.31),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4937(-18.26),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4142(-1.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.3986(-0.08),PARTIA -100.0 4 minutes ago
29320 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.1447(-13.8): was FORCED PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.5837(-12.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4938(-9.65),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4937(-5.31),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4937(-18.26),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.4142(-1.0),PARTIALLY FILLED @ 56.3986(-0.08),PARTIA -100.0 5 minutes ago
29319 FORCED EXECUTED @ 56.5837(-0.2) -0.2 5 minutes ago
March 19, 2013, 11:30:01 AM
Someone tried to borrow quite a few USD at 99999%... 
I should keep some reserves for such opportunities of squeezing someone who thinks he's smart!
i think he clicked the wrong button and he wanted to lend I should keep some reserves for such opportunities of squeezing someone who thinks he's smart!
March 19, 2013, 11:21:37 AM
Someone tried to borrow quite a few USD at 99999%...
I should keep some reserves for such opportunities of squeezing someone who thinks he's smart!
I should keep some reserves for such opportunities of squeezing someone who thinks he's smart!
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