Bitcoin and Micropayments - page 2. | Bitcointalksearch.org

Melbustus

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Quote from: evoorhees on July 22, 2011, 10:01:46 PM

Quote from: a63ntsm1th on July 22, 2011, 09:17:32 PM

I also have questions regarding micro-payment and transaction fees. I havent really been able to find a good source of information as to how transaction fees are calculated.

Transaction fees aren't "calculated." They are determined by the sender of a payment. When you send a bitcoin (or fraction of one) you may opt to pay a transaction fee and you set the fee.

Caveats:
- Some client versions set a mandatory minimum fee per kb of the transaction size. The most recent client version sets this minimum at .0005 btc per kilobyte I believe, and most transfers are 1kb. The older client sets the minimum at .01 btc... and this obviously causes problems for people who haven't upgraded.

- If you use some online wallets (like instawallet or mybitcoin) it appears that you can send btc without any transaction fee. I have done this many times.

All you really need to understand, is that fees tend to be voluntary, but it is smart to include a fee in order to have your transaction processed in a reasonable amount of time. As the market matures, the fee required for a quick transfer will continually fall due to competition. Short term, due to some client issues, some people are paying fees higher than they need/want to.

Hope that clears it up! =)

That probably clears up some of the other questions in this thread, by not my original one. Don't we still have an issue longer-term with feasibility of micro-transactions under bitcoin due to the fact that fees will likely have to a fairly high percentage of tiny transactions in order to get them processed in a reasonable amount of time?

ctoon6

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need a client patch that allows coins to be send for free.

evoorhees

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Democracy is the original 51% attack

Quote from: a63ntsm1th on July 22, 2011, 09:17:32 PM

I also have questions regarding micro-payment and transaction fees. I havent really been able to find a good source of information as to how transaction fees are calculated.

Transaction fees aren't "calculated." They are determined by the sender of a payment. When you send a bitcoin (or fraction of one) you may opt to pay a transaction fee and you set the fee.

Caveats:
- Some client versions set a mandatory minimum fee per kb of the transaction size. The most recent client version sets this minimum at .0005 btc per kilobyte I believe, and most transfers are 1kb. The older client sets the minimum at .01 btc... and this obviously causes problems for people who haven't upgraded.

- If you use some online wallets (like instawallet or mybitcoin) it appears that you can send btc without any transaction fee. I have done this many times.

All you really need to understand, is that fees tend to be voluntary, but it is smart to include a fee in order to have your transaction processed in a reasonable amount of time. As the market matures, the fee required for a quick transfer will continually fall due to competition. Short term, due to some client issues, some people are paying fees higher than they need/want to.

Hope that clears it up! =)

BookofNick

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Quote from: a63ntsm1th on July 22, 2011, 09:17:32 PM

I also have questions regarding micro-payment and transaction fees. I havent really been able to find a good source of information as to how transaction fees are calculated.

As an entrepreneur I am doing feasibility studies for several bitcoin business ideas. In doing these studies I have tried to anticipate the future value of bitcoins and several models I have used end up with bitcoins being worth easily close to 1 million current US dollars each.

If bitcoins gained enough traction to become this valuable, the term micro transaction might have different meaning all together as you would need to transfer just 1 millionth of a coin to buy a coffee.

Im sure this is adressed somewhere, does anyone have any links?

I'm not sure Bitcoin at 1 million USD is good planning. If that was your business model, then just buy 1 Bitcoin, sit back and relax and become a millionaire.

Value increases take time and infastructure. I think a more realistic target, if Bitcoin catches on, is $100 or so in the next couple years.

a63ntsm1th

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Merit: 11

I also have questions regarding micro-payment and transaction fees. I havent really been able to find a good source of information as to how transaction fees are calculated.

As an entrepreneur I am doing feasibility studies for several bitcoin business ideas. In doing these studies I have tried to anticipate the future value of bitcoins and several models I have used end up with bitcoins being worth easily close to 1 million current US dollars each.

If bitcoins gained enough traction to become this valuable, the term micro transaction might have different meaning all together as you would need to transfer just 1 millionth of a coin to buy a coffee.

Im sure this is adressed somewhere, does anyone have any links?

BookofNick

full member

Activity: 319

Merit: 116

Yes, the current fees are a problem. I can't send 0.001 Bitcoins to you at the moment. It's impossible. I'm not worried, though. When BTC price gets that high, it's a problem I'd like to have. And one I think will be solved.

julz

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I'm concerned that the high fees for microtransactions will impede the distribution of bitcoin and limit it's application.

Why can't some portion of the fees for microtransactions be paid in a cryptographic 'proof of recent work'?
(prove your client has done x seconds of calculations, after some recent block)

At the moment the fees aren't as a percent of transaction value. By shifting to requiring part of the fee to be paid in computational work, and the rest as a percentage fee rather than an absolute - it makes spamming the network impractical, and fees fair for low values.

Melbustus

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One of the potential benefits of bitcoin is in enabling cost-effective micropayments. At least, in theory. In practice, will transaction fees have to evolve to the point where they make micropayments just as infeasible as they are today? That is, when there's little new-coin reward for mining a block and transaction volume is high (causing fees to be non-trivial), will transaction fees be to high to send micropayments without losing a huge percentage of the payment?

Topic: Bitcoin and Micropayments - page 2. (Read 2877 times)