Bitcoin becomes priority alternative when cash fails - page 2.

pawanjain

hero member

Activity: 2702

Merit: 716

Nothing lasts forever

Quote from: noorman0 on March 16, 2022, 12:50:52 PM

Actually this epic moment happened in Ukraine, I don't know how difficult it is to get cash there (even using e-money). Someone sells "a Legendary Car" with bitcoin. View more...

Another milestone that bitcoin really serves as an alternative currency especially in times of urgency, bitcoin is really valuable for someone to survive. Because urgent situations are not just about war, calamities can also have more severe repercussions. I think this is a perfect consideration for any government not to be too strict on bitcoin regulations.

(The point of this thread is not about Ukraine situations specifically, but to the experiences of the people on this story.)

bitcoin has proved time over time that it is more than just a cryptocurrency. It is something that people trust at time of emergencies.
It is more like a safe haven for many people and as time goes by more number of people will start believing bitcoin for what it is and what value it brings to them.
US has also started the preparation of regulating cryptocurrencies. Many other countries have also realized the fact that its impossible to completely ban cryptocurrencies so why not regulate it instead.
Good times are only getting started.

jaberwock

legendary

Activity: 2660

Merit: 1074

Quote from: AmoreJaz on March 19, 2022, 04:22:20 PM

this is still the setback of crypto, you can't easily use it as direct payment to your local shops or merchants. so you still need to convert your crypto to your fiat if you want to spend it. but i do agree, if you have the skills, you can really earn good money via this industry. you just know how to. nowadays, freelancers are growing in numbers because we are discovering a lot of jobs that you can do at the comfort of your home. this has been boosted by this pandemic when most of us are forced to do your work at home as much as possible.
but still, even if you have crypto willing to spend for your daily needs, you can't find a lot of these shops to accept crypto. this i think is still work-in-progress, as more merchants are now trying to integrate crypto in their payment system as part of becoming more digital or additional options to their consumers..

You can actually. In El Salvador they can now use their crypto directly for buying anything locally, that is because cryptos on their country is now a legal tender. We just need to wait though for our country to become one of it. For sure it will happen to other countries too soon and not just on the El Salvador.

For countries that only adopted bitcoin normally, why can't they use a service that converts crypto to fiat on their shop so that people that prefers crypto can still use their cryptos directly? I think that was still allowed. If they didn't do it yet, your best chance to spend your crypto is via online shops. There are have lots of them now.

Wind_FURY

legendary

Activity: 2898

Merit: 1823

Quote from: stompix on March 20, 2022, 05:34:45 AM

Quote from: Wind_FURY on March 19, 2022, 04:11:52 AM

~

They are sanctioned from using the Dollar, but they are still required to pay their debts in Dollars? Wouldn't that make the lender, for receiving payments from Russian companies/financial institutions, be breaking U.S. orders under the sanction? I believe the U.S. have also sanctioned Russian Gold.

My viewpoint truly is, I believe the sanction might hurt the Dollar more in the future, because other nation-states might start losing trust in the cabal behind the U.S. Dollar.

The sanction against using the dollar is more theoretical, the actual way it works is that they can't issue more debt in dollars nor can they ask for financing through most financial systems. But nobody is stopping them to pay from their bank's accounts to some bank in China 1 billion dollars, that's why I told you on the other topic, sanctions don't work by chopping somebody's hand off so he can't play tennis anymore, it's more like nobody wants to play tennis with him at all.
Plus Russian companies' debt and governmental debt can't be sanctions since it's actually not theirs anymore, for example, if the IRS would seize all your goods and funds and bank accounts, they won't cancel your mortgage, that would still be up and running.

As for the second part, I don't know how old you are, but my father when he was a child had nothing else to listen than to all that communist propaganda about the fall of the dollar and look now, 60 years have passed, and the dollar is going strong but people still say it will ...what?
Russians are desperate for getting dollars and you think this will hurt it? Lol.

I believe it MIGHT hurt the sanctity of the U.S. Dollar, I never said that it will definitely hurt it. Do you believe that the United States' actions will strengthen the other nation-states' trust on the cabal behind the Dollar? It might weaken that trust, which was the main point.

noorman0

hero member

Activity: 1778

Merit: 709

[Nope]No hype delivers more than hope

Quote from: hatshepsut93 on March 18, 2022, 06:54:06 AM

Quote from: noorman0 on March 16, 2022, 12:50:52 PM

Actually this epic moment happened in Ukraine, I don't know how difficult it is to get cash there (even using e-money). Someone sells "a Legendary Car" with bitcoin. View more...

You don't need to send cash to Ukraine, because Ukraine's electronic payment systems are fully operational. If a person refuses to accept them and wants cash, chances that they will accept Bitcoin are actually pretty low. If you think that a 50 y.o. dude from Ukraine who only uses the Internet for Facebook and Telegram will be interesting in listening in a lecture about the benefits of Bitcoin while being in the middle of war trying to sell his car to the highest bidder, you are a bit unrealistic.

Still, it's nice that Bitcoin exists and is being used and is helpful in extreme situations. Just don't think that this is a common occurrence.

The assumption is that the buyers in this case are tourists (they speak English) who are trapped in a warring country and want to get out of the city immediately but there is no public transportation operating in the middle of the conflict. In this situation where cash and e-money are needed more by local residents so that the demand for exchanging foreign currency into local currency has reached the bank's daily transaction threshold (possibly over-demanded), I don't think there is an alternative currency to get something tourists need quickly except for a new currency which was just legalized.

smartaction

legendary

Activity: 1918

Merit: 1122

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Quote from: noorman0 on March 16, 2022, 12:50:52 PM

Actually this epic moment happened in Ukraine, I don't know how difficult it is to get cash there (even using e-money). Someone sells "a Legendary Car" with bitcoin. View more...

Another milestone that bitcoin really serves as an alternative currency especially in times of urgency, bitcoin is really valuable for someone to survive. Because urgent situations are not just about war, calamities can also have more severe repercussions. I think this is a perfect consideration for any government not to be too strict on bitcoin regulations.

Bitcoin has been created as an alternative to Fiat Money its true. Bitcoin is very popular and and easy use to anytime anywhere. But then it is meaningless. When, you have Bitcoin, but your phone will not have internet connection. But when there is an internet connection, Bitcoin will act as a valuable currency in the absence of money

yazher

hero member

Activity: 2268

Merit: 588

You own the pen

With the world right now is uncertain, you don't know when your country will become like Ukrain or like Russia facing sanctions from various industries. It's better for us to save some money and convert it to bitcoins in case we suffer like the current state of Ukraine where people are struggling to withdraw their money back because of the long line and they're having some hard time transporting it. When you have most of it in bitcoins, you are just chilling because you already know that this would happen and you are already prepared.

stompix

legendary

Activity: 2912

Merit: 6403

Blackjack.fun

Quote from: Wind_FURY on March 19, 2022, 04:11:52 AM

~

They are sanctioned from using the Dollar, but they are still required to pay their debts in Dollars? Wouldn't that make the lender, for receiving payments from Russian companies/financial institutions, be breaking U.S. orders under the sanction? I believe the U.S. have also sanctioned Russian Gold.

My viewpoint truly is, I believe the sanction might hurt the Dollar more in the future, because other nation-states might start losing trust in the cabal behind the U.S. Dollar.

The sanction against using the dollar is more theoretical, the actual way it works is that they can't issue more debt in dollars nor can they ask for financing through most financial systems. But nobody is stopping them to pay from their bank's accounts to some bank in China 1 billion dollars, that's why I told you on the other topic, sanctions don't work by chopping somebody's hand off so he can't play tennis anymore, it's more like nobody wants to play tennis with him at all.
Plus Russian companies' debt and governmental debt can't be sanctions since it's actually not theirs anymore, for example, if the IRS would seize all your goods and funds and bank accounts, they won't cancel your mortgage, that would still be up and running.

As for the second part, I don't know how old you are, but my father when he was a child had nothing else to listen than to all that communist propaganda about the fall of the dollar and look now, 60 years have passed, and the dollar is going strong but people still say it will ...what?
Russians are desperate for getting dollars and you think this will hurt it? Lol.

AmoreJaz

legendary

Activity: 3122

Merit: 1102

Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform

Quote from: wozzek23 on March 19, 2022, 04:08:09 PM

Crypto in general became one for me years ago. I have been working freelance for many years now, a lot of years actually and I can tell you that I have been paying for many things as well. I always wanted my own project and that resulted with me spending money by paying people all around the world as well, other freelancers and domains and hosting and servers and software as well.

So, I have spent and earned crypto for years and that proves to me that I never really needed fiat. Sure I still use fiat in my regular life, but that is because I have to, not because I prefer to. Who would prefer fiat if they could spend crypto everywhere? The amount of people who own fiat would drop significantly in that case.

this is still the setback of crypto, you can't easily use it as direct payment to your local shops or merchants. so you still need to convert your crypto to your fiat if you want to spend it. but i do agree, if you have the skills, you can really earn good money via this industry. you just know how to. nowadays, freelancers are growing in numbers because we are discovering a lot of jobs that you can do at the comfort of your home. this has been boosted by this pandemic when most of us are forced to do your work at home as much as possible.
but still, even if you have crypto willing to spend for your daily needs, you can't find a lot of these shops to accept crypto. this i think is still work-in-progress, as more merchants are now trying to integrate crypto in their payment system as part of becoming more digital or additional options to their consumers..

wozzek23

sr. member

Activity: 1568

Merit: 283

Crypto in general became one for me years ago. I have been working freelance for many years now, a lot of years actually and I can tell you that I have been paying for many things as well. I always wanted my own project and that resulted with me spending money by paying people all around the world as well, other freelancers and domains and hosting and servers and software as well.

So, I have spent and earned crypto for years and that proves to me that I never really needed fiat. Sure I still use fiat in my regular life, but that is because I have to, not because I prefer to. Who would prefer fiat if they could spend crypto everywhere? The amount of people who own fiat would drop significantly in that case.

Wind_FURY

legendary

Activity: 2898

Merit: 1823

Quote from: stompix on March 18, 2022, 07:18:15 AM

Quote from: Wind_FURY on March 18, 2022, 06:05:43 AM

But wouldn't the Russian government start avoiding accumulation of U.S. Dollars currently that they are sanctioned from using it? All Dollars held within Russia and in Russian banks are essentially "erased" from the ledger.

No, money held by the central reserve and their own banks in their OWN accounts and not overseas accounts as collateral is not touched by these sanctions and the Russian government needs dollars because it has debts to pay, one was just the other day, it has to pay the debt of the companies that are owned by the state, the sum is of around 150 billion, that's why they had reserves in foreign nations, to back up this debt as collateral, not because Russia managed miraculously to set aside 30% of their GDP in savings in 3 years.
If they can't service the debt there will be a default, and if their own companies can't do that either there will be bankruptcies, and assets are going to be seized.
It's the USSR all over again, what other choice do they have than getting dollars? Do you think China will accept rubles for their stuff? Grin

They are sanctioned from using the Dollar, but they are still required to pay their debts in Dollars? Wouldn't that make the lender, for receiving payments from Russian companies/financial institutions, be breaking U.S. orders under the sanction? I believe the U.S. have also sanctioned Russian Gold.

My viewpoint truly is, I believe the sanction might hurt the Dollar more in the future, because other nation-states might start losing trust in the cabal behind the U.S. Dollar.

Zlantann

legendary

Activity: 1050

Merit: 1100

Quote from: avikz on March 17, 2022, 06:14:00 AM

This is a country specific matter due to which there is an influx of bitcoin purchase transactions. But if I try to find out the same trend worldwide, I don't see any credible source of information that says bitcoin has become the world's favorite reserve currency for individuals.

Nope! Bitcoin has not yet reached that level. The capital protection leader is still gold and other precious metals. There's no proof that majority of the population is buying bitcoin for the unforeseen emergencies. What's happening in Ukraine, is an exception!

Yes Bitcoin has been around for few years now but it has not reached the level of global acceptance. To most of us cryptocurrency transactions are easy to understand but it is very complicated to most people, even the US government is still studying the system. In Africa for example were a larger part of the population has no access to education or the internet. It would take decades for cryptocurrencies to penetrate some financial market. Like the founder of bitcoin said: There is much work to be done.

stompix

legendary

Activity: 2912

Merit: 6403

Blackjack.fun

Quote from: Wind_FURY on March 18, 2022, 06:05:43 AM

But wouldn't the Russian government start avoiding accumulation of U.S. Dollars currently that they are sanctioned from using it? All Dollars held within Russia and in Russian banks are essentially "erased" from the ledger.

No, money held by the central reserve and their own banks in their OWN accounts and not overseas accounts as collateral is not touched by these sanctions and the Russian government needs dollars because it has debts to pay, one was just the other day, it has to pay the debt of the companies that are owned by the state, the sum is of around 150 billion, that's why they had reserves in foreign nations, to back up this debt as collateral, not because Russia managed miraculously to set aside 30% of their GDP in savings in 3 years.
If they can't service the debt there will be a default, and if their own companies can't do that either there will be bankruptcies, and assets are going to be seized.
It's the USSR all over again, what other choice do they have than getting dollars? Do you think China will accept rubles for their stuff? Grin

hatshepsut93

legendary

Activity: 3024

Merit: 2148

Quote from: noorman0 on March 16, 2022, 12:50:52 PM

Actually this epic moment happened in Ukraine, I don't know how difficult it is to get cash there (even using e-money). Someone sells "a Legendary Car" with bitcoin. View more...

You don't need to send cash to Ukraine, because Ukraine's electronic payment systems are fully operational. If a person refuses to accept them and wants cash, chances that they will accept Bitcoin are actually pretty low. If you think that a 50 y.o. dude from Ukraine who only uses the Internet for Facebook and Telegram will be interesting in listening in a lecture about the benefits of Bitcoin while being in the middle of war trying to sell his car to the highest bidder, you are a bit unrealistic.

Still, it's nice that Bitcoin exists and is being used and is helpful in extreme situations. Just don't think that this is a common occurrence.

Quote from: pooya87 on March 17, 2022, 02:26:26 AM

Ukraine is being invaded, it has lost a lot of its infrastructure, its economy doesn't exist, the military is mostly destroyed, millions have fled the country, analysts claim Putin's plan is scorched-earth strategy, ... and yet Ukraine fiat only dumped 5% which makes no sense!

You are drinking some Russian state kool-aid if you think that Ukraine is on a verge of defeat and destruction.

Quote from: pooya87 on March 17, 2022, 02:26:26 AM

Then we have Russia that is the invader, hasn't lost any infrastructure since there is no attack on Russia!, hasn't lost anything economy wise, the sanctions are mostly jokes that don't really target the economy (eg. sanctioning Russian cats, athletes, porn sites,etc.) and yet Russian fiat tanked 40%!

Russian trade with the West got obliterated while Ukraine's trade will only ramp up. Again, if you think that the current sanctions are a joke, it only means you're consuming Russian propaganda in large quantities.

Wind_FURY

legendary

Activity: 2898

Merit: 1823

Quote from: stompix on March 17, 2022, 03:02:38 AM

Quote from: pooya87 on March 17, 2022, 02:26:26 AM

Sorry to go off-topic but it was an interesting observation that I can only explain as market manipulation (I'd love it if someone could explain any other reason opposite of what I said).

Pretty simple!

In Russia, everyone tries to get dollars including the government which banned dollars purchases, driving a black market which in some reported cases goes to 300 rubles for a dollar, the government is desperate for foreign currency and the lack of it does what you see happening.
In Ukraine, the country is flooded with billions in aid, poeple received a ton of donations which have to be converted in local currency, doing the exact opposite as it happens in Russia, driving the offset between demand and offer down, just the proposed help to date is about 1/3 of the monetary mass in the country.

But wouldn't the Russian government start avoiding accumulation of U.S. Dollars currently that they are sanctioned from using it? All Dollars held within Russia and in Russian banks are essentially "erased" from the ledger.

kryptqnick

legendary

Activity: 3248

Merit: 1402

Join the world-leading crypto sportsbook NOW!

Quote from: noorman0 on March 16, 2022, 12:50:52 PM

Actually this epic moment happened in Ukraine, I don't know how difficult it is to get cash there (even using e-money). Someone sells "a Legendary Car" with bitcoin. View more...

Another milestone that bitcoin really serves as an alternative currency especially in times of urgency, bitcoin is really valuable for someone to survive. Because urgent situations are not just about war, calamities can also have more severe repercussions. I think this is a perfect consideration for any government not to be too strict on bitcoin regulations.

(The point of this thread is not about Ukraine situations specifically, but to the experiences of the people on this story.)

It's an interesting story, and I do believe that the war motivated the increased usage of Bitcoin. However, this only works under fairly peaceful conditions and in places with stable Internet connection. Local fiat is currently the most handy thing to have in small towns and generally in places which are under blockade or where electricity is down because of the war. In other places, getting cash is often very challenging (because the ATMs are running out of it), but paying with card is almost always an option. I'm glad they found a way to buy a car with Bitcoin, but they said it was in central Ukraine, and central Ukraine is one of the least affected areas by the war so far.

evilgreed

sr. member

Activity: 728

Merit: 266

While buying the car with bitcoins in that situation is a good thing, it is not such a huge achievement. But regardless, an achievement is an achievement which helps worldwide mass adoption. The thing is that even with the situations in Ukraine, bitcoins or any crypto currency is not a solution unless you are leaving the country. This is because there won't be any way to access your cryptos when electricity goes out. You'd be hetter off carrying cash, jewelry or anything that has value which you can trade with necessities.

sunsilk

hero member

Activity: 3038

Merit: 634

It had worked for Ukraine when infras were destroyed where could be data centers, banks and other finance related buildings were operating that led them to stop operation so using and owning cash there is truly a big problem.

In times like this, it's proven that bitcoin has remained strong and usable and it's also a place to save wealth by those affected people. It's an all-in-all asset that can be considered when the bad and worst times come like a war.

Raymond Gary

newbie

Activity: 28

Merit: 15

Quote from: noorman0 on March 16, 2022, 12:50:52 PM

Actually this epic moment happened in Ukraine, I don't know how difficult it is to get cash there (even using e-money). Someone sells "a Legendary Car" with bitcoin. View more...

Another milestone that bitcoin really serves as an alternative currency especially in times of urgency, bitcoin is really valuable for someone to survive. Because urgent situations are not just about war, calamities can also have more severe repercussions. I think this is a perfect consideration for any government not to be too strict on bitcoin regulations.

(The point of this thread is not about Ukraine situations specifically, but to the experiences of the people on this story.)

Bitcoin is as we speak has gradually started showcasing it's user case , And this why it was created initially to solve the problems that fiat currencies could not solve and this is one of them [inflation hedge] in the time of geopolitical challenge ,Economic challenge etc.
Satoshi forsaw all this problems facing the world at large and hence created Bitcoin to become a safe heaven like during era of Gold.

tbct_mt2

hero member

Activity: 2366

Merit: 838

Bitcoin becomes a favorite asset for people when the more of them realize how fast fiat currencies lose their purchasing power because of over printing from governments.

It does not come from the pandemic only. I do know the pandemic makes inflation worse globally but it is not a main reason for it. The pandemic fortunately reveals the truth about governments, central banks and fiat currencies that do bring more proofs for people to realize value of Bitcoin.

The war in Ukraine is another tip of iceberg and not the main reason why Bitcoin has become more popular and more widely accepted globally.

worldtraveller321

member

Activity: 512

Merit: 33

The Quest of the Best Information to the Solution

One has to realize the governments and banks are not going to go away anytime soon. Government systems and banking systems have been around as long as gold. Thousands of years. Sure there can be a change in government and bank systems. They are not going to go away. Some banks are now getting into crypto as well. Same with governments. Some governments more in the future will make BTC as a legal tender. Probably happen. There will always be some sort of centralization in everything.

Keep in mind., for many people , they have more confidence in using a bank for their finances vs using a private company. Private company being like for example Binance, Kraken, Coinbase etc for their finances. Even if more people used crypto as their main finance, many would have more confidence to a bank.

Just the way it is.

Yes a few years ago, the banks shunned crypto as it would cause havoc in their platform. Since most banks only dealt in fiat and precious metals.

Now the banks are looking more into crypto. Which is probably smart. As now they can deal with that system and keep their business platform.

That how it is.

More or less we are just moving from one money system to another. The higher up control will always be there at some point.

Topic: Bitcoin becomes priority alternative when cash fails - page 2. (Read 550 times)