Bitcoin does not have limited supply - page 12.

freightjoe

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Quote from: becometa.pl on November 19, 2017, 07:42:13 AM

Quote from: jakelyson on November 19, 2017, 06:51:47 AM

I think you do not understand how it works. Hardfork does not alter the maximum supply of bitcoin, it just creates an altcoin based on the current blockchain. But bitcoin will still have 21M maximum supply. If ever the hardforked coin survives, it is just an altcoin and will compete with bitcoin on the market.

I think original poster resisted on fact that no matter how good/bad hardfork is, original Bitcoin users are going to receive it's token so..

You really don't get it do you?

A person wants to invest 100 USD of real money in cryptocurrencies. If there was only one crypto - Bitcoin - with a limited supply, then over time you can argue price will go up as long as that person really want to by crypto for his USD. But when you then have more and more cryptocurrencies, some of the people will choose to put their 100USD in competing cryptos. And this means in reality that the supply of crypto currency is growing exponentially and without limits

ajmapalo22

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The fork was made to introduce a coin that can probably divert the bitcoin market not increase the supply of bitcoin none in this place or even no one can increase the supply of bitcoin this thing makes bitcoin weak because as the demand continue growing the supply need to accomodate them all but since its limited the only way is to increase the value of bitcoin.

becometa.pl

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Quote from: jakelyson on November 19, 2017, 06:51:47 AM

I think you do not understand how it works. Hardfork does not alter the maximum supply of bitcoin, it just creates an altcoin based on the current blockchain. But bitcoin will still have 21M maximum supply. If ever the hardforked coin survives, it is just an altcoin and will compete with bitcoin on the market.

I think original poster resisted on fact that no matter how good/bad hardfork is, original Bitcoin users are going to receive it's token so..

BingoDog

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No matter the forks bitcoin is limited to 21millions and that can't be changed. Every other coin that come out as a product of fork has nothing to do with bitcoin, except a part of the name but basicly these are just altcoins that don't affect the bitcoin supply. And once when the limit of mined bitcoins is achieved the price will have the huge pump.

freightjoe

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Quote from: drwhobox on November 19, 2017, 07:32:46 AM

It does not affect the maximum suppply of Bitcoin. If you fork Bitcoin there would be an altcoins (Name of the fork) + Bitcoin) They are trying to make a 2.0 Version of bitcoin. It would not really change anything with Bitcoin it self.

You really don't get it do you?

A person wants to invest 100 USD of real money in cryptocurrencies. If there was only one crypto - Bitcoin - with a limited supply, then over time you can argue price will go up as long as that person really want to by crypto for his USD. But when you then have more and more cryptocurrencies, some of the people will choose to put their 100USD in competing cryptos. And this means in reality that the supply of crypto currency is growing exponentially and without limits

freightjoe

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Quote from: jseverson on November 19, 2017, 07:30:49 AM

Coins are only as valuable as people deem them to be

Yes - is is purely a fantasy and like all dreams you will wake up and it will be gone.

Quote from: jseverson on November 19, 2017, 07:30:49 AM

There will only be one Bitcoin. Bitcoin Cash and Bitcoin Gold are altcoins, much like Litecoin or Ethereum.

Clearly you are driven by a religious belief. "There will only one god" replaced by "there will only be one Bitcoin". But as in all religions, people tend to start beleiving the "one god" is slightly different and then you get different gods and wars over who believes in the true god. The recent war between Bitcoin and Bitcoin Cash is only the begining. Ultimately these will all destroy each other and credibility in the cryptocurrencies will be totally gone.

drwhobox

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It does not affect the maximum suppply of Bitcoin. If you fork Bitcoin there would be an altcoins (Name of the fork) + Bitcoin) They are trying to make a 2.0 Version of bitcoin. It would not really change anything with Bitcoin it self.

freightjoe

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Quote from: BitcoinHodler on November 19, 2017, 07:27:08 AM

gold has a limited supply.
gold is an element in the periodic table, but we have 118 total elements. does this mean when we extract lets say iron from iron ores we are increasing the gold supply? if so then yeah bitcoin supply is increasing with fork too!

Do you really believe that the comparison you make is relevant? Are you really that stupid?

jseverson

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Quote from: freightjoe on November 19, 2017, 06:41:52 AM

Quote from: aso118 on November 19, 2017, 06:38:19 AM

Quote from: freightjoe on November 19, 2017, 06:34:51 AM

The argument is again and again that the value of Bitcoin will increase because supply is limited to 21 million. But this is quite simply wrong. Every time Bitcoin is forked that is in real terms an expansion of the Bitcoin currency beyond 21 million. To some degree the same is true of alternative crypto currencies which will flood the market. There is already more than 1000 cryptocurrencues ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cryptocurrencies )

Th forking (or absence of it) does not effect Bitcoin's supply. At best, you can consider it as a "gift" to all bitcoin holders, which will increase the overall worth. It in no way impacts the overall supply of 21 Mn, which is set in stone.

That is precisely my point. I create "Bitcoin2" by forking. Then I create "Bitcoin3" and so on and so on. In reality what I am doing is issuing more Bitcoin. That I call it a different name does not change the reality.

You have a flawed understanding of forks. None of the recent forks have been accepted as Bitcoin2, and none of them ever will be. They're considered as altcoins which are basically using Bitcoin's branding to their advantage. Coins are only as valuable as people deem them to be, and no one would support a coin that just aims to increase supply. Why increase the supply if Bitcoin is infinitely divisible anyway? There will only be one Bitcoin. Bitcoin Cash and Bitcoin Gold are altcoins, much like Litecoin or Ethereum.

BitcoinHodler

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Quote from: freightjoe on November 19, 2017, 06:34:51 AM

The argument is again and again that the value of Bitcoin will increase because supply is limited to 21 million.

the argument is about price is rising because adoption of bitcoin is growing and the limited supply is the icing on the cake for the bigger rise.

Quote

But this is quite simply wrong. Every time Bitcoin is forked that is in real terms an expansion of the Bitcoin currency beyond 21 million.

gold has a limited supply.
gold is an element in the periodic table, but we have 118 total elements. does this mean when we extract lets say iron from iron ores we are increasing the gold supply? if so then yeah bitcoin supply is increasing with fork too!

nambunamba

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Quote from: freightjoe on November 19, 2017, 06:41:52 AM

Quote from: aso118 on November 19, 2017, 06:38:19 AM

Quote from: freightjoe on November 19, 2017, 06:34:51 AM

The argument is again and again that the value of Bitcoin will increase because supply is limited to 21 million. But this is quite simply wrong. Every time Bitcoin is forked that is in real terms an expansion of the Bitcoin currency beyond 21 million. To some degree the same is true of alternative crypto currencies which will flood the market. There is already more than 1000 cryptocurrencues ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cryptocurrencies )

Th forking (or absence of it) does not effect Bitcoin's supply. At best, you can consider it as a "gift" to all bitcoin holders, which will increase the overall worth. It in no way impacts the overall supply of 21 Mn, which is set in stone.

That is precisely my point. I create "Bitcoin2" by forking. Then I create "Bitcoin3" and so on and so on. In reality what I am doing is issuing more Bitcoin. That I call it a different name does not change the reality.

yes its the problem. but its not really a problem i think. cause if its accepted by people so on it will have a value. so why we worried about such thing after all we know which one is the real bitcoin and which coin is worth with highest market value

ReLieD

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You are right partially as there is no limit to the prices of Bitcoin. Currently it says 21 million but more and more will mined and the limit will keep increasing . Then comes the price of Bitcoin . Who expect the prices of Bitcoin to rise upto 10 times the price past year. Infact now it's even more and there are many predictions which say that Bitcoin can easily cross 10k by the end of this year.

freightjoe

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All the acolytes in here are clearly religious - "21 million" is the holy word, and thou shall not dare to say otherwise.

Bitcoin and the altcoins are all competing for the same attention/market and therefore cannot in any way be seen as independent. Saying the mantra "21 million" will at the end of the day mean nothing when market power takes over and the inevitable crash comes around partially due to massive oversupply

flamengo10

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21 million sypply !!!!

VitKoyn

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Quote from: freightjoe on November 19, 2017, 06:34:51 AM

The argument is again and again that the value of Bitcoin will increase because supply is limited to 21 million. But this is quite simply wrong. Every time Bitcoin is forked that is in real terms an expansion of the Bitcoin currency beyond 21 million. To some degree the same is true of alternative crypto currencies which will flood the market. There is already more than 1000 cryptocurrencues ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cryptocurrencies )

I disagree, Bitcoin have limited supply of 21 million, if someone forked Bitcoin and created a new version of Bitcoin it doesn't mean that the supply will increase because the forked coins and Bitcoin will work on different blockchain. The hard forks may help to increase Bitcoin price and the demand because people will surely dump the coins they will get from the hard fork to buy more Bitcoin, but that doesn't mean that it is the only reason why Bitcoin is skyrocketing because the real reason is more and more people and business are adopting Bitcoin.

Xavofat

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Quote from: freightjoe on November 19, 2017, 06:41:52 AM

In reality what I am doing is issuing more Bitcoin. That I call it a different name does not change the reality.

In that case, go ahead and try to send one of your "Bitcoin2" or "Bitcoin3" to an exchange, a wallet or a merchant, and see if they accept it. They won't.

If you create a new client which abides by different consensus rules to the reference client (currently Bitcoin Core) you are creating an entirely different currency. It could be that you call your new currency "Bitcoin" and that it garners enough consensus to be regarded as "Bitcoin" by the majority, but even if that occurs, the supply of the original chain will stay consistent.

You clearly do not understand what forking software entails.

patt0

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Quote from: freightjoe on November 19, 2017, 06:34:51 AM

The argument is again and again that the value of Bitcoin will increase because supply is limited to 21 million. But this is quite simply wrong. Every time Bitcoin is forked that is in real terms an expansion of the Bitcoin currency beyond 21 million. To some degree the same is true of alternative crypto currencies which will flood the market. There is already more than 1000 cryptocurrencues ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cryptocurrencies )

I heard that argument over and over again, but I don't think it is a valid one. When you are forking bitcoin, you are not altering it's supply. You are creating a new coin, that needs to have a set of different rules, and so it cannot be considered bitcoin, so you can't say it's adding more coins to the BTC max supply.
The altcoin that results from that fork, could be accepted or not, and even if they are, they will not be confused with BTC.

Are you saying that bcash, or bgold is bitcoin? Are you saying these coins are an extension of bitcoin? They are not, so you can't say BTC limit supply was changed. You saw what happen after the B2x failed fork. Bcash was being pumped like crazy, and BTC price was decreasing. So basically these coins were "competing" with each other. Given this behaviour how can you say that the bcash fork was an expansion of bitcoin? They are completely different, and no mistakes should be made about that.

jakelyson

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I think you do not understand how it works. Hardfork does not alter the maximum supply of bitcoin, it just creates an altcoin based on the current blockchain. But bitcoin will still have 21M maximum supply. If ever the hardforked coin survives, it is just an altcoin and will compete with bitcoin on the market.

Lucius

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Quote from: freightjoe on November 19, 2017, 06:34:51 AM

The argument is again and again that the value of Bitcoin will increase because supply is limited to 21 million. But this is quite simply wrong. Every time Bitcoin is forked that is in real terms an expansion of the Bitcoin currency beyond 21 million. To some degree the same is true of alternative crypto currencies which will flood the market. There is already more than 1000 cryptocurrencues ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cryptocurrencies )

BTC have finite supply of 21 million coins and that is a fact which is very well known.I do not know why you think that some altcoin which have "bitcoin" in his name can change total number of coins.Most of that altcoins even with "bitcoin" in their names will simply disappear over time.There is always a option to increase total number of BTC,but I think nobody wants to that happen.One of the reasons why BTC is most popular cryptocurrency is his limited supply among other things,and 1000 more new coins on market will not change anything.

KuromaYoichi

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No, the supply is limited. If someone forked bitcoin then it will become a different coin, completely different than the bitcoin itself.

Quote from: freightjoe on November 19, 2017, 06:41:52 AM

Quote from: aso118 on November 19, 2017, 06:38:19 AM

Quote from: freightjoe on November 19, 2017, 06:34:51 AM

The argument is again and again that the value of Bitcoin will increase because supply is limited to 21 million. But this is quite simply wrong. Every time Bitcoin is forked that is in real terms an expansion of the Bitcoin currency beyond 21 million. To some degree the same is true of alternative crypto currencies which will flood the market. There is already more than 1000 cryptocurrencues ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cryptocurrencies )

Th forking (or absence of it) does not effect Bitcoin's supply. At best, you can consider it as a "gift" to all bitcoin holders, which will increase the overall worth. It in no way impacts the overall supply of 21 Mn, which is set in stone.

That is precisely my point. I create "Bitcoin2" by forking. Then I create "Bitcoin3" and so on and so on. In reality what I am doing is issuing more Bitcoin. That I call it a different name does not change the reality.

You create bitcoin A B C or something else but the amount of your original bitcoin is still the same.You are issuing another coin, forked from bitcoin. You can fork bitcoin 10 times but it will be useless if no one support that chain.

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