Bitcoin Gives the poor an Opportunity. - page 6.

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Quote from: albert0bsd on September 22, 2023, 04:33:24 PM

uneducated person may don't know what bitcoin is.

Not true, I am an example of uneducated person, but I know bitcoin, actually bitcoin ( especially this forum, altcoins, ICOs, other scam, pyramid, ponzi ) attract all the poor people, I wasn't poor, just unaware of the concept of ponzi, so years ago I participated in a few of them thinking those who call it scam are competitors so I ignored the warnings and paid the price by handing them my money.

But I do agree that with an empty stomach, one can only think about how to fill it just to stay alive, and who's fault is that? 1% of population is at fault.
I'm not saying poor people are criminals, I'm saying poverty brings nothing good when it comes knocking on the door.

Z-tight

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Quote from: lionheart78 on September 22, 2023, 05:06:55 PM

I would rather say, Bitcoin gives the unbanked an opportunity.

I know BTC is censorship resistant and people who don't want the bank to control all of their money will probably like to use BTC for the portion of the money they want to control themselves, but what i believe is that most of the unbanked do not have money to save in a bank, and they are mostly unbanked because of their financial situation rather than for privacy issues. If this is correct, BTC doesn't help them, because it is also a currency in itself and if they can't earn fiat they'll not be able to earn BTC.

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Quote from: Z-tight on September 22, 2023, 04:28:57 PM

The poor do not think about buying BTC, neither can they wait for the long term, they are concerned with their basic needs only; i don't know why you think BTC gives the poor some kind of special opportunity to make money. Anyone who can buy some Sats, can also afford to buy a few other assets as well, it is not as if you cannot invest little in other assets if you want to.

Agreed, it is possible to buy other assets and investments based on the ability of the user to hold. When the invested amount is smlall it takes lots of time to profit good out of it. Very few get lucky to make big money out of the small capital. If not they need to be early investors of bitcoin. The best thing that can be expected by a common man from bitcoin is a better profit on the investment than other opportunities based on the time one holds it. Whether it is a rich person or poor one, spending regularly little amount will assure with the profit in the long run. This could be life changing money.

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Quote from: Alpha Marine on September 22, 2023, 03:41:53 PM

Every other investment I know requires you to have a lot of money before you can make a reasonable profit.
The most popular forms of investment are stock trading and real estate and it's quite expensive to go into.
For you to buy these shares and make a good profit you have to have thousands to tens of thousands of dollars.
Not to mention that you need to have a deeper understanding before you can stand a chance to make it in stock trading.

Not really no. These limits can be seen in some form even in crypto or just regular stock trading. It's just that crypto in general has a greater volatility than stocks, so more opportunities even if you have a lower amount of money invested. Compared to stocks, which are volatile as well, yes, but less than crypto itself. Besides, the same thing about "knowledge" can be said about crypto.

I mean, Bitcoin is a top choice, yes, only because it's well known, it's shown what it can be, and the forum is literally about Bitcoin. You'd be hard-pressed to find someone who doesn't at least have some basic knowledge of Bitcoin. If you were, however, to go to a forum of say real estate owners (if that does exist), given enough time I reckon you'd be able to build up enough knowledge and eye about land to know which is a worthwhile investment or not. While I've never tried fractural shares, the same ideology probably holds the same (just with a bit more restrictions I suppose).

Though I guess I do agree with crypto being reasonably easier to enter than stock. I tried both when I was a college student and boy was stocks confusing as hell.

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Quote from: Alpha Marine on September 22, 2023, 03:41:53 PM

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Limits on when, how, and what you can sell
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Aren't these the same limits that are in stocks?

Quote from: Alpha Marine on September 22, 2023, 03:41:53 PM

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Fees for trading fractional shares
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Fees for trading affect you basically in every sort of trading, and if you don't own much, those fees will affect you more.

Quote from: Alpha Marine on September 22, 2023, 03:41:53 PM

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Lower dividend income and profits
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Well percentually you get same gains. If you invest less on something, expect less profits.

Quote from: Alpha Marine on September 22, 2023, 03:41:53 PM

Lack of stock voting rights

Sure, but you don't have voting rights trading synthetic stocks either and those seem to be something for example binance wanted to offer. And it's not like you have voting rights with bitcoin, if you want something else then majority, you will just create a fork.
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Quote from: Alpha Marine on September 22, 2023, 03:41:53 PM

This shows how the game is rigged against those who don't have enough money to spend on investment.

This is a matter of perspective. If you want higher fluctuation and potential profits with higher risk, you need to invest small caps.
In that way your bag of value grows with the marketcap. If you want to buy something overvalued, your money will never be enough unless you are rich.

Quote from: Alpha Marine on September 22, 2023, 03:41:53 PM

Some people frown at the fact that Bitcoin is being termed an investment because Bitcoin was created to be a currency. They feel Bitcoin might lose its nature as a currency if it continues being an investment. I don't agree with that, but I respect their opinions.
Bitcoin can be both a currency and an investment

I have used bitcoin more like a currency than a store of value or investment. I bought bitcoin and sold it for money when i needed money. I have bought and sold bitcoin up to 2015, then i stopped and found new ways to get it.

I can't really regret using it as a currency even though one time i remember ticket to public swimming hall costing 0.3 btc. I bought my tv with one bitcoin. It's now worth maybe $200

I don't have to to say that btc was way cheaper then. But i can't regret it as no one knew how high it would rise. So i keep using it to buy and sell.

lionheart78

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I would rather say, Bitcoin gives the unbanked an opportunity. Way back when Bitcoin was not created yet, the unbanked had no means of participating in the global economy since they didn't have a way to transfer funds to trade. With the creation of Bitcoin, many unbanked people have been granted the chance to do international transactions and is able to participate in global trades.

The opportunity is given to all people, poor and rich alike, it depends on people how they take advantage of this opportunity.

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Quote from: Alpha Marine on September 22, 2023, 03:41:53 PM

I can't say Bitcoin levels the playing for everybody but it gives people an opportunity to have an investment. People that ordinarily wouldn't have been able to have any investment at all.
With Bitcoin, you can just buy with any amount you have and sell whenever and however you want.
I for one wouldn't have had any investment at this point in my life if not for Bitcoin.

Well, the paragraph I quoted above vindicated you in this article. Atleast, you acknowledge that bitcoin does not level the playing ground for everyone. However it gives an opportunity for everyone to invest and grow at their pace. If we want to be very honest to ourselves, bitcoin at this time may not be able to make anyone a millionaire, except the person invests heavily during the bear and waits for the bull.
Bitcoin only made the early adopters millionaires even from nothing apart from believing the system and mining it or buying with a little money. Those good times are gone for ever. But the good thing is that as you noted, bitcoin still presents opportunity for everyone.

Quote from: Alpha Marine on September 22, 2023, 03:41:53 PM

Some people frown at the fact that Bitcoin is being termed an investment because Bitcoin was created to be a currency. They feel Bitcoin might lose its nature as a currency if it continues being an investment. I don't agree with that, but I respect their opinions.
Bitcoin can be both a currency and an investment

It seems you have discussed two issued in one topic. Will it not be nice you create a separate thread with this topic of bitcoin being an investment assets or currency.

panganib999

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I would agree. Bitcoin has allowed millions of people around the world to finally gain their financial independence if not get wealthy. The fact that a lot of them even came from this site is all the more inspiring, I was one of them after all. Nowadays you could argue that there's still the opportunity to earn money in the industry but truth be told, it's not that much. There's a lot more stability going on and with that comes the less chances of earning a large amount of profit, compared to years ago when bitcoin was dirt cheap and you can buy it with spare gas change. It's nothing bad though, as a stable asset valuation almost always means that the industry it is in is thriving or the product has gained enough fame and reputation, but diversifying your assets has become even more important and relevant nowadays as compared to back then.

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Bitcoin gives everyone an equal opportunity, it’s now left to us to choose how we deal with those opportunities presented to us, but when it comes to bitcoin giving the poor an opportunity, I don’t see any opportunity that bitcoin can give to a poor person if the person has not yet given him self an opportunity, if you can’t make it through life and make sure that you can provide for your needs and use those needs, and still have some left over, I don’t think any form of bitcoin opportunities is for you.

It’s someone who either have money to invest in bitcoin and utilize the opportunity given to them by bitcoin that can make it through, have enough time to invest in doing eke research on ways which they can benefit from bitcoin, that are eligible to make it through it. It’s sad how many people think of bitcoin as something which can move one from a poverty stage to a financial stable life in just less down a year or month or by someone making a little sacrifice of investing few dollars into it, Bitcoin is not magic money although most people call it that, but their is no magic which is performed their that double ones investment.

Baofeng

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Perhaps it might be that bitcoin is more accessible if we prefer it to be our investments, as compare to lets say buying stocks. And one beauty of bitcoin is that you have total control of it, you can buy and sell it any time you want and take the profits.

However, I disagree, it order to really maximize your profits here, you still need big amount of money to invest. However, there are some proven strategies or methods that you can used here like DCA and then slowly accumulate BTC. So it's going to be a hard grind if you are like just a simply investor, as you have to go to a lot just to earn like 0.01-0.1 BTC.

famososMuertos

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The "thing" with bitcoin is open to everyone to invest, But!, they're not really prepared.

So, using it as a payment technology or safekeeping of your money is very different from using it as an investment asset, you have to have a degree of preparation, not like that in the depth to pay for something or sell, and using a decentralized wallet to hold, invest is something else, but many users do not see it or understand it that way.

On the other hand, any asset is available for anyone to invest, it's just that there is a "bureaucracy" to do it. (+ money)

In fact, you can ask in your country how you can invest or look for professionals who do it, it is easier, you will be surprised at what things you can invest in that are in the public domain information. Only, it is not like buying bitcoin.

Then, you can invest in so many things, but bitcoin has a very high profit margin that has made it popular, in addition to its own technical configuration makes it a different asset.

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Quote from: Z-tight on September 22, 2023, 04:28:57 PM

The poor do not think about buying BTC, neither do they have money to invest that they would not be needing for the long term, they are concerned with their basic needs only; i don't know why you think BTC gives the poor some kind of special opportunity to make money, but it does not. Anyone who can buy some Sats, can also afford to buy a few other assets as well, it is not as if you cannot invest little in other assets if you want to.

I think the OP doesn't necessarily mean the actual poor people because if that's what the idea is all about then I would concur that the idea is actually going the wrong way because if you are poor then thinking of buying bitcoin wouldn't necessarily be your first concern because any man without proper work that can enable him to hold his bitcoin can and will end up selling that coins just to tackle and sustain himself in times of hardship.

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Quote from: Alpha Marine on September 22, 2023, 03:41:53 PM

Every other investment I know requires you to have a lot of money before you can make a reasonable profit.
The most popular forms of investment are stock trading and real estate and it's quite expensive to go into.
For you to buy these shares and make a good profit you have to have thousands to tens of thousands of dollars.
Not to mention that you need to have a deeper understanding before you can stand a chance to make it in stock trading.

Some might argue that you can buy fractional shares with the amount you have.
According to Stach these are a few disadvantages of fractional shares.

Quote

Limits on when, how, and what you can sell
Fees for trading fractional shares
Lower dividend income and profits
Lack of stock voting rights
Risk of illiquid shares that are difficult to sell
Tax consequences when changing brokerages

This shows how the game is rigged against those who don't have enough money to spend on investment.

I can't say Bitcoin levels the playing for everybody but it gives people an opportunity to have an investment. People that ordinarily wouldn't have been able to have any investment at all.
With Bitcoin, you can just buy with any amount you have and sell whenever and however you want.
I for one wouldn't have had any investment at this point in my life if not for Bitcoin.

For the record, I'm not against investing in other things, if you have the money to invest in other things then by all means please do, but if you don't have it, it's best if you stick to Bitcoin.
And if you'd like to know more about fractional shares, and invest in them, you can start researching here Forbes.

Some people frown at the fact that Bitcoin is being termed an investment because Bitcoin was created to be a currency. They feel Bitcoin might lose its nature as a currency if it continues being an investment. I don't agree with that, but I respect their opinions.
Bitcoin can be both a currency and an investment

Define poor. IMO poor people don't have money for investments, don't have money to DCA so how they can benefit from Bitcoin? In early years perhaps you could have invested a couple of bucks, hodl for 10 years (again highly unlikely if you're poor) and then perhaps you can have a nice amount in fiat if you sell.

albert0bsd

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Quote from: Alpha Marine on September 22, 2023, 03:41:53 PM

Some people frown at the fact that Bitcoin is being termed an investment because Bitcoin was created to be a currency. They feel Bitcoin might lose its nature as a currency if it continues being an investment. I don't agree with that, but I respect their opinions.
Bitcoin can be both a currency and an investment

Before that all you need to delimit or define your version of a poor person.

The problem with poor people is that they are living day by day, they don't usually have time to think about the food of tomorrow, even less time to think about some investments or savings

I see bitcoin as both a currency and an investment, and yes bitcoin can be the best long run investment that mankind has ever created.

But the poor people may have a lot of limitations to enter in that market, first it is what I already said about that they are more worried about some food or first needs goods like clean water, healthcare and other stuff.

Second, the technology limitation, is true that most people have access to a phone where you can access some wallet software and internet, but most poor and very poor people don't have it.

Education may be a 3rd of many points, usually poor families are more worried find any job than give the some money and they prioritize it over education, so they usually don't send their children
nt to the school or they put to work to their teen age kids, in this way a uneducated person may don't know what bitcoin is.

Z-tight

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The poor do not think about buying BTC, neither do they have money to invest that they would not be needing for the long term, they are concerned with their basic needs only; i don't know why you think BTC gives the poor some kind of special opportunity to make money, but it does not. Anyone who can buy some Sats, can also afford to buy a few other assets as well, it is not as if you cannot invest little in other assets if you want to.

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Stating that BTC is an opportunity to the poor is being partial in judgement, because it is a haven for even the rich who have funds to invest in it. The poor can also invest if they have the knowledge and discipline to be able to maintain a DCA strategy or trading effectively.
The application of the knowledge is what is of uttermost importance, be it for the poor or for the rich.

It has however proven to have been more beneficial to the poor in that they may be more concerned with ranking up in a signature campaign to earn in BTC rather than wait for other means of income to improve before investing in BTC.
The rich is merely a classification of those who know how to think outside the box by capitalizing on the BTC idea to accumulate BTC or use it for payment of purchase of goods and services. They may also be involved in other interest as the campaign projects ongoing, but the difference is that the rich wants to learn more while the poor give more excuses and rarely try out future projects.

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If you are going to compare the real estate industry to bitcoin and say bitcoin is way better for the poor then am not siding with you here!!
Think about it without any bias or shilling, most investment opportunities in real life can be financed with loans without having the actual money and make good profits at the end of it, unlike Bitcoin which needs you to have the money if you want to buy and hodl as its high risk and very few wiĺl finance such an undertaking...

So if we perform a reality check on this, bitcoin isn't really for the poor especially that the available resources are needed to take care of other agent needs like food, health, education etc which won't leave excess resources to be channeled towards BTC.

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I am of the view that bitcoin provides opportunities to anyone who wants it regardless of whether it is a poor or rich society in this case because in the end this also depends on our desire whether we want to be in bitcoin or not.
On the other hand, we also need to pay attention that this opportunity has risks and the benefits we get depend on how much we invest in bitcoin so don't expect too much when we only invest reasonably because the benefits we get will also definitely see from what we invest.
The most important thing in this case is that you have to do this for a relatively longer time because the thought that comes to mind and often happens is that when we invest most beginners always want something instant and get a big profit in a short time.

BITCOIN4X

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In general, poor people tend to prefer low-value assets rather than high-value investment assets as their investments. The simple reason is because bitcoin has an expensive price and it takes time and quite a lot of capital to make it rise 3 to 5 times its current price. This mindset is shared by poor people so they tend to invest in crypto with lower value where there is potential for profit, but I don't say all of them have the same mindset.

Some mistakes in selecting investment assets only make their plans fall apart. Some altcoins certainly have a good future, but bitcoin tends to be considered a safer long-term investment regardless of investment budget.

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Bitcoin is designed for everyone to be used irrespective of colors gender and countries, we are permitted to use bitcoin to whatever we wishes to use them for. Those who want to venture into investment may not necessarily buy big amount but can start gradually to hold some fractions of it, investment are always good when discovered the kind of investment and understood the risk associated either before venturing it at this point it gives you an edge to withstand any kind of circumstances that may arise sooner or at the later end of your investment

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