Bitcoin high transaction fees is a disadvantage to small business owners - page 2.

Gyfts

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Quote from: Kelward on June 22, 2023, 04:26:33 AM

Using Binance, has also been suggested to me, that it is a better option to escape bitcoin high transaction fees. I would love to make the efforts to introduce my customers to the use of Binance, as an exchange in our transactions, but Binance is presently having an issue with SEC in my country. Nevertheless, I'll still keep the option in mind, pending when they resolve their matter.

Also, lightening networks is another option to manoeuvre this high fees, but frankly I don't understand how it works yet. I'll go through and diligently study the links that have been shared on this topic.

Using 3rd party payment processors ruins the point of taking crypto in the first place IMO. Having to deal with a 3rd party holding your funds is too risky. I suppose if it meets the needs of your customers and there isn't any other way of accepting crypto currency then it might serve a utility. Reality are that the fees are going to be significant and you'll need to factor them into operating costs. The suggestions in this thread might mitigate fees to some degree but they're unavoidable.

Faisal2202

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Quote from: BD Crypto on June 23, 2023, 10:25:18 AM

There can be a solution to use Bitcoin Lightening Network. It's also a good idea if he use Binance Pay ID. I am not sure if it will be a good idea but he can use other blockchain for Bitcoin to receive payments as sender will have to pay a very lower fees.

Well, that's also an good idea of using bitcoin lighting network but the transaction fee difference is not that much. So, it will still cost them. And i think the Pay ID method is better as it provide free transaction fee.

But still, as i mentioned,op has to provide different ways to customers for there easiness to pay in BTC. And i found many other alternatives of lighting network technology but i prefer this one. Now it all depends on the customer, as not every customer is using lighting network for transaction.

usekevin

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The bitcoin transaction fee was high for longer and it’s like 10 dollar transaction fee for the 20 dollar transaction.So many people had suffered a lot at the time of this transaction fee increase.In such conditions,the experienced people should use of holding their coins during that situation.Some uses the holding altcoin to compensate during such situations.NFT also increased the use of crypto currency and increased the transaction fee too.

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Quote from: Litzki1990 on June 23, 2023, 01:09:00 PM

A big problem for small traders is Bitcoin's high transaction fees. Because most of the money that small traders invest in Bitcoin is spent on fees. As a result, many small traders have withdrawn from this type of business. When Bitcoin transaction fees were normal, it was very easy to make Bitcoin transactions with very small fees, but recently, due to the increase in transaction fees, this is no longer possible. It is not only a problem for small traders but it is a big problem for all types of traders. Big traders often need to do small transactions at that time but they cannot do small transactions due to extra transaction fees.

I am pretty sure fees are not that high. Obviously if you gonna go to the shop and buy dollar worth stuff then that's different story. Yet you can set the fees and priorities the transaction speeds for bigger ones.

As discussed by various fellow member LN is something that we should start learning and adopting all the way through crypto space.

There are ways to overcome this, and that is through the lightening network. Though I am just learning about this just now and willing to be a peer for the network it seems perfect solution for the same. May be just the right one and they can get instantaneous transaction with this so no long waits in the que neither waiting of the confirmation or vice versa. I am not sure how this strategy or network can be implemented on the shop keepers desk but for sure it will take lot of infrastructure and support from various organizations that can reach out to that level.

Litzki1990

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A big problem for small traders is Bitcoin's high transaction fees. Because most of the money that small traders invest in Bitcoin is spent on fees. As a result, many small traders have withdrawn from this type of business. When Bitcoin transaction fees were normal, it was very easy to make Bitcoin transactions with very small fees, but recently, due to the increase in transaction fees, this is no longer possible. It is not only a problem for small traders but it is a big problem for all types of traders. Big traders often need to do small transactions at that time but they cannot do small transactions due to extra transaction fees.

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Quote from: Kelward on June 21, 2023, 03:59:13 PM

My problem with these high transaction fees, is that customers naturally wants to minimize expenses, so if they choose to make payments with bitcoin, then they will want to exchange it at the exact rate of USD. So the seller bears the cost of the high fees alone, which may lead to selling at a loss. Although I'm guessing that the high fees might not affect big business owners, who receive payments in bitcoin, because they sell with higher profits, and when they minus the cost of the high transaction fees, it still won't affect their overall profits.

What is there in transaction fee, the question you should have asked yourself is will you be worried is will you complain if you are sending bitcoin to an exchange, you will surely pay the transaction fee to the miner before it gets to anyone, instead of converting on exchange and trade or swap to get other currencies, I would bear the cost of transaction since I'm the one buying. However, considering how high the naira to the dollar is in Nigeria, I will settle for Bitcoin through lightening Network.

Quote

I feel that this is a big edge that fiat currencies have over bitcoin, because you don't have to pay extra to buy goods or services, even when you make fiat payments through banks, they only charge a token as transfer fees. So this high fees is a disadvantage to small business owners like me who has the intention of receiving payments in bitcoin.

I understand your frustration when you convert $$ to naira, they look big but when you look at the other countries that make payments through dollars, you will choose to make payments through Bitcoin as you will not be paying just the fees when you used card or fiat, the associated task will discourage you.

BitcoinTurk

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To talk about the last few months we can see that there has been a serious increase in miner commissions due to the serious popularity of Bitcoin NFT's. Although this does not indicate a permanent rise on miner fees, we usually see increase abnormally when there is high hyped NFT mints. This has a very serious negative impact especially for receiving or sending small amount of payments. Considering such situations it would be better to prefer blockchains such as Solana, which have low transaction commissions in addition to the option to receive payments with Bitcoin. Of course, choosing a different cryptocurrency may not be very positive for users who will pay but it will be a good remedy to avoid high miner commissions.

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Quote from: Kelward on June 21, 2023, 03:59:13 PM

I feel that this is a big edge that fiat currencies have over bitcoin, because you don't have to pay extra to buy goods or services, even when you make fiat payments through banks, they only charge a token as transfer fees. So this high fees is a disadvantage to small business owners like me who has the intention of receiving payments in bitcoin.

I appreciate your recognition to utilize Bitcoin for small business transactions, which reflects how deep Bitcoin is integrating in activities of our everyday life. As many members have already recommended to use Binance account for making payments, but it will necessarily require all your customers and suppliers to maintain their accounts with Binance exchange which seems quite difficult task. An alternative option worth considering, is to explore possibility of using Lightning network of Bitcoin which is relatively low cost solution.

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Quote from: Faisal2202 on June 21, 2023, 04:46:12 PM

No wonder, the transaction fee is so much for small business, but if you trust your customer so much, you should ask them to pay at the end of month, this the amount will be huge and your customer has to pay few dollars only. But it has its own limitation like customer could scam you.

This Idea will make his Business more troublesome and this is not a good idea to grow his business at all. It can affect his business with bad impact. Because people aren't much responsible to pay due payments after buying anything.

There can be a solution to use Bitcoin Lightening Network. It's also a good idea if he use Binance Pay ID. I am not sure if it will be a good idea but he can use other blockchain for Bitcoin to receive payments as sender will have to pay a very lower fees.

19Nov16

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The thing that makes it difficult for us to use Bitcoin for direct transactions is a very expensive transaction fee, to send bitcoin with trust wallet it takes around $ 0.6 to $ 2 depending on the network's busy schedule, and when the price of bitcoin is more than $ 60k, I once sent $ 140 at a cost of $ 8.

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Quote from: Kelward on June 21, 2023, 03:59:13 PM

I feel that this is a big edge that fiat currencies have over bitcoin, because you don't have to pay extra to buy goods or services, even when you make fiat payments through banks, they only charge a token as transfer fees. So this high fees is a disadvantage to small business owners like me who has the intention of receiving payments in bitcoin.

Bitcoin network fees aren't always high, it only becomes high during a specific amount of time when Bitcoin network gets congested but that doesn't always happen and if such situations were to repeat itself, you can make use of lightening network to avoid your customers paying high fee for faster confirmation. Lightning network has been in use for some years now and businesses using it doesn't have any challenge.

Don't worry you're not using an altcoins that the value might drop or you have to convert it to Bitcoin. Lightening network still makes use of Bitcoin not altcoins for its transaction and you'll receive the transaction instantly. But this isn't a problem because majority of the time Bitcoin fee is low.

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I don't know who told you that bitcoin transaction fees are high, but it's best to avoid relying on sources like makeuseof.
I've never run a store before, but I've bought several digital products for an average of $30 to $600 and it's cost me less than a dollar on average for most transactions. Currency volatility may be a more convincing reason, although you must understand the risks associated with this industry, which must be thought of as part of the future development of these currencies. Imagine as if you bought Apple shares in the early 2000s.

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Quote from: bussybuddy on June 23, 2023, 02:45:43 AM

What is the real solution to the OP's problem? What I see here are the payments of dissatisfaction between the parties, but are there more specific numbers, I mean what range is your business's payment at 1btc, or 100btc, or simply is a few tens of dollars in btc, really knowing btc and the crypto market without looking at solutions to altcoins is a waste. Are you willing to accept XRP, LTC,... payments for your business, the fees are significantly settled, and they still don't lose value encouraging more people to use crypto as well as btc.

If there is still a solution, this kind of thing shouldn't be a problem because small entrepreneurs can still use other alternatives for this kind of thing and some of the alternatives that you suggest are also not bad to use if both parties agree to complete the transaction. But lately I think the transaction fees on Bitcoin are not that big either and are still in the very reasonable category, because the sender can still reduce the fees as he wants even though the transaction takes a little longer to be successful.

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Bitcoin fees are cheap if the transactions you make are large and international. if transactions are made in small amounts, such as payments at cafes, etc., it seems ineffective to use bitcoin as payment.

but if you don't mind fees and want to use your bitcoins directly where they support it, it seems that using bitcoins is a good option. especially when paying using bitcoin, senders don't need to worry about their identity and transaction security will be more guaranteed. so the choice is yours whether you want to pay with bitcoin or not.

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What is the real solution to the OP's problem? What I see here are the payments of dissatisfaction between the parties, but are there more specific numbers, I mean what range is your business's payment at 1btc, or 100btc, or simply is a few tens of dollars in btc, really knowing btc and the crypto market without looking at solutions to altcoins is a waste. Are you willing to accept XRP, LTC,... payments for your business, the fees are significantly settled, and they still don't lose value encouraging more people to use crypto as well as btc.

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Quote from: redwine49 on June 21, 2023, 07:41:21 PM

Quote from: coupable on June 21, 2023, 04:21:05 PM

This is a great initiative and I personally would love for people to use Bitcoin for their daily small businesses. This will be the biggest incentive for the rest to dare to use Bitcoin.
It is good that you have thought about this point before you start accepting bitcoin payments. Indeed, it is a big problem for small businesses to accept payments in small amounts for everyday products. But there really is a solution to that that you may not have come across.
The solution is to use the Lightning Network, which enables you to make transfers in small amounts on channels parallel to the Bitcoin network, and then send all the amounts in one transfer on the main network. Here are some useful links:
How to use the Lightning network?
Lightning Network questions

i think not many people are using lightning network and both of them must be the same network.
base on this
lightningnetworkstore there are 682 stores that use lightning network.
but it's slow adoption

Don't you think that 682 is a good number for the number of stores that use the Lightning Network, which proves that its use is fairly widespread? We may not be able to know the extent of the demand for using this service in those stores, but I am sure that it is almost the only solution for conducting transactions in small amounts on the Bitcoin Blockchain network. Today, there are many trading platforms that support the Lightning Network, which helped encourage more people to use it.
Of course, there are other methods that can be adopted, such as using alternative currencies with lower conversion fees, or using the internal conversion feature on Binance or other platforms. I just tried to accurately answer the OP's question about how to make payments using bitcoin in particular.

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Quote from: Beparanf on June 22, 2023, 05:47:52 AM

Even with SMES that selling low value item usually not advisable to use Bitcoin as mode of payment because of fee and the transaction speed. Lightning network is the solution but it’s not popular to many people which means only few accept this even on exchange.

I think the only time it’s good to accept Bitcoin as small business owner is if you will consider this Bitcoin payment as your long term investment and use your pocket money instead to replenish your business balance that goes to Bitcoin.

The good thing about crypto is that you do not have to use bitcoin all the time, you can use other coins which means that it would be cheap. Like lets say I will send you 5 dollars for a cup of coffee, I can do that with USDT which is stable so you do not lose any money, and do that with TRC20 so it won't cost a lot neither. That's the way to approach things and I am going to be able to pay you without much transaction cost.

It's not an easy task to get everyone to accept that, but if shop owners are worried about it, that's a good way and quick way too. You get the money right away, and nobody spends much money on it, and nobody loses or takes any risks. Even market movements doesn't matter in that case because you got a stablecoin.

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Quote from: adzino on June 22, 2023, 10:58:59 PM

It's not high at all right now. Like just few cents and even less if you can wait for a while for the network confirmations. Yeah, I won't deny that the fees are high when the network is congested and it is something that we have to deal with, but I am sure, in the future, we will come up with some solution to these issues without compromising decentralization or security of the network. Also, you can use altcoins that have very low fees and very fast network confirmation. There are some good altcoins out there which might be helpful for "small business owners".

Even with the transaction fee today, it is still considered high for the small businesses. Imagine paying $0.55 transaction fee for a $10 purchase, that's every purchase. If you want to maximize the use of your transaction fee, you need to buy everything you need in 1 transaction, otherwise you'll another fee for another transaction. There's a much cheaper fee but it'll really takes time before your bitcoin will come through.
Lightning network will be the beginning of the solution about high transaction fees and slow transaction. It's will just be a matter of time and we'll get to see this happen in the near future.

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It's not high at all right now. Like just few cents and even less if you can wait for a while for the network confirmations. Yeah, I won't deny that the fees are high when the network is congested and it is something that we have to deal with, but I am sure, in the future, we will come up with some solution to these issues without compromising decentralization or security of the network. Also, you can use altcoins that have very low fees and very fast network confirmation. There are some good altcoins out there which might be helpful for "small business owners".

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Quote from: Kelward on June 22, 2023, 04:26:33 AM

Using Binance, has also been suggested to me, that it is a better option to escape bitcoin high transaction fees. I would love to make the efforts to introduce my customers to the use of Binance, as an exchange in our transactions, but Binance is presently having an issue with SEC in my country. Nevertheless, I'll still keep the option in mind, pending when they resolve their matter.

Accepting Bitcoin via Binance does not mean that you offer your customers the experience of using cryptocurrencies, but you risk the possibility of losing your money, as Binance is a centralized entity, and if it is hacked, your money has disappeared and no one will guarantee it to you.

Why not give the user several options such as paying by coingate and BTCPAYSERVER with the possibility of adding a lightning network, all of which will reduce your exposure to fees and consider that the money that goes directly to your wallet is similar to DCA.

Quote from: Kelward on June 22, 2023, 04:26:33 AM

Also, lightening networks is another option to manoeuvre this high fees, but frankly I don't understand how it works yet. I'll go through and diligently study the links that have been shared on this topic.

This is very easy with BTCPAYSERVER you need a little bit of technical knowledge which can be gained from YouTube videos, hiring a developer or using third party applications.

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