Topic: Bitcoin negatives - page 2. (Read 764 times)

This is something I wholeheartedly agree, we may not have any solution to it that is better than bitcoin right now and that is why it matters so much.

The only fair thing I could say about bitcoin is that it does spend a lot of energy right now and we could definitely find a better suited program that would be better, staking that ETH uses so far seems to be working and turning bitcoin into that may take many many years but at least we have a way to do that and I think it should be important to keep repeating that whenever we can, it should be a big deal. Obviously it will take some time but we could make that work and that's important. Of course it is not that big of a deal if you are not careful about it as well.

They can never buy all the coins, or even all the Miner. The most hodlers will not sell all their coins, i think. The price would be too high to sell all of them and a big part of coins is lost, so they will never buy them. And all the Miners around the world, oh no, that is impossible too. All over the world there are different ways to buy a miner or run it online. Many of them will not sell everything if the price is very good, they will always keep a small part and protect it.

This is very funny, Fiat can buy miners and Bitcoin, and that makes central bank the winner? Why must they buy? They should try to print Bitcoin if truly they are worthy to be a winner, since they can print money as they want, buying Bitcoin makes them bow to Bitcoin.

It's like Bitcoin saying, You have to buy me or buy miners to get me, you can't print me, Since central banks are in control of paper money, that's the least of what they can control, they have no power over Bitcoin.

Being able to print money and buy doesn't make them the winner, remember, they aren't the only ones buying, They have to join the queue of millions of buyers around the world, there are no levels to prove here.

With Bitcoin, you give something to get some Bitcoin, with Fiat they give nothing but use paper and ink to print money. The difference is night and day.

OP's thread is a stupid and pointless topic. There is no denying that bitcoin mining requires energy and the result of mining is also emitting waste that pollutes the environment. But if judged fairly, all industries use energy and are polluting the environment to a certain extent. What's more important is that they all serve the benefit of the user, and the user is us. Bitcoin too, it is bringing a lot of benefits to us from profits and other utilities. So, it would be quite one-sided and somewhat stupid to deliberately slander bitcoin mining and ignore other industries.

Yes, the creation of new bitcoins carries a similar trail described above.
But did gold or diamond mining bring more positivity? A huge amount of blood was shed for these valuable resources, in the same way it can be argued that the effort to extract gold bullion could have been spent on extracting food or building houses for the poor. But why ? The world is full of people who are controlled not by altruism but by greed and greed for profit. And that's fine.

Let's talk about dollars and any fiat. They are printed, is this a completely eco-friendly production? In addition to electricity, chemical components are used for this when compared with cryptocurrency mining. Therefore, I do not consider bitcoin mining to be something harmful to the world.

You don't understand what a premined coin is. Premine means part of the coin is mined, or put away, before coin's launch, so that the community cannot have access, unless that part of the supply is released by the person controlling it. In case of bitcoin the supply is distributed among users with the help of a free market. There was and there will be no premine, regardless of when you are born.


When it comes to buying all the bitcoin, only roughly 2 million is available for sale on exchanges. In theory countries could buy it all out with printed money, but they'd be able to buy only as much as there is for sale. After buying 50% of supply on exchanges the price would skyrocket to some crazy prices because people would start testing them out, opening trades for 1M USD, then 2, 5, and so on. If they saw their 5M sales complete, they'd set the next one for 10 and so on. Which country would be able to print so much money that they'd be buying bitcoin at the price of $10M a coin?

Supply and demand have to stay balanced. If someone crates increasing demand, the market price is going to increase exponentially into infinite numbers, meaning that after all coins on exchanges are bought out, the sky is the limit as to what people would want for their coins.

All your arguments have nothing to do with Bitcoin itself. But I will try to go through your list with solutions, point by point.

1. A capped supply is a good thing, unless you prefer inflation because the supply keeps being artificially pumped.

2. Bitcoin does not cause toxic waste. Miners do. But so do personal computers and phones. That's not a Bitcoin problem.

3. Energy problems are rooted in how we produce energy. Blaming the consumers in how they use energy is backwards thinking.

4. 1 person could theoretically own 50% of the network. But thanks to POW, that's not realistic.

5. You can buy miners with BTC.

6. Network fees are not that high. See lightning network.

Your thread is a useless one and you know that yourself. First of all, I should clarify one thing for you that it's literally impossible for a single person to control 51% of the network and even 50% of the network. No one is rich enough to control that much of the network not even a whole country can control that much of the network in current times.

You're totally wrong the Bitcoin transactions are quite fast and smooth and the shortest time a transaction takes is just 10 minutes. Sometimes the transactions takes 30 minutes and that's still okay because the transactions made using Bitcoin are safe and no other payment method is close to the safety that Bitcoin transactions provide.

You're wrong high network fee costs more than a whole roasted chicken but only during the times when network is congested. On regular times the transaction fee is quite low and the best thing about it is that even if you make a transaction of $10000000 to a single address the fee will remain the same.

Bitcoin doesn't creates any kind of toxic wastes because it's totally digital in nature. The pollution caused is due to the mining equipment's or due to heat that they produce. The Bitcoin is totally pollution-less and I must say that most of the miners are shifting towards green and renewable energy resources which doesn't deplete anything in a adverse way.

How is this specific to PoW, and would not apply to every other industry that uses electricity?

And at an even more relevant note, what other industry would work just as well as before when you scale its electricity supply down to 50%? 1%? 0,1%?

I may not say that bitcoin is 100% the perfect solution but what it offers us today is the exact solution to the financial and economical challenges we are all facing with the government, so when you're talking about negative aspect i may not argue much because it will surely exist no matter how the little or small it may appear, the advantage is what we look on to and embrace the decentralization for our own personal interest, the solution is far better than any form of negative influence others may thought about with bitcoin adoption.

It wouldn't even make any sense.
- Central bankers decide to buy all the bitcoins.
- Every hodler gets filthy rich in the process.
- Central bankers now hold all the supply, but since no one is buying/using it, it becomes worthless.
- Bitcoiners either buy it back for pennies or just fork a new version.

That's one sh*tty attack vector if you ask me.

Fiat is stable between today and tomorrow but after a while, few years, several decades, we see fiat currency loses its purchasing power. It is less terrible with fiat currencies at big nations with better inflation controls and stronger economies. Unfortunately, it is more terrible at nations with weaker, unhealthier economies and hyper inflationary policies from governments that care more about their benefits than their citizens' benefits.

As investors, we care more about profit, growth of our capital and we tend to accept risk to achieve profit. Whether profit we get in fiat value worth anything, it is another story and depends on each national central bank and their fiat currency.

If we are to consider today and tomorrow, then we can say that fiat is stable. But we, humans, plan much ahead. We consider our future in years. Fiat, in this sense, is not really a stable way to store value. If we are saving fiat for our children's college education, for example, we will realize how unstable this money is. It only took a little more than a decade for the minimum public transportation fare in my locality to grow 140%. This isn't stability.

Anyway, I agree that coexistence is much more likely than Bitcoin taking over fiat. But then I'm not losing hope that when the time comes when people would finally demand that money be separated from state, Bitcoin would be the preferred choice.

I'm sure in 2140 you can start a new thread complaining how every single bitcoin has been mined.

Oh, sure, because gold extraction, just to make an example, doesn't ruin entire ecosystems, right?

The energy, which is electricity, can be used to feed people? How?

And yet nobody has done it.

Now? Because now criminals stopped caring about cash, gold, diamonds, etc? Now everything is about bitcoin?

Very funny thread.

Most of these points are not valid, some of them are more about mining than Bitcoin per se. Also, Bitcoin is not a currency and it wasn't meant to be instant or cheap. LN can be used to buy coffee and for similar instant transactions.

Some "facts" are outright BS, like this one: Only 1 miner wins in the end then it becomes centralized, he can push all the other miners out. This will be the FED.
this simulation proves it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q41RW6bxpM4

So many loads of bullshit here but this one caught my attention.
What the hell do you mean by this? How do you want someone's money to go to schools, garbage, and Medicare? Is that how the charity works?
Imagine saying people's part of people's salary should compulsorily go to charity. That's some bullshit.
The miners work for every penny they get so whatever money they get is earned.

making it sound as if bitcoin's the only cryptocurrency there is, and as if the remaining 7% is going to be mined willy-nilly. It's going to take another 120 years before you fully mine the bitcoin supply, and even if that happens it doesn't mean that the whole structure of bitcoin will fall down. Mining is one of its ventures but there are a plethora of ways for people to make money here. I'd argue that soon as the total supply's mined completely it could even urge a global movement of using bitcoin as a bona fide currency, meaning the adoption that some people are looking for's coming to fruition.

Plus the transaction times you're sad about is solved by layer-2 issues. Every bad thing you throw at bitcoin, a solution or a workaround was made for it already.

Some of these are incredibly funny. One person can have %50 of the mining power is technically true, I would love to see someone try though lol. We are talking about tens of billions of dollars worth of investment for a small uptick, which should be done in a way that nobody else would ever do anything about it at the same time, and no blockchain change would have to happen to prevent you at the same time. Have you been around when we moved from legacy to segwit? Because that's literally what we did and suddenly miners lost their power. The energy that can be used for cancer research? Aviation is the biggest cause of cancer by that logic lol. Lets be real, some of these are "technically true" but in reality not so much.

mined =/= premined


How so? Why am I to blame for other person hurting someone for their bitcoins? Am I to blame for fiat-related crimes as well because I use fiat? Or does it only work for Bitcoin?

We were all newbies once, but I sure do wish that we could somehow make it harder for them to post crap like this.

Firstly, the supply system is regulated as you might know, so 93% of mined coins doesn't really make a difference. Toxic waste? Do you know how small that is compared to big companies?
How do you exactly feed or cure people with energy? Hypothetical nonsense isn't really accountable - "You could of do this instead of that".

Other nonsense points aside,

Why the hell would the fees go for those causes? Your fiat money will get taxed for this, no need to get Bitcoin into that.
There are some delays sometimes, but most of the time if you give a decent fee, it will be processed rather quick. Your bank also charges provision for your transactions, nothing is free. I doubt there are many people buying coffee with Bitcoin, but even if they do, I doubt that the fee will be bigger than the product/service bought.

As you are a hater, I would suggest going elsewhere to spread nonsense against Bitcoin since you will just be defeated by arguments here. It wont get you anywhere.