I think the best advices are already given:
1. build a pool which accepts dust. Problem: why should a pool accept dust, when at the same time it could collect transactions with fees bigger than dust?
2. wait for further increase of BTC value until dust becomes valuable. I think this will be the time when the BTC devs will think about new approaches to handle the blockchain.
If I were to collect dust amounts I'd simply wait it out.
Topic: Bitcoin network is rejecting Bitcoin microtransactions - page 2. (Read 3439 times)
I like the idea of a pool supporting zero fee dust transactions, but I guess this pool would not get serious hashing power
And you continue on with more complete nonsense.
There's no doubt in my mind now, you have no idea how bitcoin really works.
There's no doubt in my mind now, you have no idea how bitcoin really works.
There's already been a vote, and the bitcoin network agrees. What don't you understand about that? We DO NOT want dust transactions spamming the transaction backlog. People with real money need to be able to move bitcoins.
The bitcoin developers can't implement this change either, it has to be the miners. All the miners already decided that they don't want you or your dust transactions. No amount of crying in the world is going to change that.
You clearly don't understand bitcoin at all.
Quote
There's already been a vote, and the bitcoin network agrees
So if the bitcoin network agrees so where is the problem with microtransactions ?
Quote
We DO NOT want dust transactions spamming the transaction backlog.
Who is WE ?
Any Bitcoin transactions is legal transaction under Bitcoin standards.
If you claim Mr. Satoshi did something wrong or his idea has week points
just say so.
http://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
The only official website endorsed by Mr. Satoshi is the above
Bitcoin: A Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash System
Satoshi Nakamoto
[email protected]
www.bitcoin.org
www.bitcoin.org
Can you see any ban on microtransactions in Bitcoin ?
Money is money and there is no dust money.
Under Proof-of-work, Merkle Tree algorithms implemented by Mr. Satoshi and nonce0, nonce1, nonce2
implemented by mining pools it takes the same amount of time to sign a block with one transaction
as with 1,000 or 1M transactions since Merkle Tree algorithm is very fast.
Microtransactions can generate just another Blockchain if you are afraid of so called "Bitcoin dust spamming"
But solution is not really complicated as exactly in case of no-reward, zero-fee transactions in general.
You can earn BTC 25 ... BTC 25.05 or nothing
There is no need to violate the genuine idea by Mr. Satoshi and claim Bitcoin transaction fees as charged by real banks in real worlds.
There is no need to punish those doing zero-fee, no-reward transactions since your reward is still granted by the system - BTC 25 as of today.
as Mr. Satoshi said :
Quote
A block header with no transactions would be about 80 bytes. If we suppose blocks are
generated every 10 minutes, 80 bytes * 6 * 24 * 365 = 4.2MB per year. With computer systems
typically selling with 2GB of RAM as of 2008, and Moore's Law predicting current growth of
1.2GB per year, storage should not be a problem even if the block headers must be kept in
memory.
generated every 10 minutes, 80 bytes * 6 * 24 * 365 = 4.2MB per year. With computer systems
typically selling with 2GB of RAM as of 2008, and Moore's Law predicting current growth of
1.2GB per year, storage should not be a problem even if the block headers must be kept in
memory.
There is no WE DO or WE DO NOT in Botcoin network since there only one man in charge of the Bitcoin network and his name is Mr. Satoshi.
Since Mr. Satoshi endorsed Bitcoin microtransactions there is no sense to claim otherwise.
One Blockchain for > 0.01 BTC transactions
and one Blockchain for zero-fee microtransactions < 0.01 BTC
can be established, maintained and supported by Bitcoin network.
There is nothing in the Articles of Incorporation of the Bitcoin to oppose the above.
If we, the poor people let Bitcoin transaction fees to keep growing on, so one day Bitcoin idea by Mr. Satoshi may collapse since real banks in real worlds can offer better terms and support for no-fee microtransactions and real-time verification and booking of microtransactions,
making people to forget about high-fee Bitcoin transactions.
Quote
And it is done that way because the core developers implemented it
Exactly the case.
Core developers can implement support for micro and nano transactions any time
to let us donate Bitcoin dust to local and global foundations.
As with any p2p public project on the Internet, there is one man (VIP) behind the project,
who can suggest and enforce such nice solution to be implemented.
If you suggest public voting is required to implement Bitcoin microtransactions
so just let us vote.
There's already been a vote, and the bitcoin network agrees. What don't you understand about that? We DO NOT want dust transactions spamming the transaction backlog. People with real money need to be able to move bitcoins.
The bitcoin developers can't implement this change either, it has to be the miners. All the miners already decided that they don't want you or your dust transactions. No amount of crying in the world is going to change that.
You clearly don't understand bitcoin at all.
Quote
And it is done that way because the core developers implemented it
Exactly the case.
Core developers can implement support for micro and nano transactions any time
to let us donate Bitcoin dust to local and global foundations.
As with any p2p public project on the Internet, there is one man (VIP) behind the project,
who can suggest and enforce such nice solution to be implemented.
If you suggest public voting is required to implement Bitcoin microtransactions
so just let us vote.
Please, try to read my whole answer instead of pointing out one thing. For example:
To sum it all up, yes you can make a mining pool to accept dust payments. Good luck with that though.
Why do you suggest our skilled craftsmen should work for free, if awarded with 25BTC on every
block signed
I didn't suggest that. I said:block signed
It only works by dividing the 25BTC block reward among the miners working for your pool, considering fees are negligible at the moment.
I think pontiacg5, Foxpup and I have made it very clear why we think your ideas and understanding isn't right. We're just trying to help you and give you our opinions. You are implying that Bitcoin is unfair regarding to dust payments, but that's implemented the way it is because of what pontiacg5 explains. And it is done that way because the core developers implemented it and the majority of miners think it is the best way.To sum it all up, yes you can make a mining pool to accept dust payments. Good luck with that though.
You can try that, but it's not gonna work.
===============================
Nobody wants to mine without earning anything.
=====================================
===============================
Nobody wants to mine without earning anything.
=====================================
Ok, "minting" pool, populated by thousands of of dust Bitcoin owners (skilled craftsmen),
interested to have their micro and nano Bitcoin transactions signed
can be self-supported and run on the same basis as any other mining pool
I can offer renewable energy solutions to power up computer facilities, ASIC, nano computing at zero-cost
so we can reduce are costs and share 25BTC among members.
Earning on share basis can work the same way as any pool mining.
email me if you are interested to have your dust, micro nano Bitcoin transactions supported
by a new micro transactions 25BTC "minting" pool made of skilled craftsmen
Why do you suggest our skilled craftsmen should work for free, if awarded with 25BTC on every
block signed
Skilled craftsman that don't understand how ridiculous setting up a mining operation to save dust transactions are, or any of the fundamentals of bitcoin for that matter. People trying to move dust don't have the capital to own mining equipment. People with real mining equipment don't waste time jacking with $.005.
If you have dust, sit on it. Hopefully BTC goes up in value and what you hold is no longer worth $.005. Doing anything else with it right now is a righteous waste of time.
The transaction fee is there to keep tards such as yourself from choking bitcoin out with bogus worthless dust transactions. Only so many transactions can be processed so fast. It makes absolute sense to let people with no value at all in bitcoin control the network as if they had a stake in the project
You can try that, but it's not gonna work.
===============================
Nobody wants to mine without earning anything.
=====================================
===============================
Nobody wants to mine without earning anything.
=====================================
Ok, "minting" pool, populated by thousands of of dust Bitcoin owners (skilled craftsmen),
interested to have their micro and nano Bitcoin transactions signed
can be self-supported and run on the same basis as any other mining pool
I can offer renewable energy solutions to power up computer facilities, ASIC, nano computing at zero-cost
so we can reduce are costs and share 25BTC among members.
Earning on share basis can work the same way as any pool mining.
email me if you are interested to have your dust, micro nano Bitcoin transactions supported
by a new micro transactions 25BTC "minting" pool made of skilled craftsmen
Why do you suggest our skilled craftsmen should work for free, if awarded with 25BTC on every
block signed
thank you
"
you could run your own mining pool to accept micro-tx.
If people out there supports your idea, they would prefer your pool over the others and points their miners to your pool.
"
I am exactly interested to establish no-fee, zero-award 25 BTC minting" pool, accepting micro, nano transactions, to let us trade in, collect, process, aggregate , donate "Bitcoin dust"
Can you guide me on how to start with micro, nano transactions "minting" pool ?
"
you could run your own mining pool to accept micro-tx.
If people out there supports your idea, they would prefer your pool over the others and points their miners to your pool.
"
I am exactly interested to establish no-fee, zero-award 25 BTC minting" pool, accepting micro, nano transactions, to let us trade in, collect, process, aggregate , donate "Bitcoin dust"
Can you guide me on how to start with micro, nano transactions "minting" pool ?
Start by getting enough hashing power to maintain at least a block a day. Right now, that's 60,000 gh/s. You'll need to increase the hashrate something in the area of 5-25% every two weeks.
There sure are a lot of people out there lined up ready and waiting to mine solely for the purpose of gathering dust
You can try that, but it's not gonna work. Nobody wants to mine without earning anything. And it only works if you manage to mine a block, which needs a large amount of hashing power.
It only works by dividing the 25BTC block reward among the miners working for your pool, considering fees are negligible at the moment.
It only works by dividing the 25BTC block reward among the miners working for your pool, considering fees are negligible at the moment.
thank you
"
you could run your own mining pool to accept micro-tx.
If people out there supports your idea, they would prefer your pool over the others and points their miners to your pool.
"
I am exactly interested to establish no-fee, zero-award 25 BTC minting" pool, accepting micro, nano transactions, to let us trade in, collect, process, aggregate , donate "Bitcoin dust"
Can you guide me on how to start with micro, nano transactions "minting" pool ?
"
you could run your own mining pool to accept micro-tx.
If people out there supports your idea, they would prefer your pool over the others and points their miners to your pool.
"
I am exactly interested to establish no-fee, zero-award 25 BTC minting" pool, accepting micro, nano transactions, to let us trade in, collect, process, aggregate , donate "Bitcoin dust"
Can you guide me on how to start with micro, nano transactions "minting" pool ?
You're hard to convince. You are citing the Bitcoin wiki, but that's just one sentence. It continues with
Quote
, but for transactions which draw coins from many bitcoin addresses and therefore have a large data size, a small transaction fee is usually expected.
FurthermoreQuote
Transaction fees are voluntary on the part of the person making the bitcoin transaction, as the person attempting to make a transaction can include any fee or none at all in the transaction. On the other hand, nobody mining new bitcoins necessarily needs to accept the transactions and include them in the new block being created. The transaction fee is therefore an incentive on the part of the bitcoin user to make sure that a particular transaction will get included into the next block which is generated.
So yes, mining exists in Bitcoin. Of course it's used as an analogy, but it has many parallels to actual mining. It takes time and energy, and you're not sure if you "mine" anything at all. So the 25 BTC is mined, and the transaction fee is a reward from the ones who want to make a transaction to keep the network secure and/or want to speed up the time that the transaction is included in one of the next blocks. 
Read carefully -
no need for transaction fee
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees
"
At the moment, many transactions are typically processed in a way where no fee is expected at all
"
no need for transaction fee
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees
"
At the moment, many transactions are typically processed in a way where no fee is expected at all
"
You could always make no-fee tx, it will just take a longer time to be included in a block.
Just as Foxpup mentioned, if you are not happy with all the pools, you could run your own mining pool to accept micro-tx.
If people out there supports your idea, they would prefer your pool over the others and points their miners to your pool.
"
Mining is a business, not a "challenge", and you don't "win" anything, you get paid for providing a service.
"
Nothing is mined in Bitcoin technology.
Collector's item - Bitcoin - is minted by skilled craftsmen
and traded freely, purchased by other collectors.
You don't get paid for Bitcoin service
all you can do is to mint 25 Bitcoin today
and sell Bitcoin at Bitcoin exchange
or buy service, goods paying with Bitcoins, if accepted by the seller, trader.
Bitcoin minting is R&D challenge in maths, IT, quantum computing, 1Ph/s ASIC technology, cryptography
Read carefully -
no need for transaction fee
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees
"
At the moment, many transactions are typically processed in a way where no fee is expected at all
"
Mining is a business, not a "challenge", and you don't "win" anything, you get paid for providing a service.
"
Nothing is mined in Bitcoin technology.
Collector's item - Bitcoin - is minted by skilled craftsmen
and traded freely, purchased by other collectors.
You don't get paid for Bitcoin service
all you can do is to mint 25 Bitcoin today
and sell Bitcoin at Bitcoin exchange
or buy service, goods paying with Bitcoins, if accepted by the seller, trader.
Bitcoin minting is R&D challenge in maths, IT, quantum computing, 1Ph/s ASIC technology, cryptography
Read carefully -
no need for transaction fee
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees
"
At the moment, many transactions are typically processed in a way where no fee is expected at all
"
Cost of electricity is your own option and risk to join a challenge and win BTC 25.
Cost of electricity is not an "option" or "risk", it's an overhead expense of running a business. Mining is a business, not a "challenge", and you don't "win" anything, you get paid for providing a service. As a business operator, you don't have to provide your service to people who refuse to pay, or are consuming more of your resources than they're paying for. That's just common sense.It looks like powerful VIPs took control over Bitcoin network deciding what transactions are ok and what should be delated, implementing double spending in microtransactions.
WTF are you talking about?Block creation should be time clocked process to have the same block created every 1-10 min
and distributed to every interested party not to let dirty games to be played to closing doors to
Bitcoin micropayments to poor people from Africa and other developing countries and regions.
What dirty games are you talking about?and distributed to every interested party not to let dirty games to be played to closing doors to
Bitcoin micropayments to poor people from Africa and other developing countries and regions.
What is Bitcoin dust for the VIPs from Japan, US, Europe is still a real money paid for
the poor villagers from Africa, Asia and developing countries.
No it isn't. The dust limit of BTC0.0000543 is about 5 cents. The transaction fee to send that is BTC0.0001, or about 10 cents. I guarantee that there are no poor villagers trying to pay amounts lower than 5 cents over the Internet, and getting upset that they have to pay 10 cents to do so.the poor villagers from Africa, Asia and developing countries.
Price of 1 Bitcoin can grow to $ 1,000,000 one day requesting people to stop < $ 100 payments via Bitcoin network since $100 payment may be called Bitcoin dust next year .
Transaction fees and the dust limit have already been reduced multiple times as a result of rising exchange rates. What makes you think this won't continue in the future?So micro , nano Bitcoin payments should be rolled into account balance sum assigned to one signature
every year via zero-award fee-free self-payments exactly as I can do at any real bank today.
Explain how. You do realise that "real banks" charge fees for this service, right?every year via zero-award fee-free self-payments exactly as I can do at any real bank today.
If UN and others awarded Nobel Prize for the inventor of microcredits
so let me win another Nobel Prize for micropayments solution and technology within Bitcoin network.
Your chance of winning a Nobel Prize would be slightly greater if you actually, you know, invented and implemented your solution. There's no Noble Prize for saying "wouldn't it be nice if..."so let me win another Nobel Prize for micropayments solution and technology within Bitcoin network.
I fully support Bitcoin micropayments since I work closely with UN Foundation, other UN agencies,
developing renewable energy solutions for Africa and other poor, underdeveloped regions of the globe.
No you don't. If you truly supported Bitcoin micropayments, you would be running a mining pool which allows microtransactions. As I explained in my first post, that's all you need to do to make it happen.developing renewable energy solutions for Africa and other poor, underdeveloped regions of the globe.
My intention is to implement Bitcoin micropayments into UN agencies world-wide.
What's stopping you?
Don't. I don't know how much clearer I can make this, but those bitcoins are likely to never "show up" at the address you sent them to, and at the very least it will take forever. In that time I'm sure you'll post twenty threads asking where your $0.03 worth of bitcoins are. This is why there is no option, or it's so hidden newbies can't find it.
Bitcoin isn't free, and if the network says you should pay a fee, then pay it or deal with the consequences. If you don't like that, go find another altcoin with no fees.
That being said, it's perfectly possible to send a transaction with no fee at all and still have it confirmed in a timely fashion. That transaction isn't going to be a bunch of 5430 shatoshi transactions though, you can bet on that.
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees
See the section on transaction priority
Bitcoin isn't free, and if the network says you should pay a fee, then pay it or deal with the consequences. If you don't like that, go find another altcoin with no fees.
That being said, it's perfectly possible to send a transaction with no fee at all and still have it confirmed in a timely fashion. That transaction isn't going to be a bunch of 5430 shatoshi transactions though, you can bet on that.
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees
See the section on transaction priority
Have u a tutorial for deleting or adding fees in transaction ?
Thanks a lot,
Thanks a lot,
What exactly did you, or are you wanting to, do?
Playing with raw transactions when you don't know what you are doing is a good way to loose your bitcoins.
Sending a transaction without enough fees is a good way to get bitcoins stuck in unconfirmed limbo land.
Anyway, I dont find the option to send no fees at all.
I use multibit 0.5.16
And there is no option a set or modify fees.
How could I do ?
Thanks a lot,
Have u a tutorial for deleting or adding fees in transaction ?
Thanks a lot,
Thanks a lot,
What exactly did you, or are you wanting to, do?
Playing with raw transactions when you don't know what you are doing is a good way to loose your bitcoins.
Sending a transaction without enough fees is a good way to get bitcoins stuck in unconfirmed limbo land.
Have u a tutorial for deleting or adding fees in transaction ?
Thanks a lot,
Thanks a lot,
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