Topic: Bitcoin Poor (Read 2063 times)

we all pay taxes.. while everyone moans about people 'defrauding' by taking government payments and having bitcoins cold stored, please please remember this.

these people are not receiving $50k a year + christmas bonus + travel expenses + living expenses paid for with your tax money. these people are normally only being given enough to pay other corporations in the form of utility bills and rents and food. which may only accumilate to a couple thousand a year.

for every $1 of tax you pay less then 1c goes towards welfare, yet more goes towards those useless government officials that sit in offices doing nothing. if you think the government employees deserve their high pay office jobs, just remember, when it was declared that government employees should go home and government would work on basically a skeleton crew. the world did not collapse. this goes to show that governments WASTE money on highly paid people.

now if your into facts and figures
check out the government statistics about numbers of government employment.then check out the number of unemployed people there are

now in both categories add up the weekly average income and you will see that grand total of government employees take more then people on welfare do.  yet media shout out propoganda that the cause of this crisis belongs to the people that cannot afford proper nutritional food 3 meals a day.
the tax is meant to pay for security and public services. not wasted on office jockeys, paid to do nothing in a government building

now i hope this has brought your head out of the sand just enough read this next part.

if you had the choice of turning $8k of hard earnings you made into enough within a year to never be in the poverty solution again knowing that with that wealth, the amount of sales tax and other taxes over the future years will by far compensate any initial government incomes.
or
spend those earnings and never secure a better lifestyle, and possibly remaining dependant on government incomes.

what would you choose. and the same for government.
if they knew that for under $10k they can set people up for life, out of poverty simply by buying up $8k of bitcoin and giving $2k to live on for 1 year. wouldnt that be better then having people living on unemployment payments long term

A subsidy is a subsidy.  Whether its done by a mortgage guarantee, a tax credit or a social security payment, its all taxpayer money being spent on specific people.  It costs the exact same amount and the different methods usually reflect ease of administration.

Liquidating all you own and going 'bitcoin poor' would be pretty foolish if you were talking about many years worth of accumulated assets.  But a year or less worth of savings?  In that case the time it would take you to recover from a bitcoin catastrophe would be less than a year.  So that wouldn't be too bad.  So it's a risk.

Just a few thoughts on the 'fairness' of someone on government assistance becoming rich.  First, that's how many bankers and billionaires got to where they are.  I suppose that's not fair either, but would rather give some help to the little guy.  There is legal and not legal.  In many states you are allowed to posses lots of assets and still get food stamps.  It is just the income part that matters.  If the dude on food stamps is being honest, but clever with finances, I don't think there is any thing wrong with that.  Personally I would be very happy to see food stamp and welfare people all turn into investors, growing their wealth and providing a stable household for their children.  Obviously at some point they are going to transition off state assistance, but cutting them off to early could stunt their social-economic rise.  Most of us probably had a supportive parents, a good education, etc.  If your parents had cut you off and kicked you out of the house when you were 12, you probably wouldn't be where you are today.

I think its good we help people to rise out of poverty, not just keep them fed and in poverty.



As I mentioned, it some states go about it differently.  I agree, fraud is fraud.  But if it is legal where they live, then they are being clever.  If they continue to claim food stamps once they have $200k in bitcoins, I would feel differently about that.  They would still be being legal and clever, but by the time they had $200k or so, I would hope they would start to think about giving back to society.  I guess everyone has their own opinion of when that point comes, but if you think that boundary for financial stability is $9000, I think you don't understand basic costs of living.

Please elaborate...

that's just all semantics

It's $7000 more than you can have to be eligible for foodstamps, so it's not just a moral issue.  It's fraud.

"Households may have $2,000 in countable resources, such as a bank account, or $3250 in countable resources if at least one person is age 60 or older, or is disabled."

http://www.fns.usda.gov/snap/eligibility

You do know that food stamps operate as a subsidy for low wage employers?  Don't blame the person for being caught in a badly designed system.

I'm sorry, but nobody gives you food stamps till you ask for them. A tax credit is a tax credit (taxes being fines for doing good) you somehow contributed to society, so you were rewarded with a slightly less fine. The level of your contribution for the type of reward might not be fair, but that's another matter.

Completely different, if you ask me. 

Well, in all fairness, if you can get free money, you almost have to take it. We got a huge tax credit (http://www.irs.gov/uac/First-Time-Homebuyer-Credit-1) from the IRS. I think it is a terribly stupid program, and I don't agree with it. That being said, money is money.

So, someone is sucking off the rest of us in order to invest in something that has good prospects for future growth.  Nice.   And I bet they'll never repay the rest of us for their parasitic behavior.  :-)

9 grand is more than half of a minimum wage annual salary ($7.25, for 15k annually) and while I now see it as "nothing" it most certainly is not to people actually in need of financial assistance.

Regardless, someone could feed themselves without cashing out all of their BTC. Lets just say he sells one, $900 could feed someone for 4-6 months pretty easy. The remaining 9 coins are still worth $243,000 in your scenario.

I don't much think it's fair that this guy has the opportunity to potentially become a quarter-millionaire while on the government cheese. I could easily liquidate all that I own and go "bitcoin poor" foodstamps and all, probably be a billionaire next year (still assuming your crazy "bitcoin never stops exponentially growing" scenario) Is that fair?

Be fair.  $9000 is nothing and if Bitcoin carries on in 2014 as it has in 2013, that $9000 will be $270,000 which can take him out of poverty and off the welfare rolls forever.

I have to agree. 9 grand in assets is much more than I have. I am living paycheck to paycheck, without gov assistance. Though I am not fully aware of your friend/acquaintance's full situation.

Use it to, rent a place, try and find a job, get off food stamps, etc.

correct, but it's a risk they are taking. what else would they do with the money that they would cash out now? maybe they believe that this is the best opportunity for them.

But if BTC disappears, you spend your whole life eating ramen, there is definitely risk putting all your money in one investemnt.

makes sense. go a few years eating top ramen in order to eat lobster everyday later.

small price to pay for future happiness?

They could trade them back and forth on localbitcoins.com easily with a premium of 5-10% each trade.

That is just pure dumb in my opinion. I like bitcoin, but I am not planning my entire life on the viability of the matter.

I'd even say the guy accepting foodstamps with over $9,000 in bitcoins (more than double digits, price at $900 now) is a leech...

I have about 80% of my assets in Bitcoin, but I'm not homeless either I don't know how low I would have to go, before I would sell them though.