Bitcoin Targeted By Latest FinCEN Ruling? – Implications Are Profound - page 2.

hazek

legendary

Activity: 1078

Merit: 1003

Quote from: kiba on February 16, 2012, 08:20:30 PM

Quote from: hazek on February 16, 2012, 08:18:56 PM

Riiight, well guess what, I'm not going to give mtgox my ID, my photo, or any other info about my identity. If it's mandatory to provide such personal details I will not use mtgox, PERIOD.

How do you get your bitcoin then? Selling goods and services?

Not through mtgox, that's for sure.

Yankee (BitInstant)

legendary

Activity: 1078

Merit: 1000

Charlie 'Van Bitcoin' Shrem

Quote from: hazek on February 16, 2012, 08:18:56 PM

Quote from: Yankee (BitInstant) on February 16, 2012, 07:33:33 PM

Quote from: kiba on February 16, 2012, 04:52:54 PM

Quote from: Yankee (BitInstant) on February 16, 2012, 04:42:29 PM

Wether or not it is specifically targeting MtGox or not, it definitely still pertains and applies to them.

Fortunately for MtGox, they have operating under this assumption since they began doing business.

Keep trying FinCEN.....

I would like to hear mtgox's statement on this compliance effort and their candid position on anti-money laundering.

Trust me when I tell you this. When FinCEN comes knocking, MtGox will be most prepared.

Riiight, well guess what, I'm not going to give mtgox my ID, my photo, or any other info about my identity. If it's mandatory to provide such personal details I will not use mtgox, PERIOD.

Of course, thats your choice and no one will blame you for it.

I'm merely trying to point out, that although we may think were above the law- were not. If I'm a libertarian, revolutionary, ect.. I still must work in the confides of the law and be compliant.

It basically narrows down to this.

MtGox or No MtGox...actually, let me rephrase

Bitcoin or No Bitcoin

If we want MtGox (Which I do) and other exchanges to operate legally, we must operate legally ourselves

foggyb

legendary

Activity: 1736

Merit: 1006

Quote from: RaggedMonk on February 16, 2012, 08:17:50 PM

The world of international money transfer is MUCH bigger than Bitcoin. I wouldn't be surprised if the people who made this ruling still haven't heard of Bitcoin.

Maybe not, but I'm sure their bosses have.

Compartmentalization.

kiba

legendary

Activity: 980

Merit: 1020

Quote from: hazek on February 16, 2012, 08:18:56 PM

Riiight, well guess what, I'm not going to give mtgox my ID, my photo, or any other info about my identity. If it's mandatory to provide such personal details I will not use mtgox, PERIOD.

How do you get your bitcoin then? Selling goods and services?

hazek

legendary

Activity: 1078

Merit: 1003

Quote from: Yankee (BitInstant) on February 16, 2012, 07:33:33 PM

Quote from: kiba on February 16, 2012, 04:52:54 PM

Quote from: Yankee (BitInstant) on February 16, 2012, 04:42:29 PM

Wether or not it is specifically targeting MtGox or not, it definitely still pertains and applies to them.

Fortunately for MtGox, they have operating under this assumption since they began doing business.

Keep trying FinCEN.....

I would like to hear mtgox's statement on this compliance effort and their candid position on anti-money laundering.

Trust me when I tell you this. When FinCEN comes knocking, MtGox will be most prepared.

Riiight, well guess what, I'm not going to give mtgox my ID, my photo, or any other info about my identity. If it's mandatory to provide such personal details I will not use mtgox, PERIOD.

RaggedMonk

sr. member

Activity: 308

Merit: 250

The world of international money transfer is MUCH bigger than Bitcoin. I wouldn't be surprised if the people who made this ruling still haven't heard of Bitcoin.

kiba

legendary

Activity: 980

Merit: 1020

Quote from: Jon on February 16, 2012, 07:34:51 PM

It's nothing but words on paper at the moment.

There are no real implications until FinCEN makes a move and demonstrates its might.

Better be prepared than never.

Jon

donator

Activity: 98

Merit: 12

No Gods; No Masters; Only You

It's nothing but words on paper at the moment.

There are no real implications until FinCEN makes a move and demonstrates its might.

Yankee (BitInstant)

legendary

Activity: 1078

Merit: 1000

Charlie 'Van Bitcoin' Shrem

Quote from: kiba on February 16, 2012, 04:52:54 PM

Quote from: Yankee (BitInstant) on February 16, 2012, 04:42:29 PM

Wether or not it is specifically targeting MtGox or not, it definitely still pertains and applies to them.

Fortunately for MtGox, they have operating under this assumption since they began doing business.

Keep trying FinCEN.....

I would like to hear mtgox's statement on this compliance effort and their candid position on anti-money laundering.

Trust me when I tell you this. When FinCEN comes knocking, MtGox will be most prepared.

michaelsuede

jr. member

Activity: 39

Merit: 1

Quote from: vuce on February 16, 2012, 06:35:41 PM

All the more reason for someone to make a p2p exchange.

Easier said than done. Just think of the various steps that would be involved.

How do you know a buyer has enough dollars in their bank account?

How do you access the account?

How do you know they have enough Bitcoins in their wallet for sale?

How do you pool Bitcoins so that any size order can be placed or sold?

An exchange doesn't work like eBay, where specific amounts of goods are bought and sold. An exchange pools the money so that any arbitrary amount can be bought or sold.

How do you prevent people from altering the client to broadcast more bank funds than they actually have?

It seems incredibly difficult to do those things without a central server to coordinate and secure all the action.

Boussac

legendary

Activity: 1221

Merit: 1025

e-ducat.fr

Interesting thread. The banking lobby will qualify any business thats challenging their monopoly as a business that must be "regulated".

Along the same line, I was hearing tonight a tv report stating that bank card fraud on the internet was on the rise because of the development of the e-commerce.

Apparently it did not cross the mind of the tv reporter that it could also be the result of some obsolete inefficient ill-suited payment means that the banks are forcing us to use to spend our own money.

Thats propaganda at work: brainwash or bribe the media, they will take care of their audience

oOoOo

full member

Activity: 238

Merit: 100

Here is the original post by Simon Black Some more quotes:

Quote

FinCEN’s latest ruling suggests a foreign MSB may now be subject to US regulations AND CRIMINAL PENALTIES “even if none of its agents, agencies, branches or offices are physically located in the United States.

FinCEN goes on to say that foreign-located MSBs must also comply with US anti-money laundering regulations and submit ‘suspicious activity reports’, i.e. assimilate into the US financial system and become yet another unpaid spy of the US government.

Quote

Despite the ‘free and democratic society’ that most of us live in, these agencies are accountable to no one. They are not elected officials, they have no checks and balances, and there is little (if any) judicial oversight.

Quote

FinCEN’s “rules” subjecting foreign companies to US criminal penalties, this is getting completely out of control.

Quote

Each of these rules has been conjured without your knowledge, put into effect without your consent, and tied to the most ridiculous civil and criminal penalties imaginable. You can’t even fill out a passport application anymore without being threatened with a $10,000 fine.

Bitcoin is no longer a little experiment by geeks. Bitcoin is a means of financial survival...

vuce

sr. member

Activity: 476

Merit: 250

All the more reason for someone to make a p2p exchange.

michaelsuede

jr. member

Activity: 39

Merit: 1

Quote from: Lupus_Yonderboy on February 16, 2012, 06:15:14 PM

I guess there are no countries left on the planet where someone could operate an exchange outside of US laws?

The US government doesn't care about borders.

It cares about robbing you blind no matter where you live on the planet.

Lupus_Yonderboy

full member

Activity: 153

Merit: 100

I guess there are no countries left on the planet where someone could operate an exchange outside of US laws?

cypherdoc

legendary

Activity: 1764

Merit: 1002

Quote from: kiba on February 16, 2012, 05:11:25 PM

Quote from: cypherdoc on February 16, 2012, 05:01:46 PM

Mark may or may not be experiencing the same thing; we just don't know b/c he hasn't commented on it.

From what I can tell, even Mark have some issues working with banks.

so do i understand this right that Jered had problems with California banks specifically? i never knew TH's banks were based there.

Marks are in HK and Japan so that may be encouraging.

kiba

legendary

Activity: 980

Merit: 1020

Quote from: cypherdoc on February 16, 2012, 05:01:46 PM

Mark may or may not be experiencing the same thing; we just don't know b/c he hasn't commented on it.

From what I can tell, even Mark have some issues working with banks.

cypherdoc

legendary

Activity: 1764

Merit: 1002

what i want to know is the inconsistency i'm sensing from Amir and Jered vs. Mark. Amir and Jered have already determined that working with the banks has been a horrendous experience and very costly. this i expected from the very beginning.

Mark may or may not be experiencing the same thing; we just don't know b/c he hasn't commented on it.

FreeMoney

legendary

Activity: 1246

Merit: 1016

Strength in numbers

Quote from: kiba on February 16, 2012, 04:50:55 PM

KYC is a violation of our financial privacy. In order to pay our taxes, we gave information to the IRS every year. Are you OK with this? I am doing my taxes for the first time year, but I felt like they're watching my every earning, trying to pounce me on the most obscure violation. It probably only happen to 1 in 100,000 but it probably made life hell.

1 in 100,000? You wish. Try 1 in 100.

Assuming you are talking about audits.

kiba

legendary

Activity: 980

Merit: 1020

Quote from: Yankee (BitInstant) on February 16, 2012, 04:42:29 PM

Wether or not it is specifically targeting MtGox or not, it definitely still pertains and applies to them.

Fortunately for MtGox, they have operating under this assumption since they began doing business.

Keep trying FinCEN.....

I would like to hear mtgox's statement on this compliance effort and their candid position on anti-money laundering.

Topic: Bitcoin Targeted By Latest FinCEN Ruling? – Implications Are Profound - page 2. (Read 5142 times)