Topic: Bitcoins Could Help Fight Ebola (Read 2746 times)

Regarding red:  I encourage you to do what you suggested, with or without an organized group associated with the action.    Do what you are inspired to do, if others want to help you to do good allow it.   I believe if your simple endeavor was shared with others, that others may be additionally inspired to do something.    As many have pointed out this thread opens a discussion that could lead to action.

Regarding green:  the focus was on bringing certain types of people -- people who care, to a table for caring people to discuss a problem (Ebola) to try to determine how, that group representing various interests with different resources can impact said problem in a way they determine with the resources at their disposal.

Some in that group may have a local perspective, others may have a national or global approach; some may want front-line involvement as you indicated, others may want back-office involvement ... it takes management to determine what is available and how it get it from point A to B efficiently.



if EMC2 made a donation to some org that studies a specific ebola strain
if Gridcoin moved their POR (proof of research) to target ebola topics
if worldaidcoin funded a youtube video regarding the campaign
if EDUcoin offered to buy books for each student involved with ebola research
if you contributed what you mentioned above
and many others were involved

it would all be under the umbrella of The Cryptocurrency Community Come Together To Help Fight Ebola
if its only the cause-coins involved then it would be Cause-Coins Come Together To Help Fight Ebola
if it was only EMC2 then it would be Einsteinium Community Get Together To Help Fight Ebola
if non of the above takes place it will be Armis Makes Cryptocurrency Donation To Help Fight Ebola

the point is to make the most impact with what you have.



[you still owe me an apology]

using your analogy


people WILL ask you. do you want volunteer bakers, icing experts, cake connoisseurs.. or people in PR, fundraising?
-to me i can see your answer being people in PR, fundraising.


yet many people like me want to help out with cake making (fighting ebola like the title suggests)

now to come clean..
professionally i recruit people, invest in businesses, donate to good causes and volunteer my time. my skeptical mind is a good thing as it weeds out the businesses that are not feasible. yet.. with that said, my volunteer mind still wanted to actually help with the fighting ebola, even if i didnt like your promotion of the fundraising and advertising mindset in the OP, without even pre-planning anything relating to ebola.

i had an idea of donating enough to cover 10,000 paper facemasks and gloves. and to volunteer my time in a infection zone informing people of the possible hazards just metres away.

but.. your topic.. although reading as helping ebola.. seems to be just a campaign to get a fundraising innitiative started.
if you went the route of doing 2,3,4 first and then coming to the forums with a plan as 'torpedo' showed. i could have got you 10 recruits to help you. lots of funds and a couple graphic designers to design a crap tonne of leaflets.


oh well...

How juvenile is that, you literally quoted me out of context.  


You keep asking how could I talk about 'volunteers, money, advertising, etc ...'  its because that's the protocol, that's how things are done and get done

Here's an analogy for you:  

If a professional baker is shown a picture of a wedding cake and told to make, it is likely that he will likely think about ingredients he knows are usual found in most wedding cakes: such as: flour, sugar, eggs, milk, and baking soda; it is probably a safe bet that an oven will likely be used to bake the cake.    But not all cakes have those ingredients or are baked.  He likely won't speculate on the amount of each ingredient until he knows that cake more intimately, perhaps by name or taste.  

The known issue is about Ebola, some of common tools cause-coins use to achieve there indicated,  the details of who, where, when, how, are yet to be finally determined.

The protocol for WHO is to reach out to see who whats to be involved.  The protocol for all other details is determined by them.  


  






That was completely incoherent. [perhaps a TIA]

Nevertheless, that comment is emblematic of your unbridled rush to judgement resulting in chronic judgement errors.

Take the time to do your homework, stop dismissing thing out of hand just because you are consumed with preconceived notions.

Look at things for what they are and the history they have created.



 

armis

if you knew my profession you would be singing from a different hymn sheet.
if you have a title of "help" and "ebola" and someone asks you how to both points. and you have no reply. then maybe your title and OP message needs to change.

im sorry that it took atleast 10 posts for you to understand that you came up with idea(well a title) of helping fight ebola, but ..........




..... yea nothing beyond that.

but next time. do your 2, 3 and 4 before mentioning an idea you have.

its the logical thing. why say bitcoin can help fight ebola if you have not thought about the "how".

im all for projects that actually work, but it surprises me how so many times people are fixated on the financial organisation side before even thinking of the end result.

come on you have to agree, if someone knocked on your door saying im here to fight ebola, i need volunteers and funds.. even you would ask questions

I'm the ideas guy, someone start the Wiki.

Well said.  

As for the logistics and specifics all of that would get addressed in appropriate committed assembled to do that.  

franky1 is so stubborn its amazing, even after it was made clear that everyone is invited, that "the house is transparent, all the lights are on, and all of the doors are open" he still thinks someone is out to get him.  

The cause needs people like you 'torpedo' but doesn't mind working with people like 'franky 1' until his brand of skepticism become toxic and infectious.

there we have it..

why be asking for volunteers and mention crowdsourcing and advertising untill you have atleast done 2 & 3.. and changed 4 to say you have a project.

only then would most sane people actually see that you would have a good reason to post what you posted in the OP.

your OP message should be 5.. not 1. so please sort out 2, 3 and 4, then come back with the OP message describing 4: the project which you are donating to

this is insanity, there is nothing analogous about what you just put forward and the matter at hand.

1) the EMC2 foundation is the giver of donated funds,  seans outpost is a receiver of donated funds

2) EMC2 searches for project we can fund that are scientific in nature, we fund scientific research, science projects, and science education; Seans Outpost deals with homelessness

3) EMC2 addresses issues that have global implications; Seans Outpost is not global, national, or statewide it's very local

4) EMC2 has NO PROJECT to defend because we are only at the beginning of the examination phase of the protocol, the protocol you indicated no willingness to care about;
    at this point the only thing up for critical discussion is the merits of the problem.  You cannot judge ability because it is still unknown the full extend of the participants involved.
    Sean's Outpost found a problem, designed a plan, then put the plan into action, you can judge the merits of their cause, the execution of their plan, as well as the effectiveness
    of their program.  

He didn't said he was doing it.
It looks like a: Would you take part in this if we would go through with it?
With the answers you receive, you can analyze what can be done with the resources you have (or willing to take part).

Your points would be valid if he was saying:

We are doing a fundraiser to fight Ebola, send your BTC to ***************************.

Now that's a different story and i would agree with you but it's not the case since he's looking for the interest the community have to fight (find a way to fight) Ebola.

for armis to know who wants to help out, potential volunteers/donators want to know what their helping with(not the title. but the cause effect and action).
so far all i read is helping with fundraising.

the better idea would be to come up with a cause action effect.. and then ask for volunteers.

its like saying "i need volunteers" 20 hands raise up wishing to help, they then say what are we gonna do.. he replies "i dont know".

without knowing what the project actually is, what the goals actually are, you cant honestly even attempt to put a number on how much physical or financial support you will need.

shouting out "building an allience to help fight Ebola" is always going to get people asking "help how"

armis cannot answer how

you cant make a claim that bitcoin can help fight ebola, but refuse to answer how

How can a cause-coin donation campaign can be a money grab??? You need to explain me that.

Why does asking other member to join forces couldn't result in something to fight ebola?

Everything need to start somewhere and as of now, no address were given for donations. So it seems like they're not ready for it yet. Accusing them of money grab is a false accusation.

You seems stuck with your ideas and right now you don't seems to bring this topic in the right way: Building an alliance between coins and members of this community to help fight Ebola (fighting can be done in multiple ways but before deciding how you want to fight it, you need to know who want to be part of it and what those members think is the best).

all i read is empty waffle with no substance.

goodluck with your money grab. no one will give you funds if they cant see how it will get spent.

this whole topic is useless as it shows nothing related to actually fighting ebola

 franky1, you ASSUME things not in evidence, over and over again -- we don't supply the types of services that you mentioned above, if you read our material as you said you have you would know that.  

You say, 'forget about this', 'forget about that', 'tell me what you going to do about the other'.  If what we do is 'this' and 'that' but not the 'other', what do you expect to hear?
If 'this' and 'that' is part of the protocol, the way we do things, but no program is in place to how do you reasonable get to a point where you are drawing conclusion about the effectiveness of a specific program.  

The only call to action you see if for people to come together to discuss the matter, and for people to ready their resources (financial, labor, and otherwise), not to act like you have a comprehensive plan on the table for consideration.  EMC2's board only recently approved one small part of the measure, the EMC2 community at large has not gone that far as of yet.   Other cause coin communities are at various levels of discussion on the matter, so how is it that you think you can talk intelligently about specific when the concept is not yet fully formed much less initiated?  

The obvious knowns are, Ebola is real problem, cause-coins are mission directed to do what they can to fight problems, and the leadership of two of such cause-coin have decided to further consider doing what they can to help fight ebola.   Just about everything else is unknown.  Which is why it is ridiculous to ask for specifics, and even worst to draw conclusions based on unknowns.  

Those who say Ebola is not a problem, or that cause-coins are ineffective, are likely wrong, but at least those are arguable matters in evidence.  What you are addressing are things not in evidence.   

Could be a good place to start: https://donate.doctorswithoutborders.org/onetime.cfm
But we'd need them to accept at least BTC and if they can (all the altcoins who want to be involved)

So to answer franky1:
Cause: giving money to help human resources in places or be there quicker to help those infected of in need of help because of onflicts, disasters or because they don't have access to health care.

Action: This post is a call to the CC community to see who want to get involved, personnaly or as a community (representing a coin)
          so the when is undetermine since we don't know who will get involved and where they can act.

Effect: Helping an organization who is currently fighting disease all over the world and showing that CC are not only related to GOX style events.

So it would be more of a big donation (or multiple) not only to help fight ebola with human resources but other diseases or epidemics, disasters and helping those excluded from health care worldwide


Would it be better, if put that way?

Ebola is the starting idea (fighting it), a way to help is bringing more qualified personals on the field to help those infected or preventing others to be infected. This kind of donation or campaign would not only help fight Ebola but help those in need all around the world.

lets try it at a different angle

seans outpost: feeding the homeless

if the guy behind it just came to this forum and say he wanted to reduce poverty and suffering in his area. but had no clue what to do to achieve it. and then started talking about needing volunteers to advertise a fundraiser, and talking about donations and pledges. no one would.

but you know what seans outpost did.
he came out and showed us his family making sandwiches, showing them being handed out. showed us the total price of a sandwich and bottle of water.

and guess what.
thousands of people donated to him because he showed the cause->action->effect.

your missing all 3 because you cant even tell me
how the funds will be used: cause
when, where, who will be involved in performing the tasks: action
what the end result will be: effect

so if your just going to reply with:
insults
waffle about your reputation
waffle about how you have repeatedly told me you have no plan of actual ebola support.
waffle that includes words like emc2, altcoin, btcoin, advertising, campaign, PR, board members, fundraising, crowdfunding.

then dont reply.

only reply once you have a genuine ebola based plan of cause->action->effect. (relating to fighting ebola, not fundraising/advertising)

i read your waffle twice just to be sure that i did not miss some information that you might have mentioned plans to  for instance:
looked into companies that are doing ebola research
looked into suppliers of safety equipment
looked into groups of people in ebola health risk zones


but no.. all you talk about is fundraising, forming a management team, getting people to advertise your campaign, and your so called reputation.

so brining it back to the title of your post

"Bitcoins Could Help Fight Ebola"

forget about waffling through posts about your spcial coin, or your reputation as a money handler. or the efforts of a fundraising campaign..

explain "help ebola"

i do not care about YOUR protocol, as YOUR protocol is flawed.
the best protocol is to find something you can help with, find out how you can help with it. look at what it might cost and form targets and desires of achievement.. then and only then start talking about fundraising.


if you knew who i was professionally, i know you would be acting differently and trying to suck eggs telling me HOW and in which form you will fight ebola and tell me in detail how much financial support and physical support you would need..
EG
using funds to hand out free protective gloves and masks to exposure zones
making food or medicine packages for the families in quarantine in dallas, hawaii, washington, etc
paying to print out leaflets to warn people that ebola can survive in the air for 90-104 minutes after someone sneezes, or that it can survive on fibres for upto 43 days. or that even after surviving ebola, a victim just becomes immune, but may carry the virus for months after.

do you even have ANY contacts that are involved in ebola.
do you even, after 2 days of me asking you.. now have a plan of what you think the campaign should be.

stop thinking of the money grab or setting up a board of your friends to be money managers. if you want to help with ebola.. think about helping ebola first, coming up with and writing out the plan of action for the ebola stuff .. then.. and only then get your altcoin and management team formed, after.

put simply, for the last 2 days no one has seen proper interest in donating or helping you. because you have no idea what help you need. you pretend that you need volunteers. yet you cant tell me what those volunteers would be doing to help with the ebola side.. all you can tell me is what the volunteers can do to help the money grab.

you should not even be asking for volunteers for the advertising of a money grab until you have a plan of action on the cause its suppose to help.

You said you read everything, if you did and are still putting forward nonsense claims your comprehension skills are lacking.  If you read at least the things relevant to this context, you would not say the things that you have said.

In this very thread numerous times I have implied a protocol, an order of how things are done.   Moreover, when you expressed ignorance of logical protocol I specifically laid out a general protocol that any reasonable cause coin would follow in such matters, did you miss it, are you ignoring it, or do you simply not understand it?

You mentioned "money grab" many times, such claims are irresponsible, wholly baseless, and dead wrong.   Where is your evidence?  When you said: "... just to get exposure to your personal money grab" what is that based on?  

Your overall assumption clearly is that something is bad, foul, or wrong.   But it isn't because of any logically drawn conclusion, it could only be due to ignorance of the facts, inappropriate/unreasonable drawing of conclusions, or a stubborn desire to only see things as you want to see them regardless of the facts or logical order.

If you look at the facts, draw logical conclusions based on the actual facts, it's impossible to reasonably get to where you are at on this matter.

Here is evidence of how you cloud logical reasoning with your preconceived notions resulting in poor judgement, specious claims, and irresponsible conclusions:

1)  you cast "shame" on an individual although there is no evidence of shameful activity,  [your irresponsible conclusion]
2)  when 'all you see is a money grab' even though the actual history of the org is that of 'money give'.  [your specious claim]
3)  when you said "i see no actual real life benefit. no actual proof that any money sent to the OP will result in any lives saved or any cure found."
     How could you have "actual proof" of something that hasn't taken place?  [your improper inclusion of facts not present]
     Why would you demand statistical data for "lives saved or any cure" when neither were introduced?  [again, you just making things up]  
4)  when you said: "i truly hate it when people use natural disasters to get rich"
     How does that have anything to do with us?    [your inappropriate connection]
     Show some reasonable and or logical evidence of how you connect that statement to me, our org, or this situation -- connect the dots.  
     Your hate simply doesn't apply to us.  The way you arrived at the connection is because you allowed your misguided preconceived notions
     perhaps based on personal experiences wrongly cloud sensible and responsible judgement.

Instead of you associating us with good guys on the good side of cryptocurrency development or philanthropic endeavors you wrongly lump us with bad guys, why's that?
If we were brand new with no track record your prejudices would be more understandable, but given our track record of excellence, and the responsibly way we carry out
out our mission we are only deserving of praise.  

Step back and look at the whole picture we have a record of excellence, we are inviting all cause coins to be involved, and all are WELCOME (even you) there's nothing to hide: the house is transparent, the lights are on, and the doors are open, if you go by what you actually see not by things you make up everyone should be happy.

Now you owe me a bigger apology.  

 

i have read everything. before i even made one post to you.

my question to you was not about the altcoin.. but about the "scintific research"
until you have identified a scientist that is an expert in ebola, identified what research level they are at and what stage of research/testing they are at. how in hell can you even propose that you are funding scientific research into ebola, and asking people to pledge, crowdfund, donate.


so GET SPECIFIC. tell us the ebola research.

oh wait

im all for promoting good causes (i do it alot) but i have ethics and so far all i see is a mission for a money grab for your own income. and has no plan of action to do anything related to ebola.

your just riding the vapour trails of something that is big news in media, just to get exposure to your personal money grab. not to help solve the issue of that big media event.

shame on you

The demand to:
"JUST REPLY WITH THE PHYSICAL ACTIONS THAT WILL RESULT IN AN ACTUAL IMPACT in regards to ebola."
is foolish.  

Why are you demanding proof or support of a promise where no promises was offered?

I think it's time you provide proof that you took your meds because you are clearly off your rocker.









Both of you need to be intimately involved in the initiative because your prejudices are getting in the way of rational thought.  

Your rationale for not donating to scientific research is because it won't have a meaningful effect for many years down the road.  This may come as a surprise to you but that's the norm.

What in the world does this mean:  "Also this kind of crowd-funding will allow you to reap all the benefits of whatever medical advancement you achieve while taking on none of the risk (your "investors" would not even be repaid under any circumstance)"?    Did you even read what it is that we do?    It's only a few sentences, please read it, I think it will clear up some of your misconceptions:  https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.9060708

 

I agree this is a money grab. Any money that is raised today is not going to be able to be spent in time to have any meaningful affect on the current crisis as this kind of research takes years.

Also this kind of crowd-funding will allow you to reap all the benefits of whatever medical advancement you achieve while taking on none of the risk (your "investors" would not even be repaid under any circumstance)