Topic: BitFlowSystems IPO (Read 17305 times)

This.

Building up a new account to scam the community again. Beware.

He was last active on    June 30, 2012, 08:04:03 PM.  My guess is he won't be back as WiseOldOwl.

Its funny you say this.  Its asshats like you that cause the paranoia.  Taking money, refusing to provide records, getting pissy, then leaving. Here's a recent quote from you:


One could reasonably argue that its management's fault this failed.

On the tenuous assumption that BitFlowSystems was only a mining company ...

50 BTC appears to have been spent on mining hardware by WiseOldOwl on behalf of the company, which being a company asset, should therefore be sold at the best price achievable.
WiseOldOwl should provide receipts covering all company expenditure on this mining hardware.
WiseOldOwl should arguably keep 51% of the proceeds from this, with the remaining 49% being returned to investors.
I suggest WiseOldOwl seeks an offer from the cafe owners identified in early posts within the thread and raises a motion so that investors can decide whether the offer is fair value for the identified assets.

150 BTC of expenditure is completely unaccounted for. This is assumed to be held in cash by the company at this date. 100% of this should be returned to the investors - WiseOldOwl has no claim whatsoever on this.

To date WiseOldOwl has repaid 40 BTC to investors.

In the absence of any further justification of what expenditure occurred by WiseOldOwl on behalf of the company and on the assumption that 50% resale is achieved for the mining hardware, this leaves a debt of 135 BTC to be repaid to investors.

Should WiseOldOwl wish to challenge this figure, WiseOldOwl is required to provide full records of any additional expenditure identified.

WiseOldOwl should work with Nefario to ensure that the ownership records of the shares in BitFlowSystems prior to delisting are recovered so that all investors are paid fairly and proportionally.

I will be charging 1% interest on the outstanding debt for every week it remains unpaid starting today. I urge all other investors to do the same.

Just for the record, even a 51% shareholder can not unilaterally change the purpose of a company.  The fancy term is "ultra vires", but what it really means is that any other shareholder should come after you and extract their pound of flesh for unlawfully taking their money.

Nice. I guess all I need to do to make money is:

• Start company
• Attract investors
• Claim to have lost all the money in company business, while I do nothing
• Tell investors to suck it up, because investment comes at a risk, and act insulted if anyone asks for details of where their money went
• ??? (I guess it's actually pretty simple)
• Profit!!!

Thanks for your teachings, O wise one.

I've simply asked for a full and proper account of where the investment money was spent.

A whole lot more professionalism and a whole lot less deflection is required here.

Show some respect, have some dignity and answer the legitimate questions of all those who put their trust in you - that is the only "favour" I will ask of you.

I never wanted to take investments in a new project, 1.. or even start one for sure for that matter.
I am over this place, in a lot of ways it is different and not even what it used to be. Im not sure what to do about this, I am not fond of getting accused of things I have nothing to do with, like shakaru's issues. And you admit the investment was a gamble and I owned 51%.... You guys are the displaying the definition of wanting to have your cake and eat too, again.
Stop being babies about it, it didnt work out and there was a 20% refund. It not easy to refund money once you have started a business, and are going along. If we were really in this together and this shit didnt work out its like oh well, well hit me up if you need a favor. Offer what ever you can to make it right. No one ever asked me like hey can you get me a programmer or maybe facilitate a transaction somehow without charging me fees? so quick to blame and act like isolated from the business, but if it took off and we were making money you would be all over it, like you were really taking responsibility and risk lol. Its not like that money went to only equipment, I bet some got spent on other shit too.
This isnt a highly regulated market, Im sorry for that. If it was I would of kept better records, but I didnt, because I straight up didnt have too.

You guys are to much.
This community is the one that has floundered, terrified of the big bad scam. paranoid to where you wont even move forward. So quick to blame, cant even take logical variables into consideration.

"you guys used to be cool" lol

Anyways Im done, this isnt somewhere that spawns revolutionary ideas anymore, but it has become a stagnate pool of paranoia.

Wondering if he will pay back or just do nothing and if he will get the tag.

Seems that the scammer tag is defunct now.

Andre from WBX got away without one ...

Him saying that doesnt matter much. Once he starts to deliver we can believe him.

Im worried about his first OP on the immmm back thread. He wants to start more projects yet he so cavalry tossed this aside and "forgot" abut it. Im with ben im not forgetting.

Also, although all investment is risky, there's a difference between negligence with invested money and a legitimate loss. If I bought a million dollars worth of JPM and they squandered it all on hookers and blow, I could probably sue. If I bought a million dollars of JPM and they went bankrupt tomorrow, then I'd just have to eat the loss. This case seems more like the former kind of situation than the latter.

I'm really quite amazed by the behaviour of WiseOldOwl ...

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/is-there-anyone-else-in-the-construction-engineering-arch-fields-89114
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/is-there-anyone-else-in-the-construction-engineering-arch-fields-89127
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/immmm-backkkk-88551

Everything seems like it was so difficult for him and he apparently thinks he can just return to the community having made a token repayment of the money invested in BitFlowSystems, all will be forgiven, everything will be forgotten as easily as he seems to forget and he can start out on another project without a stain on his character.

I won't be forgetting this.

final! I was starting to think oldwise would come back and get away without any sort of explanation on this one. imsaguy great timeline. Even if this was what he called a "gamble" we should of been able to get back more then 40BTC. hell all he had to buy was graphic cards because the other equipment was apparently free. At the time this was taking place grahpic cards were being resold like crazy near or equal to there original value.

You started a bitcoin mining company, contributed assets, sold some shares for <50% of the company.   Once some shares sold, you decided it wasn't profitable to mine so you floundered around for a direction to go.  You attempted to sell more shares but nobody bought this time.  In the meantime, you started to mine solidcoins for at least a short period of time.  You promised there would be a liquidation and that you would refund even if it meant coming out of pocket.  You sent Nef 40 btc, he got in an accident and then you disappeared.  You come back now with a bad cause of the 'I forgot what happened' even though all it takes is reviewing this thread to get a good idea of what went on.  

I draw issue with the following:

• You repeatedly failed to provide an accounting of the btc and/or hardware.  When asked, your response was that it wasn't worth talking about because there wasn't much there.   If there wasn't much there, it shouldn't have taken long to put together a listing.
• Attempting to change the purpose of the company without ever putting it to a vote.  While you did retain a 51% majority, there should have still been a public vote on it.  Instead, on July 09, 2011, 01:15:24 PM, you announced that you were taking the company in a different direction.
• You imply that their investment in the mining company was a gamble is true to a certain degree.  Any business is a risk.   You changed the terms with your wanting to merge the companies however, which means they couldn't properly calculate the risk.
• You promised refunds repeatedly, even if it meant covering them out of pocket.  When it came time to issue the refunds though, you made a token refund and then disappeared.
• You've now reappeared after your extended absence with a memory failure.

I acknowledge Shakaru is a liar, but at some point, even liars tell a shred of truth.  I have to wonder how much truth Shakaru spoke when referring to your deal with him, now that you've shown your word is less than 100%.

Still waiting for the promised information. Cumulatively a significant chunk of investment money is unaccounted for.

You talked previously of discussions with lawyers, $10,000 investments from initial investors etc ... so either this was a significant endeavour OR you don't consider the large number of small individual investments made in Bitcoin through GLBSE to be as important. You need to explain exactly what you spent our money on.

If you really want to repair your reputation in this community you need to sort this out now, enough excuses.

As it stands, I won't be trusting anything you do or any services / products you offer and will be recommending others have nothing to do with you either.

I will do my best to itemize everything that was bought and sold.
My electricity cost here was a major reason the mining did not work, and id say over the two months there was a decent portion spent on that. (Maybe 10%)

Anyways, I didnt purchase anything for myself ( like a scammer would) or cash out any money to cash unless to buy parts. so most everything should be accountable.

Im not petty in a way that even if i didnt do anything wrong and you lost money i wouldnt try to repay it if i am a focal point of losing the money. What im saying is before i have people disliking me i would pay them regardless if its my fault. Well as long as i have the personal money, without any personal money i dont even have that option.

Anyways we will sort all this out...
I have a pretty demanding day job which is different compared to last time because bitcoins were my day job. So the freakish response times and availability i became known for is not going to be happening for the time being.

Yes, a single payment was received from WiseOldOwl by Nefario representing a total of ~17% of the investment made by those buying in at the IPO price of 0.01 BTC.

The BitFlowSys asset was removed during the GLBSE 1.0 to GLBSE 2.0 transfer.

I lost a total of ~5.22 BTC. Nothing major but still felt conned. However multiplied across all the investors when BTC was trading at ~$18, it was a pretty significant sum of money, and will be again in the future. A significant loss for the community.

Once you give a satisfactory and full explanation of what assets / expenditure the remaining 83% of my investment was spent on, I'll decide whether I'll ever trust you again.

Hi,

Shakaru, why would you be looking for me?

Also, if I owe anyone and it is a reasonable debt that wasnt a gamble you lost ( i have to evaluate the old postings and situation because i truly forget the status), i will gladly pay it back just pm me. I am not now, nor was I ever a scammer.
I really did take pride in my rep, and wouldnt want to tarnish it. I may haver some project failures, but i have success's too.
Anyways Im not trying to prove or deny anything, just looking to get back into the community.

Seriously in need of a refresher when it comes to bitflow, i remember it didnt work out as a mining company because mining was worthless all of the sudden, and then i think we shifted the focus but it never took off???
I remember the user name REF, did we do business?

I am looking for him too. His phone is disconnected and he has yet to send the fabric Deslok ordered for bitcoinprintshop has never been delivered.