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Topic: Blocksize needs to be increased now. - page 2. (Read 25131 times)

full member
Activity: 124
Merit: 101
October 10, 2016, 03:45:47 PM
Which is actually unusually high. I was expecting 60satoshis/byte when I started writing this post.
Potential (pretty much is) spam attack underway: http://statoshi.info/dashboard/db/transactions
That would be also reason for my transaction being stuck (in another thread about CEX.io, right now stuck over 6 hours) :/
From the graph you mention it seems like real "traffic jam" and what is more scary is it is getting bigger.
Would be interesting to see similar graph with avg/median transaction size as to have insight if increase is of real transactions or "dust"
staff
Activity: 3458
Merit: 6793
Just writing some code
October 10, 2016, 03:39:22 PM
Which is actually unusually high. I was expecting 60satoshis/byte when I started writing this post.
Potential (pretty much is) spam attack underway: http://statoshi.info/dashboard/db/transactions
legendary
Activity: 2674
Merit: 2965
Terminated.
October 10, 2016, 03:33:14 PM
It can get frustrating when people have to pay $0.2 worth tx fee and still wait for like 1.5 hour to get a single BTC confirmation. This thing needs to be fixed asap.
What are you talking about? How about you stop making ridiculously big transactions and then blaming Bitcoin for having to pay a high fee?

Quote
The fastest and cheapest transaction fee is currently 100 satoshis/byte, shown in green at the top.
For the median transaction size of 226 bytes, this results in a fee of 22,600 satoshis (0.12$).
Which is actually unusually high. I was expecting 60satoshis/byte when I started writing this post.
hero member
Activity: 656
Merit: 500
October 10, 2016, 03:25:29 PM
It can get frustrating when people have to pay $0.2 worth tx fee and still wait for like 1.5 hour to get a single BTC confirmation. This thing needs to be fixed asap.
legendary
Activity: 3416
Merit: 1912
The Concierge of Crypto
October 04, 2016, 10:22:12 PM
Well, ... don't know if I'm talking out of nowhere or what, but I think Monero is having problems, and Ethereum ... now has two chains. He is just another user of bitcoin. If I had the money I might have invested in some altcoin too, I just wouldn't be vocal about it. Is he the Ether Jesus and Monero Jesus now too? Last I read, Jesus got nailed to a cross, but came back after 3 days.

I'm content as a normal "small" user of bitcoin to leave the blocksize at 1 MB right now. I'll let the core devs figure out a solution, we are not in a hurry and you can (and should) pay the relatively small tx fees. It's only big if you have lots of tiny transactions that need to be combined, but as I mentioned earlier, I had 3 large transactions (about 60 kb each) with about 200~300 inputs, and paid only 0.001 (which is the "standard" maximum fee, but you can override this) and they got confirmed rather quickly.
X7
legendary
Activity: 1162
Merit: 1009
Let he who is without sin cast the first stone
October 04, 2016, 06:55:57 PM
I think Ver has mentioned he doesn't mind if bitcoin splits into two chains. He has an article on coindesk or his own site (bitcoin.com)

The market will decide. The miners. The users. The nodes.

This usually means all the big players, the big exchanges, the big payment processors, and all the online web wallets.

One thing I know, if the price goes down, good time to buy cheap coins on your choice of fork. Also the fork will cause two blockchains to be maintained so you could have double your coins for a short term.

Ok that makes sense. If he does not mind and he wants to make the market, miners, users and node maintainers decide then he should not criticize anybody if Bitcoin Unlimited or whatever fork he supports is discarded by the majority. He can campaign for his fork and try to take the power of development away from the core developers but first he should show that the developers of Bitcoin Unlimited is very competent.

Are the developers of Bitcoin Unlimited competent?

Comments like that give me a headache, a flippant statement about not caring if Bitcoin splits into two chains... while investing heavily in Ethereum and Monero leave me completely disillusioned about Ver tbh.. All I have heard come from him is what is starting to feel like concern trolling. Sad that we got here, would like to see all of it stop.
hv_
legendary
Activity: 2534
Merit: 1055
Clean Code and Scale
October 04, 2016, 06:40:49 AM
I think we all (devs and other users) saw when a popular on-chain dice site ... ... hehe ... I don't like "small spammy transactions" any more than you do.

I like bitcoin the way it is right now. If it does change, we'll see if the rest of the people follow. It'll be all over the news so I don't even really need to follow this.

Every post here should cost some Satoshis - than we might get closer do define SPAM or not SPAM - correct?
legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1823
October 04, 2016, 12:55:55 AM
I think Ver has mentioned he doesn't mind if bitcoin splits into two chains. He has an article on coindesk or his own site (bitcoin.com)

The market will decide. The miners. The users. The nodes.

This usually means all the big players, the big exchanges, the big payment processors, and all the online web wallets.

One thing I know, if the price goes down, good time to buy cheap coins on your choice of fork. Also the fork will cause two blockchains to be maintained so you could have double your coins for a short term.

Ok that makes sense. If he does not mind and he wants to make the market, miners, users and node maintainers decide then he should not criticize anybody if Bitcoin Unlimited or whatever fork he supports is discarded by the majority. He can campaign for his fork and try to take the power of development away from the core developers but first he should show that the developers of Bitcoin Unlimited is very competent.

Are the developers of Bitcoin Unlimited competent?
legendary
Activity: 3416
Merit: 1912
The Concierge of Crypto
October 03, 2016, 10:27:28 PM
I think we all (devs and other users) saw when a popular on-chain dice site ... ... hehe ... I don't like "small spammy transactions" any more than you do.

I like bitcoin the way it is right now. If it does change, we'll see if the rest of the people follow. It'll be all over the news so I don't even really need to follow this.
legendary
Activity: 1708
Merit: 1049
October 03, 2016, 08:06:54 PM
Obviously. But that's the bigblocker counterargument right there: "Who are you to tell me that my transaction is spam/dust/invalid/not worthy" etc etc... They continue by saying "if I pay fees, I must get included!!!". They could also say, in the above scenario, "I'm paying 100% fees over the transacted amount, while others are paying 0.x% in percentage... is this fair?" etc etc.

I don't really know. I don't make the rules. The fee rules are in the code and in the nodes that run on it, the miners, the whole network. The rules are based on the size of the transaction and the priority of the unspent inputs.

That's the other bigblocker counterargument: "Fuckin' blockstream, they have put limits on small txs, they want to make Bitcoin a settlement network and they are killing bitcoin for not including my 0.00x$ tx !!!" Cry Cry Cry

The devs probably did the math, saw that if small spammy transactions are in high demand, coupled with practically zero fees, then virtually any block size can be full.

Monero implemented an adaptive block size which increases as more demand is applied, and where did that lead? To a spamming of the network, to kill the blockchain through bloat... and devs running to patch it with high fees per tx to prevent the ongoing attack. What more can you do? It's either limited block size, or high fees.

I've seen a variation applied in STEEM, where they use rate limiting for spammy txs, avoiding the block size vs high fees tradeoff, but that's because txs are tied to an account, so this becomes more possible (in bitcoin it wouldn't be).
legendary
Activity: 3416
Merit: 1912
The Concierge of Crypto
October 03, 2016, 04:12:14 PM
Obviously. But that's the bigblocker counterargument right there: "Who are you to tell me that my transaction is spam/dust/invalid/not worthy" etc etc... They continue by saying "if I pay fees, I must get included!!!". They could also say, in the above scenario, "I'm paying 100% fees over the transacted amount, while others are paying 0.x% in percentage... is this fair?" etc etc.

I don't really know. I don't make the rules. The fee rules are in the code and in the nodes that run on it, the miners, the whole network. The rules are based on the size of the transaction and the priority of the unspent inputs.

It used to be I could send small amounts with no fees. I'm not complaining now that I'm almost always required to spend more on fees. I understand how it works, maybe you do too. But according to the other devs there are all sorts of complications that arise if you change the one line of code that limits the block size.

The nodes just relay or forward your transaction. Anyone can change the logic of the nodes they control to forward or relay transactions with small or no fees.

The miners are the ones that actually confirm or include your transaction in a block.

I guess, the most apt saying is the one about "you get what you pay for"... You pay more, you get better chance (but no guarantee) of a confirmation. If you don't pay, you can always wait. I don't know if that's fair or not, although it looks fair to me.

Like you mentioned, if blocks become 1 GB in size, we'll eventually run into the same problem.
legendary
Activity: 1708
Merit: 1049
October 03, 2016, 11:33:20 AM
Suppose I create a faucet.

I am willing to pay 1 satoshi for fees per transaction (250 bytes).

So for every user who wants 1 satoshi, I pay 1 to him and 1 to fees.

If you do that, the transaction won't get forwarded to any other nodes. You're under the threshold for "dust".

Obviously. But that's the bigblocker counterargument right there: "Who are you to tell me that my transaction is spam/dust/invalid/not worthy" etc etc... They continue by saying "if I pay fees, I must get included!!!". They could also say, in the above scenario, "I'm paying 100% fees over the transacted amount, while others are paying 0.x% in percentage... is this fair?" etc etc.
legendary
Activity: 3416
Merit: 1912
The Concierge of Crypto
October 03, 2016, 11:13:31 AM
Suppose I create a faucet.

I am willing to pay 1 satoshi for fees per transaction (250 bytes).

So for every user who wants 1 satoshi, I pay 1 to him and 1 to fees.

If you do that, the transaction won't get forwarded to any other nodes. You're under the threshold for "dust".
legendary
Activity: 994
Merit: 1035
October 03, 2016, 11:02:56 AM
For someone that is so concerned with Capacity throughput Ver certainly doesn't mind mining half filled or empty blocks way below the average of other pools.

https://www.blocktrail.com/BTC/block/0000000000000000022a9997ce4448d1ef5da66f4e93431d8366972a2e7fbd7a

https://www.blocktrail.com/BTC/pool/bitcoincom

Most other miners are mining around 1% empty blocks. Half of bitcoin.com blocks have not been full and over 10% of their blocks are almost empty. I would expect them to at least mimic other pools ratios. This doesn't look good, especially coming from people so concerned with capacity.
Empty blocks are very rare now a days . 2 large pools are even mining 0% empty blocks. And all others are below 1% , not higher than 10% like rogers pool. Look at the stats--




legendary
Activity: 3416
Merit: 1912
The Concierge of Crypto
October 03, 2016, 07:37:48 AM
I think Ver has mentioned he doesn't mind if bitcoin splits into two chains. He has an article on coindesk or his own site (bitcoin.com)

The market will decide. The miners. The users. The nodes.

This usually means all the big players, the big exchanges, the big payment processors, and all the online web wallets.

One thing I know, if the price goes down, good time to buy cheap coins on your choice of fork. Also the fork will cause two blockchains to be maintained so you could have double your coins for a short term.
legendary
Activity: 2898
Merit: 1823
October 03, 2016, 12:28:47 AM
It's already been forked. I think. Or at least there are clients out there. I don't know who's using those other wallets, I'll stick to Core for now.

As a community member who has been here longer, what is your opinion on what will happen if a fork like Bitcoin Unlimited will gain enough support. Will it split the Bitcoin network in two just like what happened to Ethereum? The supporters of the fork all think it will be ok just like what Vitalik thought with the Ethereum hard fork.

Also if the hard fork does split the network in two, who is liable to be "hanged" by the community? Will Roger Ver step forward and own up to the mistake?
legendary
Activity: 3416
Merit: 1912
The Concierge of Crypto
September 29, 2016, 03:38:32 PM
It's already been forked. I think. Or at least there are clients out there. I don't know who's using those other wallets, I'll stick to Core for now.
sr. member
Activity: 319
Merit: 250
September 29, 2016, 02:42:44 PM
Bitcoin fork is on the way. I preditc 2-3 months.
legendary
Activity: 3416
Merit: 1912
The Concierge of Crypto
September 25, 2016, 05:50:30 PM
Here are the first three transaction and ID hashes:

Quote
Date: 2016-09-25 15:56
Total debit: -1.27887719 BTC
Transaction fee: -0.00100000 BTC
Transaction ID: e341a6b45cd349821b80c8fc5f6b92a1a983bddfd57cfd261e7c56ad2db9c37b

Quote
Date: 2016-09-25 15:59
Total debit: -6.65190598 BTC
Transaction fee: -0.00100000 BTC
Transaction ID: fe7e94741f42c83621f580cf846b1cc337c7f4a1cd10153df10a113a0eb9fde7

Quote
Total debit: -42.46593450 BTC
Transaction fee: -0.00100000 BTC
Transaction ID: d156bd503ae9fe8f8e83c2a8e7025a20f21f9dfc8a5678235a5a2d1c65703782

And the final transaction (which you can easily trace in any block explorer):

Quote
Date: 2016-09-25 16:16
Transaction fee: -0.00100000 BTC
Net amount: -50.39671767 BTC
Transaction ID: bb61536e9917297d1b8184edd3cb0fda5aed428b31953d9119694c4437e36885


You should use what you see in that website, or what is "recommended" by your client if you are using Bitcoin Core.
hero member
Activity: 812
Merit: 1001
September 25, 2016, 04:14:30 PM
^^^Link please

https://bitcoinfees.21.co/
Which fee should I use?
The fastest and cheapest transaction fee is currently 60 satoshis/byte, shown in green at the top.
For the median transaction size of 226 bytes, this results in a fee of 13,560 satoshis (0.07$).

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