You libertarians are just crazy, your whole focus on wrapping your self in secrecy and eliminating any accountability in society you create the very Dystopia you fear. To stretch a metaphor from TLOTR (a better work of fiction then anything Ann Rand ever wrote btw), your think passing out copies of the one ring will make the world a better place because the common man will somehow be 'equal' to elites. Equally unaccountable and equally likely to abuse that power I think (you know even Frodo succumbs to the temptation, because you know know power corrupts etc etc). If you want a world free of abuse of power then you can't fight fire with fire, you need universal accountability and transparency so abuse of power can be seen by everyone rather then fester in the shadows.
And seriously of all the realms of our lives were privacy might be justified, out financial and business transactions are the last ones that are deserving of privacy. I would really expect more libertarians to understand how markets work, they require information and the more the better. Information asymmetry between two parties makes a fair meeting of the minds impossible and thus leads to market inefficiency.
See David Brin (my favorite author btw) on the subject of privacy, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Transparent_Society And
http://www.metroactive.com/papers/metro/02.06.97/cover/brin1-9706.html
Topic: BOYCOTT all businesses associated to Alex Waters, Matt Mellon, and Yifu Guo! - page 4. (Read 16731 times)
November 13, 2013, 10:52:08 PM
November 13, 2013, 10:15:07 PM
No one is going to use a version of the blockchain that is easily tracked, so they will just spur on zerocoin adoption in the main client.
They're welcome to lose money trying to do so.
They're welcome to lose money trying to do so.
November 13, 2013, 09:52:24 PM
Quote
“This needs to exist for regulators to approve of use of Bitcoin in the U.S.,” says Waters. “We don’t want to be the sheriff of the Bitcoin community. We just want to create an ecosystem of clean addresses.”
In the short term, they talk about a limited database that keeps track only of registered identities and their activities with participating companies, but it’s obvious that their ambitions are grander and that a longer term prospect is to take advantage of the transparency of the Bitcoin system to keep track of which Bitcoin is tainted by associations with black markets. Waters says that the development of that aspect will depend on “community feedback.”
In the short term, they talk about a limited database that keeps track only of registered identities and their activities with participating companies, but it’s obvious that their ambitions are grander and that a longer term prospect is to take advantage of the transparency of the Bitcoin system to keep track of which Bitcoin is tainted by associations with black markets. Waters says that the development of that aspect will depend on “community feedback.”
can we stop this?
It was inevitable that organizations would try to build databases of names & coin addresses.
For every one that is announced publicly there will be 10 that are done secretly.
The only way to ensure anonymity is the development of technical solutions. Many people won't bother using them, yet some people will consider anonymizing tools essential. It will be a personal choice, similar to the choice facing users of the WWW.
We can stop this by making sure that its not viable, by tweaking our practices and the ecosystem to be an environment that things like this just can't work in. This means: Anonymous mining, Discouraging address reuse, coinjoin, etc. Importantly, people need to step up and fund the development of privacy tools. Today there is no business model for decenteralized privacy tools that people can use casually and thus pervasively.
Fully agree.
November 13, 2013, 07:48:42 PM
I really hope that Bitcoin gore dev team stays against about privacy violations or if not I hope all miners reject all plans supporting this kind of development lines possibly planned for.
This is not a change to the Bitcoin Protocol, miners (or just people running fully-validating wallet and relay nodes) cannot affect this move. Although some kind of protocol integration will no doubt be proposed by someone or other.
But that's not what this is. In some ways, this is worse than a client/blockchain fork. At least the differing market price for Bitcoin and TaintCoin would help to settle the fight. Any Bitcoin based business would then have to choose which of the coins to support, and watch how much custom they receive from each if they choose both.
This CoinValidation group is the beginnings of a way to gradually force customers to disclose their identities, not via the protocol, but by good old fashioned legislation.
November 13, 2013, 07:48:20 PM
boycott!
November 13, 2013, 07:48:06 PM
Just wow... instead of fighting for the right of freedom those guys are trying to give our privacy away on a golden plate. Enough is enough. Stop to obey, start to think on your own.
November 13, 2013, 07:35:21 PM
can we stop this?
Yes, but not by negotiating with every fool who attempts it, for there are far too many fools in the world. I've personally talked two startups out of similar business models in the past.We can stop this by making sure that its not viable, by tweaking our practices and the ecosystem to be an environment that things like this just can't work in. This means: Anonymous mining, Discouraging address reuse, coinjoin, etc. Importantly, people need to step up and fund the development of privacy tools. Today there is no business model for decenteralized privacy tools that people can use casually and thus pervasively.
We must vote with our wallets— not our spending, but how we choose to transact and what developments we fund. As a spending group the people who really realize the importance of privacy and fungiblity will always be a small enough minority that short-sighted business people will find it all too easy to go without their business.
November 13, 2013, 07:28:38 PM
Quote
“This needs to exist for regulators to approve of use of Bitcoin in the U.S.,” says Waters. “We don’t want to be the sheriff of the Bitcoin community. We just want to create an ecosystem of clean addresses.”
In the short term, they talk about a limited database that keeps track only of registered identities and their activities with participating companies, but it’s obvious that their ambitions are grander and that a longer term prospect is to take advantage of the transparency of the Bitcoin system to keep track of which Bitcoin is tainted by associations with black markets. Waters says that the development of that aspect will depend on “community feedback.”
In the short term, they talk about a limited database that keeps track only of registered identities and their activities with participating companies, but it’s obvious that their ambitions are grander and that a longer term prospect is to take advantage of the transparency of the Bitcoin system to keep track of which Bitcoin is tainted by associations with black markets. Waters says that the development of that aspect will depend on “community feedback.”
can we stop this?
November 13, 2013, 07:26:04 PM
Not sure 
, but maybe this is where genjix gets his dresses: http://hanleymellon.com/
I'm on the fence with this one, albeit leaning toward, "Mongo no like!"
, but maybe this is where genjix gets his dresses: http://hanleymellon.com/I'm on the fence with this one, albeit leaning toward, "Mongo no like!"
Your opinion means very little to me.
You have shown you can & have been bought to keep silent on BFL's doings.
You will be bought again,the going price ATM is 10BTC
November 13, 2013, 07:25:01 PM
I'm not sure you can gather enough info from this article to legitimize the personal attacks. Then again, this behavior isn't surprising on bitcointalk.
These guys have done a lot of development for the bitcoin community. They are actually very nice people. I used to work with 2 of them regularly.
I'm not saying this project is a good or bad idea. I'm looking forward to hearing more info.
Slow your roll.
These guys have done a lot of development for the bitcoin community. They are actually very nice people. I used to work with 2 of them regularly.
I'm not saying this project is a good or bad idea. I'm looking forward to hearing more info.
Slow your roll.
November 13, 2013, 07:17:31 PM
Why is anyone surprised by this, if you know Bitcoins history this is just one of many steps to come. It will be a step by step process. Finger printing ATM's was another one. I can buy anything i want without providing a hand scan, bitcoin at the atm is the only exception.
Quote
Bitcoin history facts:
2009-01-03 18:15:05 Historic moment Genesis block created
2009-01-13 18:20:08 50 coins where mined
2009-01-16 19:18:35 those 50 coins where sent to address 12higDjoCCNXSA95xZMWUdPvXNmkAduhWv
a total of 77,624 BTC where received at this address until 2011-06-04 then cashed out
http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewgpg.php?nick=I}ruid
http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=I}ruid&sign=ANY&type=RECV
Quote from: franky1 on October 16, 2013, 02:50:53 AM
|}ruid is Dustin trammell
Dustin D. Trammell
I am both I)ruid and I}ruid. I)ruid is the correct spelling. I use the alternate I}ruid spelling on IRC due to the IRC protocol not allowing the close-parenthesis character ")" to be used in nicknames.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/dustintrammell-23696, yes VIP status with a registration date of June 2011
HD Moore, Dustin D. Trammell and Tod Beardsley, all co-founded AHA! (the Austin Hackers Association) many years ago. All three still attend monthly meetings.
AHA is a white had hacker group that is Government friendly (Cahoots) and a hacker against the hacker.
HD Moore: Information security researcher and programmer, Moore developed security software utilities for the United States Department of Defense.
Dustin D. Trammell: Entrepreneur, Security Researcher performing research within the fields of vulnerability exploitation, network protocols, steganography and covert communications, and Internet telephony
Tod Beardsley: Technical Lead for the Metasploit Framework and Metasploit Pro, Founded Austin Hackers Anonymous August 2006
Now depending of your view point you could ask is it a surprise that DPR is where he is? Was SR past its use-by date and has served its purpose.
To Alternative coins look attractive with 100% knowledge from the start who is behind it and is truly decentralized.
With this known affiliated friendliness to the DOD Bitcoin is tainted to say the leased from the very beginning.
2009-01-03 18:15:05 Historic moment Genesis block created
2009-01-13 18:20:08 50 coins where mined
2009-01-16 19:18:35 those 50 coins where sent to address 12higDjoCCNXSA95xZMWUdPvXNmkAduhWv
a total of 77,624 BTC where received at this address until 2011-06-04 then cashed out
http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewgpg.php?nick=I}ruid
http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=I}ruid&sign=ANY&type=RECV
Quote from: franky1 on October 16, 2013, 02:50:53 AM
|}ruid is Dustin trammell
Dustin D. Trammell
I am both I)ruid and I}ruid. I)ruid is the correct spelling. I use the alternate I}ruid spelling on IRC due to the IRC protocol not allowing the close-parenthesis character ")" to be used in nicknames.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/dustintrammell-23696, yes VIP status with a registration date of June 2011
HD Moore, Dustin D. Trammell and Tod Beardsley, all co-founded AHA! (the Austin Hackers Association) many years ago. All three still attend monthly meetings.
AHA is a white had hacker group that is Government friendly (Cahoots) and a hacker against the hacker.
HD Moore: Information security researcher and programmer, Moore developed security software utilities for the United States Department of Defense.
Dustin D. Trammell: Entrepreneur, Security Researcher performing research within the fields of vulnerability exploitation, network protocols, steganography and covert communications, and Internet telephony
Tod Beardsley: Technical Lead for the Metasploit Framework and Metasploit Pro, Founded Austin Hackers Anonymous August 2006
Quote
Straight talk a US Government SnitchNow depending of your view point you could ask is it a surprise that DPR is where he is? Was SR past its use-by date and has served its purpose.
To Alternative coins look attractive with 100% knowledge from the start who is behind it and is truly decentralized.
With this known affiliated friendliness to the DOD Bitcoin is tainted to say the leased from the very beginning.
November 13, 2013, 07:04:19 PM
I really hope that Bitcoin gore dev team stays against about privacy violations or if not I hope all miners reject all plans supporting this kind of development lines possibly planned for.
This is not a change to the Bitcoin Protocol, miners (or just people running fully-validating wallet and relay nodes) cannot affect this move. Although some kind of protocol integration will no doubt be proposed by someone or other.
November 13, 2013, 06:52:39 PM
Replicated here for discussion:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirhill/2013/11/13/sanitizing-bitcoin-coin-validation/
This service is extremely dangerous as it undermines one of the key characteristics of Bitcoin as a MONEY: their complete fungibility. Further, since all Bitcoin transactions are public and pseudonymity given by opaque addresses is our ONLY financial privacy protection, services like this should be considered a direct and malicious attack on Bitcoin system.
I suppose the CORRECT response of the community should be to BOYCOTT any business that even remotely associates itself with this evil spynet.
This service is extremely dangerous as it undermines one of the key characteristics of Bitcoin as a MONEY: their complete fungibility. Further, since all Bitcoin transactions are public and pseudonymity given by opaque addresses is our ONLY financial privacy protection, services like this should be considered a direct and malicious attack on Bitcoin system.
I suppose the CORRECT response of the community should be to BOYCOTT any business that even remotely associates itself with this evil spynet.
+1
Did they lost their minds? They want to steal from legally obtained btc? Crazy, dangerous people.
November 13, 2013, 06:45:43 PM
November 13, 2013, 06:39:28 PM
I really hope that Bitcoin gore dev team stays against about privacy violations or if not I hope all miners reject all plans supporting this kind of development lines possibly planned for.
This is not a change to the Bitcoin Protocol, miners (or just people running fully-validating wallet and relay nodes) cannot affect this move. Although some kind of protocol integration will no doubt be proposed by someone or other.
November 13, 2013, 06:29:36 PM
I really hope that Bitcoin gore dev team stays against about privacy violations or if not I hope all miners reject all plans supporting this kind of development lines possibly planned for.
November 13, 2013, 06:26:47 PM
Not sure , but maybe this is where genjix gets his dresses: http://hanleymellon.com/
I'm on the fence with this one, albeit leaning toward, "Mongo no like!"
, but maybe this is where genjix gets his dresses: http://hanleymellon.com/I'm on the fence with this one, albeit leaning toward, "Mongo no like!"
November 13, 2013, 06:19:46 PM
Tons of comments about this also on reddit:
http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1qj7sw/sanitizing_bitcoin_this_company_wants_to_track/
Edit:
Quote from that reddit thread:
http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1qj7sw/sanitizing_bitcoin_this_company_wants_to_track/
Edit:
Quote from that reddit thread:
Quote
Bitcoins should not be assessed according to where they have been. That would ruin their fungibility and require coin blacklists that would create a central authority.
This post on Reddit explains how in 1749, a court sided with the Royal Bank of Scotland in its legal challenge to a request for such a blacklist. The court ruled that making money responsible for the acts of its previous holders would "render the Notes absolutely useless":
http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1le87j/bitcoin_core_dev_on_stolen_coins_and_transaction/cbycmhk
This post on Reddit explains how in 1749, a court sided with the Royal Bank of Scotland in its legal challenge to a request for such a blacklist. The court ruled that making money responsible for the acts of its previous holders would "render the Notes absolutely useless":
http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1le87j/bitcoin_core_dev_on_stolen_coins_and_transaction/cbycmhk
November 13, 2013, 06:11:51 PM
I'm very interested to hear what Jon Matonis and the rest of the Bitcoin Foundation crowd have to say about this.
Consider this a "Bitcoin-sign in the sky"
Consider this a "Bitcoin-sign in the sky"
November 13, 2013, 05:42:38 PM
It appears ZC uses a rather dubious encryption. As of this writing I can't say I trust anything other than Koblitz curves
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