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Topic: BTC a chance to change the deadlock of 1% rich peple holding FIAT capital (Read 1848 times)

sr. member
Activity: 812
Merit: 251
Smart rich people invest in cryptocurrencies. It's naive to think there are tech billionaires out there who think that bitcoins are bad and fiat it good.

I couldn't agree more, cryptocurrencies are actually for smart people and they are investing in it and so the smart rich people are likely to have some kind of investments in cryptocurrencies or Bitcoin just like genesis mine and even Microsoft who are into mining.
legendary
Activity: 3486
Merit: 1280
English ⬄ Russian Translation Services
I think, there is another big thing why BTC is so treated hostile. Banks have their own interest. But many rich people are very addicted to FIAT connotations and the structure of cryptocurrency may change the general structure of possession.
This may build a thesis that:
- crypto currencies are pumped to give a strike in a moment to 'alienate the fashion' to BTC and show how 'BTC and crypto' is bad for the economic system
- or they are locking into positions to make is centralized through smooth control of the course of crypto
- or it is just a sheep run pump, as it goes.

I would like to open a discussion on that. What do you think?
Money always flows up, those at the top expand and get more, rinse and repeat. It's not like it is anything different with whatever crypto you try to insert as a means of achieving some near-utopic system. Go and look at any crypto that has been accepted by merchants or is at least commonly used; the most values go upwards and into the hands of those running businesses. The overall goal in a proper capitalistic system is not to be a worker for your entire life and rather become a business owner as well, again assuming you didn't have to deal with the corporatism of today

Capitalism follows the laws of the wild

The survival of the fittest and all that. The major difference, though, is that in nature all people and animals have approximately equal life spans (but even that may change in the future), but it is different with corporations. Sometimes, they kick the bucket too, go bust and bite the dust, but ultimately their life spans are not inherently limited (unlike human lives), so a generic human who is inherently mortal has to fight with inherently immortal corporations which become only stronger over time (on average)
sr. member
Activity: 980
Merit: 255
There is no way to prevent uneven bitcoin distribution.

In the end when Bitcoin will turn out to be a legit, true and successful asset then rich FIAT holders simply liquidate their fiat positions in favour of BTC.
Nothing will really change, rich will be richer and poor wouldn't still be able to afford to buy enough BTC to change their life.
What bitcoin brought to the scene is more people, mainly early adopters, who will be extremely rich in the future.
There will always be an uneven distribution of money and as robots and technologies that replace human labor become even more common then the gap between those that can get those machines and services and those that do not will only become bigger.
legendary
Activity: 1442
Merit: 1025
There is no way to prevent uneven bitcoin distribution.

In the end when Bitcoin will turn out to be a legit, true and successful asset then rich FIAT holders simply liquidate their fiat positions in favour of BTC.
Nothing will really change, rich will be richer and poor wouldn't still be able to afford to buy enough BTC to change their life

As to me, this is an unlikely scenario

With Bitcoin we likely have a wave of new money coming in (the so-called nouveaux riches). Obviously, fiat deep pockets (those will represent old money) will be in a subdued position if we assume that they would ever want to switch to Bitcoin one day (they will be running after ever evading prices like a kitten trying to catch its tail). This is certainly not what they will like because they simply can't accept this state of affairs. So they will likely try to fight Bitcoin whenever it starts to threaten their financial hegemony
Yes this is what currently is happening and will be happening, many of the rich community having fiat are more influential on their government because they pay high taxes to the government and hence can make the government agree with what they want.
The reason for why the governments are not legalizing bitcoin consists of this factor that the stock exchange doesn’t want them to accept bitcoin. This fight between the hard stuff believers and the soft technological believers will go on.
sr. member
Activity: 1400
Merit: 269
People are addicted to fiat currency because they have not yet been introduced to bitcoin. Bitcoin is the only crypto currency that free's us from this debt based system that the fiat currency that we all been using since the evil bankers. Bitcoin will force the monetary system to change it ways or be crashed by it repeatedly until they learn, this crypto currency will free us from oppression, exploitation and tyranny from bankers. A decentralized monetary system should how be our fiat currency just like bitcoin. That's people becoming popular.
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1007
I think, there is another big thing why BTC is so treated hostile. Banks have their own interest. But many rich people are very addicted to FIAT connotations and the structure of cryptocurrency may change the general structure of possession.
This may build a thesis that:
- crypto currencies are pumped to give a strike in a moment to 'alienate the fashion' to BTC and show how 'BTC and crypto' is bad for the economic system
- or they are locking into positions to make is centralized through smooth control of the course of crypto
- or it is just a sheep run pump, as it goes.

I would like to open a discussion on that. What do you think?
Money always flows up, those at the top expand and get more, rinse and repeat. It's not like it is anything different with whatever crypto you try to insert as a means of achieving some near-utopic system. Go and look at any crypto that has been accepted by merchants or is at least commonly used; the most values go upwards and into the hands of those running businesses. The overall goal in a proper capitalistic system is not to be a worker for your entire life and rather become a business owner as well, again assuming you didn't have to deal with the corporatism of today.
legendary
Activity: 966
Merit: 1042
Smart rich people invest in cryptocurrencies. It's naive to think there are tech billionaires out there who think that bitcoins are bad and fiat it good.
hero member
Activity: 490
Merit: 501
Old analysis but showing that 1% of population may hold ~50% of all money: http://www.bbc.com/news/business-30875633

I wonder what are the statistics of BTC and currencies. If it reaches over 51%, there is real possibility for BTC to be controlled by 1%. This is something like centralization for me.
Cryptocurrencies are extremely centralised in terms of holders.  You have people like Roger Ver who put his money less than ten years ago and is now extremely rich.

When the price goes up too dramatically, it naturally results in centralisation unless all of those early adopters sell along the way.

This is just showing us that we live in reality and even if Bitcoin is representing some noble causes it is still subjected to the current environment we have. Since Bitcoin is also about value and price, it is naive to expect that the usual human nature as re[resented by greed would go away. Not so. We are still humans here and so we have our own interests to look up to.

I don't believe that there is a significant concerted effort from the so-called elites to maneuver Bitcoin...what we are seeing are people big and small who are already into cryptocurrency and they want to make their newfound power known to all...and this is quite normal in trading. The current of cryptocurrency is still nothing compared to the global economy.

Of course, there will always be resistance to something new and that is quite normal. But when those who are resisting would realize that they can't win they would eventually join. Now, the question is: Are we ready for the elites to join us in cryptocurrency? Maybe we are not since we are also resisting their influence.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 6249
Decentralization Maximalist
everyone else with a decent level of economical understanding, will definitely not sit back and look how their fiat wealth is slimming down in value year after year. It doesn't mean they need to go all in, but it wouldn't hurt to convert around 25% of their fiat wealth to Bitcoin. If that's too risky for them, they could even go with 12.5% gold and 12.5% Bitcoin if that gives them a better feeling.

You assume that Bitcoin will be a bullish asset for a long time, so people would benefit from converting fiat into BTC. But I predict that in about 10-15 years at most we will enter a new stage where the price increases of the Bitcoin unit will be much less than today - the "steady stage" or "final stage" of Bitcoin adoption. From this moment on it won't be attractive to use Bitcoin as a store of value, as it will be outgrown by other values like stocks and real estate. It will be used mainly as a currency.

That's why I think Bitcoin's main effect on wealth distribution will not be that it creates a new elite - it will create some rich individuals, but they are mostly holding Bitcoin already today. As I said before the disruptive potential of Bitcoin lays in the possibility that it will make obsolete a whole part of the financial industry and weaken the elite associated with that business.
legendary
Activity: 3654
Merit: 1165
www.Crypto.Games: Multiple coins, multiple games
Old analysis but showing that 1% of population may hold ~50% of all money: http://www.bbc.com/news/business-30875633

I wonder what are the statistics of BTC and currencies. If it reaches over 51%, there is real possibility for BTC to be controlled by 1%. This is something like centralization for me.
In my country it is even worst about 20 families control more than 80% of the riches of the country, there is never going to be any kind of social mobility since they control everything in the country, bitcoin gives us chance to make money outside of fiat and all of their controls in the economy.
This is something shocking a country whose 80% or more of the economy is when under the control of so called 20 families the people of that country must be facing too much hindrances in continuing the financial growth because almost everything and institution will be in their approach and they may not give a chance to others to grow financially and as well socially.

I feel pity for the people there. Bitcoin in such circumstances will be of a great help for the people there because it will not be in their control and so people can carry on working in bitcoin. 
legendary
Activity: 1148
Merit: 1048
There is no way to prevent uneven bitcoin distribution.

In the end when Bitcoin will turn out to be a legit, true and successful asset then rich FIAT holders simply liquidate their fiat positions in favour of BTC.
Nothing will really change, rich will be richer and poor wouldn't still be able to afford to buy enough BTC to change their life

As to me, this is an unlikely scenario

With Bitcoin we likely have a wave of new money coming in (the so-called nouveaux riches). Obviously, fiat deep pockets (those will represent old money) will be in a subdued position if we assume that they would ever want to switch to Bitcoin one day (they will be running after ever evading prices like a kitten trying to catch its tail). This is certainly not what they will like because they simply can't accept this state of affairs. So they will likely try to fight Bitcoin whenever it starts to threaten their financial hegemony

Amen. The capitalization of the average 'rich' bitcoiner pales in comparison to the dynastic wealth of the truly rich, the actual 1%. Bitcoin would have to go to infinity to catch up with these guys,, there are folks on the Forbes list that are worth GDPs of small third world nations. Old money wouldn't have time for all the new, disruptive money running around, lobbying and whatnot and mucking up the general state of affairs.  And the government gets the most of its bread and butter from the top of the ladder. If bitcoin threatened the status quo, it will be regulated to a fine mist Smiley
legendary
Activity: 1232
Merit: 1091
So they will likely try to fight Bitcoin whenever it starts to threaten their financial hegemony

That might be the case when it comes to a smaller number of stubborn people, but everyone else with a decent level of economical understanding, will definitely not sit back and look how their fiat wealth is slimming down in value year after year. It doesn't mean they need to go all in, but it wouldn't hurt to convert around 25% of their fiat wealth to Bitcoin. If that's too risky for them, they could even go with 12.5% gold and 12.5% Bitcoin if that gives them a better feeling.
legendary
Activity: 3486
Merit: 1280
English ⬄ Russian Translation Services
There is no way to prevent uneven bitcoin distribution.

In the end when Bitcoin will turn out to be a legit, true and successful asset then rich FIAT holders simply liquidate their fiat positions in favour of BTC.
Nothing will really change, rich will be richer and poor wouldn't still be able to afford to buy enough BTC to change their life

As to me, this is an unlikely scenario

With Bitcoin we likely have a wave of new money coming in (the so-called nouveaux riches). Obviously, fiat deep pockets (those will represent old money) will be in a subdued position if we assume that they would ever want to switch to Bitcoin one day (they will be running after ever evading prices like a kitten trying to catch its tail). This is certainly not what they will like because they simply can't accept this state of affairs. So they will likely try to fight Bitcoin whenever it starts to threaten their financial hegemony
hero member
Activity: 700
Merit: 500
Well it isn't much of a chance to change the 1%. More like it adds to the 1% if you think about it.

The 1% have only a few million dollars USD just so you are aware. And that is their networth, not how much is in a bank account. Networth includes your bank account + stocks +stock futures + your house + your car + your business.

A lot of small businses owners are in the 1% if their business survives for 5 to 10 years. Most people who put into their retirement fund when they retire have millions of dollars that is used for retirement.


For peope who didn't have a retirement fund like a Roth IRA or a 401k, their money was taxed while they worked for 40 to 50 years, that money is then given to them in social benefits. So they technically have millions of dollars of networth too that is paid out monthly over 20 to 30 years.

The 1% is more like the 70% in America, because a lot of Americans will get this money or have a retirement fund, the 1% is misleading because that is comparing it to the rest of the world.
hero member
Activity: 1764
Merit: 584
It's more likely that the government and banking industry would try to regulate cryptocurrencies. Money stored in it after all would be hard to tax (bad for government) and can't be lent out (bad for bankers).

As for bitcoin reducing the fiat of the rich, they are just exchanging it for bitcoins so they still have their asset. And assuming it keeps going on an upward trajectory, then the rich earn much more. And this is money they might not be taxed for. The rich become richer, always. Nothing, nothing ever changes.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/making-sense/column-conquerors-inequality-four-horsemen-apocalypse/
sr. member
Activity: 406
Merit: 253
If the rich people begin to convert their Fiat money into bitcoin will dramatically increase demand, and hence will raise the price. Everyone who has coins can win. I'll keep the coins and wait for this moment.
legendary
Activity: 1862
Merit: 1004
There is no way to prevent uneven bitcoin distribution.

In the end when Bitcoin will turn out to be a legit, true and successful asset then rich FIAT holders simply liquidate their fiat positions in favour of BTC.
Nothing will really change, rich will be richer and poor wouldn't still be able to afford to buy enough BTC to change their life.
What bitcoin brought to the scene is more people, mainly early adopters, who will be extremely rich in the future.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 6249
Decentralization Maximalist
I think this is an interesting question, but we shouldn't analyze "wealth" in a static way. Wealth is often a dynamic process, where "money works" over time and feeds a certain class of people (those relying on profits inside the "financial system").

In this context I think Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies can definitively change something, because it provides an alternative to the banking system. "Crypto banking" is still not highly developed and it has a lot of problems, including the volatility of cryptocurrencies, but I see potential for it to replace the current banking system at some point in the future.

As Bitcoin is more transparent than the traditional banking system, there will be less chances for middlemen to "steal" money out of the system than it happens with the current banking system. That means that the cycle that feeds the elites that benefit from the financial system is weakened.

So Bitcoin could weaken the financial sector and instead boost the economic sector that produces "real world" economic goods and services. We'll have the "financial elite" then replaced by an "industrial elite" and a very small "Bitcoin elite".
sr. member
Activity: 980
Merit: 255
Old analysis but showing that 1% of population may hold ~50% of all money: http://www.bbc.com/news/business-30875633

I wonder what are the statistics of BTC and currencies. If it reaches over 51%, there is real possibility for BTC to be controlled by 1%. This is something like centralization for me.
In my country it is even worst about 20 families control more than 80% of the riches of the country, there is never going to be any kind of social mobility since they control everything in the country, bitcoin gives us chance to make money outside of fiat and all of their controls in the economy.
hero member
Activity: 924
Merit: 506
Yes bitcoin is bad for economic system, it smells like sh*t better not to touch it, I'm talking to the 1% holding fiat rich people you hear me?
People now are using crypto currencies for 2 reasons:

1- To have the freedom over their money without any governmental intervention.
2- To earn pure profit by pump & dump.
I see no problem with that.
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