BTC limit for "large withdrawals" on Bitstamp

Lohoris

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Bitgoblin

Quote from: mmeijeri on May 25, 2013, 07:09:51 PM

Sure, but what if I buy a EUR IOU from them? If it's backed by USD, there is currency risk when I redeem it.

It's fake EUR, actually, since once you send it to them, they "convert" it again to USD.
They of course you can withdraw (via SEPA) to a real EUR account, converting again.

TimJBenham

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Quote from: mmeijeri on May 25, 2013, 07:09:51 PM

Sure, but what if I buy a EUR IOU from them? If it's backed by USD, there is currency risk when I redeem it.

They could do a corresponding conversion of USD back to EUR, or refrain from converting some incoming EUR to USD, or just accept the risk. If their exchange rates are current then their expected loss is zero.

mmeijeri

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Martijn Meijering

Quote from: Lohoris on May 25, 2013, 03:44:54 PM

If I deposit 100€ when EURUSD is 1.3, I get 130$ in the Bitstamp account, and they likely internally held it in USD.
Then if EURUSD drops to 1.2 and I withdraw, I get 108€, thanks to the new exchange rate. But they didn't lose anything, if they really converted the currencies, rather than only "displaying" it.

Sure, but what if I buy a EUR IOU from them? If it's backed by USD, there is currency risk when I redeem it.

Lohoris

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Bitgoblin

Quote from: mmeijeri on May 25, 2013, 02:08:16 PM

They do convert all fiat money that is deposited into their accounts into dollars, but I don't know where those dollars are held. I don't understand why they do this though, because they do issue EUR and JPY IOUs and that seems to entail unnecessary exchange rate risk.

Since they do convert everything to USD, they are not at exchange rate risk.

If I deposit 100€ when EURUSD is 1.3, I get 130$ in the Bitstamp account, and they likely internally held it in USD.
Then if EURUSD drops to 1.2 and I withdraw, I get 108€, thanks to the new exchange rate. But they didn't lose anything, if they really converted the currencies, rather than only "displaying" it.

Terk

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Quote from: bernard75 on May 23, 2013, 02:43:16 AM

As i understand it Bitstamp processes large withdrawals manually.
It took 7h yesterday for the transfer to just being initiated.

Does anybody know what they consider "large"?

I think they might experienced a significant drain of BTC in recent days which they were not prepared for. Price difference between MtGox and Bitstamp has been at 5-8% for the last week. Lot of people were doing arbitrage moving funds MtGox->Bitinstant->BitStamp or MtGox->AurumXchange->Bitstamp to take advantage of this. So people were depositing BTC into MtGox, trading to USD, then moving USD to Bitstamp (via Bitinstant or AurumXchange), trading to BTC, then moving BTC to MtGox. So Bitstamp suddenly started getting much more USD deposits and much more BTC withdrawals than usual.

bernard75

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FDIC is US only afaik.
Anyway you saw what happened in Cyprus.

mmeijeri

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Martijn Meijering

Does that mean it is insured by the FDIC?

bernard75

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It is held in their Slovenian foreign currency account in USD.
Although i dont get why they wont open an EUR market, since they are the only ones in Europe.

mmeijeri

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Martijn Meijering

They do convert all fiat money that is deposited into their accounts into dollars, but I don't know where those dollars are held. I don't understand why they do this though, because they do issue EUR and JPY IOUs and that seems to entail unnecessary exchange rate risk.

yefi

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Quote from: mmeijeri on May 23, 2013, 03:56:25 AM

And don't forget that Slovenia's banking system is shaky and may be the next eurozone domino to fall.

This is the one thing that worries me about Bitstamp. A lot of people say that another Cyprus event would be good for Bitcoin, but if that country is Slovenia, Bitstamp's account could be frozen and everything over 100K confiscated.

mmeijeri

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Martijn Meijering

If their transaction records said "waiting for hot wallet to be replenished" instead of "finished" in that case and if they published read-only wallets for both their hot and cold wallets, then people wouldn't be so nervous if withdrawals took a bit longer. They already track the block chain status of incoming BTC deposits in the UI.

FundsMoney

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BTC will change the world

A little update about their delays in bitcoin withdrawal (which happen sometimes, when many users withdraw bitcoins at same time):

"Bitcoin withdrawals are usually instant. However due to our hot - cold wallet setup transfer may take up to 24 hours to be processed.

If you should need any further assistance in the meantime, please feel free to contact us again."

This is their official response..

Although, I never experienced a delay longer than 30 mins.

Kouye

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Cuddling, censored, unicorn-shaped troll.

Since Bitstamp is one of the last exchange in europe, I'm using it.
Pulled 4BTC off 2 hours ago, and got the first confirmation less than 2 minutes later. 6 went in within 30 minutes.

For now, it seems to be the most reliable european exchange, to me.

EuroTrash

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Quote from: 🏰 TradeFortress 🏰 on May 23, 2013, 03:08:55 AM

FYI, Bitstamp is most likely in violation of US laws because it is a Ripple gateway and issues bearer instruments of USD and other fiat currencies without appropriate licensing.

dude, we know you hate Ripple.
But would you ever stop your FUD-against-anything-ripple-friendly campaign?

Seriously.

http://www.thebitcointrader.com/2013/05/i-was-offered-550-to-say-that-ripple-is.html

bernard75

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Thx for the input, but back ot:

Does anybody know what they consider "large"?
Anything above 100?

mmeijeri

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Martijn Meijering

And don't forget that Slovenia's banking system is shaky and may be the next eurozone domino to fall.

🏰 TradeFortress 🏰

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👻

Quote from: bernard75 on May 23, 2013, 03:40:22 AM

As i already said they dont have any accounts in the US.
Their bank is based in Slovenia and owned by an Italian holding.

OK - so right now they are probably not affected. but interlacing with Ripple certainly reduces a lot of your options with US accounts or payment services.

solex

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100 satoshis -> ISO code

Quote from: 🏰 TradeFortress 🏰 on May 23, 2013, 03:31:51 AM

Quote from: solex on May 23, 2013, 03:22:38 AM

Quote from: bernard75 on May 23, 2013, 03:17:49 AM

No idea about the pseudo coin, but Bitstamp is not located in the US nor is its bank.

Indeed. They are based in Slovenia (next to North-East Italy)
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/wwwbitstampnet-bitcoin-exchange-site-for-usdbtc-38711

The FinCen guidance is irrelevant to them.

Not if they want to do business in the US. Mt Gox is incorporated in Japan but that does not prevent their US accounts from being seized or blocked.

Hence why I said "US laws".

So, are they doing business in the US if their bank account is in Europe? It goes down to the internet making a mockery of international borders. Gox does have US-based accounts.

Many non-US companies ban US citizens because of FACTA.
http://www.irs.gov/Businesses/Corporations/Foreign-Account-Tax-Compliance-Act-(FATCA)
So perhaps that might be more troublesome, the reporting obligations the IRS wants for foreign accounts. Unless foreign companies want a US-based bricks-and-mortar presence, adherence is optional or politically motivated

bernard75

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As i already said they dont have any accounts in the US.
Their bank is based in Slovenia and owned by an Italian holding.

🏰 TradeFortress 🏰

vip

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👻

Quote from: solex on May 23, 2013, 03:22:38 AM

Quote from: bernard75 on May 23, 2013, 03:17:49 AM

No idea about the pseudo coin, but Bitstamp is not located in the US nor is its bank.

Indeed. They are based in Slovenia (next to North-East Italy)
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/wwwbitstampnet-bitcoin-exchange-site-for-usdbtc-38711

The FinCen guidance is irrelevant to them.

Not if they want to do business in the US. Mt Gox is incorporated in Japan but that does not prevent their US accounts from being seized or blocked.

Hence why I said "US laws".

solex

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100 satoshis -> ISO code

Quote from: bernard75 on May 23, 2013, 03:17:49 AM

No idea about the pseudo coin, but Bitstamp is not located in the US nor is its bank.

Indeed. They are based in Slovenia (next to North-East Italy)
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/wwwbitstampnet-bitcoin-exchange-site-for-usdbtc-38711

The FinCen guidance is irrelevant to them.

bernard75

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No idea about the pseudo coin, but Bitstamp is not located in the US nor is its bank.

🏰 TradeFortress 🏰

vip

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👻

FYI, Bitstamp is most likely in violation of US laws because it is a Ripple gateway and issues bearer instruments of USD and other fiat currencies without appropriate licensing.

mmeijeri

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Martijn Meijering

Either way I would recommend against putting any money into Bitstamp until this is resolved.

bernard75

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But this doesnt make any sense, if they would be short of anything, it should be Fiat, considering the recent development.

mmeijeri

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Martijn Meijering

More people, myself included, are having trouble, and not just with large amounts. It looks as if their hot wallet is empty and I'm starting to have doubts about their cold wallet too. I think they should post read only wallets of both. I'd certainly encourage people not to use exchanges that don't.

bernard75

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As i understand it Bitstamp processes large withdrawals manually.
It took 7h yesterday for the transfer to just being initiated.

Does anybody know what they consider "large"?

Topic: BTC limit for "large withdrawals" on Bitstamp (Read 7860 times)