Topic: [BTC-TC] BTC-Mining - page 9. (Read 22657 times)

I would not rent hashing but buy it as bonds and have a sell back clause after a certain time (I would want to get that money back for my own title). That would mean I'd get some bitcoins and not wait for the hashing power, and would let the hashing seller buy some more equipment right away.

So it's more like a loan, a bit like current mining operations sold off hashing on their current equipment and purchased more, but kept a buyback clause. By just buying coins off the shelf, I'd basically just be giving money to the shareholders which doesn't necessarily help as much. I'd like to put that money back on shares for the second or third rig at a later date.

>I've been looking into buying existing hashing power for which mining proceeds would be given to members while equipment is received.

Sounds more like a bond then? Also why would you rent hashing power if you can buy coins off the shelf?

I've been looking into buying existing hashing power for which mining proceeds would be given to members while equipment is received. If I can find a seller, I'll keep you all updated. If not, I may order singles right away instead that would mine for members while receiving the actual mini-rigs.

Since that would be 100% funded by me, that would purely be a gift to members for waiting. But if it must come to that... why not?

I know my concern is that if I invest, it will be months before we get any returns.  Maybe you should get a small startup rig funded by member of your team, you could take ownership of some shares to cover the cost of the equipment.  This way there will at least be a small weekly return.  IF you start paying weekly, I am sure you will increase your sales greatly.

  No hard feelings, you have to stick to the plan as you see it, but a 50% div isn't for me.

I guess what I'm lookig for is something similar to this but with a max payout (minus essential fees) and a fixed share in a mini-rig, the I can re-invest if/as I see fit. Maybe you'll have something like that after this IPO, who knows.

It is scaled to 1 mini-rig. The first one will be ordered as soon as amount required is funded.

The reduced bitcoins/block is exactly what makes the mini-rig the good option. It consumes a very low amount of electricity and is thus much safer than the single or GPUs to have. Efficiency is key for reduced mining.

I'd also offer very good terms with insurance, management, electricity, etc. included in a 10% fee.

All this is only possible with large scale mining with efficient equipment. The reduced mining per block will be the same for everyone. Having only mini-rigs would be a big competitive advantage. If everyone likes the concept but doesn't take shares by fear not enough will sell, the project will never hatch. As I said, I'll purchase back all shares in 2 month if we don't reach enough for the first rig with a small extra to cover GLBSE transactions fee out of my pocket.  If you got idling bitcoins and are interested, then please do invest. I don't like tackling micro-projects when the returns per effort are little compared to large scale and wouldn't like to see the project fail out of a common fear of others not purchasing and a dislike about waiting a few weeks.

I find it hard to believe people wouldn't wait such a short time for those advantages.

Also, people would like to see me incur more risk personally. I will purchase 500 of the shares myself soon to help fund the first rig at some point next week.

P.S. A choose your own reinvestment option would be impossible to manage. If mining proceeds are split per share, those who reinvest more would pretty much give their money to every other members. If we'd try to solve this by adding more shares for buying new equipment, then new shares buyers end up paying for replacing the dying equipment of old shareholders and their investment is diluted. A fixed reinvestment rate for everyone is a good way to go in my opinion. You're free to disagree. 50% in dividends is still a 7% return per month and the equipment still holds a lot of value. They can be reprogrammed for other purposes/resold in case we need to.

P.P.S.
No hard feelings, but I felt people where mentioning those same fears way too much again and again. I've simplified the main post, moved the IPO numbers on the website and re-posted this at the end of the main post to clear things up.

I would seriously consider scaling down this project to just one Mini-Rig to start with,

I'd also make the "mandatory reinvestment" completely optional and set by the client. Depending on how you calculate ROI, even at 100% div, a minirig could take over a year just to pay itself off. Setting a 50% div and the other 40% reinvested simply won't work for a lot of people.

Personally I'd want a maximum return, with the option of re-investing my BTC later on once things start to pan out.

What's really killing this is the Mini-Rig delivery time coupled with the looming Block Reward split, leaving ~5 months of mining at 50 BTC/block.

The location where it will be mining will be motioned later. Probably a pool at first, then if we expend over 100 GH/s, maybe soloing.

Indeed it is a mandatory re-investment. Since equipment is co-owned, we need a fixed rate. And since equipment deteriorates over time, to grow we need a substantial re-investment in equipment. I thought 50% dividends would be enough for most people.

So it's a sort of mandatory re-investment?

Also, where will this be mining? Solo, or part of a pool?

The window is right to the left. A wall conditioning system may be added later with more rigs installed. It is still a low power consumption and thus low heat emission for a 75 ghash mining rig.

The equipment is owned by the members. All bitcoins put on new equipment increase the dividends, share value, and sales price if it is voted to stop the operation.

I can't quite wrap my head around this one. How is 40%, of the 90% returned to clients, used for new equipment?
If you return it to the client, how can you be using it to buy equipment?

at 1250w each, all said and done it'll be ~4kw of pure heat energy. If you've ever had a 1kw heater in a room, imagine 4 of those on full blast. I would seriously consider putting the rigs IN a window, like an AC unit and have a fan pump air over the rigs and out of the window.

Still, this sounds like a cool idea.

Just curious, because I don't see windows, how you plan to cool your rigs?  Assuming BFL delivers on the spec, I think you're looking at >3kw of heat for your 75GH/s. 

Great.

And notice that Lancelot's performance data is not revealed yet. The current data (380MH/s,20Watts) you saw comes from Icarus, which Lancelot tries to replace.

Thanks to both of you.

@friedcat
The others seem to understand those things too and that the rigs are a much better option cost-wise and also necessary competitive wise with their much lower power consumption. They seem to still be interested even if that means to wait for delivery. So I'll avoid going for singles or the Lancelot which have worse mhash/$ for now and are more power hungry.

The more it goes, the more I feel it's an awareness issue. People are either unaware the IPO is underway or for those that are watching this sub-forum, they have spent their bitcoins on previous IPOs. There's been previous IPOs with large initial volumes that went well.

The first round is already reduced and is one third of the shares as stated. Even less depending on current rate. People may not read this thread in full however. I'm adding that fact to the main post. It may help.

I'll stay active, visit the OTC chat regularly and browse for advertising options. I've also been told by some they will buy shares when I told them about this thread and will even buy some myself which should get BTC-Mining up in the shares list on GLBSE and reduce the shares left before first rig is ordered even further. That should take care of the "so many shares left, and I'll wait and see what other people do"

I'll have to look if anyone has interesting rates for loaning equipment. That may help too.

Tips:

1. Reduce your first round of IPO to raise coins for only 1 Mini-Rig. The psychology effect of "so many shares left, and I'll wait and see what other people do" is strong enough to stagnate your fundraising.

2. Use some existing hardware to make some instant profits for shareholders. You can loan them like BTCSYN did.

3. Switch to other mining configurations like BFL single or ngzhang's Lancelot (https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/fpga-development-board-icarus-discontinued-important-announcement-51371). The development of the latter hasn't finished (announcements will be in May probably), but I believe that, even so, the delivery date of Lancelot FPGAs will still be earlier than Mini-Rigs. Of course, Lancelot FPGAs has to be competitive to BFL products to be taken into consideration.

4. Advertisement might be helpful, but not as helpful as the three things above (they are not fully compatible to each other, of course, but you could consider 1 or 2 of them.)

I'm out of BTC at the moment but when I have some I plan on investing.

A bit slow but they're selling. I've heard of interest in BTC-Mining and seen other mining offers almost sell out on preorders, yet slow.

Would appreciate feedback from the ones that were interested. Are everyone out of bitcoins after the other mnining corp IPOs or the new securities sub-forum just don't get as much exposure?

I'm considering either purchasing a chunk of the shares myself or paying for a bit of advertisement. Opinions on that?

Shameless GLBSE threads spamming?  

Nice addition, even if just for the fun of it. Guess I might as well create a few questions for BTC-Mining for people to make predictions.

Edit: just added 2 questions now waiting in moderation (share price and hashing power changes)

GLBSE prediction market launched