Topic: BTC was first bottom up experiment. Is ETH first top down planned by banks? (Read 1144 times)

LOL, well my target was low!   Regardess, if you are watching and paying attention, look out below!  (and I may be off on the drop rate also.).  But a HODLer will see it all come back

Also - I am betting that this correction starts an XRP/Ripple inflow.  Again, I could be wrong.  Do your own due diligence.

Trade you fools!  Trade (said in a Ganndalf voice as it slips over the cliff!)

It's everything across the board actually.  I'm looking at Ethereum moving up.  Bitcoin is up and holding its gains.  XRP/Ripple is up a little.  Even the little coins keep making steady gains.   Money just keeps coming in.  And this is FIAT Money moving in.  This isn't just Bitcoins and Ether and XRP and various cryptocoins moving around, getting reapportioned.  This is a steady flow of new fiat money coming in.   That means we are going to KEEP most of these gains.

Sure, there will be pullbacks, mini-corrections etc.... but this is helping the entire crypto space.  And as this progresses, I think you'll see the field get narrowed down a bit.  I really do think we are at a time that the Frontline Coins, Second Tier, and Lesser Coins will start establishing themselves more firmly.

I'm telling you.... there is a hell of a lot of fear in the global fiat system.  I really think we're starting to see people commit to this, and reallocate in from fiat investments.  HODLers.  New HODLers.

Interesting thread. All I'll say is that we live in interesting times!

Get ready for an influx of new BCT users in the next few months!

You are quite right, ripple was first top down project, but with just assets and no smart contracts .

If ETH might work, or anything else like Hyperleder,... then R3 with Mike Hearn will care about the tech, that will be some intranet thingy like SWIFT is as well.

Overall: Ripple was before Ethereum when it comes to the top down approach.


Ripple's Interledger Protocol will connect the private networks.

Good thread to read:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/could-ripple-be-the-killer-app-bitcoin-has-been-looking-for-1343597

I don't think banks are interested in their own blockchain just as they are not interested in their own distro of Linux, or Oracle, or any other piece of software.

What they are looking for imho is interoperability with other banks and a ledger to support it (like SWIFT). This requirement might make them build something secure and private on top of ETH, but I don't believe that ANY bank wants it's own blockchain (unless it's a totally private blockchain akin to an intranet).

For one thing, trust me, they do not have the expertise to handle the tech.... yet.

There is an enormous cloud of FUD against ETH being generated by legions of furious shitcoin bagholders.

Sometimes.  I predict another wave of "to the moon enthusiasm" first though.  My target is a mid $7 - mid $9 spike before a pullback to $7 - then a slow stabilization of $8ish.   There's not really been enough of any event to rationalize any "profit taking".  My guess is we're coiling up tension for a break out to upside.

Who knows.  Maybe.  Maybe not.  It's going to keep going up in stages though in some way unless there is news that indicates it is going to fail / be replaced.  I don't see that anywhere.  Just occassional short pumping day traders that are bored and trying to force some movement - but I don't see any momentum for a short play yet.  So... up.

... Like sell on good news.

This whole thread is a bullish indicator for the price of ethereum.

That's the truth. The banks don't need Bitcoin, Litecoin , Ethereum or any alt coin in existence. If blockchain technology is of use to them they will just borrow it for their own purposes. None of us will be involved except when we purchase such services from the bank. Or I suppose in a few cases work for them.

This is an interesting concept, although I smell a bit of "Short Positioning" in the motive of the post.  But it is a legitimate topic, one I think everyone in cryptocurrency space wrestles with, which is.....  "What are THEY working on behind the scenes that WE don't know about?"

It's the "Fiat Coin Conspiracy Theory".  But like they say, sometimes they really are out to get you   LOL

Here's my take on this..... 

IF there is a killer coin in the wings, then it is being worked on by Techies in the space.  And those techies are talking between each other, and positioning etc. The interesting thing about Banks and Crypto - is that no matter what coin it eventually is - the banks are more and more at the mercy of the tech coders.  Jamie Dimon, Feinstein, Blythe Masters etc.... all may be manipulative geniuses, but at the end of the day, they don't understand diddly squat about the techno details, and are at the mercy of the tech geniuses working for them.  Those tech geniuses aren't going to not capitolize on their knowledge of what is getting ready to be released.  And there will be signs.  My opinion.

So what signs are there?

Well, Ether & Bitcoin are steadily rising.  Slow.  Steady.  Ether is probably better investment.  Ripple/XRP is worth having having some but is doing nothing.  But the sign is that insiders have confidence in increases in Bitcoin/ethereum.  The "Ripple Lawsuit" has allowed an original investor to unload vast amounts daily - so that fact that price isn't eroding indicates there are steady buyers, so another indication of insider strength.  And especially in Ethereum and Ripple - there is NO News driving the positive trends.  Almost cmplete news cycle vacuum.  That indicates insider confidence.
Disclaimers: I myself am about 70% ether currently.  Bitcoin is also good for about 10%.  Bitcoin just seems safe, but even a huge move in bitcoin, is still less of a percentage move that you see on any given day in Ethereum, so it is dead investment to me which is the only reason I don't balance more in at present.  Then there is Ripple/XRP and I am about 20% in that.  It isn't doing squat because of the whale seller, but if there is a move - that's the one that has potential for violent upside moves.  But all three are relatively safe space investments IMHO.

EXCEPT for this concept discussed here - the possibility that big banks are getting ready to pull a head fake bitcoin/ethereum/ripple/altcoin destroying fiat coin release.  Is it possible?  Yes.  Here's the impact on the various coins as I see it, and the probable outcomes:

Bitcoin:  I hate Blockstream/Cripple Coin/Lightening.  BUT, I think they've won, and I think the real winners are getting ready to be Google ad other Tech Companies that will be the big winners in crypto.  If they get Lightening Network worked out and implemented, you'll see banks partially replaced by App based money.  You'll store and spend your crypto money directly from your phone/laptop accounts.  You're already seeing the first "Swipe Your Phone" tv commercials.  So that is coming, and I think that a fiat coin won't stop that completely - unless the world's nations make bitcoin illegal.  But if bitcoin/lightening has the backing of Google/Apple/ATT/IBM etc.... then you can betcha it will NOT be killed by legislation.  JPMorgan/Goldman Sachs have an equally sized, if not larger adversary in the Giant Tech Companies.  I would bet on the Tech Giants over the Bank Giants in the actual money holding/transaction aspect of crypto.  The power has shifted.  Banks are weak, and actually have less influence in the political world nowadays than tech does.

Ethereum:  I really think Ethereum is going to be the basis for Western Banking transactions.  Too much work and infrastructure already built out.  However, if Homestead isn't here by May, I might start getting nervous.  I don't like the delay.  Homestead met it's prerequisites to be implemented long ago.  The December release was delayed for no apparent reason.  The entire delay seems centered around the fact that they can still market it as "Risky Beta - Don't Invest more than you can Lose".  That has Two possible explanations.... a) they are trying to tamp down the eventual price explosion as long as they can in order to let it expand to a broader audience (which makes the platform/coin stronger) or b) they are legally covering their butts and there actually is a plan to fork it into a fiat coin and kill it off.   But I don't think they will, because banks thrive on revenue based models....  loans, transaction fees, service fees.  I think we're seeing merger of FIN & TECH & MANUFACTURING/ECONOMY especially in Ethereum.  The manufacturing/economy aspect is the most solid/important - the whole contracts aspect being built into NEW Devices, Home Construction, Autos, Service Sectors etc.  Its an economy driving model that has potential for fees - and that IS the banking model.  They will just capitolize on it, they won't "own" the currency.  And that is the whole basis of this "Fiat Coin Conspiracy Theory" - that the central banks/banks/nations will want to control the money, own the money.  But going back to the former argument under bitcoin - I don't think they can fight the Big Tech Giants - who WILL win this aspect.  Tech will "Own" the money.  I don't think people understand that at certain levels, companies like Google, IBM, Apple, Micosoft etc..... OWN the nations and banks already to a degree by the simple fact they control everything.  Every day that passes you see them exerting that power more and more.  So I think in the end it makes more sense for Banks to just go with flow that Ethereum is already building out - and try and control the fees, ledgers, service functions, machine contracts etc.

Ripple: Basically everything you see in Ethereum, except I think it may be just a second competitive player, maybe for the eastern/asian banking circle.  I'm honestly not sure how this one is ultimately positioned.  I research this one continually, and I think the fact it is so closed is in itself an argument that a big pop / series of announcements are in the works.  Maybe a month or two?  I'm slowly adding little bits here and there to this one.  I think it will likely emerge as one of the big 3 or 4.  But because of the black hole of info - human nature is to fear/avoid it.  Which is why i buy it, becasue it seems intentional, and I do believe there is gold at the end of this particular rainbow for those that wait.  But even I get nervous

ALSO, similar to the question the OP raises.... there is the whole China question, which is.... will they develop a "national coin"?  I think the answer to this is also no, for similar reasons as ethereum, but with more of a focus on Globalization.  In the end we are moving to a Global Currency Network that is based on Crypto.  Global means Shared.  Shared means Trust.  Trust means "Decentralized Centralization".

"Decentralized Centralization" is the fact that the Giants will still control everything, but no single Giant will have control.  The Glue that holds it together will be the Central Control of the Tech Giants in my opinion.... not the Bank Giants, nor the Nation Giants.

Crypto is developed by PEOPLE in the tech world.  They are techies first, and work for bankers or nations second.  An NSA tech analyst has more in common with a Mike Hearns from Google/R3CEV, or a Coder at Facebook/Apple/IBM - than he does with Lloyd Feinstein or Jamie Dimon or Blythe Masters, or even an Obama, Xi JinPing or Putin.

Tech is rising in power.  Banks and Nations are falling in power.  Just the way it is.  It's the trend, and it is why I think the existing Coins are the coins we will end up with.  That isn't to say there may not be a surprise along the way.... but I think that any new major coins will be telegraphed clearly enough to anyone watching, and there will be time for orderly rebalancing of portfolios.  And I think that is all it will be - a portfolio rebalancing event.  Not a KILLER COIN that destroys all Bitcoin, Ethereum, Ripple/XRP overnight.  Just another big coin.  Just another opportunity for anyone watching to get in early. 

But that day hasn't come yet, so for today I continue to buy a weighted portfolio of Bitcoin, Ethereum, Ripple/XRP.  My opinion for what it is worth.

Peace,
- david

I think ETH is still a bottom up project, but banks jumped on it as it might be something useful for them, they can make tests, experiments, they can gather knowledge and experience in a live environment and they can get all of it for free.

What use does a bank have for a community? That promotes bitching and factions and people quit all the time. If they want something developed they recruit and pay for what they need.

For starters, Rootstock is a white paper while Ethereum is a functioning network. Its likely that banks will be using private networks anyway though with limited access, and secured privately so they don't have to deal with the overhead of a public blockchain.


I think the best and easiest initial use case to understand for Ethereum is gambling. Currently the industry is notorious for shady dealings with either operators/bookies ripping people off and/or extracting very high fees, or the government stepping in and highly regulating various aspects. A trustless, decentralized, low fee, unregulated system will be a huge boon to the industry. Smart contracts guarantee profits for operators, while protecting betters from fraud and government interference. IMO, the gambling industry alone could propel Ethereum.

You wouldn't. Banks may very well setup a private Ethereum network for them to use for a very specific purpose. To me, this looks like the direction that R3 will point these institutions to.

Bottom line, while the blockchain technology holds a lot of promise for banks, they don't really need a fully decentralized system so it doesn't make sense for them to pay the costs of that wide decentralization.

Do you have evidence of a functional smart contract running blockchain? Beeing Turing complete, scalable and decentral + trustless?

I still don't understand what actual use cases can ETH bring to the table. Why would anyone use Ethereum if sidechains bring stuff like Rootstock and prove it to work? Why would anyone use ETH blockchain then which is smaller, has less nodes, has existed for less time... I don't see any benefits.

R3 is watching ETH and playing with that. But better prove it by bigger community?