Topic: Buffet, Munger and Gates Denounce Bitcoin (Read 284 times)

What to expect from people of old school. They really can not believe this because they simply do not understand the phenomenon of crypto currency. However, what the author writes about is also completely impossible to exclude

It's just a statement or maybe it's something they're on hold and waiting for the opportunity. Gradually they will understand and adapt to electronic money, then give out thoughts again. I believe they will change their minds and adapt to the technology of the day.

See, for example, the multi-century statistics of financial crises here:

https://qz.com/1096237/deutsche-bank-analysis-on-the-frequency-of-financial-crises/

Now it is true that gold-standard era crises may have been more severe, if less frequent.  But that is only because democratic and trade-union forces were not powerful enough to oppose the elites' tight-money policy after a crisis, in an attempt to protect the their system (ie to avoid or minimize devaluation against gold) by imposing even more pain on average people.

I don't for a minute think the elites want to go back to a hard-money-standard in the same form as the classical gold standard.  What they will hope to achieve is the best of both worlds from their point of view: the relative infrequency of crises of the gold standard, combined with the ability to prevent political 'crises' by lessening the pain.  It will most likely be a 'flexible hard-money standard' with continuous devaluation of state money over the long term.  And of course the new mantra won't be 'gold is money and dollars are debt,' but that 'gold/Bitcoin are subject to market supply and demand and we have to let these values go up if we mess up and inflate too much of a bubble.'  (Of course, the reality will be that they will try to manipulate hard-money values down, most of the time, much like what they have done with gold since 1971.  It's just that since they have more Bitcoin, they can be more market-friendly with it, and that makes sense for them too.)

This would not be very different in essence from the gold and silver standards. The public narrative will be completely different, but that doesn't matter, since that has been deceptive from day one.

Everyone can have their own opinion about the market, investing in the market have its risk and there is nothing wrong in it but some people clearly do not want to take the risk and every market had its risk when it all started, the stock market was a revolution when it started centuries back and i am sure there were many people having negative thoughts about it and we all know how it is going, this is another revolution and i am sure this will change the economics in the future.

It is.  There's no way to really know what anyone thinks.

Well, even the forked coins claim to have some technical merit.  Bitcoin Cash is supposed to be more scalable, right?  But the major reason for all of this inflation is still IMO someone wants to make a profit.  This is not to say technical improvements are not real, but the reality is that somebody benefits big.  And, even more importantly, a market of many coins is much easier for the elites to manipulate in the future.

Do not mind the statement of the 3 people. They will never declare not to hate bitcoin, their three statements always contain to suggest that we do not use cryptocurrency especially bitcoin. I do not understand why those 3 characters do not support the existence of cryptocurrency and technology when they know that the potential of cryptocurrency is very promising for a safer economy without being controlled by anyone or any party.

Go back and look at all the financial crises that happened under the gold standard. It was not the bastion of stability you make it out to be. Deflation caused by the gold standard created the Great Depression. If the "elites" run things as you seem to think and they want a gold standard, there'd be a gold standard. Congress (the Senate) especially is made up of substantially richer than normal folks in our society, and if they have so much power and desire for the gold standard and are doing the bidding of even richer people who also want a gold standard, we'd have a gold standard. In fact, it was the elites who wanted out of the gold standard because it was capping economic growth and limiting their wealth. I never see Bitcoin achieving any kind of price stability. Nobody wants it to have that. They'd rather gamble on a speculative vehicle and dream about the moon.

http://www.nber.org/papers/w3488
http://www.nber.org/papers/w18616

There's plenty more.

The economy is susceptible to deflation on the gold standard. The world has moved on for good reason.

To a large extent there is some reason in what you have expatiated but the convincing factor is not there in that everything is still based on speculation. The argument about the unlimited about of crypto and the dilution afterwards is very much valid and with the advent of forks, it makes it very easy than we all thought. If it had been the creation of other coins, I wouldn't have any issue with it because I believe that for such coin to gain popularity, it needs to add some value to the market through some level of advertisement unlike the forked coins that relies on exiting market structure and thereby diluting the portfolios of people depending on where loyalty lies and not bringing in new investment because only existing markets participants knows about them.

On the theory, there is always some group of people behind the market position and because of the current market capitalization, its fairly easy to manipulate but I hope this won't last for long.

Nothing other than this could be expected from these corporate guys.They would still continue to speak in this way against cryptos.They don't want any such new technology like cryptos to spread all over the world disturbing the traditional economic firms.

If the top elites dislike the gold standard so much, why did every gold standard get abandoned only when the elites were about to run out of gold?

'Fiat money' might have created a lot of the wealth of the elites of today, but the system is also much more unstable than the gold standard days, and on the whole less desirable from the top elites' point of view.

Bitcoin hasn't achieved a stable exchange rate against fiat money, yet.  It will likely go up a lot more (if with a lot of turbulence) before it does.  No, it will probably never serve as a unit of account or means of exchange (the trustless blockchain arhitecture makes those impossible pretty much from the start.)  But store-of-value is money's most important function.

Check out two books: 'Gold Wars,' and 'The Gold Cartel.'

Does this old folks affecting you guys?because for me its not..
They have been showing disliking to bitcoin then why need to be bother while we can expect more of this or much hated words in future,

Lets just dont give a damn with this 3 musketeers and continue support bitcoin anyway this is the best way to do thn reading and buying their press releases

we dont know what the elites are planning, sometimes cornering and making bad comments about bitcoin and cryptos, sometimes they also say good things and give very good eagerness and desire to hear about this bitxoin, one thing for sure, every time commenting about bitcoin, it will affect the price, that's my opinion on this

Absolutely. It's too much of a coincidence for me that Bill Gates, Munger, and Buffett all presented their points on bitcoin at the same time, and just coincidentally they were all completely negative stances on bitcoin.

So if they were connected by some way or another, I would not be surprised whatsoever.

Buffett even goes to say that bitcoin is not an investment, which is completely absurd. They seem to be trying too hard to discredit bitcoin completely right now, and with Buffett's influence, can definitely influence a lot of prospective investors.

Bitcoin only does one thing new, and that's decentralization. It's a poor store of value due to instability in the price, it's an even poorer currency for the same reason. When he says Bitcoin doesn't solve any real world problems, it's acknowledging the reality as it is right now. The best you can say about Bitcoin is it has potential to change things, but nobody who needs to conduct day to day commerce is taking Bitcoin seriously. To the extent it's used at all, it's to appeal to the niche part of the market that wants to use it for transactions. Bitcoin hasn't proved any ability to be the new gold, the best you can say again is that it has potential, but it's much more of a speculative asset than a store of value.

Bitcoin can't even hold it's value for an hour, the notion that it's more stable than the USD is idiotic. Sorry, there's no sense in sugarcoating that. It's absolutely absurd.

No elite prefers the gold standard because the fiat standard is what made them wealthy. The gold standard was abandoned because it constrained the economy by limiting debt-fueled growth. It wasn't until the abandonment of the gold standard that you got this explosion of ultra wealthy elites, and since the abandonment of the gold standard, the wealth accumulation by the top .1% has really accelerated relative to the rest of the populace. It defies logic they would abandon the system that created their wealth to a larger degree than the gold standard would have allowed, so if you want to sell that, you need to provide some substantiation, because it's not a compelling theory.

Dilute the value hm! Actually copy the codes, creating the value and then letting the value for current coin dilute is what done by mots of the forked coins. But it seems that there is no underlying proof of this which supports that statement. I mean I believe that they all have failed all the time when they come out as forked coins. You know very well what happened with them and today bitcoin still stands at the top. I am just counter arguing the statement of diluting the coin value and nothing much.

I'll be honest, I don't even know what Gates, Buffett, and Munger said exactly, because I don't read news or watch it.  However my guess is that they were asked about it because crypto is hot and has made the mainstream news lately--so the media people wanted their opinion on it, because they know all three people are old-school (except maybe for Gates, who's a technology pioneer).  I really think they believe that bitcoin is useless. 

I've seen the disadvantages of bitcoin since I've been into crypto.  It just doesn't match fiat in terms of cost or speed.  The average person won't want to buy bitcoin in order to spend it, and nobody I know gets paid in bitcoin--and everything is priced in terms of fiat!  I get that bitcoin doesn't depend on governments or banks, and that's why I like it, but I understand that's why people like Buffett couldn't care less.  Buffett looks at things very rationally and unemotionally, and he has no need for bitcoin--or even more fiat at this point in his life.  So I don't think this is any sort of campaign of mis- or disinformation; I think it's their honest opinions, which they gave because they were asked to by the media.

It's amazing how many of these conspiracy theories you see, when you look for anything Bitcoin related on Youtube for example.
No wonder people start copying that and basically spread unfounded claims of mass market manipulation.

I'm not saying that there isn't market manipulation going on, just saying that I haven't seen any credible source provide us with any real evidence.

You can always take this perspective.  You can say things are just as simple as they appear in public, and it's hard to prove you wrong.  Whether there is a deliberate (dis)information campaign, we really have no evidence either way.  What I try to do is to look at incentives.

I would disagree with 'Bitcoin doesn't solve real world problems,' however.  Bitcoin is the new gold (not entirely, but largely.)  The elites clearly prefer something like a gold standard (they just won't say so at this point!)  Whether it's good or bad for the economy, it does provide for more stability compared to 'totally fiat' money we have today.

The reason Bitcoin has come this far may well be due to behind-the-scenes support by the top Western elites, who would like to return to something like the gold standard, but don't have enough gold to do it (or have to devalue currency against gold to an extraordinary and embarrassing degree to obtain any stability.)

It's the people making them look like monsters trying to disrupt the crypto market for their personal gains. They are nothing more than a bunch of trolls altogether -- the more we grant them attention, the more they will talk trash about everything concerning this market. Warren Buffett made a very interesting statement that clearly shows that he is out to troll everyone here. His point was that if you like something and see value in it, why would you get mad when someone is discrediting it? The sole reason is that people are in for the profits, and I completely agree with him on that part. We shouldn't talk about their trolling and shouldn't try to correct them, because it only confirms their thoughts and fuels further trolling from their side. Bitcoin doesn't need anyone to prove them wrong because it's proving wrong all naysayers on a daily basis already, and that with progress and development....