Topic: Buy the DIP, and HODL! - page 210. (Read 109096 times)

The DCA is talked about so much because it is the best method if strictly followed. Before one talk about investing in bitcoin it is assumed that everything like source of funding is in place. Anyone who talks about the DCA method without following it, is not deceiving anybody but him/her self because at the end of the day it is what you have accumulated that you will stand a chance of profiting. Before you start up your investment journey it is always advisable to have plan, and holding period, something like roadmap so that you will always be guided by it. When it comes to investing in bitcoin we shouldn't just do it any how. We should do it with all diligence, knowing that we are investing our resources there and what we are doing has the possibility of transforming our life.

If you have to benefit, from all kinds of strategies you have to move forward only if you will succeed. Suppose you have a super shop, if you just want from a running product to be more profitable in that case you need to hold a few days, If the price is low or high in the market, you can buy product by following DCA strategies, thus you can keep your capital safe and more profitable if you invest. This strategy will make you more profited by both. And the big businessmen became even bigger businessmen following this method. If you have a lot of money you could invest by HOLD, and after a period you will be beneficial....Simultaneously following DCA can boost your profit.

Nah I've not been up to 16 months in, I've only been 6 months in although I started beign consistent from December, but now I'm confused can please explain more about the bear market and the bull market, cause i initially thought that the bear is when bitcoin is experiencing a price decline and much people are selling instead of buying while the bull is when bitcoin is appreciating in price and more people are buying instead of selling. This has been the definition of what a bear market and a bull Market has been to me, is there a better way to define this or have I been wrong with my own personal definition or concept of bear and bull markets.

If I started buying before December or rather let me use December, the trend was kind of bearish casue we were still experiencing some kind of price decline and I think bitcoin also had a major dip or correction to 25k around that same period of time, so i think anyone nee to bitcoin woudl assume they are in a bull, that's why I've been thinking that way.


I highlighted a paragraph out, I've not been mixing strategies, I've been buying but I always thought we have been in the bear Market and I have also expressed myself in terms if us beign in the bear market but right now I feel my perspective of what a bear market or bull market is shattered, so I think it would be fair if I could explain more about it.

You are actually right on this sir, I have not been into this crypto space for too long, but have done a lot of research and findings and what I have observed and take notice of is people that bought Bitcoin with the intention of holding it for a very long time like 4 years upward as you mentioned, are people that benefited the most from their investment, because I have seen that Bitcoin investment is more beneficial to a long term holder, than a short term holder, and during the cause of that lengthy years, the accumulation of that person will be much more impressive if he or she keeps to his accumulating strategy during that time, and he will sure reap bountifully when the perfect time comes that he wish to take some profit.

One thing with human is that when something is introduced newly not everyone will show interest yet because they are afraid if it will have a future, every one is careful with their investments as no body want to lose while investing. The few that embraced Bitcoin when it was introduced, had the most advantage of it and some of them who were so determined to continue investing saw a "light at the end of the tunnel"
I have come across various posts talking about using the DCA as a beginner in Bitcoin investment but that's not a prerequisite that when you use the DCA that you are good to go but what is important is your ability to maintain the DCA because it is not just about saying it but actions matters a lot like what effort will you be putting in place to make your DCA survive the test of time so before thinking of DCAing, a reliable source of maintaining the DCA must be put in place

You are reading me out of context.  I was talking about anyone who may have been investing in bitcoin in the last 16 months has been investing in a bull market, and even if you have intentions to invest longer than 16 months, there surely are quite a few forum members who are participating in this thread who started in the last 16 months.

Furthermore, your forum registration date is coming upon 5 years, so maybe you are getting close to 5 years of investing into BTC.?

By the way, another thing that I frequently mention is that anyone who considers himself as an investor in BTC and buys new BTC should have a plan to invest 4-10 years or longer for any new purchases that he makes, otherwise from my point of view, he would be considered a speculator rather than an investor on those new purchases if he is not able to consider an investment timeline of at least 4 years.

Investing for 16 months is not really wise for me. Because here it is possible to make profit only by planning and investing for 16 months, it may not be correct, many times I think some part should be invested regularly. It should be planned to invest for a period of at least 3 to 5 years so that no matter what stage the market goes through, the investment will continue and the profit will always increase.

It is not about what you believe as that cannot change what the market wants to do. Instead of focusing in that, your plans should be how to take advantage of the opportunity the market is offering you with the declines and purchase some Bitcoins as your finances permit. Following thus thread should motivate you to be invested in Bitcoin already while you continue to improve on your knowledge of Bitcoin.

I usually feel happy when I see new people join us because I was once a newbie and I made a lot of mistake when I started. Being active in this forum and engaging in the discussion help shape my understanding which helped in my decision making process. I always appreciate the process that brought me this far and I'm grateful for the opportunity to be part of Bitcoin.

I am confused.  I thought that you ONLY recently started accumulating bitcoin.. so if so, you were not investing in a bear market.

And, even if you started investing in the last 16 months, it was not a bear market.

I will grant that we might not have realized that the last 16 months had been a bull market until either mid-2023 or maybe it did not sink in with enough evidence until around October 2023... but the fact of the matter is that any investment strategies that you had been employing in bitcoin in the last 16 months had not been during a bear market.

You cannot proclaim that it was a bear market merely because it was below the previous ATH.. the fact of the matter of the last 16 months is that the BTC price had been pretty much going up the whole time even though there were some corrections in there and some of us might not have had been clear about it having had been a bull market the whole time.

In other words it is a bunch of bullshit when people are mislabelling what kind of market that we were in....

Now, if you had been in the market in late 2021 and through out 2022, then you would  have been in a bear market, yet you would not have realized that you were in a bear market until maybe some time around May 2022 it became somewhat clear that we were in a bear market.

I will grant you that we don't really necessarily know what kind of market we are in at the time that we are in it, so sometimes we should be talking with some caution about what kind of market that we are in, especially since laboring what kind of market we are in is a lagging indicator, and the mere fact that we might be in a bull market and there are some corrections in the middle of the bull market, the market does not change merely because there is a correction, even though we might not know where we are at, even though at any given time, we can see that we are in an uptrend or a correction or maybe a consolidation range.

Anyhow, part of my point is that the dynamics are different if you are getting in and you are buying while the BTC prices are going up as contrasted if you are buying while they are going down.

Now if you are mixing your actions by buying and selling (in other words trading) then that is another story, but if you are strictly buying, then you have a dynamic that either your holdings are continuously going into less and less profits (in a bear market) or you have the dynamics that your holdings are increasingly in profits (in a bull market).

Maybe you need to explain your timeline again in order for me or anyone else to understand when you were buying and what you were doing because my sense (or memory.. which might be faulty) is that you have not even been buying more than 16 months.. so therefore you were likely buying in a bull market, even if you might not have had realized it.. but feel free to correct me if my memory is wrong.


There is no way to answer for everyone, but if you are buying (or establishing a position in) bitcoin, then you could front load lump sum, DCA and/or buy on dips, and so maybe you could have a target allocation that you are wanting to reach in light of the rest of your investment portfolio... so if you initially establish what your target allocation is going to be, then it could make some differences if you are acquiring your position while the BTC position is going up versus acquiring it while the BTC prices are going up.

If you are not sure about what your target is, then you would just have a budget and just continue to accumulate BTC.. within the budget, and if the budget is not very BIG, then it could take several years before you try to consider or figure out what your target level of  accumulation is going to be.

If you are worrying about getting in and out then you are trading/gambling and not investing.. so yeah, it likely depends on what kind of mindset you come to your investment... and of course, anyone is likely going to become nervous when the price is moving around a lot and he is still trying to establish his position since it could take a year or two to establish.. or maybe if there is lump sum investing up front, it still could take 6 months or more to establish a position, but if the price is moving around a lot then there could be some rethinking that ends up happening becaue the price is moving around a lot and perhaps the movements of the price could challenge the investment thesis. if the price moves had not been anticipated.


Well if you would have started out by buying towards the top of the market let's say at various times in 2021.  It could have been early 2021 and then the price goes up and then drops and then goes up again and then drops. or even if you started towards the end of 2021, then you might have had front-loaded your investment, so then your cost per BTC would have had been quite high, and so when the price ends up dropping more than 70%, then you may well be a lot in the negative, and even if you keep buying, maybe you do not have enough money to really off set the amount that you bought at or near the top, so you end up staying in the negative for a couple of years.

A similar thing happened to Bukele (and El Salvador)  He started buying in 2021, so he ended up buying a lot coins at or near the top, and sure it could have had been worse for him, but he (on behalf of El Salvador) had something in the mid $40ks as his average cost per BTC  when the price dropped down to $15,479, and at some point he (El Salvador) resumed buying BTC and even announced in November 2022 that they (El Salvador) were going to resume buying at 1 BTC per day.

So I think it takes some level of commitment to continue to buy at a rate that you believe is reasonable, even while your BTC holdings are in the negative, overall and on average.  So if you keep buying while the price is below your average costs, each time you buy more BTC, you are bringing down your average costs per BTC... even though it may be just little by little, but then it does not take as much for the BTC price to go up in order for your BTC holdings to get back into profits.


It may well be similar for anyone.  If you have decently strong confidence that each new BTC purchase that you make is for 4-10 years or longer, and so even if you have older coins and newer coins and each of your purchases have differing costs, you still can also average them out and there may well be some excitement to be continuing to buy and bringing down your average cost per BTC, even if your holdings is still in the negative in the process of going through such ongoing BTC purchases.


By the way, any guys waiting for dips, now we have slightly more than 12% (from $73,794 down to $64,780, so far). Who knows if the BTC price is going to go lower on this particular correction.

There isn't any actual necessity to advertise Bitcoin, probably a social media campaign, ads or whatever is not a good one. I came to realize that Bitcoin is already as more versatile than we think, just that most people who claims to know nothing must have heard about Bitcoin but only ignorant on how it works, too lazy to pick up the internet and get details of Bitcoin.

Not just alone financial institutions, companies and many other platforms already made Bitcoin as part of payment option, this should tell more about the popularity and wide range of adoption.

It's certainly true that Bitcoin market is dumping but I still believe that the declining will not take much time before it will appreciate and this time the appreciation will be in parallel increase in the price of Bitcoin. However, the decline in the price of Bitcoin is a good opportunity for investment in Bitcoin market and to acquire more Bitcoin as possible but irrespective of the unexpected decline in the price of Bitcoin I think it will good for one to have adequate knowledge and understanding of Bitcoin price focasting and proper budget  planning before thinking of investing much money to Bitcoin.

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Considering the flutuation in the present price of Bitcoin there may be expectable more declining in price, although it's not certain but it seen to happen and if this happen those that are in rush to buy Bitcoin now may still regret for not waiting for minimum decline before making the investment. However, the present decline may be an avenue and the opportunity for those that were not financially able to invest at the high price of Bitcoin to invest and accumulate more Bitcoin as much as they may possibly afford with the expectation of a near future appreciation of Bitcoin price.

This is not about trading, it is about how we can save Bitcoin in the long run. We protect our bitcoin holdings by following the same approach as how bitcoin hedges risk in the long term, and the DCA method helps control the average price. So we will discuss holdings as any other discussion may change the mind of investors, so we only apply to the discussion of how to accumulate bitcoins for the long term.

Trading is not advice worthy, you'll make a lot of bad acquaintances if you tell people go trading😂
Good point about your last line, there. Holding has proven it's worth, and I've preached it, all every bull run gives me a reference.

I know I've not been that long in bitcoin but at least if this bull run is over I would count that as one cycle cause I started accumulating during the bear market and one thign I noticed is how much it is hard to hold in such market conditions and how it can affect the best of us especially those that have a major portion of their asset or Value stored in bitcoin, although I was so early I've had thoughts of how the old folks manages go persiver through all those hard times and one thign that came to my mind is how they all had a personal conviction about their investment In bitcoin and how they all consistently continued in their buying of bitcoin in all market conditions.

IMO in anything one wants to achieve great result in life persistence is one attribute that we must have even when thigns are quite against us, and I think one way to actually reduce the impact of those hard times is to have a long term plan for your investment, cause if its a short term or the time duration is too short like a year or two its so possible that your investment can still be mutually experiencing one side of the trend like the bear or maybe you bought at very high prices, you would most likely have feelings of failure in your investment but if you had a longer term plan its easier to have patience cause your approach to bitcoin won't be to solve a short term problem but for a longer term plan, like maybe reaching a fuck you status or retirement.

From my little experience I know that it has been way easier for me to have patience and be consistent cause I know that my plan is for a much further future so I just tend to keep my eyes of profit and loss and focus more on accumulating bitcoin.

It seems what you are saying is a fair interpretation, and it is up to you if you feel that you are able to invest and still potentially be a financial burden on others in terms of meeting your basic needs.. and I suppose referring to food and lodging as the most fundamental.   

But, yeah if you want any investment to last there is a need to be able to create and maintain some kind of cushion between the money for your living expenses and the investment, and it seems that we have already been discussing that the larger your investment becomes, then the more need that you are likely going to have to make sure that you have sufficient finances so that you don't have to dip into it at any time except your own choosing, which I am suggesting to be 4-10 years or longer, and if you are not able to invest for that long, then you might not really be in a situation to be gambling with whatever money that you might need for your living expenses.

So if there can be ways to figure out how to increase your income or to cut your expenses, then you are in a better position to be able to invest, yet since we are participating in a quasi-anonymous forum, we cannot always know the abilities (or lack thereof) for some of our members to be able to earn an income or to keep their income steady or even to maybe have some abilities to save up some extra cash if their income is not very reliable.


I know that some folks might be worried about the extent to which their BTC holdings are in profits, and I frequently say that the first BTC I bought was not in profits for over 3 1/4 years from November 2013 until March 2017; however, my overall average cost per BTC had various periods of being in profits, and maybe some ambiguity in regards to the level of profits depending on how well it was calculated during close to 3 years before the average costs per BTC had clearly gone into profits.

So there can be long term periods in which an investment like bitcoin might not be in profits, yet we can still figure out position size and investing techniques that involve ongoing buying and hopes to have more options in the future, including hoping to be profitable in the future.. while realizing that profits are not guaranteed, even in an investment as great as bitcoin... but we are likely going to have better chances of being in profits in the longer term if we continue to exercise prudent, persistent, reasonable and ongoing  BTC accumulation practices.

In other words the main way to prepare for the BTC price to go up is by continuing to buy BTC, even if some of those purchases might raise the cost of your BTC and also even if sometimes the BTC price moves against you after you made purchases that ended up being at higher prices than the current prices... just keep buying with reasonable persistence.. and perhaps study bitcoin to attempt to get more conviction in the strength of bitcoin's long term investment thesis.

I think there are not a few people who initially doubted bitcoin especially when bitcoin was not as well known as it is now in the eyes of the public, but with the growth of bitcoin which does bring certainty for a more beautiful future along with quite a number of people who have managed to take advantage of a fairly large amount then indirectly this event makes people involved in accumulation even though at first they always carry doubts in their minds. On the other hand you gave very good advice and direction by suggesting him to use the DCA approach as the initial stage of involvement, and of course this is a good suggestion because DCA is more specialized for those beginners who just want to jump in by investing the same amount (not too big is fine) in the long run which can indirectly keep their financial situation balanced and can make them make maximum profits in the future as long as they don't delay too much during the allocation period.

Another thing I hope or I advise you to provide a detailed explanation or understanding to you about what investment really is, for the problem of goals yes we all as investors have the same goal at the end of the engagement which is to achieve or get a profit, but I hope you also explain to him in terms of risk, don't let your friend tend to always think about profit because the worry is that he could be too worried when bitcoin experiences a significant bearish or correction phase which in turn could make your friend act instantly to thwart or stop his bitcoin accumulation plan that he has been maintaining, because I see events like this are not uncommon when someone is too focused on his expectations.

With this we can differentiate between investment money and the money we use in the real world. So there is no need to spend the money we have invested in Bitcoin to simply meet the shortages that are occurring in the real world.
I even experience it now. When you feel down in the real world and don't have money to just buy food, it turns out there are still neighbors who give you a little gift that can be used to buy food.
So the neighbors don't know how much assets are in my postfolio, and let it remain a secret. while the daily money remains from the actual results of work.
while assets in bitcoin remain and are not sold for nothing. especially now that the asset is still being developed and is still accumulating more bitcoins.

Bitcoin have passed the level of advertisement, and it would be on whose accord to do that. Bitcoin is already famous for SEC to have approved bitcoin ETF, that alone has made bitcoin more popular than before, because it has given room to those that don't believe in bitcoin to believe in it, and adopt it.

If you feel that bitcoin is not yet popular in your region or location, you can volunteer to educate people in your neighborhood about bitcoin and investing in it. You should not force anyone to accept what you say, but only the ones that shows interest in bitcoin should be taught.

Many financial institutions already know about bitcoin and its potential. El Salvador has adopted bitcoin without advertisements, and the country has their reserve funds in bitcoin. All the second world countries government knows about bitcoin, because initially they saw it as a threat to their fiat currency.

Well, I somewhat randomly picked a goal that might be a goal of someone in the west, but if you think that the goal is too high, then you can reduce the goal to your level.  Perhaps $500 per month or $1k per month, and if the goal was $500 per month, then just reduce (multiply) everything that I already said by 1/10th. ... which means that either 0.5 BTC by mid 2034 or 0.25 BTC by mid 2039 would be sufficient to accomplish the goal of $500 per month, and if you wanted an extra cushion of $1k per month, then you would have to double the target amount.


Of course.  Bitcoin is for everyone or anyone who chooses to get involved in it, and anyone who gets involved investing in bitcoin within a way that is not overdoing it, then is likely going to have some benefits from such investments into bitcoin.


I think that I have always suggested that guys try to be as aggressive as they can in their bitcoin investment without overdoing it, so if a guy has $100 per week that he can invest into bitcoin, then he should do that.  By the way, I was not suggesting that the guy who is shooting for $5k per month income from bitcoin is able to invest $5k per month.  The guy might currently be getting a $3k per month salary and maybe he has $2,000 per month of various expenses, and so the most that he could invest into bitcoin might be $250 per week, and maybe it varies between $150 and $250 per week depending on the variation in his expenses... or even the variation in his income.

So yeah, if the price corrects, he is able to buy more bitcoin and if the price goes up too rapidly then he may well not be able to get as many BTC as he thought that he would be able to get.  If he is on target and overly accumulating bitcoin, then maybe that is not a bad problem to have, or maybe if he is under accumulating, he might have to change either his target accumulation level or maybe change his timeline until such a point that both the timeline and the amount of BTC accumulated overlap... and of course, he will likely monitoring these matters along the way, and I personally like to use the 200-WMA in terms of the valuation of the BTC holdings in order to give greater protections to anyone who would not be pulling the fuck you lever too soon (prior to being actually in a good financial and/or psychological place with his BTC holdings relative to his expectations for how much income he is going to be drawing from such BTC holdings.).

In recent times, I have also been coming toward thinking that a guy might not need to have as much of a bitcoin savings as he would have to have in traditional investments since with a bitcoin investment, he likely would be able to employ a higher withdrawal rate of 6-10% in bitcoin as compared with 4% in traditional investments.



Yep.  The more that you build different options for yourself and different kinds of funds, then the more likely you will not get into a pickle in regards to your BTC, and also you can some times buy extra BTC to make up for some of your earlier missing of times that you would have had wanted to buy BTC... You likely have to balance how many BTC you already have and what might be your goals, and sometimes if you perceive the  BTC price to be in a dip, you may want to be extra aggressive in your BTC accumulation during those kinds of times.. but yeah sometimes emergencies or even other kinds of needs for cash will also happen during periods in which you would prefer to buy more BTC, but you only have so many funds that you are comfortable to draw upon in order to make your BTC purchases during that period.

And, yeah another thing, sometimes we learn from our stupid mistakes in which maybe we get robbed or we suffer some expenses that could have had been avoided.. but if we have some systems in place, we also might be able to keep buying BTC (or maybe at least not sell any BTC) during times in which our finances are suffering.  I recall one period in 2015 that I was able to skip paying rent for 2 months on a business due to some financial hardships, and then later down the road, I paid back the rent from those two months, and sometimes if we otherwise have good relationships, we can sometimes receive favors through our business relationships.


You can sell part of your BTC at various points on the way up.  The guy who 10 BTC bought at $100 might sell 0.25 BTC at $500, and 0.25 BTC at $1k, and then maybe every time the BTC price goes up $1k he sells anther 0.25 BTC, or maybe instead of selling 0.25 BTC, he decides that he is going to sell a certain percentage of his BTC (maybe somewhere between 1% and 5%) for every time the BTC price goes up 50%.

There is nothing wrong with any of those strategies, and maybe even the guy ends up with way more cash and even though his BTC quantity is going down he is happy with that... and maybe if the BTC price happens to correct, he can buy back, but when he sells parts of his BTC, he is not selling with any expectation to buy back.

Bitcoinb has become the volume and preferred investment for investors, making it is the best experience and source of income for investors around the world. There is no doubt about its popularity and acceptance . But until Bitcoin's legality is fully clarified ,the hype will continue. Attention to legalization can increase its naturalness and acceptance. Advertising gives people the right information about the benefits and risks of Bitcoin which increases their confidence in this new and important asset.  Without regulatory clarity, advertising is a necessity so that people get accurate and truthful information and are well guided in their investment decisions. Advertising Bitcoin can increase its acceptance even faster and help people understand its value and future.  Therefore , until Bitcoin legal framework is in place, advertising will continue to be required.